!!!!!!Updated with my solution!!!!!!

The background:
I have a 71 cruiser that I had upgraded the stock axles on and while doing that, I did an SOA, spring flip, and shackle reversal. I rotated the pinion to 13-14 degrees, redid the caster to + 4-6 and done. I did new hangers by ruffstuff, etc. etc.

So now I shortened a front 60 to 64.5" and took out the stockers but b/c I flipped the front springs (center pin foward) and did the SR, my 60's pinion barely hits level 0 degrees under load (unweighted the pinion points down) even though the GM 60 has a factory pinion angle of 10 deg IIRC. I don't really have the time nor do I want to 3 or 4 link the front. I want to keep it on leaves. Solutions.......

I know that I can use caster shims, but I don't really want to use 12 degree shims :eek:

I can shim 4-8 degrees and live with it

I can redrill and flip the spring back to stock (not sure how much it will help)

I can put the shackles back on the front (but I like he SR and spent time and money doing it)

What do you guys think? Any other suggestions?

Post pics of your setup. They would definitely help figure out a viable solution.

Aside from modifying the cast in spring pad on the 60,you may be able to gain a couple degree's by shortening your shackle or lowering the spring hanger or a combination of both.

Post pics.

even though the GM 60 has a factory pinion angle of 10 deg IIRC.
Are you sure on that?:confused:

That number seems VERY off. I seem to recall the GM housing I had in my possession having close to zero pinion angle from the factory. My shortened Dodge housing definitely is zero and bolted up with the stock pad fine.

You can always weld a large caster shim on the fixed pad and then weld the driver mount at the right degree.

Castor is the important #. You can use shims, but with the two bolts in the housing, you have to use opposing shims on that side, to keep the bolts straight and in plane with the housing. If the castor is way off, you can also turn the knuckles.

I have the shims if you need them.

What degrees do you have? I need probably 6-8 deg and 4 of them......and remember when you looked at my front setup and said "you should put the hanger inside the frame rail like mine" . Looks like I'll be doing that now :flipoff2:

mine was at 12* so i shimed it 8*.....now drives perfectly at 4* caster
post 155 of my build thread(below) shows the 8*shims....and yes use opposing shims to keep the load even on the studs , in fact use opposing shims on both springs as this will keep a square load on the spring center pins........ infact save yourself some time and drill and tap a third hole between the studs on the center section because you WILL break them if you don't. use a 9/16 d44 stud......easier to do it with the axle out but it can be done with it in

good luck

glenn

mine was at 12* so i shimed it 8*.....now drives perfectly at 4* caster
post 155 of my build thread(below) shows the 8*shims....and yes use opposing shims to keep the load even on the studs , in fact use opposing shims on both springs as this will keep a square load on the spring center pins........ infact save yourself some time and drill and tap a third hole between the studs on the center section because you WILL break them if you don't. use a 9/16 d44 stud......easier to do it with the axle out but it can be done with it in

good luck

glenn


I used CAT bolts and they've been holding strong

I used CAT bolts and they've been holding strong


wilson what are those? ( cat bolt).... maybe i should use those with my third stud:D



sorry for the hi jack

bolts made by and sold through a CAT (Caterpillar) dealer. I've got a friend in the equipment repair business and he swears by those bolts. He bet if I ran the CAT bolts I wouldn't need the third stud/botls, so I gave it a try. Another guy in our club is running them on for the bottom bolts on his kingpins with dually hubs. They hardly looked scratched afer 5yrs.

i have used Cat bolts for a few things on my rig...you can get them in grade 10 up to a certain size

I talked to Trevor at WFO and he recommended 8* shims (3 of them though, maybe I should get the 4th :shaking:) and is sending me "some bomber studs" that he hasn't seen break yet. I was thinkin about doing the third stud but I am using the stock plates and they have that huge hump in the middle. I'm also going to relocate the spring hanger thru the frame and should gain 2-3* by doing that which would put me around 4-6* caster :D

pooze.....you got 1 or 2 - 8* shims?

