What diesel engines are availible worldwide

[Mongoose87]

that are small enough to fit in a pickup/jeep, reliable, and make decent power??? How popular is cummins worldwide?

[r0nin89]

4bt , theres another one I cant think of, I wanna say a turbo isuzu

[bigorangecntry07]

perkins(makes CAT), cummins, isuzu and you could try the VW 1.9L

[copeland]

I think the Chevy/GM Duramax may be quite global, it was designed by Isuzu.

I saw a isuzu commercial where they advertised there "D MAX" in their pickups..

[PAToyota]

They keep saying that the 4.5L Duramax (http://www.autoblog.com/2008/05/05/gm-releases-details-on-upcoming-4-5l-duramax-turbo-diesel-v8/) is coming out. Would be smaller than the 6.6L and fit a lot more places.

However, I figure that you're looking at three to five years (after they are out) before you can start finding them for a price you'd be willing to pay - unless you have deep pockets for a crate engine.

[blakerj10]

I just finished putting a 4bt in my k10 shortbox. Really an easy fit. Still working on tuning and odds and ends, but it really impresses me so far. Awesome power, and mileage on very first trip was 27.5 going 65 mph one way and 75 mph the other. They are definately used worldwide as well.

[Trail Mule]

Not trying to steal the post, but can a cummins 4bt bolt up to a np435 out of a ford?

[DZLCJ7]

Yes. I sold my extra 4bt to a friend that did just that. Just need the flywheel housing for 4bt to NP435 and then a bellhousing from, I think, a NP435 that has a six cyl.

[braxton357]

In terms of reliability and simplicity, you can't beat a b series cummins. Not to mention they're used in every application imaginable around the world. Though...why is "worldwide" a criteria? Planning on shipping this vehicle around the world? If just in north america, most any common diesel should be able to find parts.

[Chet]

if its going in a fullsize You could look at a inline six toyota diesel. you can't get much more worldwide than a toyota motor.

[r0nin89]

I just finished putting a 4bt in my k10 shortbox. Really an easy fit. Still working on tuning and odds and ends, but it really impresses me so far. Awesome power, and mileage on very first trip was 27.5 going 65 mph one way and 75 mph the other. They are definately used worldwide as well.

God I wanna do that. What gears, tires, trans are you running? All the diesel guys told me the sm465 would be a bad idea to run with a 4bt.

[r0nin89]

In terms of reliability and simplicity, you can't beat a b series cummins. Not to mention they're used in every application imaginable around the world. Though...why is "worldwide" a criteria? Planning on shipping this vehicle around the world? If just in north america, most any common diesel should be able to find parts.

Ummm cause thats the point of an expedition rig. To traverse the great outdoors of multiple countrys on a very very long trip. A 2 week road trip to some wheel spots is not what alot of serious guys have in mine when yuo say expedition.

Theyre thinking ok we'll start in texas and drive south til we see penguins.

[braxton357]

Ummm cause thats the point of an expedition rig. To traverse the great outdoors of multiple countrys on a very very long trip. A 2 week road trip to some wheel spots is not what alot of serious guys have in mine when yuo say expedition.

Theyre thinking ok we'll start in texas and drive south til we see penguins.

I wasn't aware there was a road to antarctica. I also wasn't aware that you couldn't have an "expedition" involving only central and north america. Point being, unless you seriously think you're going to pack up your rig and ship it overseas..."worldwide" parts availability isn't as much of a concern as say reliabilty, mileage, ability to easily fix it with typical hand tools, ability to get parts at napa or the local hd truck shop that every city from chile to alaska has...

[Mongoose87]

Well, I'm not really looking to ship world wide, but a possible South american excursion could be in my future... I would really like to use a Cummins 4BT but was unsure about their use globally.

[blakerj10]

Mongoose,

The 4BT is used in boats, generator set-ups, tractors, pumps, etc. all over the globe. Plus it is a very simple design that is very easy to work on and a I would thing that anything problematic could be brougth at as a spare, however I cant think of anything. With a manual transmission, you could push start the rig and run it with just about any problem I can think of.

r0nin89
It really does run good. I am truly amazed. I did put a lot of thought into set-up though. A 465 would be useless on the road. Thats what was in mine to start with. You really need an overdrive with these. I am running 3.73s, 33" tires, and a dodge version NV4500. It is about the perfict gearing. I had alway planned on running 255/85-16s which are a smidge taller and much narrower than 33x12.50s but got a good deal on these. I might try a set of 35s from my buddies pickup just to see how the gearing works out, but it really drives good right now.

I am running a 241 t case and in low range in first gear, it would NOT climb my test hill. Geared to low and spins at idle to easy with no momentum. put it in low 2nd gear or low 3rd and it idles up with no throttle input. But out on the highway I can still run up and down every hill in 5th gear with out shifting or loosing speed and get 27 mpgs at 75 mph. With a little more tuning I bet I can get 30 mpg.

[bigorangecntry07]

i using a sm465 in my cj5 but im offrad only so i needed the low first gear

[Diesel_Dirk]

Worldwide???

