Ive been reading up on 14 bolt fronts.
So it got me thinking. Why not an Eaton front?

Why?
Cause Ive got an H072 rear in my junk now and an extra H072:smokin:

Why not?
1)Well the pinion is offset waaay to the left. (Pass drop t-case)
2)Dana 60 Cs wont work. Eaton axle tubes are 3.5in
3)Custom Axles. Eatons are 17 spline (I have 2 Eaton Detroits)

These pics suck, but at least you get an idea of the offset pinion.
It would make the short side real short.
How would I make the long side longer? Housing is all one piece.

Thoughts?

to make the long side long enough, you could simply insert a dana 60 long side tube and support it inside the center section with plate. same might work on the short side.

if you look a this photo of a 9" housing, you can see a plate welded inside the housing that will support the tube. this might be what you need to do.
http://www.totalcontrolproducts.com/support/TA2F9/TA2F9-33_with-housing_AT.jpg

to make the long side long enough, you could simply insert a dana 60 long side tube and support it inside the center section with plate. same might work on the short side.

if you look a this photo of a 9" housing, you can see a plate welded inside the housing that will support the tube. this might be what you need to do.
http://www.totalcontrolproducts.com/support/TA2F9/TA2F9-33_with-housing_AT.jpg

Look inside an eaton housing. you don't have a nice flange like that pic of the 9 inch for the tubing to slide into.EDIT never mind, I looked at the picture again, and saw how they did it.

With the eaton, if you flip the housing(not the chunk) so that your long sidee is away from the pinion offset, I would think that you would have enough. You gain about 8-9 inches withthe inner and outer C's dont you? Also, as far as the 16 spline axles, you can put 14 bolt spiders(or a whole 14 bolt detroit) in an eaton, and then use the 14 bolt axles. If this could be made to work, it would give you more diff cleareance than a 14 bolt.

With the eaton, if you flip the housing(not the chunk) so that your long sidee is away from the pinion offset, I would think that you would have enough. You gain about 8-9 inches withthe inner and outer C's dont you?

Thats a good idea....I gotta check if the third member can be flipped in the housing and take a measurement. Should work, bolt holes look symmetrical. That would make the long side longer for the front application.

I know of the Eaton/14 bolt Detroit compatibility.
I have an extra H072 detroit so its not an issue.


to make the long side long enough, you could simply insert a dana 60 long side tube and support it inside the center section with plate. same might work on the short side.

if you look a this photo of a 9" housing, you can see a plate welded inside the housing that will support the tube. this might be what you need to do.
http://www.totalcontrolproducts.com/support/TA2F9/TA2F9-33_with-housing_AT.jpg


Grump, I like that idea!
If the D60 tube will fit inside the Eaton housing, looks like Im in business:smokin:

Who would you recommend for custom axles?
Or possibly cut and respline D60 axles (again need to take measurements)


On a side note...Tryin to keep this somewhat low-budget.

Thats a good idea....I gotta check if the third member can be flipped in the housing and take a measurement. Should work, bolt holes look symmetrical. That would make the long side longer for the front application.

You can flip the chunk any way you want. You can also put studs in the cover side, and bolt it to that side. (this would keep your vent tube opening on top) . I wish they would have just updated the eaton with better axles instead of introducing the 14 bolt. I've always loved mine.

One consideration,(if you don't know this) the eaton housing is nodular iron, so it takes some extra measure to weld to it properly.

there's enough meet on the stock 60 C's to have them board open to 3.5''. i was going to do a set for a 9'' axle, i was going to use the stock 9'' axle tubes witch are 3 1/8 and i noticed there alot on there. i can messure them if you need, i still have them uncut and unwelded to the tube's.

jason.

there's enough meet on the stock 60 C's to have them board open to 3.5''. i was going to do a set for a 9'' axle, i was going to use the stock 9'' axle tubes witch are 3 1/8 and i noticed there alot on there. i can messure them if you need, i still have them uncut and unwelded to the tube's.

jason.

If you could measure the opening I would appriciate it.
I dont have a set to mess around with....yet.

Who would you recommend for custom axles?
Or possibly cut and respline D60 axles (again need to take measurements)


On a side note...Tryin to keep this somewhat low-budget.

If the Eaton shafts are comperable to 14 bolt shafts, D60 stuff will be too small. FF 14 bolt shafts are 1.625", roughly 37 spline if cut like newer Dana stuff.

Good point 77k5.
Eaton shafts are even bigger than 14 bolt.
Gonna have to be custom.

Ive been reading up on 14 bolt fronts.
So it got me thinking. Why not an Eaton front?


I think its a great idea and mentioned it last week on here.

I would imagine you could turn down a D60 tube/C and slide it into the Eaton tubes. Then the cheep guy could weld old 35spline side gears into the Eaton diff and run some stock style common 35 spline shafts.

You can flip the chunk any way you want.

Isn't flipping the "chunk" the same as flipping a 14 bolt"?

I high pinion Eaton.....:laughing:

Jesus

Isn't flipping the "chunk" the same as flipping a 14 bolt"?

I high pinion Eaton.....:laughing:

Jesus


no no no

For a high pinion Eaton you'd have to flip the whole truck:flipoff2:

Isn't flipping the "chunk" the same as flipping a 14 bolt"?

I high pinion Eaton.....:laughing:

JesusWhat I meant was that you can mount the chunk four different ways in the housing to get the long side axle where you want it. obviosly you can't run it upside down, unless you run a rear engine. you can mount it normally, 180 degrees from that, or move it to the cover side, and have 2 different options. when you run it upsidedown, you then have to flip the housing as well. one of those options is going to put it with the long side to thedrivers front, and hopefully get away from using a crazy custom axle.

On a side note...Tryin to keep this somewhat low-budget.

that statment and custom axle dont go together. Isnt a 60 the cheapest option?

What are you looking to gain?

Just get some rocks and be done.

that statment and custom axle dont go together. Isnt a 60 the cheapest option?

What are you looking to gain?

Just get some rocks and be done.


Built D60 would cost what? $1500+

For the H072 front I should be able to use mostly parts I have around.
Other than axles, which would have to be custom made.

I never said it made sense....just said I wanted too:flipoff2:

Cheapest option would be to have left my junk stock in the first place.:shaking:

What are you looking to gain?


Stronger ring and pinion without adding the 150lbs extra and high pinion height of the rocks...

I think its a great idea and mentioned it last week on here.

I would imagine you could turn down a D60 tube/C and slide it into the Eaton tubes. Then the cheep guy could weld old 35spline side gears into the Eaton diff and run some stock style common 35 spline shafts.


Im thinkin of opening up some D60 Cs to fit over the H072 tubes.
A friend of mine has a machine shop...so cost should be low.
D60 knuckles spindles and outers should work.
Depending of final length, I may need custom inners.

i didn't forget about messuring those C's for you. they have plenty of meet left on the OEM dana 60 C. the OD of the C's i messured was 4 7/8. so that leaves plenty of meet left to weld to the eaton tube.

i would even feel say to say if someone wanted to weld the 60 C's to a dana 70HD ( 4" tube ) there still would be plenty.

jason.

Bringing this back up to the top for a few reasons-

#1 - these axles are cool
#2 - removable thirds has always appealed to me
#3 - 609s are expensive and are mostly custom
#4 - 5.14 factory gears :smokin:
#5 - you can still find these, they're not too rare yet

As you can tell, they have a ton of benefits. They're actually stronger than D60s and there's no gear setup if you find the correct ratio you're looking for (4.10s, 4.57s, or 5.14s). I have a few questions though-

Stock 14 bolts are 30 spline, correct? Is the shaft diameter not the same as stock D60 30 spline junk? Are there 35 spline 14 bolt stuff we could put in there that's the same diameter and spline as 35 spline D60 stuff?

