I was hoping someone could help me on a design to do a triangulated fourlinker with 37" tires and keep my 100" wheelbase on my II and I want to work on my stock axles and later full width 60s

do I smell fire?..


First, there are months, even years, worth of reading on how to design and tools to use to figure out proper geometry. If you are unaware of the tools and requirements to build one, you might try a kit and weld it in.

Second, if you spend an hour reading here you will find this type of inquiry is never responded to as you wish it would. If you have a plan, it is best to elaborate on your needs and how you plan to tackle the task.

I am in the middle of my first IH build, not my first build, and I find that I can find most support from threads already
posted, just pick one and revive it if it fits your needs.

do I smell fire?
WTF :confused:



Viking, your going to get it, so I might as well start it.... search. This site (all of Pirate 4x4) is probably the most comprehensive data collection of how to link a 4x4 offroad rig on the web. That's good, but also a lot to wade through.


There is also no "one" answer. There are MANY different ways and geometries to a link suspension, and no one is superior to the rest. There are 'better' than the rest, but they all are a balance of performance trade offs.

Spend some time wallowing in the search function (mostly Gen 4x4) and start your reading.

The down in dirty is to get 4 links, and put them were they fit, but some basic structure and placement knowledge will be required. Look for some of the LONG threads in Gen Tech and be prepared to filter out the BS.


Baring that, D&C/Damian/Snoopy *used* to make a link "Kit" for Scouts. Not a bad kit, not cheap, but as close to "bolt on" as a Scout gets. Don't know if he still makes them, but I suspect he does/would/might.



No one's going to spoon feed you the answer... partly because there is no "right" answer, and mostly because thats just not the way we roll :flipoff2:

funny you caught that before I could fix it....damn enter key.

You need to hang aroung the J@@p hardcore forum just to get some ideas. There are a couple of good discusions on four link tech in the FAQ try there. Then download a link calculator and start playing.

Can't be done!!! Just set your rig on fire at the local gravel pit then walk home....Forget the whole thing.:(

I knew there was a smell of fire....

37" and 100" wheel base is going to be tough with out some major sheet metal mods. It would be easier to just only cut the fenders, but you then you would need to push the axles fore and aft some. I find the front is tight and not wanting to cut into the cab for tire room, I move the axle forward a bit. Same with the rear, it was easier to just cut one side of the fender so I move that back about 4"



copy this build up http://www.ihonlynorth.com/forums/ih-only-build-ups/442-pds-drivetrain-upgrade.html

yea looking at your build answerd alot of what i was stuck on with mounts and the trac bar im sure ill have to stretch the wb i just dont want a whole lot and have something that looks like it cant make up its mind whether it wants to be a buggy or a truck

What I found out, for me anyways and the style of all around wheeling I do, is
careful calculation based on ride height, tire size and ride characteristics that "I" desired. My links are adjustable in regards to location points and length so I can play with it and set it up for different traction requirements. So far I have found a configuration that is working decent in most scenarios.

In my case, it is mostly maintaining control over speed bumps at the Mall. :homer:



Then you start from there and do it over till you get it right.

im sure once i get it set up itll take months to get it tuned in but whatever i do the road manners cant be any worse than how they are now

im sure once i get it set up itll take months to get it tuned in but whatever i do the road manners cant be any worse than how they are now
Don't tell yourself that. Sure they can.

I know a couple buddies who's early link set ups (back when linking a 4x4 rig for hardcore offroad was "new") that had horrible manners. However, with even the basic info in this board, you should be able to toss together something passable for a start.

There are several 'Tech threads' in FAQ about 4-linking your Scout. Take a look. The FAQ is one of the top threads in the forum.

since the topic fits what I am looking for I am bringing this back up, of course there is no tech really here so looking for some :p

4400 pound scout 80, just entertaining the rear 4-link idea.

What did they use on powerblock?

Are you telling us you could not find info about a 4 link.

nope, tons of it - just looking for info on a scout 80/800. Don't imagine it is any different but I could see where people mounted links etc.

Surfin away at tons of buildups right now..


These brackets look pretty slick and the price is pretty good, Ballistic has some beefy joints too. Of course there is Dan for brackets too - lots of options.. too many :p

http://www.ballisticfabrication.com/Axle-link-coil-mount-brackets-40241_p_1444.html#

What did they use for numbers or hardware? As for numbers the last episode they drop the springs to, crap can't remeber exactly. As to the hardware is was D&CExtreme 4 link kit. You really need to watch the first episode as they did some mods to the 4 link as the kit is not a "bolt" on option. You need to figure out some details and radius the end of the truss to fit the axle tube.

nope, tons of it - just looking for info on a scout 80/800. Don't imagine it is any different but I could see where people mounted links etc.

Surfin away at tons of buildups right now..


