I have been looking at getting a varmint gun for awhile now. Originally I was looking at bolt action but I have been thinking that an AR15 (or variant?) would be a lot more fun. What are your guys' opinions as far as brand and features? The AR's seem to have a bazillion options. Some of the things I was looking at when considering a bolt action rifle that I would want in the AR:

Bull Barrel
Fluted Barrel
Stainless finish
Ready to receive my leupold scope (already have rings)

I was looking at the 22-250 when I was looking at the bolt action (front runner was the savage BVSS) but I would probably look at .223 instead w/ the AR.

So who has the best bang for the buck out there? What options should I consider outside those I listed above? Anything I am not considering?

Thanks guys!

Kevin

Shameless plug.

I have a Browning A-Bolt 22-250 I would sell.

Almost all the manufacturers are making a varmint rifle. All of them are getting good press.
The Stag model 6 is a nice rifle. Double Star version is also a very nice rifle.
Have you thought about the .204?

Shameless plug.

I have a Browning A-Bolt 22-250 I would sell.

Nice rifle...still looking at AR's though :flipoff2: :grinpimp:

Remington makes the R-15 which is a "AR" style rifle in 223 and 204 ... But its not cheap!!!!


http://www.remington.com/images/products/firearms/centerfire/smsil_r15.jpg

Remington makes the R-15 which is a "AR" style rifle in 223 and 204 ... But its not cheap!!!!


http://www.remington.com/images/products/firearms/centerfire/smsil_r15.jpg

man...that thing has a pretty thin 'heavy' barrel (0.68") versus the competition (armalite, dpms, rock river)

Pricey and the barrel isn't even fluted...looks more like you're buying the name.

Have you thought about the .204?

I looked at the .204 and it is a very nice round. The thing that is swinging me towards the .223 is the heavier grain (would be perfect for doe season in south texas) and the surplus ammunition. I have a .300WSM right now and at a little over $2 a round it isn't exactly economical to shoot.

Double Star 24" fluted HB that has been duracoated flat black.
has a JP trigger, reads 3lbs.
MIAD PRS stock and MIAD grip.
DD rail.

Shooting under 1" right now with some crappy handloads. I need to get some BH or Fed match and take it back out.

The barrel is pretty nice, all that weight it doesn't move at all wehn firing.

man...that thing has a pretty thin 'heavy' barrel (0.68") versus the competition (armalite, dpms, rock river)

Pricey and the barrel isn't even fluted...looks more like you're buying the name.

It'd probably a DPMS lower stamped with Remington anyway since the same company owns them both.

here is the thing: Colt built the original AR-15. I own one and yeah, its not much more than the other guys but its got a muffle break, permanent bi-pod, competition grip and 2.4 lbs of trigger pull (sorry, i dont have a picture)

anyway, look online for some prices and then try and buy one used. you can get one that is pretty much factory for cheap and then add the things you want (barrel, new trigger, accesory rail). also, for varmint shooting, i would stay with .223 because you can buy military surplus stuff for cheap.

if and when i buy another AR ill look for DPMS, Armalite, Colt and maybe Olympic Arms. thats just FWIW

here is the thing: Colt built the original AR-15. I own one and yeah, its not much more than the other guys but its got a muffle break, permanent bi-pod, competition grip and 2.4 lbs of trigger pull (sorry, i dont have a picture)

anyway, look online for some prices and then try and buy one used. you can get one that is pretty much factory for cheap and then add the things you want (barrel, new trigger, accesory rail). also, for varmint shooting, i would stay with .223 because you can buy military surplus stuff for cheap.

if and when i buy another AR ill look for DPMS, Armalite, Colt and maybe Olympic Arms. thats just FWIW

Your parents dropped you on your head didn't they?

Your parents dropped you on your head didn't they?