Toyota or mercedes.

[r0nin89]

I wasn't aware there was a road to antarctica. I also wasn't aware that you couldn't have an "expedition" involving only central and north america. Point being, unless you seriously think you're going to pack up your rig and ship it overseas..."worldwide" parts availability isn't as much of a concern as say reliabilty, mileage, ability to easily fix it with typical hand tools, ability to get parts at napa or the local hd truck shop that every city from chile to alaska has...


Mmm wow ok. First of all check back when you graduate 6th grade biology :flipoff2: theres penguins at the very southern tip of south america. Ever heard of those very famous islands called the Gallapagos (sp) ? Thats what I was talking about.

Secondly you couldnt be more wrong. An expedition rig is a vehicle that is as capable offroad as it is onroad and is self-maintainable and serviceable around the globe. The majority of people that are serious about an expedition wouldnt even consider thinking your on a so called expedition if theres a napa or "local hd truck shop" what ever the fuck that is, within driving distance.

Your talking about middle of fucking nowhere third world countries. And yeah there are plenty of people who trek through south america, and theres plenty of people who go to, middle of nowhere asia and africa... for fucks sake theres a huge group of people who take a wheeling trip across Antarctica every year.

So your little "expeditions" 300 miles away from your local mudhole, yeah thats not an expedition. Websters points to the synonym excursion when talking about expedition, the definition of excursion is deviation from a direct, definite, or proper course. Tell me how many Napas you find in Uegala Africa.

[r0nin89]

Mongoose,

r0nin89
It really does run good. I am truly amazed. I did put a lot of thought into set-up though. A 465 would be useless on the road. Thats what was in mine to start with. You really need an overdrive with these. I am running 3.73s, 33" tires, and a dodge version NV4500. It is about the perfict gearing. I had alway planned on running 255/85-16s which are a smidge taller and much narrower than 33x12.50s but got a good deal on these. I might try a set of 35s from my buddies pickup just to see how the gearing works out, but it really drives good right now.

I am running a 241 t case and in low range in first gear, it would NOT climb my test hill. Geared to low and spins at idle to easy with no momentum. put it in low 2nd gear or low 3rd and it idles up with no throttle input. But out on the highway I can still run up and down every hill in 5th gear with out shifting or loosing speed and get 27 mpgs at 75 mph. With a little more tuning I bet I can get 30 mpg.

Yeah I'm running 350/sm465/3.73's/36's right now.

If I went to a 4bt I'd imagine I'd need nv4500/4.10's to run at a good speed. As of right now I run high rpms at 70... like 3000.

[braxton357]

Mmm wow ok. First of all check back when you graduate 6th grade biology :flipoff2: theres penguins at the very southern tip of south america. Ever heard of those very famous islands called the Gallapagos (sp) ? Thats what I was talking about.

Secondly you couldnt be more wrong. An expedition rig is a vehicle that is as capable offroad as it is onroad and is self-maintainable and serviceable around the globe. The majority of people that are serious about an expedition wouldnt even consider thinking your on a so called expedition if theres a napa or "local hd truck shop" what ever the fuck that is, within driving distance.

Your talking about middle of fucking nowhere third world countries. And yeah there are plenty of people who trek through south america, and theres plenty of people who go to, middle of nowhere asia and africa... for fucks sake theres a huge group of people who take a wheeling trip across Antarctica every year.

So your little "expeditions" 300 miles away from your local mudhole, yeah thats not an expedition. Websters points to the synonym excursion when talking about expedition, the definition of excursion is deviation from a direct, definite, or proper course. Tell me how many Napas you find in Uegala Africa.

First, the fucking galapagos penguin and islands are on the equator, and hundreds of miles off the coast of south america. You're still a dipshit.
And second, I don't give a shit where you are. There will always be a trucking industry, and there will always be a shop and parts store to service them. No shit, you might not be anywhere near one when a problem arises...but if that's the case, how does that even apply to the point of this thread. If you can't get parts, then you cant get parts. For anything.

How many times have you shipped your 87 chevy on fawking tsl radials to africa? About as many times as the OP plans to.

The only point I was trying to make before you went off on your dumbass rant was that "worldwide" and "north and south america" makes a difference. A cummins b series engine is used in not only generators, boats, ag equipment, and pumps around the world, but is also a staple of the light and heavy truck market. It doesn't matter where the fuck you are, small town wisconsin or panama...there is someone that sells parts for a cummins diesel. Try going to your local north american parts house and getting a part for a toyota diesel. Or a mercedes for that matter. No doubt they're a dime a dozen in europe, but so is a vauxhall...try finding parts for one in a 500 mile radius.
The meaning of worldwide does make a difference. And just because to you and your magazine reading mind, the only thing that constitutes an "expedition" is driving from here to siberia does not make it true. What exactly makes a trip across antarctica more of an expedition than one from washington to the yukon? Nothing. :rolleyes:

[bowtied_micky]

well allow me to ramble...