These brackets look pretty slick and the price is pretty good, Ballistic has some beefy joints too. Of course there is Dan for brackets too - lots of options.. too many :p

http://www.ballisticfabrication.com/Axle-link-coil-mount-brackets-40241_p_1444.html#

Brandon, I'd go simpler or more complex, here is complex

http://www.ballisticfabrication.com/assets/images/newbrackets/ultimatebracket1.jpg

This gives you the lower shock mount

And simpler. Add straight tabs for the axle lower link mount (and a ton of other things)
http://www.ballisticfabrication.com/assets/images/newbrackets/coilplatemount.jpg


I wanted to keep lower coil mount as close to the axle tube as possible. I am very happy with my rear set up with the exception of the upper shock mount, which needs to be higher.

Here's the build.


http://www.binderplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52069&highlight=link

endless amounts of fab parts, sheez..

just looking at trusses and upper link at the axle ideas

http://www.genright.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=RSM4044
http://www.polyperformance.com/shop/Universal-Rear-Axle-Truss-p-17172.html
http://bluetorchfab.com/store/product_info.php?products_id=172
http://www.ballisticfabrication.com/Rear-Dana-60-Truss_p_1487.html
http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/heavy-weight-truss-p-118.html

definitely no shortage on options..

Clean kit
http://www.genright.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=R4LINKKIT

Trail gear has a kit for yotas too.

I did a three link with panhard bar. My exhaust was in the way to do a four link or triangulated three link. If I was to do it again I would probably try to do a triangulated lower links with straight uppers and get away for the panhard bar. I used ballistic coil brackets on the axle and built the rest of the mounts myself. I used TJ 3 1/2" rear lift springs. (they were free). Handles great on the road, I'll see how it does wheeling next month when I take it to Hollister.

More pics.

If it handles great (and it obviously articulates well) why would you change it? I have some serious body roll - soft springs and too much shackle angle I think. About how much $$ do you have into it? Where did you get those joints from? Looks great!

My exhaust is in the way too, I could probably figure out a way to make it work though..

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=473520&stc=1&d=1256013945

As to the hardware is was D&CExtreme 4 link kit. You really need to watch the first episode as they did some mods to the 4 link as the kit is not a "bolt" on option. You need to figure out some details and radius the end of the truss to fit the axle tube.
There is no such thing as a 'bolt-on' 4-link. And if you do find one, it'll probably be for a Jeep. Relatively minor fab work will be required, such as welding and as noted, coping the truss. Come to think of it ~ anyone know of a bolt-on Reverse Shackle? How about a cut-n-turn. Needless to say, anything worth while ~ weather you buy a 'kit' or piece it together yourself ~ will require something more than turning a wrench.

If it handles great (and it obviously articulates well) why would you change it? I have some serious body roll - soft springs and too much shackle angle I think. About how much $$ do you have into it? Where did you get those joints from? Looks great!

My exhaust is in the way too, I could probably figure out a way to make it work though..

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=473520&stc=1&d=1256013945

I guess I worded that wrong. I am very happy with the way it turned out. It was just a lot more work doing it the way I did it. If I had done the triangulated lowers and straight uppers, I wouldn't have had to build the truss, panhard bar mounts, notching the crossmember to clear the upper link, and the tall cross member for the upper link. I do like the fact that my axle is now trussed, and that the diff is tied into the truss. The upper links are Ballistic Fab 3.0" ultra duty joints 1 1/4" shanks, the lowers are from Polyperformance. Summit Machine sm-fjxl 1 1/4"(frame end) and bushings on the axle end (ppm-4304). The lower coil buckets are from Ballistic. I have @$450 into my setup. (2)Ballistic Joints, (2) summit Machine joints, (2) Poly Performance bushings, Ballistic lower coil mounts, (4) 1 1/4" jam nuts, (4) 1.25 sq. tube adapters, (1) 3/4" tube adapter. Built the truss myself. Had all the steel I needed at the shop. Springs were free, panhard bar was my old tierod that I cut down (went to full hydro steering)

If it handles great (and it obviously articulates well) why would you change it?
That's funny ~ and the exact reason I sold Snoopy and built Rusty. The answer ~ Why wouldn't you change it? Leaf springs flatten over time. You can't leave them articulated and expect them to live, and after all the fab time you have in building custom mounts (for wider springs), extending the frame (for longer springs), and then setting up shackles, shocks, and a axle-wrap bar ~ to be stuck with leafs and the problems associated with them, you end up kicking yourself in the pants for staying with them in the hope of saving what ended up being only a few hundred dollars.

Seriously, when I was done with Snoopy, after having tackled Indy and everything I did with it, and having been through one set of springs, I was wishing I had just did the 4-link to begin with. So having swapped the rear springs out, I sold it and started Rusty. Sure I could have done Snoopy over, but having just spent 3 years tearing it apart, I wasn't about to tear it apart again.

That's why you change what you have ~ or go with what you want in the first place. In the long run, its easier, better, and leaves you with nothing else to do. None of that: 'I could have been 4-link'd' going through your mind, or worse: 'should I have 4-linked it' which inevidably leads to 'I'm going to 4-link it' ~ and as seen by 'Buck/Scott' linking a Scout is not as difficult as it may seem.