:laughing:

but its got a muffle break

wtf is a muffle break?

wtf is a muffle break?

http://www.autotrucktoys.com/ram/images/m82209823.jpg

I heard LaRue makes em

Armalite, Colt and maybe Olympic Arms. thats just FWIW

Wow, talk about opposite ends of the spectrum.

http://www.autotrucktoys.com/ram/images/m82209823.jpg

I heard LaRue makes em

That shit adds at least another 250 fps...how much shipped to 78254?

:flipoff2: I already told you what to do kevin

:flipoff2: I already told you what to do kevin

What? buy a nice rifle and put cheap chinese optics on it? :flipoff2::flipoff2:

When did a Bushnell 3200 become cheap Chinese? Great scope, especially for the money :flipoff2:

I cant believe no one has noticed the bipod on backwards yet though :laughing: It is now properly mounted to the free float tube.

Double Star 24" fluted HB that has been duracoated flat black.
<snip>
The barrel is pretty nice, all that weight it doesn't move at all wehn firing.

hey Pete, PM me what an upper with that barrel and simple (ie. cheap) handguard would cost. thanks.

Wow, talk about opposite ends of the spectrum.

well, i just want a knock around rifle to keep under the seat in the truck with no scope. dont need to get another colt, but if i found a deal on an armalite, i would be willing to pay a little more for it.

wtf is a muffle break?

ooopppps..... you all knew what i meant.. muzzle break, bastards! :flipoff2:

Your parents dropped you on your head didn't they?

multiple times. but its probably more the years of being kicked around by steers, exposure to farm chemicals and hard binge drinking that did it more than that. :beer:

I have a 204 AR with a 26" WOA barrel. I shoot 1/2" groups at 250yards shooting 40gr bergers.

here is the thing: Colt built the original AR-15.

When you make kool-aid the sugar gets all over the place, when the sugar is left out it attracts bugs.

Don't make kool-aid around here, most of us have cans of Raid. :laughing:


free clue: the original AR-15 was made by ArmaLite (hence the "AR" part) not colt.

When you make kool-aid the sugar gets all over the place, when the sugar is left out it attracts bugs.

Don't make kool-aid around here, most of us have cans of Raid. :laughing:


free clue: the original AR-15 was made by ArmaLite (hence the "AR" part) not colt.

Awe mang, why'd ya spoil it? :laughing:

When you make kool-aid the sugar gets all over the place, when the sugar is left out it attracts bugs.

Don't make kool-aid around here, most of us have cans of Raid. :laughing:


free clue: the original AR-15 was made by ArmaLite (hence the "AR" part) not colt.

Thread Killer :flipoff2:

So what are the big differences in the major AR manufacturers? Is there a high, middle, and low grade? There is rumor of quality control issues for the panther (dpms inc) but I don't know how reliable that is.

Thoughts?

Edit: Let me make this easier...Finish the following sentences

"If money were no object, my varmint AR-15 would be a __________"

"If you want a good weapon at a fair price, look at _________ for your AR-15 needs"

"Since you already blew all your money on smack and hookers look into finding religion. If you still want the AR take your food stamps down and get something from ________ and hope it doesn't blow up in your hand"

I took a fighting pistol class a few months ago from James Yaeger (Tactical Response) and we got into thi argument. He claims DPMS is crap. Claims he sees them fail all the time in his training classes. I have 2 DPMS uppers that run, and have always run flawlessly. At the same time, I have a DPMS 7.62x39 upper that I still cant seem to get to run right. I am close, but I have been working on it for a year!

I took a fighting pistol class a few months ago from James Yaeger (Tactical Response) and we got into thi argument. He claims DPMS is crap. Claims he sees them fail all the time in his training classes. I have 2 DPMS uppers that run, and have always run flawlessly. At the same time, I have a DPMS 7.62x39 upper that I still cant seem to get to run right. I am close, but I have been working on it for a year!

What the hell are you doing on PBB at 5:20 in the morning :flipoff2:

I am starting to wonder if the DPMS bad rap is internet myth and now everyone accepts, and spreads it, like it was gospel. There seems to be an inkling of bullshit in some of the things I have read online.

