I can get a Dana 70 front axle with 4:88 gears for $750. Is this a pretty good price? Is this a good axle? I got a GM 3/4 ton 10 bolt to go under my 75' GMC right now but been lookin at D60's and they go for $1000+ and say this D70 and thought this would be a better way to go then the 10 bolt and cheaper then the D60. Is there cross-over for this axle or would I need to modify to get Cross-over?

thanks yall

its all based on d60 stuff just bigger.


have you seen this axle yet?

is it closed or open knuckle?

no I haven't seen picture's yet, hopefully he'll post some tommrow.

Would it matter open or closed knuckle?

yup, i would drink my own piss before using a closed knuckle.

why's that?

drum brakes
kuckle seals leak horibly[espeicaly bad for florida swamp goobers]
goofy axle joints
on top of just all around hard to get parts for.

No way of upgrading to disc? I know I can do a disc brake swap on my 14 bolt FF rear for only $320.
Probley to upgrade for seals im sure.

Closed knuckle front D70's use small joints, small shafts, parts are expensive, etc.

Open knuckle front D70's are ridiculously rare and even then only parts of them are marginally stronger than a D60.

If its closed knuckle its not even worth half of $750.

sure you can. but why spend the money, now you are over what you would have spent on a d60 open. hell there are 2 open d70s on the board for sale now, im sure you could get them shipped for less than what you would piss away dicking witha closed knuckle.

Closed D70 = 1/2 ton shafts and joints.... it's not worth your time and you can't convert it over to anything strong without putting open d60 inner C's etc on it so you might as well pick up a open d60/70 to start with.

I have an opened D70 fron for the rear steer on my buggy. PO put it in and it is one stout setup. Now I have broken the outer shaft on it and have had a difficult time finding a replacement. Looks like it is going to end up being an D60 outer afterall.

I have an opened D70 fron for the rear steer on my buggy. PO put it in and it is one stout setup. Now I have broken the outer shaft on it and have had a difficult time finding a replacement. Looks like it is going to end up being an D60 outer afterall.

Dana 70 outers are the same thing as 35 spline Dana 60 outers. So why can you not find the shafts?

Dik

not shit i have 3 of them sitting on my floor. and those are stock, not to mention all the after market spanky ones available.

get pics!

yes, this all moot if it turns out to be a open knuckle.

its closed knuckle with durm's

Pass!!!!!

A local guy tried to sell one of those for $100 and no got no takers.

alrighty thanks yall

Closed knuckle front D70's use small joints, small shafts, parts are expensive, etc.

Open knuckle front D70's are ridiculously rare and even then only parts of them are marginally stronger than a D60.

If its closed knuckle its not even worth half of $750.

nothing in them is small. not the shafts. they dont use u joints they use a tracta joint. its a four piece joint that is really really wierd looking. no bearings what so ever just big pieces of metal rubbing against one another.

got mine at a junkyard for 200. im going to retube it to chevy specs and put 60 outers on it.

if its closed knuckle dont even bother with that shit. if it were cheap enough i would say retube it. but for your case i wouldnt mess with it. you would be better of just getting a rear dana 70 or 80 and starting with that.

Not to mention the tierod that is mounted behind the axle and hangs down lower than the housing.They are worth about ten cents a pound (unless scrap price has went up):D

Not to mention the tierod that is mounted behind the axle and hangs down lower than the housing.They are worth about ten cents a pound (unless scrap price has went up):Donly the new d70's from the kodiac's have the tie rod like you mentioned. all the old ones that are mentioned in this thread are the typical configuration.

only the new d70's from the kodiac's have the tie rod like you mentioned. all the old ones that are mentioned in this thread are the typical configuration.

taken from mr.n's page:

http://77cj.littlekeylime.com/img/dana70/Dana70_Front_closedknuckles_f7_12.jpg

the old dodges, and im pretty sure internationals too, had the tie rod in the back.

i wouldnt scrap any D70 front before checking if it had a two piece case (nice) or a power lock or detroit (even better)

Ive seen a few and had a few and all of them have had the tierod in the back.Im sure theres variations but all the closed knuckles/drum brakes 70's I've saw were that way.

why couldnt you just install some deadenbear/Crane C's on em

why couldnt you just install some deadenbear/Crane C's on em

You could, but you could also put inner c's on any retubed rear axle, 9" housing etc.

If you have to invest in new shafts, inner c's, knuckles, hubs, etc. why use the D70 center section at all?