Here's some small pictures of mine, triangulated lowers, slightly triangulated uppers, 10.25 sterling, no springs or upper spring mounts. 2x2x.25 lowers, bushing on the axle end and a ballistic joint on the frame. Uppers, 1.25x.28125 DOM (9/32 wall) the ID will is the correct tap size for a 3/4 heim. Just cut them to length and run your tap in both ends. Then I sleeved the 1.25" OD with 1.5x.120 DOM for a total wall thickness of .40125"


I can get you bigger pictures & articulationpictures if you want.
http://i561.photobucket.com/albums/ss57/1wook/Scout%20800/100_5332.jpg
http://i561.photobucket.com/albums/ss57/1wook/Scout%20800/100_5320.jpg
http://i561.photobucket.com/albums/ss57/1wook/Scout%20800/100_5334.jpg
http://i561.photobucket.com/albums/ss57/1wook/Scout%20800/100_3445.jpg
http://i561.photobucket.com/albums/ss57/1wook/Scout%20800/100_3444.jpg

What I like about the design I used is I didn't have to do a crossmember for the frame mount. Both upper and lower frame ends are in a combo type bracket. The lowers flair out on the axle end and the uppers converge at the truss.

I have great lateral stability and good articulation, no where near RKScout's, but adaquate for my needs.

1wook, are you running yours yet? what did you do for shock mounts?

Edit... I have some serious body roll - soft springs


Brandon just add a leaf or two first. I did that to my rear pack as I had major rear steer issues on the freeway when taking connector ramps. The body would roll and steer you into the wall:eek: I added two leafs to the rear and it was like night and day. I just gave away about 8 packs of springs a few months ago:shaking: or I could have hooked you up. Had to clean up the yard (wife). You could use any 2 1/2 leaf and just cut the ends to fit into your pack. The older Chevy Burb and pickup rear packs are offset and bolt right into the waggy packs.. Also check the bushing, I found that mine were just a tab sloppy. FYI new bushing are dirt cheap as the YJ bushing fit the waggy packs. I get the Daystar bushing from WFO.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=291091&stc=1&d=1172897292




One sweet Scout.

Buck,

I don't need shock's while the front is on jack stands waiting on a 3 link and panhard! I'm planning on them outside the frame rails, if my stock H1's don't hit them.

Building a crossmember so you can have triangulated lowers isn't that hard. How much of a difference the lower roll center will actually make I have no idea.

Buck,

I don't need shock's while the front is on jack stands waiting on a 3 link and panhard!

Well shoot, those are easy....


Yeah right:flipoff2:

Brandon just add a leaf or two first. I did that to my rear pack as I had major rear steer issues on the freeway when taking connector ramps. The body would roll and steer you into the wall:eek: I added two leafs to the rear and it was like night and day. I just gave away about 8 packs of springs a few months ago:shaking: or I could have hooked you up. Had to clean up the yard (wife). You could use any 2 1/2 leaf and just cut the ends to fit into your pack. The older Chevy Burb and pickup rear packs are offset and bolt right into the waggy packs.. Also check the bushing, I found that mine were just a tab sloppy. FYI new bushing are dirt cheap as the YJ bushing fit the waggy packs. I get the Daystar bushing from WFO.



I have new bushings, I did a dumb move and took apart one of my rear packs so that I could cycle the suspension - but then I never took apart the other pack and they sagged funny. Found a new set on craislist I might pickup, and read the 2wd f150 has the same length springs. I will probably put springs in first while I research the 4 link. Bout to go search for some sort of list of spring lengths, offsets, and rates..

Yes you must wheel it for a 1 year before you upgrade, it's the law!!



Just kidding:p

Yes you must wheel it for a 1 year before you upgrade, it's the law!!



Just kidding:p

Or atleast just 1... time :flipoff2:

I did pretty good. I actually wheeled mine twice before I tore it back down.:flipoff2:

Be careful now boys, you might actually start a tech revival in the IH forum! :flipoff2:


Rokscout is :grinpimp:

What with the extra 2" sq tube? Is it to reinforce upper link mount and keep the crossmember from twisting?
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=498570&stc=1&d=1265117805

I was wondering the same thing but figured it was somehow obvious and I was really dumb :p

It's to brace the upper link mount. I was worried that it would try and twist the two lower mounts off the frame, so I added that in to help brace the mount.

I did pretty good. I actually wheeled mine twice before I tore it back down.:flipoff2:

That's one more than me.:D:(

Rkscout do you have a build thread floating around somewhere?

search now and then rkscout..... Great Scout

Yep, like Jetfxr said, Search Then and Now. Think I finally figured out how to add it to my sig.

search now and then rkscout..... Great Scout

Yep, like Jetfxr said, Search Then and Now. Think I finally figured out how to add it to my sig.

Fawk it was even in the FAQ's and i have read it a dozen freaking times.:shaking:

:grinpimp:scout rksscout