Welcome to the next contribution to the
The Official Pirate4x4.com Jeep Talk Bible (http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=705122)

Topic of the Month D300 swap Tips and Tricks

Give use some Tips and tricks of your Dana 300 transfercase swap.
This includes flip kits DIY or off the shelf, Shifters, how to do front digs?, outputs shaft swaps/ spacers, Clocking rings...

This does not include D300 doublers, We have a different TOTM for doublers.

D300 DIY flip kit thread: http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=273505

Can you get away with not using a flip kit. Im planning on going cable shift. My question, is the flip kit 100% manditory when you flip it?

No, it is not necesary, mine is flipped and all I did was plug the vent and put a new one in the top. Mine is mounted behind a doubler tho.

Im MAKING cable shifters like timmy:
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=664135
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=667979
I will post up my shifter setup when i get it finished.

D&D Machine also makes a cheap flip kit;
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=505924


Something else that is neet. Home made
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=161815

The question Im having is do you need a 7/8" spacer between the AW4 and the D300? Like this;
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=628996&highlight=aw4+dana+300+spacer

Can you get away with not using a flip kit. Im planning on going cable shift. My question, is the flip kit 100% manditory when you flip it?

go 2 guy flip/clocking ring,lip seals and cable or mechanical shifters is all you need to flip a dana 300.

you will need to relocate or make a breather/vent in the old bottom(now top pan).... if you try to clock it flat you will have to move it from the old(oem) location as it will hit the floor board,or it did on my tj.

that is all there is to it.

Yes mine will be behind a 231 Box for Rox.

When I did mine, I used the Down East Offroad flip kit, the shifters that came with the kit did not fit right for my application as seen in this pic
http://www.fullsizexjgear.com/New%20xj%20project/2007-08-05-1817-41/Front%20hoops/2007-08-21-1602-44/2007-08-23-1214-13/2008-01-10-0900-46/P1010022n.jpg


So I ended up making these for it instead
http://www.fullsizexjgear.com/New%20xj%20project/2007-08-05-1817-41/Front%20hoops/2007-08-21-1602-44/2007-08-23-1214-13/2008-01-10-0900-46/2008-01-29-1302-11/2008-02-07-1134-35/P1010024n.jpg

as for the ring, I tried without it and to do so, you have to remove the rear seal in the trans, I was never able to get a good seal and always leaked tran fluid so I used a Novac clocking ring as a spacer and put my seal back into the trans and it works great now

I redrilled 3 of the holes on my nv3550 and flipped it. Plugged the vent and put one on top, right behind the speedo gead. If you redrill the ax-15 I believe you need a 5/8 spacer, or the end output of a 727 tailhousing. I have never had a problem with the shift rails leaking.

300 in stock position behind a 231 doubler, cable shift.

http://photos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-sf2p/v217/53/103/24800499/n24800499_32017075_486.jpg

http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-sf2p/v217/53/103/24800499/n24800499_32017077_1257.jpg

http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-sf2p/v217/53/103/24800499/n24800499_32017079_2033.jpg

Twin stick is easy, just use two sticks. :D

If for some reason you want front hi-range only, you'll have to modify the shift rails. I couldn't think of a single reason why I'd ever need this so I didn't bother.

Front digs are fun. Something that works but probably isn't good for the case is when you're digging the front around something, you can just slap the rear output back in without letting up. I don't do this if I'm really smoking the tires but if you're creeping around something it's nice to not have to stop and mess with the clutch/brake/etc.

I've got almost 2 years on the stock outputs and 1310 driveline joints. Haven't broken any of 'em, but I've broken PLENTY of Dana 60 parts, both stock and 4340, Detroit, drive flange, Spicer u-joint, etc.

I went with the Stak replace a case, cause it was shiny :D. I picked up the adapter from A&A, along with the 21 spline I needed. It cost more money, but it was quicker to install. The dana300 was free, after someone stole my first one. (when scrap was high price)

as for the ring, I tried without it and to do so, you have to remove the rear seal in the trans, I was never able to get a good seal and always leaked tran fluid so I used a Novac clocking ring as a spacer and put my seal back into the trans and it works great now

So if I use the Nocac spacer/clock ring (7/8" thick right?) I wont have to mess with any seals and such?

On the shift rails, Do you have to put two lip seals on each rail or just on set of fresh ones?

I use front high all the time when Im going from trail to trail - mainly because my front is spooled and the rear has a detroit. It turns much better with the front pulling

I use front high all the time when Im going from trail to trail - mainly because my front is spooled and the rear has a detroit. It turns much better with the front pulling

Guess that makes sense.

My front is a detroit and I can hit 60 MPH in low range. :)

I flipped my 300 and put it behind a Box 4 Rocks 231. I used Duffy's flipped twin stick shifters but they were very sloppy. So I am in the middle of building a cable shifter setup. The only thing I did special to my 300 was put extra seals on the shifter rails and polished up the rails when i rebuilt the box. I also put a little shroud over the new breather (old drain plug) because fluid would try to push up the breather line.

I will get pictures loaded of everything in the next day or so.

anyone else with the novak flip adapter between their ax-15 and d300 disappointed that there's not a position to clock the tcase flat? mounted mine up this weekend and the highest position puts the tcase about 20 degrees from horizontal. is there an issue with the tcase being flipped and flat that i'm not thinkging about? floor isnt an issue with me, what about driveline angles?