You didn't state what vehicle you would be swapping into, so i'm going to cover several bases. If you are sticking with a full size truck, I would look at a Ford Super Duty. Instead of spending time and money on a swap, i would get a Ford and rebuild what you have. The 7.3 is a great engine and that is what I would get. I know some of you are probably thinking why not the dodge... well if you are shipping a vehicle around the world or planning some global expo, the dodges just suck to sit in. Thats a whole lotta miles in a real shitty seat. Is the Cummins the baddest diesel, yes. Do dodge interiors (where you spend the majority of your time) suck the biggest ass? Yes again. So I would rebuild a Ford over a Dodge. I would like to point out i am only speaking of the 99-04 i think Super Dutys that had the 7.3. Put a better IC, turbo, injectors, exhaust, stuff like that instead of a custom radiator, whatever.

Now if you have some attachment to a smaller vehicle and really want to do this swap, I would look at a 4bt. The reason I would say the 4bt over the others to keep as much space in the engine compartments as possible. If you shoe horn an engine into the compartment, and your later your n BFE and need to do repairs, it just got harder. Leave room to work.

Honestly, unless you want a smaller vehicle (IE tacoma) i would really look at selling what you have and rebuilding something from the factory. Your custom motor mounts to fit the whatever diesel you decide into the whatever vehicle are great, til they bust. I know factory stuff breaks. But if you don't have a welder, the gear, whatever you always have the "order it from a dealership" option.

[Mongoose87]

small enough to fit in a pickup/jeep,
:)

[Strange]

i never knew the 4bt cummins was world wide

on availability ide probably put my money on the Isuzu 4BD1T and 2T there's tons of those NPRS runnin around everywhere

[p14175]

ULSD is not a common diesel fuel in Central and South America. Take this into consideration when selecting a diesel engine for a repower if you are planning an extended trip there with your truck. Does Canada use ULSD?

[Mongoose87]

I may be in danger of sounding like an idiot but what is ULSD?

[jphrse]

ultra low sulfer diesel

[bigun]

I may be in danger of sounding like an idiot but what is ULSD?
Just a SWAG "Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel"

[r0nin89]

First, the fucking galapagos penguin and islands are on the equator, and hundreds of miles off the coast of south america. You're still a dipshit.
And second, I don't give a shit where you are. There will always be a trucking industry, and there will always be a shop and parts store to service them. No shit, you might not be anywhere near one when a problem arises...but if that's the case, how does that even apply to the point of this thread. If you can't get parts, then you cant get parts. For anything.

How many times have you shipped your 87 chevy on fawking tsl radials to africa? About as many times as the OP plans to.

The only point I was trying to make before you went off on your dumbass rant was that "worldwide" and "north and south america" makes a difference. A cummins b series engine is used in not only generators, boats, ag equipment, and pumps around the world, but is also a staple of the light and heavy truck market. It doesn't matter where the fuck you are, small town wisconsin or panama...there is someone that sells parts for a cummins diesel. Try going to your local north american parts house and getting a part for a toyota diesel. Or a mercedes for that matter. No doubt they're a dime a dozen in europe, but so is a vauxhall...try finding parts for one in a 500 mile radius.
The meaning of worldwide does make a difference. And just because to you and your magazine reading mind, the only thing that constitutes an "expedition" is driving from here to siberia does not make it true. What exactly makes a trip across antarctica more of an expedition than one from washington to the yukon? Nothing. :rolleyes:

Ya want to know what makes a trip from washington to yukon not an expedition? The fact that you can stay at a fucking best western every stop inbetween and then grab McDonalds breakfast when you wake up... :shaking:

I'm not arguing by any means that 4bt / cummins is a great worldwide choice, for fucks sake I suggested it. My point is despite what you thinking there are places that people go where if you said jeeze I need a water pump for my Chevy 350 theyd look at you like your fuckin nuts. Then when they finally broke out a book theyd be like o ok it'll be 3 months.

Secondly how do you know the OP wont fucking ship his truck to Africa, or Cambodia, or some place like that. Clearly he has enough interest to try to build a truck thats friendly to parts sources all over the globe, so why would you assume "o well he'll never go to Africa to blah blah engine is a great choice"?

[p14175]

It sounds like you have a bit of research to do.
A good starting place is www.4btswaps.com

[roscoFJ73]

Worldwide???

Toyota or mercedes.

X 1 Billiion. Once you step off the north american continent it is all japanese and european diesels.
The toyota B group are used almost everywhere as is Isuzu and Mercedes.
Fords european plants also put out a decent 4cyl diesel used in the Transits and new Defender LR.
No one else drives full size pick up trucks so its ludicrous to think parts will be easy to get outside NA.
You may find similar parts in boats ,generators etc ,but who wants to go on a wild goose chase in a foreign country looking for odd parts?

