hey everybody

just got 38s, and im thinking my stock steering box isn't going to be up to snuff

im thinking im going to go with this ram
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2008102019454374&item=9-4410-08&catname=hydraulic

does anybody sell a good weld on mount, and clamp for tie rod

also will the stock waggy tie rod be strong enough. it seems pretty beefy for being stock, or will i have to build my steering out of DOM

im going to try to drill and tap the stock box myself.

whats a reasonable amount to spend if i dont need to redo my steering. im thinking around 120?

search again

I spent like $150, i'm only posting this to whore my own stuff.

I have a complete tierod, draglink, hydro assist package that I will be selling soon for a driver drop waggy axle, if you are interested 1.25 DOM and 1 ton tre's, tapped box, lines and ram...


http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=55711

Had it bookmarked, that should save you some time....

yea..ive been using that thread as a reference to some of the materials. anyway you would sell just the drag link, tie rod, and hydro assist without the box?

so does hydro assist take most of the stress off of the frame while turning?? since the ram is helping mounted on the axle? I'm asking because i'm looking for a solution for my junk, not wanting to go full hydro...

I went with this kit.
http://www.trail-gear.com/hydro-ram-kit.html
For 200 bucks I got brackets, hoses, fittings, and a ram that had adjustable ends and grease fittings along with all the spacers and what not.

I also drilled the main fitting on my pump to 5/16" and tightened the nut on the piston to increase the pressure.
I picked up a junk yard steering box from a 99 durango so I would have the 3.5" piston to move more fluid volume. Drilled and tapped the box without taking it apart by using a large welding magnet near the bit to draw out the shavings.
I picked up a cooler and magnetic filter from summit.

I would have to say it was a pretty easy mod.
It definiatly takes some stress off the unibody because the ram is now doing the pushing. You just wouldn't believe how nice it is. I wish I had done it a long time ago.

ohhh...i like that

i think ill order it

thanks

i guess if my stock steering doesn't hold up, ill build it out of DOM

so with hydro assist do you need another reservoir or just the one on the ps pump?

I have this.

http://www.ballisticfabrication.com/OD-Tube-Clamp_p_21-1474.html

In the 1.25 variety to match my tie rod. I just modified some brackets, I should have just made them. Doing it with the clamp means if I bend the tie rod I can jsut unbolt it, and put the spare tie rod on and still have assist.

Mine is not complete so don't ask how it works yet.

check out psc...there stuff isnt that expensive...the one way rams are like like 125.00 and up....

so with hydro assist do you need another reservoir or just the one on the ps pump?


Iuse a small cooler as my resevoir :D

okay so i'm goin with hydro assist. Ive got a tapped YJ box and that's it. So with my rockwells i measured 9" of steering throw. So can anyone recommend what 10" ram i need to use? size of shaft etc....

Or should i go with an 8" ram only because im limited by the steering box stops?? I dont know how much throw an xj box has??

okay so i'm goin with hydro assist. Ive got a tapped YJ box and that's it. So with my rockwells i measured 9" of steering throw. So can anyone recommend what 10" ram i need to use? size of shaft etc....

Or should i go with an 8" ram only because im limited by the steering box stops?? I dont know how much throw an xj box has??

^^anybody?

^^anybody?

Dude with the package you have you need full hydro. Think about packaging and the pinion brake in the way. You are trying to build a bad ass rig with out spending money. It will become this.

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/Misc%20goofy%20stuff/trainwreck.jpg

I hate to break it to you this is an expensive sport. You will have to come up off some money. There are ways and places to save money. Steering is not one of them. You have the potential to build a nice rig. Sit back and make a plan. But I assume you won't take this advice as you haven't taken any other advice given to you. This is not to come down on you just to point out the obvious to the rest of us.

Its not that i'm not taking advice, i know what could possibly be in the way, I'm moving the steering box forward a little so it will clear the pinion brake. I dont want full hydro, i want a mechanical link in my steering, so im choosing hydraulic assist. So i guess i'm on my own. I'll figure it out.

okay so i'm goin with hydro assist. Ive got a tapped YJ box and that's it. So with my rockwells i measured 9" of steering throw. So can anyone recommend what 10" ram i need to use? size of shaft etc....
I was considering this ram=
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2008110522414742&item=9-7258-10&catname=hydraulic

Or should i go with an 8" ram only because im limited by the steering box stops?? I dont know how much throw an xj box has??

have you talked to matt at westtexasoffroad.com??? i talked to him about rigging up my plans for assisted steering and it is more than obvious he has got it all down. btw, he runs rockwells with 47's... he'll know what to do for sure...

okay so i'm goin with hydro assist. Ive got a tapped YJ box and that's it. So with my rockwells i measured 9" of steering throw. So can anyone recommend what 10" ram i need to use? size of shaft etc....
I was considering this ram=
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2008110522414742&item=9-7258-10&catname=hydraulic

Or should i go with an 8" ram only because im limited by the steering box stops?? I dont know how much throw an xj box has??