When you make kool-aid the sugar gets all over the place, when the sugar is left out it attracts bugs.

Don't make kool-aid around here, most of us have cans of Raid. :laughing:


free clue: the original AR-15 was made by ArmaLite (hence the "AR" part) not colt.

I appreciate your free clue, and offer you one: Armalite, that is in exsitance now, is not the same Armalite that created the AR-15. Armalite was a division of the Fairchild Engine Company (which i think is in someway Fairchild-Dornier these days), then they broke off from that company AFTER they sold the patents to the AR-10 and AR-15 to Colt in the late 50s. The military didnt adopt the AR-15 (M16) until 63 or 64, which means that Colt built the original AR-10 and AR-15 for military and civilian use.

You are correct, Armalite created the AR-15 design and Colt decided to keep the AR designation in front of it.

What the hell are you doing on PBB at 5:20 in the morning :flipoff2:

I am starting to wonder if the DPMS bad rap is internet myth and now everyone accepts, and spreads it, like it was gospel. There seems to be an inkling of bullshit in some of the things I have read online.



I have an infant :flipoff2:

I like DPMS. I will buy more DPMS if given the chance.

Colt built the original AR-10 and AR-15 for military and civilian use.


:homer:

So what are the big differences in the major AR manufacturers? Is there a high, middle, and low grade? There is rumor of quality control issues for the panther (dpms inc) but I don't know how reliable that is.

Thoughts?

Edit: Let me make this easier...Finish the following sentences

"If money were no object, my varmint AR-15 would be a __________"

"If you want a good weapon at a fair price, look at _________ for your AR-15 needs"

"Since you already blew all your money on smack and hookers look into finding religion. If you still want the AR take your food stamps down and get something from ________ and hope it doesn't blow up in your hand"

I don't know of anything that fits in your last sentance.

Some manufacturers have been known to have a higher failure rate.
Olympic had some problems in years past.

At the higher end some manufacturers to perform testing (high pressure testing, MPI, etc) to components.
There is an issue of cast- vs - forged - vs- billet for the receivers.
There are some differences in the quality of the steel used in barrels, bolts, carriers, etc.

People putting 1000rds a day through a carbine in classes do report failures from some of the lower end weapons.

Noveske, Sabre, LMT are all upper tier weapons. This is based on their reputation for reliability.
Stag, CMMG, S&W all make a great product and are reasonably priced.
DPMS, RRA, Olympic, Bushmaster, Double Star, etc all seem to be about the same.

I know that there are only a little over a half dozen companies that actually make the forged blanks for receivers and the 30+ finsihed components on the market now are all made from these blanks. The only difference being the CNC they use and the final finish. I have seen different lots of lowers from the same manufacturer have a wide variation in color as well as machining marks. I have built on DPMS, BM, RRA, DS, CMMG, Supioer, Spikes, GunSmoke, Sun Devil lowers and never once had an issue with fit. They have all been made to the same spec and the parts fit.
Supossedly the same thing is true for some of the internals. Only a few companies actually manufacture FCGs and everyone else uses those.

Supposedly some of the lower end 5.56mm chambers are not true 5.56mm.
Some people put A LOT of emphasis on a chrome lined, 1:7 barrel.
if you intend on shooting a lot of Wolf I would recommend chrome.
If you shoot your rifle and throw it in the trunk for a month before shooting it again, might want chrom.
If you are going to be shooting 1k a day, get chrome.
If you think you might be shooting bullets heavier then 65g, get a 1:7.
otherwise it doesn't realy matter.

You will see a lot of people refer to the tech specs of the M4, the TDP. they will claim that these are the specs from the Gov and therefore if an AR isn't made to that spec its "not good enough". The specs are actually made by a contractor and presented to the gov as a way of saying "this is what we intend to do to meet our contractual obligations". if the gov signs off on it, then basically thats the standard you have to meet to get paid. TDPs are used for everything from weapon systems to computer software. I have been involved in a number of DoD contracts and writen and seen a lot of them. A lot of the kool aid drinkers are going to throw TDP in your face and not really have a clue as to what they are talking about. So in this case we have Colt telling the Army, this is how we intend to build the M4.
That doesn't neccessarily mean its the BEST way to make one.