[Kali-K10]

why not carry your parts with you...

you said you wanted to be self contained and self reliant. spend the money on all the parts you would need here and stock them in the truck. keep some tools and some RTV on you and i think you will be fine. lol

if your using a diesel, buy a new one...they last 300K miles before you have to build them. it just seems like you guys are over-analyzing and getting in shit fits about "expeditions" to here and there.

as far as the choice of motor....i think these guys have all summed it up for you. worldwide, as in outside of north and south america....go with the benz or toyota...if your staying on these continents then get a cummins.

most of all you want reliablity and ease of repair right? that should be your main concern. anyone can go there...only certain people can get back. if you make it back...you wont even have to worry about finding a parts place.

if your prepared for anything, your chances of survival are much better.

and whoever was bitching about dodges not being comfortable....your :rainbow:

[Never Monday]

gonna throw Deutz into the mix behind the 4bt and VW 1.9
The hardest part of this is getting a decent power to weight ratio.

[braxton357]

Secondly how do you know the OP wont fucking ship his truck to Africa, or Cambodia, or some place like that. Clearly he has enough interest to try to build a truck thats friendly to parts sources all over the globe, so why would you assume "o well he'll never go to Africa to blah blah engine is a great choice"?

The part where he said this towards the beginning of the thread maybe?


Well, I'm not really looking to ship world wide, but a possible South american excursion could be in my future... I would really like to use a Cummins 4BT but was unsure about their use globally.


Having been through canada and the baja peninsula... you're a fawking idiot. Just because you can find a hotel and restaurant within 200 miles does not mean that you must partake--or even go near them. You watch too many tv shows. :shaking:

[stjames151]

I got some randoms for ya. Volvo, Hino, and Yiwu (sp?) make some diesel engines that are pretty well distributed throughout the world. Many marine and general utility applications in other countries will use these platforms. I'm not sure they make something that will work for your particular intent, but its always nice to know who's parts are readily available in odd places. Also, the Toyota Hilux has a 4.?L that is internationally known to be reliable, efficient, easy to work on, and for some reason...impossible to find in the US. Fukin retards at the EPA wont let it in.

[bigorangecntry07]

heres my engine compartment to give you an idea
http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m274/bigorangecntry07/4bt%20CJ5/100_0140.jpg
http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m274/bigorangecntry07/4bt%20CJ5/100_0133.jpg

[Mongoose87]

So is Cummins popular outside of the US or not??? I would think they are used in alot of medium sized vehicles through out the world...

[bigorangecntry07]

So is Cummins popular outside of the US or not??? I would think they are used in alot of medium sized vehicles through out the world...

yes, 4bts are used in ford superduties in central/south america

[jasonmt]

yes, 4bts are used in ford superduties in central/south america


The 4BT has only been used for the last couple of years in the central/south american F-100's/F-250's, before that they were 4.2L MWM Sprint inline 6 engines.

[Mercedesrover]

Of course a Benz is my choice. They were used everywhere in the world for years and years. Common, reliable, quiet and economical. And if you do blow one up, a used one can be had for cheap anywhere in the world.

125hp w/turbo and high revs so in most cases there's no need for a gear-ratio change.

http://www.seriestrek.com/109/together4.jpg

No, I won't build you an adapter. :flipoff2:

[romeolimagolf]

I have read that the GM 6.5 diesel is used wordwide as a marine engine. There is even a place in Europe (Sweden, I think ) that specialises in the 6.5.

[WTweeder]

Of course a Benz is my choice. They were used everywhere in the world for years and years. Common, reliable, quiet and economical. And if you do blow one up, a used one can be had for cheap anywhere in the world.

125hp w/turbo and high revs so in most cases there's no need for a gear-ratio change.

http://www.seriestrek.com/109/together4.jpg

No, I won't build you an adapter. :flipoff2:

wtf is that bolted to the front of your t-case? just some sort of extension?

[GQtim]

For teh guys who said nothing will break your a fool

ive been through the canning stock route with a brand new toyota 100 series 1HZ at the time, the vibrations caused the harmonic balancer to shear its key and then needed to be replaced, 1000km from no where we had to go to the nearest station 1day drive away and leave his car on the side of the road, the farmer got onto the local dealer and 2 days later we got the balancer air freighted to the farm.

Now just because its new doesnt mean it wont break, had it been a big US v8 turbo diesel or something we would have been waiting years for the parts, Merc, Nissan and toyota offer the same engines in europe asia and africa so go with a big 6 or 8cy one from them thats turbo diesel :D

[Mercedesrover]

wtf is that bolted to the front of your t-case? just some sort of extension?

Nope. Standard issue Land Rover transmission except for high-ratio gears. That's a Ford NP435 between the two.

[CronusTRD]

My sammi has a 1.8L Isuzu Diesel out of a chevette. I can't find parts for it anywhere :(

[Mongoose87]

Of course a Benz is my choice. They were used everywhere in the world for years and years. Common, reliable, quiet and economical. And if you do blow one up, a used one can be had for cheap anywhere in the world.

125hp w/turbo and high revs so in most cases there's no need for a gear-ratio change.

http://www.seriestrek.com/109/together4.jpg

No, I won't build you an adapter. :flipoff2:

What kind of torque does it make? Is it a mechanical engine?

[Mercedesrover]

What kind of torque does it make? Is it a mechanical engine?

125hp @4350
170lb# @ 2400

All mechanical.

[bigorangecntry07]

4bts have 105hp @ 2500 RPMs and 265 ft-lbs trq @ 1600 RPMs thats the non-intercooled version, the intercooled is 120hp @ 2500 RPMs and 280 ft-lbs trq @1600RPMs

[Mongoose87]

125hp @4350
170lb# @ 2400

All mechanical.

Thats a little short on power if you ask me unless you were putting it in a Samurai.

[Wheelingnoob]

Yes Canada has ULSD as well.

[roscoFJ73]

This is the Toyota 1HZ 4.2 litre diesel out of my landcruiser just after it was rebuilt.
Nice smooth 6cyl,easy starting and ultra reliable



http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s188/roscoFJ73/robspics053Medium.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s188/roscoFJ73/robspics015Medium.jpg

[bigorangecntry07]

thats a pretty long block, how much power does it produce??? i assume its smaller than the 6bt cummins due to 4.2L vs. 5.9L????

[GQtim]

its much shorter, but we only get the 6bt here in boats and import crate motors i believe

[nicks90]

love the nissan 4.2 - immensely reliable and oodles of low down torque.

not massively powerful in bhp, but you dont need that much bhp unless you intend to drive around at 150mph all day long. Torque is more important and that donk has plenty to go around!

plus they are definitely easy to find all over the world. Not that you would need any work doing to it though :D

[nicks90]

oh, and one other thing - they will run on just about any old sludge that passes for "Diesel" in most back of beyond countries.

will also run on straight vegetable oil as well.

[quebeczuk]

Toyota's 1HZ 4.2L is putting out 130HP @ 3800rpm and 310ft-lbf @ 2200rpm.

Here's a link (http://www.brian894x4.com/landcruiserenginestransmissions.html) for Landcruiser's engine info

[Mongoose87]

Toyota's 1HZ 4.2L is putting out 130HP @ 3800rpm and 310ft-lbf @ 2200rpm.

Here's a link (http://www.brian894x4.com/landcruiserenginestransmissions.html) for Landcruiser's engine info


Is Toyotas motor all mechanical? Is this motor still in current production? Anyone have some links to more info about it?

[151fab]

You should be honest with yourself and realize that the majority of your vehicles life will be spent in the U.S. There are almost no Mercedes, Toyota, and especially Nissan diesel parts here in the US. The Toyota and Nissan diesels, though rock solid by all standards, are VERY overpriced in the US, as are their parts. Any Toyota diesel other than the 3b will cost you at least 6k and I have no idea how much more a Nissan would be, but it wold be more. 4bt or 6bt are great for parts and service here in the US, but they are heavy, tall, and aren't a sleeved motor and therefor are more expensive to rebuild. Turbo Isuzu's are sleeved, cheaper, lighter, and at least as powerful as the 4bt but I have no idea how available they are down south. Internationals are great for South America. Europe, take your pick of them all and then some. Africa has all those that, again, you won't easily find parts for here.

The argument that some are trying to make to you is that most engines are regional so unless your going Turtle, figure out where your going to spend most of your time and build it for there.

Oh ya, quite acting :mr-t: , all bad ass, about expeditions, the majority of those that think they are going to travel more than 200 miles from the a hotel or McDs never get more than 200 miles from there home relying solely on there vehicle. :flipoff2: Those that are true expo-ers would, likely, welcome anyone to the outdoors with their rig even if it's only miles away from home.

[151fab]

Is Toyotas motor all mechanical? Is this motor still in current production? Anyone have some links to more info about it?

Yes, that one and a few of the other, more popular, ones are mechanical.

[GQtim]

The two big motors are with out a doubt the Toyota 1HZ or the Nissan TD42 , neither is a powerhouse but they willl run for a proven million kms with servicing on shitty fuel, Both are similar design 4.2l straight 6 both can be turbo'd easily, have good fuel economy and will move a house albit not in a hurry. they are comepletely mechanical and have only recently ceased production.

both a featured in the UN vehicles in affrica ect which proves there reliability

[roscoFJ73]

Is Toyotas motor all mechanical? Is this motor still in current production? Anyone have some links to more info about it?

It was introduced in 1990. There is a also 5cyl version and 3 turbo versions.
No longer on sale in oz from 07,replaced with Toyotas new V8 diesel.
It still for sale in SouTH Africa and the ME.
You can get about 180 hp from an aftermarket turbo kit on a 1HZ.
It came inthe 7*,80 and 100 series landcruisers and the Toyota Coaster bus.
They are fairly devoid of electronics,just a single wire to the fuel cut solenoid on the earlier models.
This is the specs page for all Landcruiser engines.
http://www.cruiserfaq.com/05-04.php
The 1HZ 6 cyl,1PZ 5cyl are non turbo indirect injection.
The 1HD T,1HD FT and 1HD FTE are the turbo 6 cyl version with direct injection.
They are all basically the same block and share most external parts except fuel pump.
They have 2-3 gearboxes and autos that will mate to them

A 1HZ with blower kiT
http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/6233/robspics103smallaw4.jpg

and mine with gearbox attached waiting to be installed

http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/8278/robspics071mediumas3.jpg

[472Scout]

125hp @4350
170lb# @ 2400

All mechanical.