A strong, unique, low budget axle pair could be had from these. I'm looking to have a 65-67" WMS in the front and 63-65" WMS in the rear and these are looking promising to me. Thoughts?

If you could measure the opening I would appriciate it.
I dont have a set to mess around with....yet.

for the axle set up go to a axle/ gear place with a alignment bar and just tell them what your trying to do. but as grump said a sleeved axle tube is probably the only way to do this easily. you still need to figure out the inner axle seal.
i think a company named seals all or seals it makes plugs that fit in side the axle tube and have an axle seal. how ever the eaton shafts might be an odd size so they may not have it, either way you could probably have a plug made that works with a seal so ya... ohh scracth that, youll need a surface machined for a seal anyways on a custom axle shaft. uh sounds money and work if your trying to do this all on the cheap side of things.

why not use Rockwell Knuckle balls, Knuckles,shafts, spindles, and 14 bolt or eaton hubs? weld rockwell sides into the eaton carrier and let er rip

I will get Pics of what Ive done so far,

But what I did was I took a set of dana 60 35 spline side gears had them machined to fit inside the HO carrier. I made a set of plates that will act as weld in seal reatiners, they use noramll dana 60 style inner axle seals.
I made a set of pucks to fit the bearing jurnals and as far as the C's I'm going to have the dana 60 tubs and C cut down to fit inside the OEM HO axle tube.

I promiss I will get Pics, its not much to look at but Its progress. As far as finding 5.13 diffs, there out there but they are getting harder and harder to find.
So even if your not interested in building one if you find a good diff post up in the HO thread theres plenty of us that will gladly buy it:smokin:

Jason.

#1 - these axles are cool
#2 - removable thirds has always appealed to me
#3 - 609s are expensive and are mostly custom
#4 - 5.14 factory gears :smokin:
#5 - you can still find these, they're not too rare yet

Stock 14 bolts are 30 spline, correct? Is the shaft diameter not the same as stock D60 30 spline junk? Are there 35 spline 14 bolt stuff we could put in there that's the same diameter and spline as 35 spline D60 stuff?




In the world of "cool axles" I don't think that an Eaton comes close to being cool. Strong, capable...yeah....

The removeable third is nice, but hella heavy going back in.

Limited gearing, not too many aftermarket companies even look at these axles.

While stock 14 bolts are indeed 30 spline, they are stronger than a stock Dana 30 spline. Way stronger. At 1 5/8ths" thick, stock 14 shafts are no slouch.

For what they are, and how they are designed, 14 bolts have the retarded strength in stock form.

In the world of "cool axles" I don't think that an Eaton comes close to being cool. Strong, capable...yeah....




Advantages of the Eaton over a corporate 14 bolt are...
More strength (arguably).
Lighter weight.
Better ground clearance.

All make this a "cool" axle.

I think the cheapest solution to shafts would be to have side gears made for the locker to match a common spline count/size.

Like a 14 bolt inner and a 35spline dana stub shaft. We already know you can put the 14 bolt lockers in the eaton to update to a fine spline.

That being said... Odin is that a IFS width toy rear? And do you want to sell it?

for the axle set up go to a axle/ gear place with a alignment bar and just tell them what your trying to do. but as grump said a sleeved axle tube is probably the only way to do this easily. you still need to figure out the inner axle seal.
i think a company named seals all or seals it makes plugs that fit in side the axle tube and have an axle seal. how ever the eaton shafts might be an odd size so they may not have it, either way you could probably have a plug made that works with a seal so ya... ohh scracth that, youll need a surface machined for a seal anyways on a custom axle shaft. uh sounds money and work if your trying to do this all on the cheap side of things.

From what I understand, front axles do not require an alignment bar because, simply, there is nothing to align. I think boring out the inner C from a D60 is easiest and would be plenty strong. I think it would take extreme abuse to kill a inner C, then it's time for some SOLID or Crane Cs. I think something else would fail before then anyhow.

Inner seal, as you said, Seals It. They make good products and it would be pretty easy to install. I have one in my disco HP30 and it was a super easy install. It shouldn't be a problem to polish the surface on the shaft...and didn't some of the 60 shafts come with it?

why not use Rockwell Knuckle balls, Knuckles,shafts, spindles, and 14 bolt or eaton hubs? weld rockwell sides into the eaton carrier and let er rip

Cuz that shit is heavy! 60 stuff is plentiful and even across the counter in some stores. Plus you can usually piece together this stuff locally for decently cheap.

I will get Pics of what Ive done so far,

But what I did was I took a set of dana 60 35 spline side gears had them machined to fit inside the HO carrier. I made a set of plates that will act as weld in seal reatiners, they use noramll dana 60 style inner axle seals.
I made a set of pucks to fit the bearing jurnals and as far as the C's I'm going to have the dana 60 tubs and C cut down to fit inside the OEM HO axle tube.

I promiss I will get Pics, its not much to look at but Its progress. As far as finding 5.13 diffs, there out there but they are getting harder and harder to find.
So even if your not interested in building one if you find a good diff post up in the HO thread theres plenty of us that will gladly buy it:smokin:

Jason.

This sounds awesome :smokin: What machining was needed for the 35 spline 60 side gear to fit? Did you take a look at Seals It option before going with the Ford 9" style of seal with the plate? Can you explain the pucks as well? I'm just trying to get a mental picture of what you're explaining to me. :grinpimp:

Same goes for me, if you got a H072 axle, especially a 5.14 chunk, PM me.

In the world of "cool axles" I don't think that an Eaton comes close to being cool. Strong, capable...yeah....

The removeable third is nice, but hella heavy going back in.

Limited gearing, not too many aftermarket companies even look at these axles.

While stock 14 bolts are indeed 30 spline, they are stronger than a stock Dana 30 spline. Way stronger. At 1 5/8ths" thick, stock 14 shafts are no slouch.

For what they are, and how they are designed, 14 bolts have the retarded strength in stock form.

Stronger, capable, gear change in minutes, lighter, can weld to the housing itself, etc etc. I know 14B are stronger than 60s...I asked for size differences :p A side by side pic of D60 30 spline, D60 35 spline, and 14B junk would be awesome.

I think the cheapest solution to shafts would be to have side gears made for the locker to match a common spline count/size.

Like a 14 bolt inner and a 35spline dana stub shaft. We already know you can put the 14 bolt lockers in the eaton to update to a fine spline.

That being said... Odin is that a IFS width toy rear? And do you want to sell it?

Right, unless you can find a set of 35 spline 60 side gears and machine them to fit, like above. Then the parts are already there and it just takes a little massaging versus making an entire new part ($$$).


The way I see it, bore out the D60 inner C, press over Eaton axle tube (stronger tubes). Use Seals It seals on the inner axle sides (aren't there inner seals already there? How does it hold oil as a rear end?), then setup your caster and burn it in. Make sure to measure for some type of stock shafts, probably 35 spline 60 stuff and swap in 35 spline machined 60 side gears. There's other options but that's what I'm thinking so far.

although the idea and concepts are good and would work, i think its still gonna be too costly vs. effectiveness.

take a 14 bolt - shave it, weld the tubes, good set of gears, a detroit with chromo shafts. if you need more than that, id have to say you need more than 1 tons.

To machine the 60 side gears was very easy, well easy for my machinest to do. I still need to clearance the back side of the gears so they sit and mesh better with the stock HO spiders gears. They dont have to be the best fit ( the spiders and side gear mesh ) as mine ( and most ) will get welded.

Yes custom 35 spline side gears can be had for a 14 bolt detroit ( I think ) but that drive up the cost. The only thing I need to do is have the stock Chevy dana 60 inner axle shafts cut a tad more down the seal area.
In other words the area were the stock OEM axle seals sit on the shaft, my side plates and 60 seals are a little further down the shafts.

So a little custom lathe work will be needed on the shafts, but were only talking a minor cut about an inch further down the stock shafts.

gtxracer you cant just re-use the stock HO axle tube's ( well there really not tube's ), the long side doe's not have enough tube for a stock inner Chevy axle. Thats why I'm going to use a housing that has a spun bearing. I will have the tube cut to slide into the the HO axle tube.

Line up pucks that I made are cut out of the one's I made for my rockwell housing chunks. Here's a Pic of what they look like inside my rock chunk. http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s89/420willys/rockwell10.jpg

I just had them cut so I can still use them for a rockwell and a HO axle. Inside the steel plate I insert a 1.5" Hiem joint and use a Chrome rod for a bar.
http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s89/420willys/rockwell8.jpg

The chrome rod is from a E-stick and other than a few scratchs is very true.

Jason.

although the idea and concepts are good and would work, i think its still gonna be too costly vs. effectiveness.

take a 14 bolt - shave it, weld the tubes, good set of gears, a detroit with chromo shafts. if you need more than that, id have to say you need more than 1 tons.

The reasion I chose a HO72 is for the load bolt and the fact that I found one with 5.13's for 75.00 dollars for the chunk. I got lucky its in very good shape and I dont need to repalce the front pinion bearing.

Even if you use a 14 bolt, you still need to address the inner seals, the custom shafts or use machined 35 spline stuff and if your using stock shafts theres still not enough tube on the 14 bolt to use the oem one's. All the same probelms are pretty much the same with the HO as the 14 bolt.

For me my buggy is being built as a rear engine, so haveing the load bolt was a must, yes a 14 bolt has a 3rd pinion but a HO72 has the 3rd pinion and the load bolt. So any deflection will not be had from this housing.

Ive said it before and will say it again if there was anyone making after market gears and the "hard parts" the PT axle would of been based off the HO axle 3rd and not a 14 bolt.

Jason.

From what I understand, front axles do not require an alignment bar because, simply, there is nothing to align. I think boring out the inner C from a D60 is easiest and would be plenty strong. I think it would take extreme abuse to kill a inner C, then it's time for some SOLID or Crane Cs. I think something else would fail before then anyhow.

Front axles technically dont require an alignment bar because you have machine surfaces that you can measure camber and caster off of. Therefor you can put an angle meter on the top of the c or the knuckle and measure where everything needs to be set.

Inner seal, as you said, Seals It. They make good products and it would be pretty easy to install. I have one in my disco HP30 and it was a super easy install. It shouldn't be a problem to polish the surface on the shaft...and didn't some of the 60 shafts come with it?



Cuz that shit is heavy! 60 stuff is plentiful and even across the counter in some stores. Plus you can usually piece together this stuff locally for decently cheap.



This sounds awesome :smokin: What machining was needed for the 35 spline 60 side gear to fit? Did you take a look at Seals It option before going with the Ford 9" style of seal with the plate? Can you explain the pucks as well? I'm just trying to get a mental picture of what you're explaining to me. :grinpimp:

See wouldnt the problem with using a 35 spline side gear and a dana 60 shaft be that your not reaping the benefits of the huge inners in a HO/14b?

Same goes for me, if you got a H072 axle, especially a 5.14 chunk, PM me.



Stronger, capable, gear change in minutes, lighter, can weld to the housing itself, etc etc. I know 14B are stronger than 60s...I asked for size differences :p A side by side pic of D60 30 spline, D60 35 spline, and 14B junk would be awesome.



Right, unless you can find a set of 35 spline 60 side gears and machine them to fit, like above. Then the parts are already there and it just takes a little massaging versus making an entire new part ($$$).


The way I see it, bore out the D60 inner C, press over Eaton axle tube (stronger tubes). Use Seals It seals on the inner axle sides (aren't there inner seals already there? How does it hold oil as a rear end?), then setup your caster and burn it in. Make sure to measure for some type of stock shafts, probably 35 spline 60 stuff and swap in 35 spline machined 60 side gears. There's other options but that's what I'm thinking so far.

I'd like to see this done. Would be like a 1-1/4 ton napco front :)

Speaking only as a garage builder not a fab shop I feel a line up bar is critical unless you get all the parts to slide together without any interfernce. Can most do that, no.
So for me a simple bar and jigs were made, for the outer C's to be welded on again they will be a slip fit into the HO axle tube. But since the inner tube has a small raied seam that I eather need to notch the 60 tube or grind down, I figure just have the 60 tube cut a little smaller and leave a little wobble room.
I have the bar so I can assmble the outer C's to the knuckle, put the spindle on and the bar fit very snug on the inner spindle bearing.
I figure that close enough and after the bar will slide threw the linup pucks in the carrier jurnals.

The other reasion for the bar is to position the inner axle seal plates. I will put the seals in the plates, put the plates in the housing tack weld the plates in the corner's and then remove the bar along with the seals and weld the plates in.

Jason.

Stronger, capable, gear change in minutes, lighter, can weld to the housing itself, etc etc.

I don't know how you figure a Eaton is stronger than a 14 bolt, or lighter for that matter. And guess what? You can weld to a 14 bolt housing too!!!!:shocked:

It's already been said - load bolt. If you want to argue about the strengths, do it elsewhere. This thread is for a Eaton front axle build using a HO72 as the base. By the welding comment, you know what I meant, cast vs iron :shaking: It's also lighter and has better ground clearance, go to the HO72 thread for that.

Stock 14 bolts are 30 spline, correct? Is the shaft diameter not the same as stock D60 30 spline junk? Are there 35 spline 14 bolt stuff we could put in there that's the same diameter and spline as 35 spline D60 stuff?

14 bolt shafts are 30 spline but are cut at a different pressure angle than just about everything else, they are 1 9/16" or so and are closest to 37 spline Dana stuff.

ive never understood how you can take a rear and just use it for the front without flipping it, becuase wouldnt the gears be riding on the curved side (like going in reverse if it was still in the rear) when going foreward as a front axle? i would think you would have to flip the housing to use a rear in a front...

I don't know how you figure a Eaton is stronger than a 14 bolt, or lighter for that matter. And guess what? You can weld to a 14 bolt housing too!!!!:shocked:

i have one in my garage right now, they are lighter.

ya you could use nickle but thats almost more of a braze than welding as far as tensile strength... but as far as strength its much easier/stronger to weld to an eaton than a 14bolt.

I'd like to see this done. Would be like a 1-1/4 ton napco front :)

The NAPCO front axle assemblies were in essence a modified corporate GM axle, and the differential gear assemblies are interchangeable with the GM corporate rear end of the time. Model's HL-52 for the 1/2-tons, and HO-72 for the 3/4-ton and 1-ton units. The 3/4-ton and 1-ton units are the same, with the exception of the gear ratio's. Manually locking hubs were also an optional item.

Why not just use a NAPCO ho72 front out of a 3/4 or 1 ton?

Why not just use a NAPCO ho72 front out of a 3/4 or 1 ton?
1. Those are extremely hard to find.
2. This would be kick ass and extremely unique.
3. NAPCO's came stock with drums.
4. NAPCO shafts/kingpins/knuckle's/locking hubs are hard to find/expensive to replace.
5. This would be kick ass and extremely unique.

ive never understood how you can take a rear and just use it for the front without flipping it, becuase wouldnt the gears be riding on the curved side (like going in reverse if it was still in the rear) when going foreward as a front axle? i would think you would have to flip the housing to use a rear in a front...

The front output of the T-case spins opposite of the rear output, so a rear axle placed in the front will drive properly; If you flip the axle it will drive backwards.

A H052/H072 ran in the front will be running on the curved side if you want to call it that and it will be weaker than the same in the rear. All low pinion axles do this when ran in the front and is why a low pin is weaker in the front than a high pin in the front.

Well I made some progress on my HO72 steering axle. I took the dana 60 35 spline side gears and had them machined to fit the HO carrier. They sat in there fine but did not make contact with the spiders all that well.
So I had to cop the teeth off the side gears and then made sure the cross pin sat flat on the custom side gears.
You can see how I chopped the teeth off spider gears to clear the side gears.

Thats a stock Chevy 60 shaft sitting inside a HO carrier, you can see were I'm pointing to that the shaft touchs the carrier keeping it from engaging the full amout of spline's. So I need to clearance the carrier a tweak or machine down the shaft to a hair under to clear the shaft.
Plus the inner axle seal area on the shaft needs to be cut further down the shaft, so other than some minor machine work every thing here looks doable.

I have the seal plates made but need to get the C's on to line up the seals inorder to tack them in place.

Jason.

Then I put the set up 3rd into the housing and slid the bar threw. This when I saw that the housing was a little off. I guess years of abuse and over weight loads on a all steel housing will bend it.

This is why I feel that a set up bar is critical whan a housing of this sort is being built.
More to follow,

Jason.

This is why I feel that a set up bar is critical whan a housing is of this sort is being built.

Most definitely and your pics show why.

This is why I feel that a set up bar is critical whan a housing of this sort is being built.


You can basicly do the same thing with an axle shaft... just insert the shaft into the carrier like you normaly would and use it to approximate how far off you are and adjust. I have done this severial times with good results.

What's realy amazaing is how far an axle housing can be off and still function. I have pulled many appart where you had to hammer the shaft out because the housing was bent so bad.

Project is looking good!

You can basicly do the same thing with an axle shaft... just insert the shaft into the carrier like you normaly would and use it to approximate how far off you are and adjust. I have done this severial times with good results.

:confused: The shaft installed in the diff can be pulled 1/4" one way or the other so maybe for a billy bob hack job its good enough, but not for something you want to work well for a long time.


What's realy amazaing is how far an axle housing can be off and still function. I have pulled many appart where you had to hammer the shaft out because the housing was bent so bad.



That is true, but it puts wear and stresses on parts and will fail prematurely. Maybe not in a month or a year, but put it to some severe hard use with many miles and things will start to come undone.

I got the doner 60 axle cut tonight, that will supply the C's and some decent length of useable tube. The HO axle is 3 1/4" and the 60 is 3 1/8", so I will bevel the larger tube and weld them that way.

I'm heading to a friends house this weekend to machine the tube's to fit. I hope his little lathe can handle it:D

Jason.

Oh Tim that detroit locker I thought I had in that 14 bolt, well it turned out to be a Gov bomb. So I wont be able to get your demensions you were looking for.

:confused: The shaft installed in the diff can be pulled 1/4" one way or the other so maybe for a billy bob hack job its good enough, but not for something you want to work well for a long time.


Yep it sure does...I bet the long side of a front axle moves even more than 1/4". What I do is I pull the shaft all the way up and take my calipers and measure from the shaft to the tube... then do the same thing on the bottom and the sides to determine when the axle is true. I use a simple setup with a piece of 5x5x1" wall square tube chained to both ends of the axle and a bottle jack pushing in the center to push the axle back straight. I bet I can get it to within 1/8" of alignment. Witch is good enough for what 99% of us do.

The real benefit of my chain/jack method is I can preload the axle against the natural pull that welding a truss to the housing creates so when it springs back from the welds cooling it is closer to true. I have used an alignment bar and pucks before and you have to beat the thing back apart after you weld it anyway because of the warpage from welding.

Now if I were doing this all the time producing new axles with all new parts I would surely use an alignment jig of some sort. I have worked as an ME in the Ag equipment manufacturing business and have built my fare share of jigs for heavy material welding. But for Billy Bob the home builder who might do a set of axles every 5 years for his wheeling rig; it's hard justify the machine time and material cost to have an alignment jig built for each setup. If you didn't have access to free machining/materials I would think you would be better off to just purchase a new custom housing from a vendor considering how prices have dropped on many of them in recent years. Luckily the original poster gets free machining :D

edit: never mind... I thought you were machining the eaton tubes :( Now that I read it again I bet you are machining the C/stub from the 60.

edit: never mind... I thought you were machining the eaton tubes :( Now that I read it again I bet you are machining the C/stub from the 60.

Yep, I had a Chevy housing that i got with a spun bearing, a bad spun bearing. So I stipped the axle and put it aside for this prodject, well it started life as a 14 bolt but this cooler:smokin:
All the mchine work so far cost me 50.00 dollars, I could have did the side gears myself but I felt that was the critical part so I left that to the experts.

The dana 60 tube's will get cut with some wiggle room, I will straigthen the housing the best I can and then assemble the knuckle's on the C's.
This way I can use the spindle's as the outer attching point for the line up bar.
The bar will go threw the center chunk to, so I hope that will be straight enough.

The bar is a chrome rod from a E stick cylinder. I pulled it out and tried to clean it up but it was cheaper to buy a new one, so I put it aside. Its still very straight, just a few nicks and scratchs.

Jason.

Well big time change in plans. I forgot I had a dana 60 HP with a cracked housing, it was under some other axle's I had.
The guy I got the axle from cut to much off the short side to expose the tube, well when he did all that work and installed it the housing it cracked were the tube meets the housing.

So what doe's this mean, well I figured now since I have some good tube with factory inner axle seal spots just pull the tube's out of the cracked housing and cut the HO axle to except them.

The doner axle is a Ford so that ment the stock Chevy shafts I have wont work, well wont work on the short side. The donor cracked 60 was narrowed down 4.5"s off the long side.
So in order to use that side I went ahead and lengthed the tube to the Chevy spec, witch is 28.5"s.
The short side will stay factory ford as I have some ford inner short side shafts. So the WMS should be 68 1/4".

Heres some Pics of the housing and were I marked the line's to cut the tube to slide into the housing.
Now after some time figuring were to cut the housing It came down to 4 3/4" from the side of the inner flange on the housing. This left around 1/16" of wiggle room on each side and I need to machine some inner pucks made to fit int he OEM seal spots.
I figure it wont hurt to have them on while I set it up and weld it.

Jason.

Well I got the inner axle pucks made, they fit in the factory seal spots. Slid the bar threw and put the hole thing together. I still need to fill some of the gaps were I cut a little to much off.
I will do this before I weld the tubes on, that will help keep the tube's from pulling around. So onto Pics,

Jason.

That is :smokin: Are the bucks just some steel stock cut in the right diameter?

Looking good so far, definitely the way to go with the D60 tubes slid into the Eaton center housing.

What are you doing out at the spindle ends?

That is :smokin: Are the bucks just some steel stock cut in the right diameter?

Yep just some steel tube I cut on an old grampa lathe, they work perfect and help line up the tube's on the insde. So I have the pucks insde the carrier and now a set insdie the OEM seal location, then the bar slide's threw to the spindle bearing were it holds true on the ends.

I had to extend the long side tube to 28.5"s, so I cut an extension slid a small piece of tube in there and used the line up bar with the pucks on the inside of the tube.

The axle I cut up was a narrowed 87 Ford 60, it had a huge crack in it that I was thinking of trying to repair but in the end it woked better this way, as the doner.

Jason.

What are you doing out at the spindle ends?

For hubs? Or for line up with the bar?

For hubs I will use some machined DRW Chevy hubs and 35 spline spicer stubs and yes using 60 tube's with the seal step is the way to go.

What about axle spline depth. I was reading in a other thread about 9" fronts and stock shaft's. It was brought up about the adjustable 3rd might interfere with the amount of depth on the spline's.

I guess if I run into a problem I will have the spline cut deeper and while I'm at it have a spaer set made.

Jason.