Mine is through the frame with a 4.5" shackle, 0 lift springs and no shims. Drives like a dream with unbalanced 42" iroks

trevors the one that told me to go a third stud....... i have his stud kit in there as well.

is the third shim to oppose the one under the spring(pass side)?... if it is i recomend you get a fourth for the drivers side ......i was bending spring center pins(drivers) until i put the opposing shim in that side too

you can use 6* for the top shim if you can't find 8*..... works fine on mine

wilson i have a buddy that works on heavy equipement as well , i'll have to hit him up for the cat bolts..... he swears by CAT equip:smokin:

I got the third stud kit from Trevor but he assures me that I only need one shim on the long tube side cause the ubolt can tilt since it has a round bottom and it does not put any uneven pressure on it......he's a mechanical engineer, so I'll believe him for now :D......I'll throw a shim on there if I have problems...thanx for the third stud idea Rock the dog :smokin:

ya you put one on the bottom and top so it evens it out after. sinces the studs are in the housing that doesnt move.

Enlighten me on the third stud concept. Is this third stud hole drilled at an angle to match the degree shims? Or is drilled the same as the others and just added for strength?

fyresq mentioned above that he bought a kit for the 3rd stud. Does this come with the stud and a new spring plate?

The third stud is added for strength, since the two studs (originally bolts) can break under extreme duty, so people drill a third stud in the middle and they do have different spring plates for them (Ruff Stuff and WFO carry them for sure). I put in a Dana 44 stud because it is a 9/16's fine thread vs. the 60's coarse thread. And I drilled it straight b/c when I did the shims, I did opposing ones top and bottom which kept the spring plate level and the studs straight......

So I added 8* shims and relocated the spring hanger into the frame sucking up 2"
Before
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc111/bradyb4/x16.jpg
After...the shackle will have a little more angle when the v8 is in
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc111/bradyb4/x18.jpg

And the caster change
Before
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc111/bradyb4/x17.jpg
After, at +6* caster, but should be 4-5* with the weight of the motor in
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc111/bradyb4/x19.jpg

looks more like mine, with the same steering setup.

For those of you that want to run the CAT bolts, post up with a size and I can give you the CAT part#. There high strength bolts are rated at minimum 170,000 psi. The same as the track bolts.

righton markie! there's a cat dealer not far from my shop. always good to have more resources.......

looks more like mine, with the same steering setup.




mine too:D

For those of you that want to run the CAT bolts, post up with a size and I can give you the CAT part#. There high strength bolts are rated at minimum 170,000 psi. The same as the track bolts.



is there diff types of CAT bolts mark?

my buddy asked his cat salesman the other day and he told him they were grade 8:confused:

he got me some anyway:p

Just 2 types that I know Glenn, the normal CAT bolt will meet or exceed a grade 8 bolt with minimum tensile of 150,000 psi. It has 6 dashes on the head. The heads are 20% taller than an average bolt.

The "High Strength" CAT bolts have 7 dashes on the head.

Just an FYI they have 12 point and hex socket(allen) bolts that are rated at the same as the high strength bolts. :smokin:

Track bolts have a high dome to the head.

Metric ones will have a 10.9 or 11.9 for high strength.

3/4" x 3.5" IIRC

3B-2968 Thats the high strength bolt p/n.

Just 2 types that I know Glenn, the normal CAT bolt will meet or exceed a grade 8 bolt with minimum tensile of 150,000 psi. It has 6 dashes on the head. The heads are 20% taller than an average bolt.

The "High Strength" CAT bolts have 7 dashes on the head.

Just an FYI they have 12 point and hex socket(allen) bolts that are rated at the same as the high strength bolts. :smokin:

Track bolts have a high dome to the head.

Metric ones will have a 10.9 or 11.9 for high strength.

Good info Top.

Here is some info on Cat bolts.
http://www.cat.com/cda/layout?m=37648&x=7

mine too:D

Hey rocthedog , I got the 5/8 11x3 , hope they work. But why didn't you ask for that center stud 9/16 x3 also? If you need it let me know :confused: Get more CAT bolts then we can talk diesel, then you will believe :D