Ok, i was thinking about what suv has a similar suspension as my 96 ram, and i like the way my 96 ram works off road, just alittle big. I want to knwo how they actually compare from someone who has driven both of them. i know i liked the cherokee when i looked at buying one, just was too small for daily driving.

SO, if i were to pick up a cherokee for wheeling, what would it take to make it work well on 35" mt/r's? I was thinking warn shafts, and CM joints in the front dana 30, get an 87 cherokee with the factory d44 rear, and detroit that, and maybe some alloy shafts. Then CV the 231 and some HD driveshafts. After that, where woudl the weak link be? I would probabally go after an auto tranny, over a manual. Any advice? doubt i will do it, but it really is in the back of my mind.

Garrett

IMO the weak link would be in the overheating the closed systems are known for. Cherokees in general have a problem releasing the underhood heat. I think once that is fixed you should have a strong running Cherokee.
HTH

Front axle: 297x joints should be enough, warn shafts and CTMs would be indetructable. If you might possibly jump it, you should truss the d30.

Rear axle: not all '87s came with a d44, very few actually. If you find one, get it. If not ford 8.8 is a great swap with 31 spline axles and disc brakes if it's out of a 95+ Explorer.

Drive shafts / TC case: 87 XJs had a different TC(207?). 88 and on have 231 or 242. SYE rear with driveshaft. www.4xshaft.com front shaft will be fine to ~7 or 8 inches.

Engine: be sure to get a 4.0

Tranny: the manual from 87-89 was a POS Puegout, get the auto AW-4

Lift: 6 inches and TJ flares, you will likely want long arms.

Gears: gear lower for those 35s!



You will find that making a cherokee run 35s is twice as hard (and $) as 33s. You sure you want 35s?

oh yeah, and check out www.naxja.org it is a site (with BB) solely devoted to XJs and MJs. Those guys know so much about the XJ it is crazy.

In my opinion I would run at least Dana 44s front and rear, if not bigger (say a D60 in the rear?) Don't spend money on the POS D30. Not worth it except for maybe gears and a pansy ass locker.
I'd go for an automatic unless you plan on spending some major money on this thing. I would get a 91 or newer Cherokee in my opinion.

Also, like that other guy said my friend did an 8.8 swap with a Detroit and likes it alot.

Do a search man, topic has been covered many times. :D

Originally posted by Wish4YJ
Don't spend money on the POS D30.

Speaking of spending cash on a Dana 30, look at this 30.

Pic came from a thread on NAXJA and I believe he is registered here too...
http://home.off-road.com/~wanderingwillys/xjpics/d30_1.jpg

I still dont get though how a dana 30 with d44-sized shafts will break any faster than a d44. Same size shafts, same ball joints and knuckles, only difference is the center section. Oh, and as for gears, i woudl probabally put in like 4.88 or lower gears. And Also, i have a set of 35" mt/r's on rims ready to go, but what i was thinking of for a lift was that rockkrawler 8" lift, seems like a way to go, and it flexes well. But, how will a d30 break?

if you start looking into gears for the d30, 4.88 is the lowest you can get. and by the time they get that low, you're looking at about 8 or 9 teeth on the pinion, and a really small pinion at that. that's definitely gonna be weak. the unit bearing used on the d30 is failure prone and expensive. the knuckes on the XJ d30 are different than d44s i would suggest going d44 front and 9" rear with 5 on 5.5" bolt pattern.

go for a 95 cherokee w/o ABS, 4.0 auto. it'll be new enough to have the upgraded brakes, not be rusted too bad, bolts should come off easier and it'll be old enough to be a little cheaper.

look for one with the factory skid group, factory front tow hooks and a class III hitch (if factory tow pkg, will have tranny cooler as well.)

you can cut more meat out of the rear wheelwells in a 2-door also, could fit and stuff 35's with a 6" lift, keep the COG down.

they make good daily drivers too. big enough to fit my fat ass comfortably.

Originally posted by Wish4YJ
In my opinion I would run at least Dana 44s front and rear, if not bigger (say a D60 in the rear?) :D

what the hell are you talking about? a d30 would be fine in the
front with 4.56 gears and TJ shafts. and a d60 in the rear is a little
overkill. a d44 or a 8.8 in the rear would be the best.

wish4yj, why have i never seen your '88 yj? oh ye, becouse you
don't own one :flipoff2:

I say build the front 30 w/ Moser 44 shafts, CTMs, 4.56s and a locker. If you wanna get rid of the vacuum disco axle (depending on the year of XJ), go with the Warn hub conversion.

For the rear, look for an XJ 44 out of an '87-'88 XJ. Its a direct bolt in and can be loaded the Superior Super44 kit, that comes with 33 splined shafts and a Detroit (or OX).

I also agree with keeping the CoG down and running larger tires. You can definitely squeez 35s on that rig with 6". There is PLENTY of useless fender on XJs, so don't be afraid to get out the sawzall and hack away.

Build the axles, hack the fenders for 35s, add an SYE and CV shaft out back, add a tranny/ 'case skid, some rock rails and bumpers and go beat the f**k out of it.:D

Originally posted by norcalXJ


what the hell are you talking about? a d30 would be fine in the
front with 4.56 gears and TJ shafts. and a d60 in the rear is a little
overkill. a d44 or a 8.8 in the rear would be the best.



So why are you swapping youre D30? I dont get it. Just keep it its fine. :flipoff2:

Hmm My YJ is sittin in my front yard right now. Just haven't paid for it all. :flipoff2:

4.88s in a D30 are TINY. I've had them and was worried the whole time that they would break. Skip the D30 and get a 60 :D

Originally posted by BrettM

Drive shafts / TC case: 87 XJs had a different TC(207?). 88 and on have 231 or 242. SYE rear with driveshaft. www.4xshaft.com front shaft will be fine to ~7 or 8 inches.


FWIW, my 87 has the 242. Maybe you meant 87 and on...

wish4yj, i am puting a d44 in the front becouse i am going to run 37's. a d30 with tj shafts will be just fine for 35's.

4.88s + D30 + Locker = :nuke:

Man don't you have anythin better to do today? O wait its Sunday and your mormon! :flipoff2:

Originally posted by 1337j33px0r
if you start looking into gears for the d30, 4.88 is the lowest you can get.




Not true. You can get 5.38's for a D30.

Originally posted by SanDiegoCJ


Not true. You can get 5.38's for a D30.

Originally posted by Wish4YJ


4.88s + D30 + Locker = :nuke:


5.38s + D30 + pulling out of the driveway = :nuke: :nuke: :nuke:

:flipoff2:

hmm, so 4.56 gears should be the same strength as a d44, right? and couldnt i swap on chevy knukles, run f-150 breaks, and go to 5 lug, or better yet, 8 lug? I would probabally just do dana 60's, but i really woudl rather deal with bolt ups, and not spend the $$$.. and yes, i could see my self going to 37's too.. so who knows.

You'd be surprised what an XJ on locked 35s will do, with a built 30 and a 44 rear. I say keep it simple frist and see how you like it. If you keep breaking shit, do Waggy 44s and 37s.

i am suprised what my 33'd ram with open diffs does. ANd something else, what is the difference in wheel bast between the 2 door and 4 door? i have been looking, and havent found that fact yet.

2 door and 4 door have the same wheelbase (104 I think). the two door has longer front doors and more sheetmetal before the rear fender flare.

ok, and also, how many inches can be cut out of the 4 door? I know the 2 door can have alot more cut out. Also, has anyone cut past the doors on a 4 door, so that the door had to be cut, but still functional? any pics?

thanks. Garrett

Originally posted by Hick
ok, and also, how many inches can be cut out of the 4 door? I know the 2 door can have alot more cut out. Also, has anyone cut past the doors on a 4 door, so that the door had to be cut, but still functional? any pics?

thanks. Garrett

If you try to cut that much, then you'd be adding TJ flares. Most add the flares to where half of the flare is tacked onto the door and the other half is mounted on the body of the Jeep. The only problem with this is when you cut that much, you will split the fender well and the inner body seam. When this is done, you have to do some patch welding in order to seal up the split. Its not a big deal, but it discourages a lot of people from adding the flares.

If you wanna just add the flares, you can do it by keeping them just below the door or flush. Either way, it will allow you to cram larger meats in there with a tad smaller lift. The front fenders are easy as hell to cut, there isn't any seams up there. just rip all that :rainbow: ass plastic fender lining out and get down to business with the sawzall.

It's great fun to see how crap gets around ;)
Sorry to burst your bubble but I have only spent 380.00 so far on that D30 (k-5 inner "C's", flat tops, 4.88's, welded spiders, and waggy 6 lug outers with some used warn premiums...) That price included everything listed above and seen in the pic - I plan on putting warn shafts and either ox or ctm joints eventually but not in the buget for now.

You can make it work you just have to be a little handy and have some time to work with... I figure if I start killing the ring and pinion I will put a tera 50 or 9" center section in it later on...

Also the whole deal is under the XJ and the 3 link has a few bugs but will be up and running soon - I need to replace some seals on the PS box but otherwise the hydro assist works great...

Take it easy and have fun with the XJ project if you decide to go that route (I know if am)

Matt

Originally posted by JS-Economos


Speaking of spending cash on a Dana 30, look at this 30.

Pic came from a thread on NAXJA and I believe he is registered here too...
http://home.off-road.com/~wanderingwillys/xjpics/d30_1.jpg

I was wondering if you would catch this thread Matt. Hell, I'll give ya $380 for that 30...:D :D

BTW, the drab paint and Exo look insane dude.:eek: :eek: http://www.uniquehardware.co.uk/server-smilies/contrib/ruinkai/biggthumpup.gif

I think my elbow grease costs a little more than 10 cents an hour!! Thanks for the good words though - You just have to be a packrat/scrounger/cheap bastard to build'em at only 10% of what the store bought ones go for, take it easy - I will try and get some pics of the finished deal up some time sooner than later

Matt :D

Originally posted by wanderingwillys
I think my elbow grease costs a little more than 10 cents an hour!! Thanks for the good words though - You just have to be a packrat/scrounger/cheap bastard to build'em at only 10% of what the store bought ones go for, take it easy - I will try and get some pics of the finished deal up some time sooner than later

Matt :D

:laughing: :laughing: Hey Matt, I'll pull my 30, box it up and mail it to you w/ $380. I expect results bro.:flipoff2: :flipoff2:

My buddy polished both of his terds...ie D35 and D30!1..He wanted ground clearance or some crap like that!..Superior shafts front.( 297 joints and one piece axles) and rear ..OX lockers front and rear..Trussed the rear...Had hy-steer built with beefy arms ..Ram assist...and so on!....He WILL be looking for 44's or 60' soon!..Here are some pics!

front

some shots of the rear.

..i think the trusss is key with these tiny axles!...4:88's are holding up...He did grenade the rear Ox once!

But over all the XJ works pretty well!!...Body flex is now becoming an concern...I'm not sure if a roll cage will help this..But ..That is the route he is going to take first!

That thing is something else.:eek:

Body flex is an issue, as you said. When I wheel with my doors off, it becomes obvious at just how much it does flex. I would say that a cage would be the best solution. I've heard good results from others who have done cages and they claim that it reduces the twist in the uni quite a bit. Something to consider if that rig is in the rocks as much as it appears to be.:smokin:

:D

Somebody said: "IMO the weak link would be in the overheating the closed systems are known for. Cherokees in general have a problem releasing the underhood heat. I think once that is fixed you should have a strong running Cherokee."

I call bullshit. Closed systems work fine when maintained and filled properly. I have never once had a problem, with 4 XJ's of the closed system vintage, 87-90.

NP242's suck- take my word for it. I'd rather not hammer out why, they just suck. Get the 231.

I have never yet seen a 29 spline 8.25 break with less than 35" tires, either. 27 spline 8.25's break once in a while, but a 27 spline 8.25 side gear fits right on a D35 shaft, as well as a D30 front shaft, so why is it only the D35 breaks so much? 35's just suck balls. If you buy a 35 equipped XJ, throw it as far as you can, quick.