All boxes have the same throw. You can adjust the amount of travel with the length of the pitman arm.

Look at this for example.

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/Other%20Jeeps%20type%20pics/pitmanarmtohighsteerarm.jpg

You'll need to see what the rockwells have then get the pitman are that matches. You should be able to measure the arm on the rockwell and match that.

My hydro assist is up and has been trail tested.

I ordered this cooler from Summit

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=FLX%2D3818&N=700+4294924500+400226+115&autoview=sku

I have a yj box drilled and tapped for 3/8" NPT

I have the inner frame plated.

I have this Tie Rod Bracket.

http://www.ballisticfabrication.com/OD-Tube-Clamp_p_21-1474.html

I did the West Texas Pump Mod.

http://westtexasoffroad.homestead.com/powersteering.html

I have this cylinder.

http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2007040810283306&item=9-4410-08&catname=hydraulic

SPECIFICATIONS
Double Acting
Bore/Stroke 1 1/2" x 8"
2,000 PSI max
Rod dia 3/4"

Ports 3/8" NPT
Retracted Length 13 1/2"
Shpg. 10 lbs.

END MOUNTINGS
Rod End Crosstube
Pin hole 3/4"
1-1/4" cross-tube width

Base End Crosstube
Pin hole 3/4"
2" cross-tube width

I will also need to do an internal stop on the cylinder for 7 1/8" travel. Some say this isn’t necessary due to the box having an internal relief when it hits the internal stops. However I have my knuckle stops hitting before the box reaches the internal stops, so if I kept turning with the assist I’d push my knuckles right off the inner-c’s eventually as the ball joints can only take so much. So I took the cylinder apart and added this metal sleeve.

Before

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/cylinderinternalstop1.jpg

After

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/cylinderinternalstop3.jpg

Also why we are on the cylinder as this axle is very tight I needed to rotate the fixed end 90 deg so I could have the hoses coming out of the top of the cylinder. I had to cut it off and re-weld it on.

Started like this.

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/cylinderbefore1.jpg

90 deg rotated

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/cylinderafter1.jpg

Lastly on the cylinder I didn’t want to use a ¾” bolt so I sleeved the ends with bronze down to ½”

Here is a pic of the frame plating ¼”.

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/steeringboxbrace3.jpg

New box bolted in.

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/steeringbox1.jpg

Axle brackets welded on.

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/bracket003.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/bracket002.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/bracket001.jpg

Cooler installed. I put it on the passenger side as it is the side with the mechanical fan and will be pulling air constantly.

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/cylindercooler2.jpg

The cooler is plumbed off the return line from the box to the top fitting on the cooler. The lower fitting goes to the reservoir on the pump.

I went to the local Parker store for the hose and ends. I may have gone a little overkill on these, but the hose is 4700lb hose reinforced with 3 layers of wire mesh. I had to cut it with a chop saw. I also used reusable ends. As a result if I have a broken line on the trail I can take out my spare line and put the ends on and call it good.

I prefilled everything I could with fluid. This would make bleeding much easier. As for fluid I have heard many things work well, but all agree that Amsoil Synthetic Power Steering Fluid works the best. Some problems are that most people go through growing pains when they first install the hydro assist and have to replace the fluid a couple times and that you can’t get it on the trail or at a part store. Well I bit the bullet and bought a case of it. This way I’ll carry my own and have enough to redo it a couple of times.