I've got one crappy pics I know.

http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f27/M-1028/P1010210.jpg

http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f27/M-1028/P1010212.jpg

http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f27/M-1028/P1010211.jpg

It's out of an International
Closed knuckles
Drums
tie rod behind the axle
6.17 gears open
1310 yoke
shafts use the same u joint a 60's
shafts are 1.5" corse spline
Inner shafts are the same length as chevy inners, outers are ford length. Ford hubs will fit, you just need a spacer for the spindle nut to tighten it all up, and brackets made for the calipers.

carrier is the same as later 70's, so converting it to 35 spline should be easy.

even doing dedenbers you will spend a bunch of $$ just on spindles, bearings, hubs, rotors, calipers, etc. IT is cheaper to buy a D60 complete than to piece one together - although a built one will be all new components and probably stronger

i stand corrected.

so, an open(knuckle) D70 with 35 spline D60 outers is a stout setup? is it worth the hassle?

so, an open(knuckle) D70 with 35 spline D60 outers is a stout setup? is it worth the hassle?

No, dipshit.

As the model numbers get higher, the axles are weaker.
What you want is a Dana 30.

the pinion on a 70 has the same dimensions as the pinion on a 60, at least at the yoke. they use the same spline yokes; as a matter of fact, the yokes interchange.

so... if you have a 60 with 35 spline axles and stubs, it would be relatively close to the same as a 70, with the main exception being the ring gear diameter.

add 50-100 lbs for the 70, with no appreciable benefit in strength until you put big ol joints in the axles...

mind you, these comparisons are of open knuckle axles.

Closed knuckle stuff is drastically different, as the inner axles are 23 spline, and the ujoints are marginal in a 3/4 ton environment.

Sure you can upgrade... but like was stated before, you could use a 9 inch center section, weld tubes into it, gusset the fuck out of it, and have a lighter axle thats just as strong.

why couldnt you just install some deadenbear/Crane C's on em



I looked at doin that one time and the 70 tubes were larger in diameter than the 60 C's were.I dont remember how much right now but you would have had to either retube it or turn the tubes down to accept the 60 C's.

No, dipshit.

As the model numbers get higher, the axles are weaker.
What you want is a Dana 30.





:lmao:

I looked at doin that one time and the 70 tubes were larger in diameter than the 60 C's were.I dont remember how much right now but you would have had to either retube it or turn the tubes down to accept the 60 C's.





You mean machine the inner 'C's to except the larger tube???

Either/or :D

Either/or :D




Of the two, which one do you think would be 'better'?

again why do you want to spend
$1k on knuckles and c's
$200 for stubs
$600-800 for all of the outer stuff, hubs, spindles, bearings,
$300-500 for arms
$200 for a tie rod

plus the 750 for the axle to begin with. dont forget you now have to ge tthe axle sealed because closed knuckle use the ball to seal the housing.

when you could buy a d60 or even a oen d70 for $1000-1300
there are 2 people on the board selling built d70s right now.

Of the two, which one do you think would be 'better'?

Fawkin' bacon. DUH.



OF THE TWO, I'd turn the C's. Because it's easier. :flipoff2:

Fawkin' bacon. DUH.



OF THE TWO, I'd turn the C's. Because it's easier. :flipoff2:



That's what i was thinking.




Oh; And you copulate the bacon, eh :flipoff2: ?!!

Closed knuckle front D70's use small joints, small shafts, parts are expensive, etc.

Open knuckle front D70's are ridiculously rare and even then only parts of them are marginally stronger than a D60.

If its closed knuckle its not even worth half of $750.

All of the closed knuckle Dana 70 fronts that I've worked on had 1.50" inners, 1.375" outers and the ones with u-joints were 1480s. They have their problems but none of the ones that you mentioned.

Gus

the pinion on a 70 has the same dimensions as the pinion on a 60, at least at the yoke. they use the same spline yokes; as a matter of fact, the yokes interchange.

so... if you have a 60 with 35 spline axles and stubs, it would be relatively close to the same as a 70, with the main exception being the ring gear diameter.

add 50-100 lbs for the 70, with no appreciable benefit in strength until you put big ol joints in the axles...

mind you, these comparisons are of open knuckle axles.

Closed knuckle stuff is drastically different, as the inner axles are 23 spline, and the ujoints are marginal in a 3/4 ton environment.

Sure you can upgrade... but like was stated before, you could use a 9 inch center section, weld tubes into it, gusset the fuck out of it, and have a lighter axle thats just as strong.

Have you actually looked in a closed knuckle 70? I've worked on several and they were all 1.50" 35 spline inners, the IH versions were 1480 series joints without seals on the trunions and the stock outers were 1.375".

Gus

Have you actually looked in a closed knuckle 70? I've worked on several and they were all 1.50" 35 spline inners, the IH versions were 1480 series joints without seals on the trunions and the stock outers were 1.375".

Gus

closed knuckle 70s have necked down shafts.