For hubs? Or for line up with the bar?

Line up on the bar.


What about axle spline depth. I was reading in a other thread about 9" fronts and stock shaft's. It was brought up about the adjustable 3rd might interfere with the amount of depth on the spline's.


When you are ready to measure for shafts, drop in your 3rd, slide a tape measure into the axle tube, go all the way to the center until you hit the center shaft, let the end of the tape drop and then pull back until you catch the inner edge of the side gear.

For optimal shaft strength you want to limit the length of the axle spline.

Well I got the inner axle pucks made, they fit in the factory seal spots. Slid the bar threw and put the hole thing together. I still need to fill some of the gaps were I cut a little to much off.
I will do this before I weld the tubes on, that will help keep the tube's from pulling around. So onto Pics,

Jason.

this is so rad. its good to see it done right.

Looking at the way the 3rd is designed, are you worried about the pinion getting oiled properly in a front application since the ring gear is turning the oposite way? Probably will not be an issue in a slow crawler application since there is a chase through the pinion support too. What if you would be driving it down the road in 4wd?

Looking at the way the 3rd is designed, are you worried about the pinion getting oiled properly in a front application since the ring gear is turning the oposite way? Probably will not be an issue in a slow crawler application since there is a chase through the pinion support too. What if you would be driving it down the road in 4wd?

I'm building a rear engine buggy and this is the rear axle, so I'm flipping the 3rd, for now I will have a flipped Chevy 60 for the front.
Oiling was an issue till I saw what a Eaton 3rd looked like, its a carbon copy ( or I should say the 9" is a carbon copy, not sure witch one came first ) of a 9" and alot of guys are flipping them.
This will be a crawler with the some short burst ( short burst from a 4.3 TBI:flipoff2: ) of speed from trail to trail. Oiling wont be an issue, I will over fill and run some stcky Lucas in theere, should be fine.

Tim the end of the line bar had a had a mount on it, I think thats what your seeing in the Pic.
God deal on the shaft info, I will see were they land after I tack the tube's up heavy, This way I can see if factory shafts will work or if I need to get them cut with more spline.
I still need to machine the carrier open to let the shaft slid in all the way and cut the seal spot on the shaft deeper down the shaft.

Jason.

Makes sense now why you have the third in upside down in the pic and why you welded it solid. I assume you are putting in a standard drivetrain and flipping the axles to get you moving in the right direction. Does that mean you front axle will have a centered pinion?

Really enjoying this.

I had to laugh with your "forgetting" about having another D60 under your pile of axles.:D

Jack

Hello my name is Jason and I'm addicted to Dana 60's, I even chase after them in my truck when I see them strapped to trailers going down the road.
:laughing:

Hello my name is Jason and I'm addicted to Dana 60's, I even chase after them in my truck when I see them strapped to trailers going down the road.
:laughing:

Ya I got a few 60's kicking around and yes i'm guilty of seeing dana 60's drive buy on there way to the scrap yard and rescue them from the crusher, hey just found a 78/79 Ford front this week doing that.

Why am I telling you this I called you while I was in hot pursuit of said axle:D

Jason.

That was one of the funiest phone calls I've had in while.
Looking forward to seeing this axle finished, its going to kick ass!

this is cool. I like eatons. must subscribe to see the final axle.

Don't know why it took me this long to trip over this thread. A friend actually PMed me a link to it knowing my obsession with these axles. Looks good man. Keep it up. If you need or want any CNC cut parts or something gimme a shout, I'll hook it up for a project of this nature.

Don't know why it took my this long to trip over this thread. A friend actually PMed me a link to it know my obsession with these axles. Looks good man. Keep it up. If you need or want any CNC cut parts or something gimme a shout, I'll hook it up for a project of this nature.

Thanks for the offer, like any build this axle wont see the rocks for a little while. I still need to build a buggy to put it under:D
But I figured start with the axle's first and kinda build around them.

I got it it all welded last night, things I still need to do is machine the carrier open to allow the chevy shaft to slide threw the jurnals and machine the shafts with a longer step for the seal.
I still need to have some work done on the DRW hubs that I had machined to SRW, the guy that did them left the OEM weld well I told him to leave it.
But thet screwed me becasue the rim hits the weld.
So I need to cut a plate and weld that onto the hub to all the ears, that will do two things space the rim away from the weld and conect all the ears.

I also have a Jeep with one tons thats needs alot of work, that keeps me in the woods till my buggys built, So I got alot on my plate this winter.

Found another axle in the junkyard once the rain ends I'm checking it out.

Jason.

I'm building a rear engine buggy and this is the rear axle, so I'm flipping the 3rd, for now I will have a flipped Chevy 60 for the front.
Oiling was an issue till I saw what a Eaton 3rd looked like, its a carbon copy ( or I should say the 9" is a carbon copy, not sure witch one came first ) of a 9" and alot of guys are flipping them.
This will be a crawler with the some short burst ( short burst from a 4.3 TBI:flipoff2: ) of speed from trail to trail. Oiling wont be an issue, I will over fill and run some stcky Lucas in theere, should be fine.

Jason.

Bringing this back to the top.

In a front application, you wouldn't flip the third, correct? So would this remove the oiling issue? Also, the deflection bolt would really shine in a front application, right?

In want to build one of these :smokin:

Bringing this back to the top.

In a front application, you wouldn't flip the third, correct? So would this remove the oiling issue? Also, the deflection bolt would really shine in a front application, right?

In want to build one of these :smokin:

Wish you were closer, I could help. The way I did it was I think the easyest and truest. But if there's any suggestions lets here them.
I have mine done, but money is all dried up for any future buggy parts. So for now Its on hold.

You are right for a front you dont want to flip it. The only reasion I am flipping the 3rd is becasue I had a rear engine planded for it. But the nice thing about a Eaton as a steering axle is you can unplug the 3rd and just about come up with any side drop.

Jason.

I think a lot of my questions about the oiling and actually making this work would be answered as soon as I get my hands on one of these and start building. Until then, I'll have to wait. I still want to find a pair of these and start as soon as I can. Thanks for sharing all the info.

Eatons in action...

YouTube - Off-Road Climb up Pikes Peak with Chevrolet truck in 1957 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-4A5pFbuLU)

I think a lot of my questions about the oiling and actually making this work would be answered as soon as I get my hands on one of these and start building. Until then, I'll have to wait. I still want to find a pair of these and start as soon as I can. Thanks for sharing all the info.
What ratio are you looking for?

5.13s, can't even start building or collecting parts since I leave in a month, won't be back until April or May.

I thought someone posted a diagram or schematic of the third but can't find it again.

Eatons in action...

YouTube - Off-Road Climb up Pikes Peak with Chevrolet truck in 1957 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-4A5pFbuLU)

fuck yea chevy along with eaton and napco among the first ever rock crawlers :smokin: thats bad ass to the core, i feel like a part of history running these axles under my junk. i wonder if they had no-spins front and rear in those trucks:D

have you welded this yet? interested to see how you do it with all the controversy on how to weld nodular iron.

have you welded this yet? interested to see how you do it with all the controversy on how to weld nodular iron.

Yep all welded, the Eaton is a all steel housing. Its not like a normall 14 bolt, but I along with plenty of others have welded Cast section on axle's with mig with no problems.

I will get some Pic's of it welded, sucks I cant find a home for it under a buggy of mine:shaking:

Jason.

Why not?

Oh and :flipoff2:

fuck yea chevy along with eaton and napco among the first ever rock crawlers :smokin: thats bad ass to the core, i feel like a part of history running these axles under my junk. i wonder if they had no-spins front and rear in those trucks:D

Yep I really dig that video! Probaly a no-Spin in the rear but I doubt the front, those trucks did not have power steering. They also had 4.56 gears stock.

Why not?