How do you put extra lip seals on the rails? Is it as easy as just putting them in or do you have to fab some stuff?

How do you put extra lip seals on the rails? Is it as easy as just putting them in or do you have to fab some stuff?

When you put the first lip seal in it will sit flush. The second one will stick out a bit. But if you look at the figure 8 piece that goes over the rails (with a bolt that goes through the center) there is an indentation that are the same size as the lip seals. So they will hold the second set. From what I have seen you cant put a second set of seals in without that firgure 8 looking cap holding them in place.

Maybe someone will have a picture of what I am talking about. If not i will have to see if I have that piece sitting around

Twin stick is easy, just use two sticks. :D

If for some reason you want front hi-range only, you'll have to modify the shift rails. I couldn't think of a single reason why I'd ever need this so I didn't bother.

So the stock d300 shift rails will allow:
Front Low
Rear only Low
4wd Low
4wd high
Rear only High

Will not allow rear High-front low due to the internal pins?
If you modify the shift rails for front only high would it still protect you from having it in Front High-Rear Low?

So the stock d300 shift rails will allow:
Front Low
Rear only Low
4wd Low
4wd high
Rear only High

Will not allow rear High-front low due to the internal pins?
If you modify the shift rails for front only high would it still protect you from having it in Front High-Rear Low?

I think that's correct. There's an interlock pin that only lets it go into front high if rear high is engaged. That's what you're changing by modding the shift rails...so yeah, that means you could put it in front high at any time, even if the rear was in low.

When you put the first lip seal in it will sit flush. The second one will stick out a bit. But if you look at the figure 8 piece that goes over the rails (with a bolt that goes through the center) there is an indentation that are the same size as the lip seals. So they will hold the second set. From what I have seen you cant put a second set of seals in without that firgure 8 looking cap holding them in place.

Maybe someone will have a picture of what I am talking about. If not i will have to see if I have that piece sitting around

Yeah I think pictures would help alot. Im not for sure what figure 8 thing you are talking about. THANKS!

Here's a few pics. of my homemade Dana 300 flip....

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f144/thetvaman/Jeep/P1010045-2.jpg

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f144/thetvaman/Jeep/P1010046-2.jpg

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f144/thetvaman/Jeep/P1010045-3.jpg

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f144/thetvaman/Jeep/P1010048-3.jpg

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f144/thetvaman/Jeep/P1010050-3.jpg


I used Atlas shifters and modified the stock shift forks.


The rest of the build thread along with my 231 doubler can be seen here...



http://www.rockhardxj.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1686

dont own a heep any more but heres my contribution
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=311519&highlight=

And for a spacer to run an unclocked D300, find a '80s fullsize dodge with a A-518 tranny. They have a factory spacer that should work for the unflipped D300/AX-15 combo.

Nice!

I like cheap solutions.

Bump this back to the top, im bout to do this on my rig. :smokin:

X2 I want to run a 231 300 doubler w/ drivers drop. I was looking at the D&D flip kit, what's sloppy about it, a lot of throw? So basically I could do a cable shift and just get a clocking ring, and thats all thats needed to flip the 300? Will i need to drill a hole on top for a filler, and one on the bottom to drain? or use the originals for the opposite purposes, if so is the fill level correct? sorry i've never seen one in person... what about the breather? and what has to be done to the shift rails to run front hi?

X2 I want to run a 231 300 doubler w/ drivers drop. I was looking at the D&D flip kit, what's sloppy about it, a lot of throw? So basically I could do a cable shift and just get a clocking ring, and thats all thats needed to flip the 300? Will i need to drill a hole on top for a filler, and one on the bottom to drain? or use the originals for the opposite purposes, if so is the fill level correct? sorry i've never seen one in person... what about the breather? and what has to be done to the shift rails to run front hi?

I too have these same questions!

i just finished my cable shifters on Saturday with a drivers side drop. I will post up the pictures tomorrow.

These pix arent mine, but its the same exact set up i am doing minus the E-brake, I got a 4' twin stick cables from NW fab works for 299, and a novak flip kit spacer i think for 120. Comes out cheaper then the DEO flip kit, and is going to work better IMO. I am putting mine behind a ax 15 in a YJ. From what the guy told me that this this is that the Novak spacer/clocking ring doesnt flip the case completely horisontally, so i might have to cut out my floor board, and modify my skid plate. The old drain plug hole is going to be used as a breather. In the future i am planning on installing a sight tube and a fill and drain plug. For now i am going to use the breather as a fill plug. One thing i would like to see in the picture is where and how do you install the lip seals, and where can you buy them.
here are some pix of the flipped dana 300 with the NWfabworks cable flip kit.
http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r190/czechunit/dana3000.jpg
http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r190/czechunit/dana3002.jpg
http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r190/czechunit/dajnd.jpg

Very simple all you do is grind the old shifter bracket off, install a new one that is supplied with the kit, and run the cables behind the T-case, and you can put them just about anywhere...

so which rings allow for a flat belly? i see D&D lets you clock every 6*, what about great lakes offroad?

here is my shifter setup. Works much better then the kits you can find online. My setup is a drives side drop with the D300 clocked 6 degrees, which lets me run a flat belly pan.