Bleeding procedure taken from here.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/PR-Hydro_Steering/index3.html
Once you have everything installed and plumbed, it's time to fill and bleed. The procedure I discovered works well is:
1. Fill reservoir to just over tip of column
2. Raise front tires off ground to remove resistance
3. Turn steering wheel lock-to-lock while constantly checking the reservoir for air bubbles and level drop. Top us as necessary - be careful not to over-fill. When no more air appears to bubble out and the level remains constant, go to step 4
4. Check fluid level in reservoir, disconnect coil wire, and crank engine over to operate pump and flow fluid through entire circuit. Crank in short bursts. When no more air appears to bubble out and the level remains constant, go to step 5
5. Re-connect coil wire.
6. Check fluid level in reservoir and start engine. Operate at low rpm's at first, do not turn steering wheel. After a few seconds shut down engine and check reservoir. It will likely look like the pic at left, frothy and full of air bubbles. Allow bubbles to dissipate (can take upwards of an hour) and repeat this step until frothing does not occur.
7. Check fluid level in reservoir and start engine. Operate steering lock-to-lock while constantly checking the reservoir for air bubbles and level drop. Top us as necessary - be careful not to over-fill. When no more air appears to bubble out and the level remains constant, go to step 8
8. Top up reservoir, install reservoir cap, lower front tires to ground.
Here you can see everything installed. You can see how tight the clearances are.

Turned right

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/complete006.jpg

Turned left

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/complete001.jpg

Front shots

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/complete005.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/complete002.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k51/hadfield4wd/My%20Jeep/complete004.jpg

so ideally you want pitman arm hole end -hole end the same as center of knuckle to draglink hole on high steer arm?

yes

Welding in crocks huh?
Nice.

Welding in crocks huh?
Nice.


Those are my work crocs. I have dress ones too.:smokin:

I will also need to do an internal stop on the cylinder for 7 1/8" travel. Some say this isn’t necessary due to the box having an internal relief when it hits the internal stops. However I have my knuckle stops hitting before the box reaches the internal stops, so if I kept turning with the assist I’d push my knuckles right off the inner-c’s eventually as the ball joints can only take so much. So I took the cylinder apart and added this metal sleeve.



You are correct. With no limit in travel, you are safe to have a ram longer than your steering throw. The relief valve as Matt said will limit the travel of the ram, so make sure that it is centered on the rams throw when you install it on the tie rod. If you have a situation like Matt does, you will indeed destroy stuff if you're not carefull. Generally, for most axles, you'll be safe with an 8" throw ram.

so on my ram, when extending, I made the ram not fully extend, about 1/4 before it fully extends, should I have made it fully extend and fully compress?

so on my ram, when extending, I made the ram not fully extend, about 1/4 before it fully extends, should I have made it fully extend and fully compress?

Max that depends. If your box hits the internal stops it goes into bypass. Then you should be fine. Like I said I have the knuckle stops adjusted so the tires don't hit the control arms so my box doesn't go into bypass.

my box stops before my steering stops hit...which needs to be fixed as well

my box stops before my steering stops hit

You should be fine then.

which needs to be fixed as well

The more I do the more needs to be fixed. The list just keeps growing.:shaking:

by box i mean steering box...not hydro ram

by box i mean steering box...not hydro ram


I know. The steering box has internal stops in it. When I hits those it goes into bypass.

A hydraulic ram has no bypass by itself.

Subscribing.... for later. :)

Max,

Also if you're worried it is real easy to internally stop the ram. I got the sleeve I posted above from Lowes, cut it to the proper length. Pulled the ram apart and put it in. Took less than an hour.

should i go with a psc 8" ram that has the adjustable rod ends for mounting ($125) or go with a swivel eye cylinder from surpluscenter($85)?-
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2008121023520068&item=9-7258-8&catname=hydraulic

Trail Gear has ram with adjustable hiems on it.

Trail Gear has ram with adjustable hiems on it.

yes and it costs more than the psc ram with the same features.

should i go with a psc 8" ram that has the adjustable rod ends for mounting ($125) or go with a swivel eye cylinder from surpluscenter($85)?-
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2008121023520068&item=9-7258-8&catname=hydraulic


Since you are cheap and can't seem to make a decision just buy the cheapest one you can find. :shaking:

You'll probably never get your rig done anyway.

Since you are cheap and can't seem to make a decision just buy the cheapest one you can find. :shaking:

You'll probably never get your rig done anyway.

ouch!

Since you are cheap and can't seem to make a decision just buy the cheapest one you can find. :shaking:

You'll probably never get your rig done anyway.


oh well i might as well just carry it to the scrap metal scales.... :flipoff2:

fukwad

IMO, those surplus center rams wont last nearly as long as a ram designed for steering. What is 40$ for a quality product? I only have about $250 in my setup and it works awesome. Not to mention, the PSC ram Is completely rebuildable and parts are easy to get.

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g312/crzyxj/XJ003.jpg
And it looks cool too! :eek: