Ok this may be one of my :smokin: thoughs but hear it goes


well I am sticking this FF Dana 60 under my scout its open with 4:10s and I'm to cheap to buy a locker. The scout will be 60% off road 40% on road so hears my idea. We all know spools are hard on tires and handeling so I was thinking if I welded it up and pulled one axel and caped the bearings then when I hit the trale pop the cap and slidin the axel in and away we go.

what do you think

it will pull very badly but it will work.

That shouldn't cause a problem, thats the nice thing about FF, you can drive away after you break an axle, unlike SF.:)

It'd be alright if you don't mind changing lanes every time you accel/decel. ;)

It'll be a hairy ride...:eek:

Originally posted by watts
It'd be alright if you don't mind changing lanes every time you accel/decel. ;)

It'll be a hairy ride...:eek:

To say the least. Very hairy ride, but it will function.

Ed

i must be missing something. why would it pull any different from an open diff? open diffs pull from the passengers side tire goin forward anyways so whats the diff (excuse the pun).:confused:

OMG WATTS is that you ? ! ? ! someone said you sold your jeep to put an addition on the house ....ok im exadarating but man you've all but fell off the planet !!! You going to big dowgs? if not get your butt over to my place and help me wrench on the puke !!! i still have an open seat (once it gets put back in)

:flipoff2:

-yag

It will obviously work, but as mention will drive like shit. I'd expect lots of torque steer.

Spools aren't that bad, in fact I prefer a spool over anything else. I'd like a selectable locker someday just to save on tires, but I doubt that will ever happen. I've had the rear in my daily driver BII welded for 10 years. With new tires(especially siped) you will barely notice the spool is there. The lugs just flex when you are going around a corner. At about 1/2 tread, it will start to skid and hop a bit, but it's still not bad.

With only one axle, you will have far less traction than an open diff. I'd expect big time one wheel peels when it's wet out.

Originally posted by FULLSIZE
i must be missing something. why would it pull any different from an open diff? open diffs pull from the passengers side tire goin forward anyways so whats the diff (excuse the pun).:confused:

Open diffs don't pull from the passenger side (unless you are driving around the world to the left). Open diffs put the power to the tire with the least resistance. When you are driving in a straight line, both sides of the axle are getting equal traction and the power is applied evenly (unless you are running different sized tires on the left and right).

makes sense to me.:D

You'll wear out the bearings WAY prematureley. The carrier will try and torque sideways, thusly wearing it out. You'll also get a funny contact pattern on your gears... The carrier bearings were designed with two axles in mind. Even when you take tight corners with a spool, or welded diff you tires will scrub and one side will be loaded up more than the other, but 99% of the time you're driving with an equally loaded carrier.

Originally posted by MR4WD
You'll wear out the bearings WAY prematureley. The carrier will try and torque sideways, thusly wearing it out. You'll also get a funny contact pattern on your gears... The carrier bearings were designed with two axles in mind. Even when you take tight corners with a spool, or welded diff you tires will scrub and one side will be loaded up more than the other, but 99% of the time you're driving with an equally loaded carrier.

Huh?:confused:

Why would running with only one axle have any effect on the carrier bearings? There's no sideways pressure from the axles on the carrier.

Why would running with only one axle have any effect on the carrier bearings? There's no sideways pressure from the axles on the carrier.
kinda what i was thinkin.:rolleyes: but what do i know..............:p

Since you're only loading up one side of the carrier (with an axle shaft) you'll be exerting torque tortionally on the bearings. I'm not entirely sure how I can relate that to you without a picture, but that's the way it is. Check with any millwright if you don't beleive me.

Originally posted by landuseorc
That shouldn't cause a problem, thats the nice thing about FF, you can drive away after you break an axle, unlike SF.:)




I've driven home from Moab twice with a broken rear SF axle:flipoff2: 235 nerve racking miles- I was running a Detroit at the time and it handled quite well- No real problem with it pulling either.

Originally posted by MR4WD
Since you're only loading up one side of the carrier (with an axle shaft) you'll be exerting torque tortionally on the bearings. I'm not entirely sure how I can relate that to you without a picture, but that's the way it is. Check with any millwright if you don't beleive me.

There's no side load on the carrier from the shafts, only angular or rotational, and the carrier bearings allow all the angular movement you want. That's what bearings do. Any sideload comes from the ring and pinion not the shafts. In a SF application there is some load from supporting the vehicle's weight, but most of it is on outer bearing. On a FF application the only weight being supported by the carrier bearing is the weight of tha axle shaft itself. That's nothing compared to the forces from the ring and pinion even in a SF application.

Originally posted by bqnbits





I've driven home from Moab twice with a broken rear SF axle:flipoff2: 235 nerve racking miles- I was running a Detroit at the time and it handled quite well- No real problem with it pulling either.

I didn't think you could do that. What axle are you running? Where did the shaft break? What sort of damage did you do from driving it?

Listen gramps, yes there is. There WILL be sideload. I'm well versed in how gears work, and I don't require the readers digest version of your opinion. What I'm telling you is the WAY it IS. If you don't like it, don't respond to me, but look into it further. I'm not talking about carrying load from the axle shaft(s) but rather rotational load (laterally, not longtitudanally or whatever the f*ck).

You'll be trying to twist the carrier sideways, and when you apply torque to it, you'll make it want to buck in the bearings. It's like that, and that's the way it is. With 2 axles sharing the load, there can't be any distortion.

Also, gramps, you can drive almost any non c-clip axle home with a broken shaft. ie: Ford 9"

Grandpa Jeep - MR4WD guessed it - It was Ford 9" 28 spline - They both broke near the carrier at the end of the splines. - As far as damage- I cleaned everything up and ran it. There was some fine metal particles in the tube, but it didn't mess up the bearings. I sold the axle when I went to a D60 and the guy I sold it to is still running it.

Originally posted by MR4WD
Listen gramps, yes there is. There WILL be sideload. I'm well versed in how gears work, and I don't require the readers digest version of your opinion. What I'm telling you is the WAY it IS. If you don't like it, don't respond to me, but look into it further. I'm not talking about carrying load from the axle shaft(s) but rather rotational load (laterally, not longtitudanally or whatever the f*ck).

Too bad you can't explain yourself worth a fuck.

Originally posted by MR4WD
You'll be trying to twist the carrier sideways, and when you apply torque to it, you'll make it want to buck in the bearings. It's like that, and that's the way it is. With 2 axles sharing the load, there can't be any distortion.


Whatever dickhead.

Originally posted by Grandpa Jeep


Too bad you can't explain yourself worth a fuck.



Whatever dickhead.

Dude....who pissed in your cheerios?

I understand what he's saying and agree, but I seriously doubt the life span of bearings or gears will be shortened.

cheif i ran like that once. it would get stuck going up hill on a dirt road, i could smoke the rear tire 400+ ft. with a crappy 4 banger. it really sucked, but i don't remember any torque steer though. i would say don't do it. and this is from someone who has run one like it for about 2k miles. mike

I'm with Grandpa Jeep here, and I've been building axles longer than MR4WD has been alive. I do understand the point he's trying to make; that with one axle in a spool the lateral force on one side of the carrier is 180 degrees out from the other side. However the real issue is that the magnitude of the force is the same regardless of whether there's one axle in a spool or two; and the direction doesn't matter.

Originally posted by Nobody


Dude....who pissed in your cheerios?

I understand what he's saying and agree, but I seriously doubt the life span of bearings or gears will be shortened.

Just his whole attitude. He KNOWS gears and there WILL be sideload, yet he can't explain shit. I'm just supposed to accept his opinion as fact because he's MR4WD. Whatever, I don't think he knows shit.

Now, back to the subject at hand, I don't see how having one axle vs. two is going to affect the sideload on the carrier bearings at all much less how it's so great it's going to affect bearing life. Since you understand it, maybe you can explain it to me. I promise I won't bite your head off.

jeez,who cares? the point is it will drive like shit,and hell likely end up in a ditch,or in the other lane in front of traffic,if hes not careful,specially if hes running a stick.

bqnbits,you are really pushing your luck driving that far with broken semifloating axles. the axle is not being supprted ay longer at the diff end,and the shaft is able to wobble around. this changes the wheels alignment(wich may not matter much in the rear) and puts alot more stress on that outer bearing. its oly pressed on there,remember,and it could come off

youd think after driving home once with broken semi floating shafts,the ext time youda had some spares so you didnt have to repeat 235 nerve racking miles :flipoff2:

cheif yelling alot,id deal with the tire wear,or weld the front. at least then you can unlock the hubs on the road and not kill yourself :eek:

It WILL work, it WILL drive like shit, it WILL be extremely hard on the one remaining shaft, but can be done for short periods of time. I wouldn't do it to save tire wear, think of it like driving on the front axle only on the street, you can do it, it will get you home, but you wouldn't want to do it everyday.