TDP does not talk about free floating, 11* crown, precision trigger, night sights, etc. But I think many people would agree that those are all good things.

Its going to take a metalurgist and chemist to do some destructive testing on each individual component from all of the various manufacturers to tell you if there is really any difference.

A lot of people put a lot of faith ($$$$) into the claims by manufacturers that they HPT and MPI barrels and bolts. There is NO WAY to determine if this test was actually done.
BCM does this testing on the BCGs. I accept it as true because annecdotaly(sp) people are claiming higher rounds counts before cracking on BCM bolts. The BCGs only cost 10$ more then the CMMG BCG. So I use them.
CMMG makes their own barrels. they claim that all barrels are HPT. I have yet to notice a single problem with them. They also make a wide variety of Mid Length barrels. The ML surpasses the carbine lenght in terms of reliability and less maintenance, so I use them.
Stripped lowers, as long as its forged, does not matter one lick. Find the least expensive one you can.
i use an F marked FSB with a flat top upper simple because it's the proper height. A non F will work just as well, but it is almost two full turns of the post shorter. Same cost so why not use the correct one.
Make sure your barrel extension and upper match, ie if the receiver has feed ramps, make sure the extension has the extended ramps. other then that I have never noticed any difference in uppers between the different manufacturers. Some do number the slots. I believe every one I sell is numbered Some color the numbers white. I don't think this is required, but have customers insist on it :shaking:
Some LPKs have roll pins some split. I again don't see any difference, but some people prefer one over the other.


if the rifle is something you intend to count upon and failure = loss of life then yeah, maybe you don't get the cheepest one you can find. But you also dont need to spend 1000+ on it. And no matter what you get buy 1k of ammo and go run the bitch and make sure it works and you know how to work it.
Thats my .02

I appreciate your free clue, and offer you one: Armalite, that is in exsitance now, is not the same Armalite that created the AR-15. Armalite was a division of the Fairchild Engine Company (which i think is in someway Fairchild-Dornier these days), then they broke off from that company AFTER they sold the patents to the AR-10 and AR-15 to Colt in the late 50s. The military didnt adopt the AR-15 (M16) until 63 or 64, which means that Colt built the original AR-10 and AR-15 for military and civilian use.

You are correct, Armalite created the AR-15 design and Colt decided to keep the AR designation in front of it.

Yes and no. http://www.armalite.com/images/Library/AL%20HISTORY%20COPY%202.pdf

Armalite built the first AR-10 to compete agains tthe M14 and FAL in the 1950s.
Colt acquired the license to the AR10 and AR15 in 1959.
Armalite split from fairchild in 1961.
The M16 was not fully officially adopted until 68 or 69.
I do not know that Colt ever built any of the AR10s.
In thew 80s Armalite was again sold to a company in the Phillipines to produce the AR18 for the Phillipine Army.
How ever someone in the US maintained the rights to the Armalite trademark.
The Owner of Eagle Arms sister company to LMT purchased the trademark.

I don't know of anything that fits in your last sentance.

Some manufacturers have been known to have a higher failure rate.
Olympic had some problems in years past.

At the higher end some manufacturers to perform testing (high pressure testing, MPI, etc) to components.
There is an issue of cast- vs - forged - vs- billet for the receivers.
There are some differences in the quality of the steel used in barrels, bolts, carriers, etc.

People putting 1000rds a day through a carbine in classes do report failures from some of the lower end weapons.

Noveske, Sabre, LMT are all upper tier weapons. This is based on their reputation for reliability.
Stag, CMMG, S&W all make a great product and are reasonably priced.
DPMS, RRA, Olympic, Bushmaster, Double Star, etc all seem to be about the same.