Oh and :flipoff2:

Right back at ya, :flipoff2:

Jason.

Yep all welded, the Eaton is a all steel housing. Its not like a normall 14 bolt, but I along with plenty of others have welded Cast section on axle's with mig with no problems.

I will get some Pic's of it welded, sucks I cant find a home for it under a buggy of mine:shaking:

Jason.


awesome. yea ill be waiting for pics. looking at doing this myself. running an ho72 in the rear and have a line on another one for cheap so i may run one in the front. i have all the tools and capabilities to make this happen. very kool.

Yep I really dig that video! Probaly a no-Spin in the rear but I doubt the front, those trucks did not have power steering. They also had 4.56 gears stock.

haha i was joking about the no spin in the front but theres really no way to say what gears they had since they came stock with all all three ratios. Kinda seems to me like gear choice from the factory was just kinda luck of the draw

another question... youre messing around with spiders in an earlier post and i saw where you welded them up. with running a stock detroit, all id have to do is just swap in the d60 side gears, correct? am i thinking correctly? the detroit doesnt have spiders and thus wouldnt need the work you put into it. just machining of the side gears. right?

another question... youre messing around with spiders in an earlier post and i saw where you welded them up. with running a stock detroit, all id have to do is just swap in the d60 side gears, correct? am i thinking correctly? the detroit doesnt have spiders and thus wouldnt need the work you put into it. just machining of the side gears. right?

I really cant answer that question, I don't know if the 60 35 spline side gears will fit in place inside the locker. I do know the 60 side gears needed to have the wall machined to fit inside the carrier.
And you need to machine the depth of the gear to get it to fit, if not the gear will not bottom out and you wont be able to close the carrier halfs when you bolt the ring on.

The only machine step I have left is to machine the ID of the carrier so the shafts can slide into them, they bottom out past the seal surface towards the larger end of the shaft where it necks up.

Theres alot of little machine work needed, thats why it took me a while to get to the next step when building this axle, I had to wate for a shop to do all my machine work.

So its not cut and dry as dumping side gears into a carrier and going from there. You still need to have all the pucks made for a line up bar. Think you dont need one take a look at the Pic with the bar inside the very bent factory tube.
At least make a bar out of some 1.5" 1/4" wall DOM, this will at least get you very close.

Jason.

whichever axle you go with hit me up, i got lube lockers for both

Buy a star and go to the vendor forum instead of posting in every thread on the board with an axle rebuild.

I really cant answer that question, I don't know if the 60 35 spline side gears will fit in place inside the locker. I do know the 60 side gears needed to have the wall machined to fit inside the carrier.
And you need to machine the depth of the gear to get it to fit, if not the gear will not bottom out and you wont be able to close the carrier halfs when you bolt the ring on.

The only machine step I have left is to machine the ID of the carrier so the shafts can slide into them, they bottom out past the seal surface towards the larger end of the shaft where it necks up.

Theres alot of little machine work needed, thats why it took me a while to get to the next step when building this axle, I had to wate for a shop to do all my machine work.

So its not cut and dry as dumping side gears into a carrier and going from there. You still need to have all the pucks made for a line up bar. Think you dont need one take a look at the Pic with the bar inside the very bent factory tube.
At least make a bar out of some 1.5" 1/4" wall DOM, this will at least get you very close.

Jason.


i have all the capabilities to do the machine work. thats not a problem. thanks for the info. cant wait to see this done.

you going to put a truss on it?

i have all the capabilities to do the machine work. thats not a problem. thanks for the info. cant wait to see this done.

you going to put a truss on it?

Yes, but you have to rememeber this axle pretty much got shelved. As anything in a build the axle was going into a buggy, well that buggy got put on hold.
So really I cant say when It will see action, a year maybe two. Heck maybe next month I can restart the build, money dictate's all my moves like anyone else.

Jason.

Jason,
Nice work on the axle so far. I am looking to build a H072 front and rear steer for a buggy I intend to build one day.... Im glad someone else is building a steering eaton!

-I have a few eaton axles and additional Diffs. and a set of spidertrax knuckles. I would like to get a set of RCV custom shafts 30spline inner/35 spline outer and run a 14 bolt detroit... any issues you see running this set up?

-which seals you have found to work? (as far as Size?) what is the ID of the dana60 tubes?

-I would like to run the same WMS that you have as well. Can you go into detail about the axle tube lengths.

I also like how you cut the housing to sleeve the tubes into the eaton housing.
Thanks in advance, hope to see your axle done soon!
_Mike

Jason,
Nice work on the axle so far. I am looking to build a H072 front and rear steer for a buggy I intend to build one day.... Im glad someone else is building a steering eaton!

-I have a few eaton axles and additional Diffs. and a set of spidertrax knuckles. I would like to get a set of RCV custom shafts 30spline inner/35 spline outer and run a 14 bolt detroit... any issues you see running this set up?

-which seals you have found to work? (as far as Size?) what is the ID of the dana60 tubes?

-I would like to run the same WMS that you have as well. Can you go into detail about the axle tube lengths.

I also like how you cut the housing to sleeve the tubes into the eaton housing.
Thanks in advance, hope to see your axle done soon!
_Mike

I dont see any problems running the 30 spline RCV shafts. I built it with 35 spline stock Chevy one's only because I had a bunch.

Tube seals well I plan on using the OEM 60 seals, I just need to get the OEM shafts cut deeper down the shafts for the seal spot.
I used OEM Ford tube's and extended them to match the Chevy shafts.
I had a junk housing that I cut up for the tube's with the OEM seal placement cut in them all ready.

How I got that tube messurement, I installed the custom spool, put it in the cut housing and then messured out to the ends of the axle's were the ears start.
Now I did screw up the long side tube and need to cut and re-do that one side, its to long.

I cut the housing 4.5"s away from the end of where the 3rd drops in the center hole. Wiggled the tube's in from there and then let the line up bar hold it solid. I did have to remove the tube's alot to fill the gaps, that kept the distrotion down.

My axle is on hold, I dont have the cash to finish my buggy, so no buggy no axle, someday:D

Jason.

I am also kinda working on this front Eaton thing. My intentions are to fab up a diamond style center section. I have a Torchmate table so cutting the main ring and all of the parts for the housing will be easy. Hoping to run the same route of having some RCVs, if I an swing the cash, or set of 30 spline 14 shafts cut and running a 14 bolt locker in the Eaton Carrier. The seals, I am pretty certain that I can track down some form of double lip seal that has a the proper seal dimensions for the application and I can have my brother machine me some slugs that can be pressed into the ends of the tubes where they enter the fabbed housing.

If you're using the standard size 14 bolt 30 spline shafts, I'm pretty sure SealsIt could get you a pair of seals just based on the diameter of the shafts and ID of the tubes you're using.

I also thought about making a diamond style center and using some nice new DOM for tubes that are .500 wall and keeping with the standard 60 KP outers, but I read about making them from scratch and it took a TON of work if you're up for it. I assume everyone wants to use KP outers but I've also heard that BJ 60s can be better for lightweight rigs like Jeeps and buggies and could be a pretty budget option if BJ outers are used from a Dana 50 or similar BJ axle.

One more thing I've thought about is Spidertrax's splined ears for shafts, like these:

http://www.spidertrax.com/core/media/media.nl?id=9316&c=407909&h=4e1d2d4f29e521149364

See the splined "cup"? I don't know much more about them (spline count, available spline counts, etc) but you could possibly get some standard 14 bolt shafts cut down and just slide them in. Thoughts? :smokin:

I'm bringing this thread back to life because it is full of good information but I still need a bit more....


So I am building an Eaton HO72 front axle, but on a very tight budget, as an 18 year old with welding certs in a small town with almost no structural work and a tiny offroading scene and working in a college welding shop I make very little money (minimum wage unfortunately but at least its a job), so I am trying to do this without throwing down like $500+ for custom shafts.