I did it with the adaptor from JB. I have it almsost flat with the frame. Thinking about clocking it down a little before i do the skid.
I am having problems shifting it easly to do digs.. Sometimes i cant get it out of low??

http://solofabworks.com/images2/rigs3/IMG_0267.JPG
I have another case im building with the Lowmax kit and the output shaft upgrades.. I ordered the new shift rails.. Will that help with the shifting or was it just to keep the shifter from popping out of gear? never had that problem.

any picutres on how to run the double lip seals in on the shifter rails?

Heres an idea im looking into. What would happen if you swaped the shifting rods to the back of the Case? Remove the plugs and have the shifter atatchment in the back so there is no interferance with the driveline. New shifters may have to be made for this to work, but I got some neet friends who could do this.

Thoughts ?
Questions ?
Ideas?

Dave

here is my shifter setup. Works much better then the kits you can find online. My setup is a drives side drop with the D300 clocked 6 degrees, which lets me run a flat belly pan.

Looks like somebody was studying my build thread. :laughing:

Looks like somebody was studying my build thread. :laughing:

I knew what I wanted it to look like and I knew your design works. I didn't want to do it like AnNoFEELkFK4Whel because it would hurt my ground clearance.

Your stuff works, no need to deny it. :smokin:

So the stock d300 shift rails will allow:
Front Low
Rear only Low
4wd Low
4wd high
Rear only High

Will not allow rear High-front low due to the internal pins?
If you modify the shift rails for front only high would it still protect you from having it in Front High-Rear Low?

I think that's correct. There's an interlock pin that only lets it go into front high if rear high is engaged. That's what you're changing by modding the shift rails...so yeah, that means you could put it in front high at any time, even if the rear was in low.

if you remove the detents you can put one in high and one in low
if you just grind down the shift rail you can have all the options, including front high only, without allowing you to put one in high and one in low

picture is from Lucas Murphy
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o251/alpha-96/07012801.jpg

^ Thanx, thats what Im looking for!

Bump for more input.

Heres an idea im looking into. What would happen if you swaped the shifting rods to the back of the Case? Remove the plugs and have the shifter atatchment in the back so there is no interferance with the driveline. New shifters may have to be made for this to work, but I got some neet friends who could do this.

Thoughts ?
Questions ?
Ideas?

Dave

I had this exact same idea last year when I was building my 300. Unfortunately I did not have the time/money to pursue. Surely someone has tried it!

i've got a few questions for this topic. I'm getting ready to put an NP 435, and a Dana 300 in my CJ5, i've got a few friends to help out with this, and we'll be twin-sticking it. but i personally have absolutley NO idea what i'm doing with it. can someone break this down to a "dummies guide" level please? i'm looking for an explanation of why you'd need to flip it, clock it, etc. why you'd want to leave the shift rails un-modified and the detent pins in to prevent it from going to FH/RL, If i'm running chevy tons will i need to flip the 300? or can i leave it the way it is? what does it take to run a 231/300 doubler setup? Sorry for the long series of questions, just trying to get a handle on some of the things i know nothing about.

Nick

i've got a few questions for this topic. I'm getting ready to put an NP 435, and a Dana 300 in my CJ5, i've got a few friends to help out with this, and we'll be twin-sticking it. but i personally have absolutley NO idea what i'm doing with it. can someone break this down to a "dummies guide" level please? i'm looking for an explanation of why you'd need to flip it, clock it, etc. why you'd want to leave the shift rails un-modified and the detent pins in to prevent it from going to FH/RL, If i'm running chevy tons will i need to flip the 300? or can i leave it the way it is? what does it take to run a 231/300 doubler setup? Sorry for the long series of questions, just trying to get a handle on some of the things i know nothing about.

NickYou don't need to flip yours, d300 is a passenger side case

You may want to clock it but that's personal preference/case by case

Just put a twin stick shifter on it because the stock shifter is shit. You will have front only low without any modifications to the case

You would need a 27 spline input on the 300 to do the 231 doubler. an adapter shaft may be made/possible, I dont know

You don't need to flip yours, d300 is a passenger side case

You may want to clock it but that's personal preference/case by case

Just put a twin stick shifter on it because the stock shifter is shit. You will have front only low without any modifications to the case

You would need a 27 spline input on the 300 to do the 231 doubler. an adapter shaft may be made/possible, I dont know

what is clocking? i've seen the term used, but havent been able to find much of a definition of it. also, would i benefit from doing a basic twin stick conversion? or is modifying the shift rail more advisable?

Clocking is just rotating the transfer case in relation to the transmision

yeah the stock shifter does not work good at all. twin stick is really not a conversion, they bolt right on without any modifications

I never modified the shift rails on my cj7 and I was happy with mine. I'm pretty sure the only thing I didn't have was front wheel only high range but it's been a few years..

Clocking is just rotating the transfer case in relation to the transmision

yeah the stock shifter does not work good at all. twin stick is really not a conversion, they bolt right on without any modifications

I never modified the shift rails on my cj7 and I was happy with mine. I'm pretty sure the only thing I didn't have was front wheel only high range but it's been a few years..

would having the ability to shift the front and rear into high/low independent of each other benefit me in any way? (make digs easier etc) or would it just put un-wanted stress on my drivetrain by creating a crab walk effect?

No that would destroy parts

ok, cool. Thanks. any tips for fabricating my own twin stick setup? looking to go as in-expensive as i can manage to get, and a buddy of mine has put one or two together ....

Not really, just a stick going down to a pivot point to push and pull the shift rails

What cables are you using?

What cables are you using?

Midwest Control
- 3" of throw
- 5' long
- 1/4"

They are the best price I found. Great product too.

http://www.midwestcontrol.com/cables.php

Midwest Control
- 3" of throw
- 5' long
- 1/4"

They are the best price I found. Great product too.

http://www.midwestcontrol.com/cables.php

Are they the grooved or bulkhead ones?

Thanks!

Im going to use the midwest control 4' ones with a bulkhead. 1/4" hopw they are long enough.

what drive shafts are you using with just aw4/300 combo

im going to use front Cherokee CV shafts front and rear. The 231 front CV yokes fit on the factory 300 outputs.

has anyone made there own clockingring/spacer i just got laid off and have the steel and tools to do just wondering if anybody had the spec and were the holes need to be anybody have a cad file i could use
thanks tim

This is a cross post. I originally posted it in the Hardcore Jeep Tech section and was refer here since you guys have probably dealt with this before.

Can the front output shaft of a dana 300 handle a front driveline that continues to turn while in 2wd?

I have a rover that was originally full time 4wd and still has the original front axle assembly in it. I have been running a Dana 18 which does not deal with a constantly turning front drive shaft very well. I believe that this is because while in 2wd it is supported by one bearing and a pilot bushing. While in 4wd the front shaft has a gear that slides onto it locking it together with the rear output shaft which effectively makes the split output shaft into one shaft that has a front and rear bearing. While the pilot bushing and bearing wear quickly in 2wd they seem to run just fine in 4wd. The vehicle sees much more 2wd than 4wd.

I am planning on replacing the Dana 18 with a 300 because the front output shaft of the 300 is supported by two bearings all the time making it able to deal with the constant turning of the front drive shaft while in 2wd.

Is this correct?

Does any one have any experience with this type of situation? I have no doubts about the strength of the 300 but I know this is not its intended purpose.

Matt.

if you remove the detents you can put one in high and one in low
if you just grind down the shift rail you can have all the options, including front high only, without allowing you to put one in high and one in low

picture is from Lucas Murphy
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o251/alpha-96/07012801.jpg

I'm thinking about doing this myself. Do you have specific dimensions that it needs to be ground at? Or do you just eyeball it and try to get it close?

~Bry

Are they the grooved or bulkhead ones?

Thanks!

Bulkhead

Is this correct?


2 years of operation like this (with front drive flanges) and mine is holding up great. No issues related to what you're describing.

So how flat can you clock the D300 up on an xj without cutting the floor?




and can we list all the pirate vendors that make a D300 flip kit?

So how flat can you clock the D300 up on an xj without cutting the floor?

Until it hits...

:flipoff2:

It is pretty tight in a cherokee with a dana 300. Check out my build thread. its got some photos on it. School interent will not let me post picutres.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=742762

I'm thinking about doing this myself. Do you have specific dimensions that it needs to be ground at? Or do you just eyeball it and try to get it close?

~Bry
some good info on that mod here : http://www.4x4wire.com/tech/dana300/

[QUOTE=Maytag;9506687]So how flat can you clock the D300 up on an xj without cutting the floor?
QUOTE]

I clocked mine DOWN and I still had to cut hole in my floor!

im thinking of putting one behind my aw4. ive been reading about a few guys who , instead of buying the 7/8's ring from novak, milled down the input shaft bearing retainer and used a sealed bearing behind it instead.

anyone try this? did the sealed bearing actually seal?

AW4, Novak spacer/clocking ring, Clocked in the lower position. Cables are 4' 1/4" midwestcontrol. Shifters are homemade.
428593
Just some blots drill, taped and notched
428594
This is how it sits CLOCKED DOWN even
428596

428597
428604

I have a 2wd xj and have a 14 bolt rear and chevy 60 front. it has the 4.0 and aw4. I want to put the axles and a dana 300 in it. Of course with my axles I want have to flip it. Is there a certain year or model of tranny that will work best for the 4.0? DO i just need to get a 4x4 version of the aw4? Is the case going to need an adapter? Will the tranny need a special output shaft? I thought about putting the tbi amc 360 and tf727 in it also but then I want have the setup for A/C.
Thanks
Bobby

Here is what my end product ended up looking like.

Just thought I'd chime in with another option I recently discovered...While bullshitting @ NWF one day I mentioned I I needed an AX15 to D300 adapter Kyle gave me this to try
http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j200/redder22/d300005.jpg its a spacer/ flip ring for a d300 to his black box under drives tolerances are bang on for the trans and bearing retainer. The holes to the immediate left of the allan bolts are for passenger drop the far left are drivers. Since i'm running a passenger drop waggy 44 this was perfect for me and alot less $ than novak/advance etc. it's not a dedicated clocking ring but i'm sure if you asked he could accomodate. I did have to trim abit of the shifter bracket but i'm planning on running cable shifters, though theres still enough meat left to make somethign work off of it
cheers Red
http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j200/redder22/d300004.jpg
http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j200/redder22/d300002.jpg
http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j200/redder22/d300007.jpg

hey redder how much does kyle charge from those ( this is pnut from crawlin)

any picutres on how to run the double lip seals in on the shifter rails?

I still haven't seen this either. I'm trying to figure out how others are getting 2 single lipped seals in a D300.