I know that there are only a little over a half dozen companies that actually make the forged blanks for receivers and the 30+ finsihed components on the market now are all made from these blanks. The only difference being the CNC they use and the final finish. I have seen different lots of lowers from the same manufacturer have a wide variation in color as well as machining marks. I have built on DPMS, BM, RRA, DS, CMMG, Supioer, Spikes, GunSmoke, Sun Devil lowers and never once had an issue with fit. They have all been made to the same spec and the parts fit.
Supossedly the same thing is true for some of the internals. Only a few companies actually manufacture FCGs and everyone else uses those.

Supposedly some of the lower end 5.56mm chambers are not true 5.56mm.
Some people put A LOT of emphasis on a chrome lined, 1:7 barrel.
if you intend on shooting a lot of Wolf I would recommend chrome.
If you shoot your rifle and throw it in the trunk for a month before shooting it again, might want chrom.
If you are going to be shooting 1k a day, get chrome.
If you think you might be shooting bullets heavier then 65g, get a 1:7.
otherwise it doesn't realy matter.

You will see a lot of people refer to the tech specs of the M4, the TDP. they will claim that these are the specs from the Gov and therefore if an AR isn't made to that spec its "not good enough". The specs are actually made by a contractor and presented to the gov as a way of saying "this is what we intend to do to meet our contractual obligations". if the gov signs off on it, then basically thats the standard you have to meet to get paid. TDPs are used for everything from weapon systems to computer software. I have been involved in a number of DoD contracts and writen and seen a lot of them. A lot of the kool aid drinkers are going to throw TDP in your face and not really have a clue as to what they are talking about. So in this case we have Colt telling the Army, this is how we intend to build the M4.
That doesn't neccessarily mean its the BEST way to make one.

TDP does not talk about free floating, 11* crown, precision trigger, night sights, etc. But I think many people would agree that those are all good things.

Its going to take a metalurgist and chemist to do some destructive testing on each individual component from all of the various manufacturers to tell you if there is really any difference.

A lot of people put a lot of faith ($$$$) into the claims by manufacturers that they HPT and MPI barrels and bolts. There is NO WAY to determine if this test was actually done.
BCM does this testing on the BCGs. I accept it as true because annecdotaly(sp) people are claiming higher rounds counts before cracking on BCM bolts. The BCGs only cost 10$ more then the CMMG BCG. So I use them.
CMMG makes their own barrels. they claim that all barrels are HPT. I have yet to notice a single problem with them. They also make a wide variety of Mid Length barrels. The ML surpasses the carbine lenght in terms of reliability and less maintenance, so I use them.
Stripped lowers, as long as its forged, does not matter one lick. Find the least expensive one you can.
i use an F marked FSB with a flat top upper simple because it's the proper height. A non F will work just as well, but it is almost two full turns of the post shorter. Same cost so why not use the correct one.
Make sure your barrel extension and upper match, ie if the receiver has feed ramps, make sure the extension has the extended ramps. other then that I have never noticed any difference in uppers between the different manufacturers. Some do number the slots. I believe every one I sell is numbered Some color the numbers white. I don't think this is required, but have customers insist on it :shaking:
Some LPKs have roll pins some split. I again don't see any difference, but some people prefer one over the other.


if the rifle is something you intend to count upon and failure = loss of life then yeah, maybe you don't get the cheepest one you can find. But you also dont need to spend 1000+ on it. And no matter what you get buy 1k of ammo and go run the bitch and make sure it works and you know how to work it.
Thats my .02

:eek::eek: Pete...you rock! That's exactly what I was looking for!

Talked it over w/ the wife and it looks like I will be ready to "pull the trigger" in August. I will definitely be coming your way.

Two questions:

What's the lead time from purchase to arrival?

Paypal/check/money order/credit card?

Greatly Appreciated Bro!
Kevin

I like my RRA Predator Pursuit.