Weak.

[ncmog]

If one can stand the weight, a 6 cylinder Mercedes OM 352 or the turbo version OM352A would work well in the US or the rest of the world.

[Mercedesrover]

Originally Posted by Mercedesrover View Post
125hp @4350
170lb# @ 2400

All mechanical.

Weak.

The benefits of an extremely common, reliable, long-lived and cheap to acquire diesel engine far out-weigh the lack of a couple of horse power and lb#s of torque....For my needs anyway.

That Toyota motor is pretty but I'd hate to pay for it. That Benz engine came to me for free. :flipoff2: What's a 1HZ going to cost you here in the states?

And I'd hate to have to find parts for it state-side.

[Mongoose87]

I'd hate to drive and drive my jeep down the interstate with that thing powering it...

[quebeczuk]

I'd hate to drive and drive my jeep down the interstate with that thing powering it...

With the gaz price going up and up, you'll learn to love fuel economy. :D

But with 120hp I'd like more then 170lb of torque.

[Mercedesrover]

I'd hate to drive and drive my jeep down the interstate with that thing powering it...

Something tells me we wouldn't have to worry about that.....

[roscoFJ73]

With the gaz price going up and up, you'll learn to love fuel economy. :D

But with 120hp I'd like more then 170lb of torque.

I thought it more like a 135 hp. It manages a solid 70 mph@2600 rpm all day with a load on.
Very similar in power to a 2f gasser in a FJ40/60
They usually last 300000 miles but some owners nearly double that.

Parts would be hard to get in the US but they dont need too many of them.
They can go for 4-5 years just on oil and filter changes.
The joints are largely gasket free being designed to be fixed in the field(you only need a tube of something).

Offroad in low range it really sips the diesel and in 3-4 hours the fuel gauge barely moves.

It probably would not be the best diesel for the USA but they are ideal for continents like Australia or Africa where the roads are not great once you venture far from the city.

[quebeczuk]

Yeah Rosco these are the Mercedes number's.

Like you said, Toyota's 1HZ is putting out 130HP @ 3800rpm and I said earlier 310ft-lbf but it's 210ft-lbf @ 2200rpm.

And to travel the world, there's no need to have more power than necessary.

[roscoFJ73]

I'd hate to drive and drive my jeep down the interstate with that thing powering it...

I was thinking the same thing about taking a Jeep offroad:smokin:

[roscoFJ73]

Yeah Rosco these are the Mercedes number's.

Like you said, Toyota's 1HZ is putting out 130HP @ 3800rpm and I said earlier 310ft-lbf but it's 210ft-lbf @ 2200rpm.

And to travel the world, there's no need to have more power than necessary.

x2 I drove my Landcruiser from Perth to Alice Springs via Ayers Rock last year on the dirt roads in central oz.
Couldnt get over 90kph very often due the dust and herds of camels on the road.
Expedition vehicles are nearly always loaded to the hilt and spend much of their time on bad roads.
Trying to get above safe limits is a disaster
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s188/roscoFJ73/th_perthtoalicesprings112.jpg (http://s152.photobucket.com/albums/s188/roscoFJ73/?action=view&current=perthtoalicesprings112.flv)

This blown tyre had us going sideways at 40 MPH

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s188/roscoFJ73/perthtoalicesprings111Small.jpg

[quebeczuk]

Talking about 70 series cruiser,

Should I go with a BJ (13BT) or HZJ (1HZ) and why.

What are the pros and cons of each engine.

[nicks90]

I'd hate to drive and drive my jeep down the interstate with that thing powering it...

Whats with the fascination with huge HP?
my landrover diesel only manages 111bhp, yet happily towed a fully loaded up twin horse box (two 18H hunters) at 60mph all day long to an event and back. Must have been almost 300miles round trip and never missed a beat. Only had to change down to 4th gear a couple of times on the steeper motorway hills - but still maintained 60 at all times.

thats whats required on a proper expedition truck, the ability to lug a heavy weight utterly reliably for long distances with minimal maintanence and the ability to fix it at the side of the road with a hammer and a tube of superglue!
The toyota and nissan engines are perfect for that role. Hence why every man and his dog in australia and africa use them! Plus they use very little fuel when compared to a big V8.

If you want to tour the world, you'd be hard pressed to beat a decent long wheebase yota or nissan with a diesel.
if you want to tour north american freeways - fine, get a 4 tonne truck with a 300bhp V8 and load it up with another 4 tonnes of expedition gear (bbq, full size freezer, jacuzzi, tv room, etc).......

[quebeczuk]

Whats with the fascination with huge HP?

Welcome to America where you need to turn heads to feel important and be happy. :laughing:

[Mongoose87]

Whats with the fascination with huge HP?

Welcome to America where you need to turn heads to feel important and be happy. :laughing:

Since when was 200hp huge HP, lol. The Mazda 6 I drive to work every day makes more than that.

[roscoFJ73]

Talking about 70 series cruiser,

Should I go with a BJ (13BT) or HZJ (1HZ) and why.

What are the pros and cons of each engine.

They are close when it comes to power but the 1HZ is still in production while the 13BT has been out of production since 1990.
So parts will be around for a lot longer.
However the larger 14B and 15B engines are still in production and are turbo ready.
I would still take the 6 cyl for its smoother power delivery and wider powerband.
The 1HZ is probably more widely sold around the world as most mining operations use them exclusively.
The 1HZ engine bay is very uncluttered,its like working on a 50s gasser where you can see the ground underneath the car.
Its vac pump,PS pump are built into the front of the engine.
The 13BT has the horrible vac pump at the rear of the alternator and is difficult to replace cheaply.
The 1HZ has aftermarket starters and 120amp alternators )that are identical to Toyotas and good quality(and cheap).

[quebecsamurai]

And how about weight, does it really makes a difference on a let's say an fj74 for a wheelbase reference.

[Velocewest]

Whats with the fascination with huge HP?


X2. Anyone who has done any significant off-highway distance would know that you'll see 60 mph/100 kph only rarely, on graded gravel roads. On two track, you seldom get over 40 mph. Reliability, economy and simplicity -- all at the top of the list. A 4bt or the Merc setup that MercedesRover has would be excellent on those points, and have more than adequate power.

I went on a 1000 mile trip in June that included 400+ miles off-highway. One of my friends has a RRC with a 300tdi engine, I've got the stock 3.9 gasser. We were carrying similar loads, and he had no problem on any of the trails we covered, plus he could generally outpace me on the smooth road stretches because with his foot on the floor he was getting 20mpg -- and I was getting 10mpg holding myself to a 60mph max. And he didn't need to carry 3 gerry cans full of fuel to be sure he would make the next filling station... I'm either doing a diesel swap or converting the truck to run on LNG.

[151fab]

Since when was 200hp huge HP, lol. The Mazda 6 I drive to work every day makes more than that.

You really know nothing about diesels, Hp, or torque. First, don't compare a Mazda V6 or I4 to a diesel and expect the HP ratings to transfer over usefully. Second, forget HP anyways it is a useless way to rate an engine. Third, Hp and torque, in any form of engine require fuel to produce. Driving around the world in a big cubic inch diesel that you shoe-horned into a jeep or smaller pickup will cost you unnecessary gas, weight, space. Not to mention you won't be able to work on it because it's hugging the inner fenders and jammed up against the radiator and firewall. You'll also break everything else on the drive train more often too with all that unusable torque.

You want a minimalist, reliable motor that has the torque to move your vehicle at an appropriate speed. Gears are there to get you over obstacles, get your weight and gearing correct and you would do fine with any of the Toyota, a 4BT, Nissan, etc.

if you still think all that extra "HP" is nesecery; take a look at the big diesels that are putting down 400,000-800,000 miles without failures. They are not the light, computer controled Fords and Chevys. They are the massive Cummins, Internationals, Mercedes, etc. They weigh too much for any expo rig but that weight is what makes them last. You can't have it both ways.

[Mongoose87]

You really know nothing about diesels, Hp, or torque. .Wow, you know me that well after reading just a few posts on an internet message board? Good job douchebag.
First, don't compare a Mazda V6 or I4 to a diesel and expect the HP ratings to transfer over usefully. Show me where I compared my V6 gas engine to a diesel engine.
Second, forget HP anyways it is a useless way to rate an engine. Third, Hp and torque, in any form of engine require fuel to produce. Driving around the world in a big cubic inch diesel that you shoe-horned into a jeep or smaller pickup will cost you unnecessary gas, weight, space. Not to mention you won't be able to work on it because it's hugging the inner fenders and jammed up against the radiator and firewall. You'll also break everything else on the drive train more often too with all that unusable torque. When did I say I wanted to put a big cubic inch diesel in my Jeep?

You want a minimalist, reliable motor that has the torque to move your vehicle at an appropriate speed. Gears are there to get you over obstacles, get your weight and gearing correct and you would do fine with any of the Toyota, a 4BT, Nissan, etc. I was already leaning towards a 4BT dummy

if you still think all that extra "HP" is nesecery; take a look at the big diesels that are putting down 400,000-800,000 miles without failures. They are not the light, computer controled Fords and Chevys. They are the massive Cummins, Internationals, Mercedes, etc. They weigh too much for any expo rig but that weight is what makes them last. You can't have it both ways. They also put down 500-650hp, HP does make a difference.

[Mercedesrover]

Whats with the fascination with huge HP?......

X3

125hp or so is plenty for an "overland" vehicle. We're not desert racing here.

This truck has only 75hp. How do you like that? This picture was taken on James Bay last year during a 4000 mile trip, 1100 miles of it on gravel road. Two people, two dogs and a month's worth of gear.

http://seriestrek.com/jamesbay/jb9.jpg

[151fab]

Wow, you know me that well after reading just a few posts on an internet message board? Good job douchebag.
Show me where I compared my V6 gas engine to a diesel engine.
When did I say I wanted to put a big cubic inch diesel in my Jeep?

I was already leaning towards a 4BT dummy

They also put down 500-650hp, HP does make a difference.

Here's where you said you knew less than you'de like about diesel. (I didn't mean to be harsh in my post, I meant to be a smart-ass.)
I may be in danger of sounding like an idiot but what is ULSD?

Here are the quotes I used to surmise that you are now looking for more than the 4 cylinder 4bt & 5 cylinder MB(I think its five?). (Other than the Toyota 6 cylinder diesel, anything else would be a shoe-horn fit.)
that are small enough to fit in a pickup/jeep, reliable, and make decent power?

Thats a little short on power if you ask me unless you were putting it in a Samurai.

I'd hate to drive and drive my jeep down the interstate with that thing powering it...

Here's where you compare your Mazda to a Diesel.
Since when was 200hp huge HP, lol. The Mazda 6 I drive to work every day makes more than that.

I reread my post and I don't think it's too harsh. You need to look at it with a little sarcasm in mind. Also, you calling me a "douchbag" after reading just a few of my posts as a response to thinking I didn't know you after a few of your posts is kinda ironic. Douchbag:flipoff2:

[sperkinsnwfl]

ultra low diesel fuel (ulsd) required for use in all 2007 and newer diesel engines by our government .. how do i know this you ask ?? i read the sticker on the diesel pumps lol :flipoff2:

[Mongoose87]

ultra low diesel fuel (ulsd) required for use in all 2007 and newer diesel engines by our government .. how do i know this you ask ?? i read the sticker on the diesel pumps lol :flipoff2:

Once someone posted it it a light came one, was having a brainfart.

How much do the toyota and nissan motors weigh?

[151fab]

You can find a ton of info about the Toyota Diesels at ih8mud.com. They have a whole section dedicated to just the Toyota diesels and the have a classified section with only diesel engines and their ancillaries. While your there check out the FJ40-45, FJ60-62, and FJ80s. Because they were offered outside the US with diesels they are an easy swap candidate. They would be a great rig for your purposes.

[mr. Smith]

ULSD = Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel (fuel)

[roscoFJ73]

And how about weight, does it really makes a difference on a let's say an fj74 for a wheelbase reference.

The MWB range are all about the same weight,1800-1900kg.
The engine weights of the 4 and 6 cyl,gasser or diesel are all around 300kg

[malcb]

perkins(makes CAT), cummins, isuzu and you could try the VW 1.9L

Perkins make perkins - owned by CAT but NOT a CAT engine. OK engines but a bit heavy for the power output compared to say the VW/AUDI turbo units.

[Patrol]

I'd say:

Toyota 1HZ
Toyota 1HD-T
Nissan TD42(T)
Nissan TD27
Nissan SD33(T) also available in the US and worldwide used in fork lifts etc.
VM 2.5 used in Jeeps and Chrysler Vans, needs very good cooling
Mercedes 5&6 Cyl. engines
Peugeot Diesels, very reliable and sold worldwide

[BAGDADEXPRESS]

I have read that the GM 6.5 diesel is used wordwide as a marine engine. There is even a place in Europe (Sweden, I think ) that specialises in the 6.5.

The gm 6.5 td can be found worldwide in marine and over the road versions. However, the most desirable for road/military/expedition are made from may 1999 forward and have the "506" cast into the engine valley. Engines built before may 1999 have a block cracking issue when overheated.

Marine versions can be had in 6.2 or 6.5 and hold up well because of the better cooling marine applications have.

[LRDisco]

well allow me to ramble...

You didn't state what vehicle you would be swapping into, so i'm going to cover several bases. If you are sticking with a full size truck, I would look at a Ford Super Duty. Instead of spending time and money on a swap, i would get a Ford and rebuild what you have. The 7.3 is a great engine and that is what I would get. I know some of you are probably thinking why not the dodge... well if you are shipping a vehicle around the world or planning some global expo, the dodges just suck to sit in. Thats a whole lotta miles in a real shitty seat. Is the Cummins the baddest diesel, yes. Do dodge interiors (where you spend the majority of your time) suck the biggest ass? Yes again. So I would rebuild a Ford over a Dodge. I would like to point out i am only speaking of the 99-04 i think Super Dutys that had the 7.3. Put a better IC, turbo, injectors, exhaust, stuff like that instead of a custom radiator, whatever.


You just wrote off an entire line of vehicles and engines based on a seat? Wouldn't it make more sense to, oh idunno, just swap seats?