Mine, Homemade Cable shifters, Unknown brand of clocking ring on an AW4
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/JK_Motorsports/FloorChopwithshifter.jpg
Ruffly covered, look much better now that things are finish and smoothed out.
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/JK_Motorsports/Jeep%20Build/DSC_0010.jpg

Anyone know what adapter I need out of GM truck for the 700R4 to Dana 300? I have one that I broke, but I don't remember anymore what the heck I got it out....
I used the AA input shaft and the flipped/clocked my D300 flat with drivers dump. I cracked my adapter though. and now need to hunt down another one. cracked it by mounting it to solid, as in not enough give in the mount to handle the torque.
I think it was a NP205/TH350 adapter?? Been 6 years since I did it and search for the past half hour on here has netted me no results yet :(

ok how about a list of what the d300 originaly came out of?

bump for the same question^^^

ok how about a list of what the d300 originaly came out of?

Jeep

CJ-5 (1980-1983)
CJ-7 (1980-1986)
CJ-8 Scrambler (1981-1986)

Scouts have them too but they are a different pattern.

theres one posted on my jc site saying it came from a ford... driver drop with 32 spline outputs... anyone know anything about these?

theres one posted on my jc site saying it came from a ford... driver drop with 32 spline outputs... anyone know anything about these?

That would be an NP205 not a d300.

Jeep

CJ-5 (1980-1983)
CJ-7 (1980-1986)
CJ-8 Scrambler (1981-1986)

Scouts have them too but they are a different pattern.



Quick question.

All of the mods in this thread are the same with the Scout case?

The pattern is the only difference?

guess I never posted this here -

STaK 300 with 4:1, 32 spline outputs, 21 spline input, twin-sticks and an Advance Adapters clocking ring.
might help someone -
T-case with front dig (http://www.rockhardxj.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2834&sid=eab26f4bc1886ad87d1ae847b43e3039)

installed in an XJ.

Quick question.

All of the mods in this thread are the same with the Scout case?

The pattern is the only difference?

the scout case is the same d300 but the pattern is so strange that nobody uses it....

Thats good.

I can get my hands on a scout d300 for free. Just makin sure the internals were the same.


I will be using it for a doubler so I can make whatever pattern I need for the adapter.

Thanks xjdoug

Does any one have any pics or ideas on putting the 2 lips seals on each shift rail our is this even necessary?

Does any one have any pics or ideas on putting the 2 lips seals on each shift rail our is this even necessary?

I don't have pics but you can do it. The first seal goes into the case and seats flush. The second will be held by the seal retainer.

I had mine flipped for 2 years with only having 1 seal. It never leaked.

Jeep

CJ-5 (1980-1983)
CJ-7 (1980-1986)
CJ-8 Scrambler (1981-1986)

Scouts have them too but they are a different pattern.
Seems the 1980 versions were a "short" case. Is there any difference other then that? Does it even matter what you get?

http://www.novak-adapt.com/knowledge/model_300.htm

Seems the 1980 versions were a "short" case. Is there any difference other then that? Does it even matter what you get?

http://www.novak-adapt.com/knowledge/model_300.htm

From what I have seen the difference is only in the rear output. I don't really think it matters though unless you are trying to have a specific length drive line.

Does any one have any pics or ideas on putting the 2 lips seals on each shift rail our is this even necessary?

I only put one seal on each shift rail. Still hasnt leaked FROM THE SHIFT RAIL. That said im going to put another set on it now that I have it tore apart.

anyone adapted one to the AW4??

anyone adapted one to the AW4??

I have. it is pretty tight for shifters and such and you need a spacer ring

I have. it is pretty tight for shifters and such and you need a spacer ring

whose adapter did you use?? any pics?

whose adapter did you use?? any pics?

check post 66 in this thread :shaking: did you read through this before you asked?

whose adapter did you use?? any pics?

You dont need an adaptor. I have one behind a AW4(flipped), you need to redrill a couple holes make a spacer( I think mine is 3/8ths) and you mechine the input seal area off and use a sealed bearing. Then you just have to figure out the shifter.

OlyWa

Can someone PLEASE give the acctual length of a 231/300 doubler. Ive been searching damn near all day and cant get an exact number. I got "its close to this" and "its close to that" and no....I want a number. Since I know Im not the only one wanting this info, I figured this would be a good place to ask. SO can anyone....please....give the exact length of your 231/300 doubler. Make sure to list where to measured from and to.

Can someone PLEASE give the acctual length of a 231/300 doubler. Ive been searching damn near all day and cant get an exact number. I got "its close to this" and "its close to that" and no....I want a number. Since I know Im not the only one wanting this info, I figured this would be a good place to ask. SO can anyone....please....give the exact length of your 231/300 doubler. Make sure to list where to measured from and to.

There are different length D300 outputs... youll need to know that to go with the numbers.

mine is 19 3/4 from 231 doulbler to the end of the yolk on the 300...
heres where i measured from the aw4..
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f18/jeepnzj/IMG_1198.jpg

There are different length D300 outputs... youll need to know that to go with the numbers.

I know but the shorter outputs would be in the 80 case only. And it would only be 1 1/8" diffrence max.

KEVIN-Thank you very very much!

For those of you using cable shifters, what are you doing for them?


Seems people either buy a kit, NWF, or make your own using cables from MCMaster.