The military didnt adopt the AR-15 (M16) until 63 or 64, which means that Colt built the original AR-10 and AR-15 for military and civilian use.

umm ..no

Armalite BUILT the first ar-10's ar-15'a and every ar 1 through whatever the fuck they stopped at.
They built the FIRST and the ORIGINAL weapons, they produced them BEFORE they sold the rights to colt. Colt did not buy unproven blueprints that had never been built into weapons :shaking:

so far your posts are 2:0, want to try for a third?

Texas97, what band of mouth breathing retards is feeding you this crap? Or are you making it up as you go?

i would stay with .223 because you can buy military surplus stuff for cheap.


What fawking alternate universe do you live in?:laughing:

What fawking alternate universe do you live in?:laughing:


where colt is god and LC headstamp is $300 a thousand :laughing:

my .02.....
owned a colt with no problems........

have a built national match upper w/ bushmaster lower......shoots great trigger SUCKS ASS and occasionally sticks

I have taught a few 40 hr patrol rifle classes to P.O. where we average 1000-1500 Rd's in a week .....in my experience...you see more problems/failures with bushmaster/dpms/SW mp5.....

least amount with colts/ rock river arms

in fact our first batch of s&w mp5 AR-15 out of about 150 weapons ,,40 we couldn't sight in without the front site post being all the way screwed out and had to have the rep come by after we red tagged them..(S&W contracted out and didn't build these...just had there name on them) we sight in at POI/POA at 50 yards so your good out to 200 w/o much sight calculations

(we were given a donation to our dept to buy these rifles with a caveat that we HAD to buy from a certain S&W dealer.....but they were free so....)

and I'm currently buying a rock river arms 24" complete upper with Wilson barrel w 1/8 twist, the varmint hunters 2007 magazine just tested it with 40 Grain through 72 grain bullets.... the best 100 yard 10 shot bench rest group was .75 inch and 300 Yard 10 shot group was 1.1 inch...

As others stated , build your own. Use a quality upper and lower, GOOD trigger, and GOOD barrel.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/toxicar/crow.jpg

Kreiger barrel, mega upper and lower, JP trigger. I sent the upper to Kreiger and they sent me back a "laser...". Anyway, they setup the barrel and upper, handguards and everything.

The front accuracy block and stuff on the rear stock are for "riding the bags" when I shoot of the bench. I shoot with bags in the field instead of a bipod as well as I find I am more accurate with bags.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/toxicar/groups006.jpg

This is my best group. Caught an evening when the air was still and NO wind, stars aligned, planets aligned :smokin:

Got a more graphic pic of the results of 50 grain Vmax on a crow if you wantem!

Yes. We do.

here ya go

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/toxicar/crow3.jpg

broncman, can you give us more specs on the barrel (ie. length and rate of twist) ... 1:8 ?

What's the lead time from purchase to arrival?

Paypal/check/money order/credit card?


As long as you don't want RRA/POF/LMT, it usually take 2-4 weeks.
Those three can take 2-3 months.

Everything except Paypal. I only take pers checks from folks on here that have been around for a while

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/toxicar/groups006.jpg


Sweet googly-moogly

Varget huh? What primer?

Texas97, what band of mouth breathing retards is feeding you this crap? Or are you making it up as you go?


Thank you, aloharover, for your link to Armalite.

i never disputed that Armalite (the division of the Fairchild engine company) created the first design and produced them before Colt produced them for the military. The original military ar-15 rifle, adopted by the government, was manufactured by Colt.

I dont care if you believe that or not. believe what you want to believe.

Whats the count up to now, USMCdoc? does that make it 3:0?

It is 1in 9 (8.8 I belive?) 24 inch stainless 223 SAMI chamber. I had Krieger set it up and their customer service is phenominal. But it should be as they are a little pricey. But I feel they are one of the top 3 barrel makers.

They have a match chamber which has a deeper throat for the longer match bullets and a tighter neck. I knew I would be shooting varmints so I stayed 223 SAMI spec.

I also have a weight added to the bolt similar to the ones Tubb sales for AR space guns. I feel like the added weight to the bolt slows the bolt down and holds it in lock a little longer to utilize the longer barrle length???

It stabilizes the heavier bullets fine due to extra barrel length compared to your shorter 16" barrels.

That group was shot at a local range where a "tacticommando" practically lives. He saw me getting bagged in and asked, "What barrel twist? What bullet?...Oh you know that a 1-9 won't stabilize 77's".

I then shot that group and he never said anything else:shaking:


That load is with Winchester Brass, Varget, and Federal 205M match primers.
This gun shoots anything with Varget pretty well.

Oh you know that a 1-9 won't stabilize 77's".

I then shot that group and he never said anything else:shaking:


That load is with Winchester Brass, Varget, and Federal 205M match primers.
This gun shoots anything with Varget pretty well.

I am very surprised to hear its a 1:9.

Be interesting to see how it does vs a rifle with the exact same set up but in 1:7.

I think you would need to get out beyond 4-500 to see any difference.

I feel the longer barrel/velocity helps it stabilize the 77's. Gives it more time to impart spin. My theory anyway.

I have done several F class matches with it. 600 yd and 1000 yd.

We first took it to Camp Butner in 2005 to the North State Shooting Clubs Long Range Clinic. Kent Reeves (Palma fame and medalist) was the instructor. Norm Crawford and several other Long Range champions were their and help out NSSC. I took my 3 sons, the youngest was 10.

He went through the class, 3 days worth and shot from the 600 yard line. He was coached by one of the US Palma Team coaches while he was shooting. He pulled down a 194 with something like a 7X:eek: (200/20x is perfct score)
20 shots, 10 points maximum each plus number of Xrings....

My best was a 192 (can't remember x count) ...I HAD TO read my own wind though:(

That was my first long range attempt. I tried 1000 yds, but my load was subsonic and was allover the place. Target pullers could not tell if I had shot or not!!



I went with 1 -9 because varmint rounds of lighter weights are the rifles primary use.


I SOOOO want an F Class rig though..

I'm looking for a 24" AR barrel in .223 ... I want to shoot the critters at long range. Advise me on a barrel purchase. I really like the looks of that fluted on that Aloha posted that wasn't a full bull barrel.

How much are you looking to spend? You want just a barrel and then you gonna build the upper yourself or do you want a finished upper?

I am partial to Krieger. There are others that use Krieger blanks and produce some great varmint rigs. White Oak armament has some cool stuff.
http://www.whiteoakarmament.com/complete_uppers.htm

Wilson Barrels are good barrels but are just below Krieger,Lilja,Obermeyer barrels.

I would be happy with any of those.

Also look at Compass Lake Engineering. Frank White does some excellent match grade uppers http://www.compasslake.com/Exp.htm

www.compasslake.com

My other suggestion would be White Oak Armament. He mostly does NM barrels, but he also has some varmint stuff.
I know someone here has one of his .204 barrels.

He went through the class, 3 days worth and shot from the 600 yard line. He was coached by one of the US Palma Team coaches while he was shooting. He pulled down a 194 with something like a 7X:eek: (200/20x is perfct score)
20 shots, 10 points maximum each plus number of Xrings....


:eek::eek::eek:
AWSOME!!

Was this his first time shooting 600?

I only ever shot rack rifles and think my best was just over 150. match winner was a 180. We were all shooting issue 55g FMJ.

On your F-Class are you thinking an AR platform?
I was just reading about someone that built up a 308 F-Class rifle. Sub 1/4moa at 100yrds. 1.88" 3-shot group at 600yrds. I would like to see a larger string then three rounds, but even so, thats amazing. if I remember correctly he was shooting federal match, not handloads.

I'm looking for a 24" AR barrel in .223 ... I want to shoot the critters at long range. Advise me on a barrel purchase. I really like the looks of that fluted on that Aloha posted that wasn't a full bull barrel.

The one I posted in this thread?
It is 1" behind the gas block and .9 ahead of it. 24" stainless, fluted Douglass barrel.

Have not had time to shoot it yet :(