I like what 420willys did with the Dana60 side gears to be able to utilize a common Dana 60 spline count which seems like it would save one quite a bit of money on shafts. I noticed he said he had to machine the Dana 60 side gears to fit into the HO72 carrier, but what surface of the side gears did he have machined, as I couldn't tell from the pictures and I read the post over and over and couldn't quite figure it out? The flat surface on the back of the side gear or the cylindrical surface of the side gear? Also, I noticed he said that the side gears did not mesh will with the spiders gears, is this due to a bevel angle difference between the side gears and the spiders or are the spiders too large in diameter or something?

The axle I'm building is going in a truck that will be driven on the street and 4wd used during bad weather conditions and welding the spiders and using manual locking hubs still would not be very practical as it would be a bitch to turn if driven on pavement at all with the hubs locked (and would probably make something go snap crackle pop and possibly dangerous to drive). So would Dana 60 spiders work in conjunction with the Dana 60 side gears to be able to keep it as an open diff, or could the HO72 spiders have a steeper bevel machined or cut a bit of the teeth off all the way around to mesh better with the Dana 60 side gears?

One other crazy idea I had was to grind the splines down a bit shorter on the HO72 side gears then weld all around inside of them to build up the surface, then have them bored true and have a common Dana 60 spline count cut into them, I really don't know if such a thing can even be done and if it will work, never heard of anyone doing it before but I think as long as the welding is sound there isn't much reason why it wouldn't work, just don't weld alot at once to keep the side gear relatively cool so it doesn't lose any strength.

Could anyone out there who does machining/knows someone who does machining for a living chime in on the cost of having a side gear bored true after welding the inside and resplined to a common Dana 60 spline count (30 spline I guess? Or 35? I am not all that familiar with the D60) compared to having custom shafts made for the normal Eaton sized 17 spline? I just find the ability to run any number of aftermarket stock length Dana 60 shafts appealing, and if something breaks on the trail or something wears out, the parts store or various online shops will have a fairly cheap and readily available part.

What I had to machine was the part of the gear that slide's into the carrier. I will get better pics and show some messurements.

The meshing of the spiders gears betwen the HO and the dana side gears will not work. They are close but mesh at different angle's.

I'm no expert but I would have to say that building up the surface with weld ( maybe tool steel filler ) and then re-splined, might work.
Theres a guy building a killer 14 bolt front here in the Chevy forum he was saying that the side gears allmost interchange with miner machine work.

Reddman here on the board been saying this for years ( that the side gears interchange with minor machine work ) but without locker in front of me I took the easy road and welded it all together.

Really wish I could finish this axle, but cash is tight and I have a Jeep with duel steering 60's that will keep me buisy for now.

Good luck with the build and any questions I can answer I will.

Jason.

What I had to machine was the part of the gear that slide's into the carrier. I will get better pics and show some messurements.

The meshing of the spiders gears betwen the HO and the dana side gears will not work. They are close but mesh at different angle's.

I'm no expert but I would have to say that building up the surface with weld ( maybe tool steel filler ) and then re-splined, might work.
Theres a guy building a killer 14 bolt front here in the Chevy forum he was saying that the side gears allmost interchange with miner machine work.

Reddman here on the board been saying this for years ( that the side gears interchange with minor machine work ) but without locker in front of me I took the easy road and welded it all together.

Really wish I could finish this axle, but cash is tight and I have a Jeep with duel steering 60's that will keep me buisy for now.

Good luck with the build and any questions I can answer I will.

Jason.

Sorry for the newb response but do you mean 14b side gears or 60 side gears? I've read over and over that 14b side gears fit into the Eaton without needing any machine work at all. Same goes for the detroits and whatnot.

Also wondering, with minor machine work on the D60 side gears, would it be possible to make the D60 spiders fit the Eaton cross pin and use 4 spiders for an open diff? Not sure what side cross pin the D60 uses but im sure the D60 spiders could be bored out to work with the Eaton cross pin. Only thing that I could see preventing this from working is the diameter of the 60 spiders vs. the Eaton spiders. If they are any smaller in diameter, or any bigger, they still wouldn't mesh right.

Right now though I am thinking that building up the inner surface of the Eaton side gears and having them re-splined would be about my cheapest option and best option to be able to utilize stock D60 shafts. In the mean time I am going to see what kind of options are out there for high tensile strength MIG filler wires. I would do this with TIG but seems like it would be a major PITA trying to fit a torch in there even with a short back cap, and I don't own or know anyone with a pencil torch that I could use. So any suggestions from anyone for MIG filler wire of the tool steel variety? TIG is more my thing as I do it almost every day and have a couple certs and I only have a structural cert with MIG, not really my area of expertise.

And thanks for the help man, I've followed your Eaton front build from day 1 on here and got it in my head that I just had to build one sometime since I've never had any luck with finding a Napco conversion.


EDIT: I should probably contact a few vendors on here who might be capable of doing this custom machine work, might end up where they would want to do the welding on such a part themselves. Not really sure where to start though. Anyone have some suggestions right off hand where I should be asking first? I am a newb to the whole custom made parts scene short of making stuff myself....

The Pic that shows the Mic and the side gears, one shows the factory Eaton side gear, the other Pic shows the "cut" dana 60 side gear.

That ball of steel is a spool made from the Eaton spiders and cross shaft with the "cut/machined" 35 spline Dana 60 side gears.

The dana 60 cross shaft is bigger than the Eaton, so this means the spider gears wobble on the shaft, thats why I didn't use them when I welded the spool.
But I had to cut the side gears down alot to make them fit.

35 spline side gears that fit into a factory detroit locker is whats needed here.
I wish a Vender would try to make some, this leaves the door open for alot of 14 bolt and Eaton build's using stock dana 60 shafts.

I tell you what PM me and maybe I can better explian threw a phone call.

Contact Tech Tim, he seems to be up to speed on what were trying to achive here. Maybe he has some issue's figured out since the start of this build or other 14 bolt steering axle's.

Get me a Vender that will make 5.13 gears and you will see a hole bunch of doors open up for the Eaton, HINT HINT.

Jason.

Bringing this back, for my Eaton front axle build I am thinking of just using 2 Dana 60 long side shafts (be it Ford or Chevy, whichever is longer and largest diameter of the two, unless Ford wasn't 35 spline), positioning the center chunk so that a stock D60 long side shaft could be cut right at the seal surface, as in the largest diameter part of the shaft, then turned down and splined to Eaton 17 spline, then use another long side shaft cut down, turned, and splined to use as the short side shaft. Only issues I might run into with this as far as the center chunk's position is drive shaft/oil pan clearance issues. However, if I keep the WMS-WMS distance equal to that of my rear Eaton H072, which I believe is 65'', I shouldn't have to have the center chunk too far towards the middle of the truck to be able to use long side shafts cut down and resplined.

Only reason I am thinking of going this route is because it seems like it may not be feasible right now to have couple side gears made to match the Eaton ones with Dana 60 sized 35 spline, at least not for a decent price maybe? Any vendors here that could give some input on this? I'd like to not limit the discussion to a PM, a product like 14b/Eaton side gears made to accept stock Dana 60 35 spline shafts would open a lot of doors for people wanting to make custom front axles when they don't have access to or the skills to use machining equipment and a limited budget. They would sell like crazy I'd bet, too.


EDIT: Blazerboy85, would you happen to have a measurement of the long side shaft of your Napco/Eaton front, from very end to center of pivot at the joint?