Are the premade shifters really worth the money, or is it just something fancy with a brand name on it?

Those that made their own, 3' or 4' length? How long of a throw do you need? Mounting seems easy, but any tips or tricks?

NWF bling
http://pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=636996

edit: This would be for a flipped 300, so it seems like my only option would be to route the cables under the case. This a major problem?

Bringing this to the top, I'm interested in the above question too :smokin:

Keep an eye on my build thread for shifters... working on them now. :D

For those of you using cable shifters, what are you doing for them?

Seems people either buy a kit, NWF, or make your own using cables from MCMaster.


Read this entire thread and you will see what people are "doing for them"


Are the premade shifters really worth the money, or is it just something fancy with a brand name on it?

Those that made their own, 3' or 4' length? How long of a throw do you need? Mounting seems easy, but any tips or tricks?


Premade are not worth it IMO. I made my whole setup for about $150. That is with the three cables, cable ends, scrap steel and wrenches for shifters.

second question = 3 feet with 3 inchs of throw.



edit: This would be for a flipped 300, so it seems like my only option would be to route the cables under the case. This a major problem?

Once again, read the entire thread. Your cables do not have to go under the case. You will see tons of pictures of where the cables, mounts and shifters are located.

Flipped to passenger side drop
http://pirate4x4.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10629105&postcount=400

Pictures of my setup on the drivers side are earlier in this thread.

Bringing this to the top, I'm interested in the above question too :smokin:

answered?

Yes, thanks. If anyone has negative feedback on clocking rings, spacers, or specific companies, please post up.

Does anyone know the ACTUAL stroke required to shift a D300 from high- neutral- low?

I think 4" of cable throw is a bit much, Advance Adapters only uses ~1.75" on their Atlas shifters.

I would like to keep the shifter body as compact as possible. shorter stroke would allow for this.

-Chris

Does anyone know the ACTUAL stroke required to shift a D300 from high- neutral- low?

I think 4" of cable throw is a bit much, Advance Adapters only uses ~1.75" on their Atlas shifters.

I would like to keep the shifter body as compact as possible. shorter stroke would allow for this.

-Chris

It isnt far from 2". I got all 3" because the doubler needs almost all of the 3"

Cool... I'm at work so I couldn't measure.

IMHO, you don't NEED to shift the doubler ALL the way back to "2WD" position.

I plan on running mine in "4WD" high for most of the time, and then shifting through neutral to Low range.

I measured from the shift rail flat to the end of the rails. Distances from the shift rail flat to the end of the rail are: 2 5/8" High, 2 3/16" Neutral, 1 11/16" Low. That's only 15/16" of actual movement at the rail.........


Edit: corrected values after double checking measurements.

I measured from the shift rail flat to the end of the rails. Distances from the shift rail flat to the end of the rail are: 2 5/8" High, 2 3/16" Neutral, 1 11/16" Low. That's only 15/16" of actual movement at the rail.........


Edit: corrected values after double checking measurements.

I think North West Fab only uses a 1 inch throw cable

Got my Midwest control shifter cables the other day, nice stuff, good find :smokin:
For reference this case will run in the flipped postition so it's upside down in the pictures:

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s229/feva4u/TJ%20Build%2008/041400_210400.jpg
http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s229/feva4u/TJ%20Build%2008/041400_210401.jpg
http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s229/feva4u/TJ%20Build%2008/041400_210600.jpg


Qty Part# Description Unit Price Extension
2 MPF-4 Sphcl Rod End, Female, Nylon Race USD $5.33 USD $10.66
2 BTC-250L Clevis, Turned Housing, Inch USD $4.92 USD $9.84
2 40-048-BH-BH-3 Cable Assembly USD $42.38 USD $84.76
Subtotal USD $105.26
Shipping and Handling USD $13.81
Total USD $119.07

I finally ordered the items from Mcmaster-Carr but accidentally ordered the 10-23 cables instead. Every post I have read in this and other threads mention the 1/4 cables but could I still use the slightly smaller ones? the push pull ratings are much less but do you really need 130/170 lbs? my transfer case has always shifted easy after I installed the 4:1 kit.

I finally ordered the items from Mcmaster-Carr but accidentally ordered the 10-23 cables instead. Every post I have read in this and other threads mention the 1/4 cables but could I still use the slightly smaller ones? the push pull ratings are much less but do you really need 130/170 lbs? my transfer case has always shifted easy after I installed the 4:1 kit.

Mine only have around 100 lbs pull and they have been on for 2 years. And mine does not shift easy at all.

the scout case is the same d300 but the pattern is so strange that nobody uses it....

not so fast.

the 'strange' scout pattern is the reversed texas pattern that is identical to that of a D20.

so if you have a D20 and are wanting to go to a D300, you should try and find a scout D300 before spending the money on a fancy adapter.

probably mentioned before, but to adapt a d300 to a th350/700r4 use a np208/241 adapter and use a JB conversions/AA spud shaft for ~$200.

Added pictures of the midwest cables in my previous post :smokin:

Bump for question...

XJ Crawler dabbed at it but I want a more defined answer.

The 80' case only is short. 10 1/2" from input face to yoke face. The 81-86' cases are 1 1/8" longer. In a thread I had on another site months back, it was suggested I use the longer case. And I was suggested by a few. I realized the only true driffence in the 2 is the speedometer changes.