Have you actually looked in a closed knuckle 70? I've worked on several and they were all 1.50" 35 spline inners, the IH versions were 1480 series joints without seals on the trunions and the stock outers were 1.375".

Gus


I have worked on severial. All had eather had a d44 sized u-joint with neck down/course spline shafts or that funky CV style joint. I have herd rumers of a large shaft/joint combo but never seen them. Personaly they are of no interest to me because the brakes/closed knuckles. I might as well get a rear axle and retube it...

closed knuckle 70s have necked down shafts.

True, they have necked down shafts like the early open knuckle 60s had but they were still 1.50 at the splines and the IH versions had 1480 joints.

Gus

I have worked on severial. All had eather had a d44 sized u-joint with neck down/course spline shafts or that funky CV style joint. I have herd rumers of a large shaft/joint combo but never seen them. Personaly they are of no interest to me because the brakes/closed knuckles. I might as well get a rear axle and retube it...

Up till the late 60s the Dana 70s used 23 splines, by 1970 or so they had switched to 35 spline, all of the IH Dana 70s that I've been into had 1.50/35 spline axles with 1480 series joints, the Dodges used the Tracta Joints. While the 70s that I've worked on had several problems like the tierod behind the axle and under the pinion. Drum brakes that are a pain to change over to discs, poor turning that is inherent with the closed knuckle 70s. In addition to the other problems the older ones used .500 inch offset pinions which make getting gears a little more interesting at times. While these are problems and I wouldn't use one of these axles myself, I have never seen one with the small u-joints and only a couple of the older version 23 spline axles. Just my experience, after working on several of these axles.

Gus

Just my experience, after working on several of these axles.

Gus

Thanks for providing us with your experience, Gus.

Would you like to tell me again that the pinion sizes are the same as a dana 60? I think they are, since the yokes interchange... so, strengthwise, the axle is relatively a duplicate with a bigger ring gear. oh... and drum brakes suck.

but thats my experience.

The 70 I have would be easy to make stronger than an open knuckle 60.

Like I said above Get a 35 spline diff for a 70, get a set of Chevy inner 35sp axles ,and a set of ford 35sp outers, Ford rotor, hub assembly, and drive flanges or locking hub. THERE IS NO REASON TO CUT THE KNUCKLES OFF. The Ford stuff WILL BOLT ON with a spacer in between the spindle nut and the outter bearing. The biggest problem is getting a caliper connected to the knuckle, but with a little work it shouldn't be a problem.

You would have about $1000 into the axle and is stronger than a 60. Besides The weak link in most 60's is the R&P once you do cromos, and the 70 is definatly beefier in that area.

This is for the IH 70 I have others may be different.

No, dipshit.

As the model numbers get higher, the axles are weaker.
What you want is a Dana 30.

ok, awesome thanks, ill go buy a jeep and jack it up then. maybe ill find one in a full size width for my blazer! so i guess that means the 14bolt FF in the rear should be taken back out and a 10 bolt put back in? also i guess that means i should run taller gears with taller tires, cuz well taller and taller right? gotta be, why would you run a lower gear ratio with a taller tire. doent make sense.

thanks for bringing this to my attention, i was about to waste my money on a front axle when i can get a stonger one for a 1/3 the price. dana 30s are everywhere! :flipoff2: jackass

Thanks for providing us with your experience, Gus.

Would you like to tell me again that the pinion sizes are the same as a dana 60? I think they are, since the yokes interchange... so, strengthwise, the axle is relatively a duplicate with a bigger ring gear. oh... and drum brakes suck.

but thats my experience.

Yes the pinion splines are the same size, however the inner end of the pinion shaft and the inner pinion bearing are considerably larger on a 70 and therefore pinion deflection are less of an issue with a 70 compared to a 60. As I stated there are a lot of problems with a closed knuckle 70 and drum brakes are just one of the problems, especially if you're running in a lot of mud and water. They can be a stronger alternative to a Dana 44 if you can pick one up for little to nothing and you don't mind living with their shortcomings. As an alternative to an open knuckle 60 they are a waste of time.

Are you old or just grumpy?:flipoff2:

Gus

I'm grumpy.

I'm grumpy.


No Kidding. :flipoff2:

:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:

ok, awesome thanks, ill go buy a jeep and jack it up then. maybe ill find one in a full size width for my blazer! so i guess that means the 14bolt FF in the rear should be taken back out and a 10 bolt put back in? also i guess that means i should run taller gears with taller tires, cuz well taller and taller right? gotta be, why would you run a lower gear ratio with a taller tire. doent make sense.

thanks for bringing this to my attention, i was about to waste my money on a front axle when i can get a stonger one for a 1/3 the price. dana 30s are everywhere! :flipoff2: jackass

Just make sure that the 10 bolt has a govlock in it. You wouldn't want an open rear diff would you?