Bringing this back, for my Eaton front axle build I am thinking of just using 2 Dana 60 long side shafts (be it Ford or Chevy, whichever is longer and largest diameter of the two, unless Ford wasn't 35 spline), positioning the center chunk so that a stock D60 long side shaft could be cut right at the seal surface, as in the largest diameter part of the shaft, then turned down and splined to Eaton 17 spline, then use another long side shaft cut down, turned, and splined to use as the short side shaft. Only issues I might run into with this as far as the center chunk's position is drive shaft/oil pan clearance issues. However, if I keep the WMS-WMS distance equal to that of my rear Eaton H072, which I believe is 65'', I shouldn't have to have the center chunk too far towards the middle of the truck to be able to use long side shafts cut down and resplined.

Only reason I am thinking of going this route is because it seems like it may not be feasible right now to have couple side gears made to match the Eaton ones with Dana 60 sized 35 spline, at least not for a decent price maybe? Any vendors here that could give some input on this? I'd like to not limit the discussion to a PM, a product like 14b/Eaton side gears made to accept stock Dana 60 35 spline shafts would open a lot of doors for people wanting to make custom front axles when they don't have access to or the skills to use machining equipment and a limited budget. They would sell like crazy I'd bet, too.


EDIT: Blazerboy85, would you happen to have a measurement of the long side shaft of your Napco/Eaton front, from very end to center of pivot at the joint?

I used to have all those measurements floating around but i wouldnt know where to look for them. When i take my front apart next ill get the measurements for you.

Has anyone found a set of shafts that can be cut down to fit a 30 spline 14 bolt carrier? Do any of the blank shafts have a large enough diameter?

Has anyone found a set of shafts that can be cut down to fit a 30 spline 14 bolt carrier? Do any of the blank shafts have a large enough diameter?

I ordered custom inner shafts for my 14 bolt (30 spline) front axle project through Offroad Design. Apparently their axle manufacturer had no problems finding the appropriate blanks to start with. Sure look to be standard Dana 60 blanks to me.

http://i548.photobucket.com/albums/ii326/startheblackcat/K20%20build/101_0295.jpg

I ordered custom inner shafts for my 14 bolt (30 spline) front axle project through Offroad Design. Apparently their axle manufacturer had no problems finding the appropriate blanks to start with. Sure look to be standard Dana 60 blanks to me.

If you don't mind saying, roughly how much did that set of shafts there cost you? And you say they look to be standard 60 blanks, so I take it you didn't get any fancy alloy shafts like 4130 or 300M, etc.?

There isn't a problem cutting the 30 Spline GM in a D60 blank.

The GM 30 spline profile has a Major Dia. of 1.55".

The Dana 60 35 spline has a Major Dia. of 1.50".

The blanks I have here have an OD of 1.60".

The Dana 80 37 spline profile has a Major Dia. of 1.583" and we been able to just barely squeeze that profile into those same blanks.

If you don't mind saying, roughly how much did that set of shafts there cost you? And you say they look to be standard 60 blanks, so I take it you didn't get any fancy alloy shafts like 4130 or 300M, etc.?

Sorry... I can see now that my statement could be confusing. By "standard Dana 60 blanks", I'm just saying that I don't see anything particularly special about them.

I think I paid about $370 for the pair, in April of 2010. They are 4340---most likely import (Yukon) blanks.

Say what you will about Yukon shafts, but my first set served me very well. I'll be quite satisfied to get comparable performance out of these. My build required custom length shafts, and from a cost versus strength standpoint, I figured these would be a significant improvement over stock resplined Spicer shafts, and would likely be a pretty good choice for me.

In addition, I saw no need to spend a lot of money on this set of shafts, because I'm working on a way to get bigger shafts in my axle. If I do manage to squeeze a bigger shaft in there, THAT'S the set I'll put real money into.

Any updates on some front's being made? mine is sitting on the floor wishing it had a buggy over it.

Just checking.

Jason.

Still working on mine but its slow, ran out of money for more Dana 60 stuff (outer shit like knuckles/hubs/spindles/brakes) and can't seem to find the information I need (A fully dimensioned front profile view of a Dana 60 showing the distance from king pin hole center to king pin hole center for a stock GM d60, etc.) Basically I only need to know that so I can adjust that distance to be the proper wms-wms width for my GMC (Want to match the rear at 65''). I am still for sure going to build it, it'll just take a while. I'm going for drivers drop with mine too, didn't feel like dealing with the driveshaft making close friends with the trans and oil pan. I cleaned up the pair of D60 inner C's that I have though and welded some gussets on them for the hell of it.

I need to buy a setup bar too, figured it would be worth the $120 or so from speedymetals. 420willys, do you happen to have another set of those alignment pucks that you would sell? Or would be willing to sell the set you've got? I don't have access to a lathe anymore so I'm not able to make something like that.

I want to hold onto to mine since there now made with two steps on them, I have one side that can do Rockwells and them flip them over and I can do Eatons.
Let me see now that I have a small lathe maybe I can make somethening for ya. Even if I used some simple 1/2" round plate with a 1.5" hole in it, or somthing you could weld a chunk of DOM threw a hole.

I have a friend that used some 1.5" .250 wall tube for his 60 that he centered for rear steer. He said it was straight enough and he use's this buggy as a go fast car.
No problems yet, point I'm trying to make is maybe you can just use some 1.5" .250 wall tube for your bar.

Let me see what I have for small round plate maybe I can turn two pucks.

Mine is so damm close to being done, problem is no rig. I was thinking of putting it under my Jeep/juggy but then I would have to regear the HP 60 front for 5.13's and its all ready 5.38's.

Jason.

can you get me dimensions on those pucks? I have access to a lathe and could make a set....or two.

can you get me dimensions on those pucks? I have access to a lathe and could make a set....or two.

I just messured the OD of the race and cut to that size. As far as the ID just cut them to whatever size of the line bar that needs to slide threw.

Mine are very custom since I used 1.5 Hiem for a ID, so really your better off getting the demensions off your race's and then use "your" bar OD for the inner cut.

Jason.

420willy's, I may have missed it but what is your WMS-WMS distances supposed to be on your eaton front?


I have done a ton of searches recently trying to find some basic D60 dimensions with no luck so I'll ask here...

Would anyone be able to measure the distance of upper king pin hole center to upper king pin hole center (on the C's) on a stock Chevy D60 housing? Also looking for a measurement from the end of the short side tube to the end of the long side tube (inside of the C's). Really need to know these dimensions and cant track down that info myself anywhere so if someone could measure those 2 things for me that would be awesome.

I just need to know those measurements to figure out the overall housing width on my Eaton since I do not own any D60 outer stuff to figure out the distance from WMS to kingpin centerline on my own. Once I know those dimensions, since I know a Chevy D60 has a 69'' WMS-WMS distance, I can subract 4'' overall from those dimensions to put my Eaton front at a 65'' WMS-WMS to match the rear.

I based mine off a Chevy 60 lenght inner/outer axle.
I just went down and messured a Chevy housing that I stripped down last week, its down to the upper KP cone's.
I checked it three time's and each time I come up with 53" on center. But this is me trying to go center of cone to center of cone while holding the tape over the top of the housing. There is no bend in the tape and I tried to go to the inner of one cone to the outer of the other but this was kinda tuff.

Now that was a stripped axle, I messured a still built housing and messured off the greese fittings on the top of the KP's. Now don't ask why but there center to center is 52 1/2", I thinks its because the KP tilt in 1/4" each side, so overall is a 1/2".

Make sence? Now one issue I ran into is the since the eaton carrier can adjust side to side this was a issue with mine. One side forced the axle shaft about a 1/4" past the outer C and the other side theres a 1/4" or so less spline engagamnet.
So I'm going to cut the tube's ( again ) and get it perfect. Plus I still need to have the seal steps cut further down the axle shafts and have some spares made.
I want to fiinsh my rear steer Jeep then I will have some back on this axle.

GMCkid I can PM my number if you want and I explain maybe a little better in detail.

Jason.