So why would I want the longer case over the shorter one? Is there something diffrent about running cables?
The internals other than the speedo are all the same right?
So why are so many suggesting the longer case?
Whats the catch?

So why would I want the longer case over the shorter one? Is there something diffrent about running cables?
The internals other than the speedo are all the same right?
So why are so many suggesting the longer case?
Whats the catch?

The upgrade kit for the short tailhousing didn't used to be available.
Then when it did come out it was significantly more expensive than the long tailhousing kit.
Now they are about the same so it's a wash....

That used to be the main reason to want a long tailhousing because you will eventually need the upgraded shaft.

Well that I didnt know. Great info. Thanks a lot.

So basically....there's no reason to keep me from getting the short case???

If you can work with the speedo assembly being different than I don't know of any...

Good build that my buddy did and it's been working well.
http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1023104

How many people are upgrading the outputs of the 300s? People seem to think the outputs are the weak link on the 300s, but is it worth the ~$400 for the rear and ~$180 for the front to convert to 32 spline?
http://www.jbconversions.com/index2.php?pc=2


Any different if it was going with a 231/300 doubler?

Does anyone know the ACTUAL stroke required to shift a D300 from high- neutral- low?

I think 4" of cable throw is a bit much, Advance Adapters only uses ~1.75" on their Atlas shifters.

I would like to keep the shifter body as compact as possible. shorter stroke would allow for this.

-Chris

Cable throw is pretty much decided by the fulcrom point in your shifters

Cable throw is pretty much decided by the fulcrom point in your shifters

True, but you can't move the cable farther than the shift RAIL will move inside the tcase. :flipoff2:

I gave up on cables, and am working on a linkage system...

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs681.snc4/62170_1495130611323_1025802758_31155353_5087623_n. jpg

How many people are upgrading the outputs of the 300s? People seem to think the outputs are the weak link on the 300s, but is it worth the ~$400 for the rear and ~$180 for the front to convert to 32 spline?
http://www.jbconversions.com/index2.php?pc=2


Any different if it was going with a 231/300 doubler?

Most will upgrade the rear. I chose to also upgrade the front since Im gonna be running a doubler. Its a cheap upgrade at only $180 or so. Really, there's no reason not while you have it apart IMO.

Ok, read this thread...searched and searched some more :D

But I still have one question...what are people doing for the speedo with say a 32 spline upgraded rear output (still longer snout with the hole for a speedo) and the AW4? I wasn't sure if there was someway to adapt the old speedo or the speedo off the D300 into the AW4 and so on?

ive been pondering on putting a 300 in my cherokee. i found a 1980 shorty and i do know about the speedo being wrong. is there an adapter or something i can use to make it work still? my cherokee will be driven on the road so i will need the speedo. i have a 4.0 and an AW4. if someone does know of an adaptor to help me out could ya post some info on it for me? thanks!

x2 on that aw4 to d300 what adapter do i need for this, im not trying to run a doubler either, please let me know.

ive been pondering on putting a 300 in my cherokee. i found a 1980 shorty and i do know about the speedo being wrong. is there an adapter or something i can use to make it work still? my cherokee will be driven on the road so i will need the speedo. i have a 4.0 and an AW4. if someone does know of an adaptor to help me out could ya post some info on it for me? thanks!

x2 on that aw4 to d300 what adapter do i need for this, im not trying to run a doubler either, please let me know.

Did you guys read through this thread? There's at least 3 different companies mentioned when adapting a D300 without using a doubler.


As far as the VSS issue, here's a post from vetteboy that I found on naxja when researching the issue:

On my '94 anyway, without a VSS signal the engine liked to stumble and occasionally stall out if I suddenly lifted the throttle and coasted after running hard for a while. Apparently it uses the VSS to sense this condition and modulates the IAC some to keep it running.

You can use a stock sending unit from a NP231 and splice the 3 wires from your harness into the old sensor. The basic signal is the same and actually it'll give you the ability to calibrate it by being able to change out speedo gears.

Here's a copy-and-paste from when I was figuring this out the first time with my Stak 32-spline D300 upgrade (which ironically uses your new-style sensor)...

Quote:
The ECM does use the VSS sensor and throttle position to determine if the vehicle is decelerating. While in deceleration mode, it will use the idle air control motor maintain a set engine vacumn. (Per 1995 FSM, page 14-25). In deceleration mode, the ECM will reduce the injector pulse-width and delivery less fuel (1993-1995 Fuel Injection Manual, page 3).

Now I need to figure out how to use the new VSS on the STaK. From the same FSM, the stock speedometer at 55 MPH is getting a square-wave signal from the VSS at a rate of 122.2 Hz.

The STaK VSS (which is the same as the newer 2003+ TJ VSS) sends 3 pulses per driveshaft revolution. Figuring with my tire size and 4.56 axle ratio, at 55 MPH my driveshaft is spinning at 2250 RPM. So the VSS is sending a signal at 112.4 Hz.

Basically what that boils down to is if I splice the new VSS into the old wiring harness, without changing anything else my speedometer will read ~10% slow. I think that's close enough that I don't need to spend $80+ for a converter box.

In a rare display of helpfulness, STaK provides this package of wiring diagrams for their VSS and all the different Jeep plugs.

http://www.stak4x4.com/pdf/VSS_pinout.pdf

So it's as simple as splicing 3 wires together and I'll have an almost-good speedometer and an engine that doesn't stall/stumble on deceleration. Cool.

So does anyone have any information on how to get a signal from a stock D300 to a 00' PCM?

I could have swore there was a conversion sensor offered at one point, but I can't seem to find anything.

x2 on that aw4 to d300 what adapter do i need for this, im not trying to run a doubler either, please let me know.

http://www.novak-adapt.com/catalog/kit_153.htm

Its just a 7/8" spacer and it clocks the case up some. I had a flat belly on my XJ with this adapter. You can also do something with the bearing and skip the pacer but idk about that

im going to use front Cherokee CV shafts front and rear. The 231 front CV yokes fit on the factory 300 outputs.

did you have to lengthen the rear or shorten the front or were they able to bolt up no issues?

question for those that flipped the 300 behind the aw4. I went to put mine in today i cut the bracketry for the old shifter setup off then ground it flat like nwf says to do. But when i go to install it the shift rail housing on the 300 wont clear part of the tail housing on the aw4 where the bolt goes through to the transmission. What did you guys have to do to clear it?

grind a little off the tail housing?

grind a little off the tail housing?

this

you can kinda see it in this pic...kinda
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=428594&d=1237087892

Link to thread in Hardcore Jeep: http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=947986

Guy made custom shifter for flipped 300 with cables on the top side of the case.

this is what i did back in 03 when i put an unflipped d300 in my zj behind a v8.
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=201598&highlight=

the hole in the floor was big enough to just use strandard twin sticks for shifters.

Nothing fancy with mine really... Novak adapter, clocked flat in PSD position. I made custom brackets (don't have pics of these) off the stock shifter bracket assembly and massive 1" wrenches for shifters. I actually cut a little more sheet metal than necissary. I liked how the shifters ended up fitting nice and tight to the center console to give the passenger some leg room. After some plating and boxing to cover up the top of the case I was able to cover most it back up with the carpet. I ended up using a stock XJ automatic front shaft for a rear. I had to lengthen it 8" to work for my application. If the rear axle was in stock location 6" longer than stock would work. For the front I used a front XJ shaft out of a 5 speed (about 1 1/2" longer than an auto) for my application. Also when you do the install, take into consideration that at some point in time you will need to check/add fluid in the case, so make some sort of access hole while you're at it. I forgot to but I'm a dumbass. :shaking: :flipoff2:

http://i552.photobucket.com/albums/jj335/jrhxj1/SU1HMDAxMzAtMjAxMTAxMTUtMDg0OS5qcGc-1.jpg

Anybody using the dd machine flip shifters on an AX15? I've found lots of posts saying "you know, dd machine makes a sweet flip shifter omg lol" but none where someone is using one. I did find one post where someone was trying to use them and a novak flip ring and said they didn't have enough clearance with the trans case, but that's the only one. I'd like to try to stay away from cable shifters to save a little cash...

Anybody using the dd machine flip shifters on an AX15? I've found lots of posts saying "you know, dd machine makes a sweet flip shifter omg lol" but none where someone is using one. I did find one post where someone was trying to use them and a novak flip ring and said they didn't have enough clearance with the trans case, but that's the only one. I'd like to try to stay away from cable shifters to save a little cash...

To semi-answer my own question, the DD setup will most likely not fit. At least part of the shifter mount on the stock front output retainer will have to be trimmed to clear the ax15. See the pic below...the shifter hits the trans before the bolts in the retainer can be aligned.

http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii297/mudtoy67/XJ/Photo494.jpg

Started a thread for my flipped 300 swap:

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=981822

reviving this thread.

a bit of a n00b with cable shifters, so i have a question.

the 1/4" midwest cables that i've seen others run, are they strong enough to push the shift rails from hi to lo in a tough shifting case? the cables seem pretty flimsy to me.

reviving this thread.

a bit of a n00b with cable shifters, so i have a question.

the 1/4" midwest cables that i've seen others run, are they strong enough to push the shift rails from hi to lo in a tough shifting case? the cables seem pretty flimsy to me.

That is what I used... they worked for me

Still working for me :mr-t:

Anyone run a D300 flipped behind a 4l60e? I did a bunch of searching, but couldn't find any info on running it flipped, just in the pass drop. I'm looking to do this without buying an adapter that costs almost half what an Atlas would. The bolt pattern on the output of the tranny is the same 6 holes, just rotated 90* off of the Jeep pattern. It would seem that a new input shaft for the D300 along with a custom flip ring would be all that is needed? Anyone done this?

Can anyone tell me what the shifting patterns of the 231/300 is??

my question is a little outta place, seeing as how all of you are flipping yours. my question is if you have a aw4 trans, d300 and the novak adapter (http://www.novak-adapt.com/catalog/kit_153.htm) you should be set to run a passenger side dif right? as far as trans and t case goes i wouldnt need anything else, correct?

Got the D300 flipped in the XJ now. Fucking thing leaks like a BITCH. I can't even tell where it's coming from. The shift rails are wet, and then within minutes of parking it, there's a small pool of drips.

Anybody know of a nice quick way to pull the shift rails without having to disassemble much of the case? I remember seeing a little walkthrough somewhere but I don't know where it went. Just going to try doubling up those seals and see if it helps.

I'm sure it doesn't help that I put synthetic in there for a test run. :(