I actually got a ticket for having a welded diff in my old truck, legally, you have to have differential gears in Michigan and the cop was super pissed that my Chevy on 38's was just barely under the lift limit, he pulled me over for squaking a tire in a parking lot, when I explained the welded diff, he got out the code book, damn, should have told him it was broke or something. I pulled one shaft and tossed in a dummy (14 Bolt short side on the long side) and drove to the cop shop, he made me drive in figure 8's in the parking lot before he would sign off. What a dick.

I could care less about bearing side loading r front loading or diagonal loading....


All I know is anyone who has ever driven a vehcile where all the power was sent to ONE tire ALL the time will tell you it SUCKS.

Originally posted by MR4WD
I'm well versed in how gears work...

Originally posted by MR4WD
Yes, 5.13's in a 10.5" 14 bolygive better torque multiplication to the wheels under the same circumstances and conditions than a set of 5.13's in a 7.5" 10 bolt. There's greater mechanical leverage...

Originally posted by Grandpa Jeep
I don't think he knows shit.

I think that sums it up nicely. :flipoff2:

Originally posted by DRM

All I know is anyone who has ever driven a vehcile where all the power was sent to ONE tire ALL the time will tell you it SUCKS.
I second this- backed by experience.

Taper-Roller bearings are combination load bearings.

Dear Lloyd. Eat my asshole and die.

Dear Gramps, make like Lloyd...

Ask any millwright. It's not open for discussion like for instance what tire do you think works better, what tubing thickness should I use on my driveshaft, do you think my old flatty with stock tires and a 2.3 ford is a hardcore rig etc.... It's more like, will the sun come up tomorrow? Will I be taxed on my earnings? I don't feel the requirement to draw you some sort of half-assed picture explaining rotational loads and variances of torque due to sideloading, but I think I may if I have an excess of time on my hands later on today... JUST so I can give the bitchslap both of you need. Simply because you're older and crustier than me doesn't mean that you know more about gears than me. Ignorance would lead one to beleive that though.

To get the marble rolling around in either of your dimwitted skulls, think about when the pinion turns the ring gear; How does it go about turning the ring gear? Leverage, or torque applied from one tooth to another. Now, if the carrier bearings weren't there to locate it along the same axis that the pinion is on, wouldn't it buck sideways? RIGHT! (it would, I'm just hoping you got it right) Now that's all fine and dandy for say like the other guy said 2000 miles... The axle shafts are located into the side of the carrier and in turn being driven by the carrier in some sort. A positive side effect of that is, however something similar to a gyroscope. The axle shafts (full floating as well) will have equal amounts of torque (all things being equal) being delivered to them, therefore maintaining the directional rotation of the carrier. With one axle shaft though, it will cause it to deflect. We're not talking burn the bearings up and toss them into the teeth in a hundred feet deflection, but perhaps .001" at first for example. You should know by know that any slop in bearings will cause them to rapidly deteriorate. Engine power, driving style, tire size, gear ratio and type of axle will all play roles in the length of time it will take before your ring gear and pinion get into a brawl with one another and barf out of the cover, but it will happen.

Now, if for example you wanted to run one axle shaft out of a spool style carrier and maintain any kind of service life, you'd need a support bearing (with some sort of intermediate stub shaft), a carrier bearing, the carrier, another carrier bearing and then the axle shaft or vice versa. This however is COMPLETELY unfeasable...A 14 bolt full floater with a pinion support bearing would be a great example. One bearing after the pinion yoke. Then, another bearing after it jumps into the drop out. THEN! another bearing after the pinion gear itself supporting the nose so as to not allow any deflection.

If you don't understand that, then neither of you old bastards should be behind the wheel of anything with gears in it.

Now, as far as the second lamer brought up, the greater torque applied to the wheels with a bigger ring gear theory of mine isn't a theory.... It's something that was discussed not all too recently in either Four Wheeler or 4 Wheel and Off-Road... Sure, I expect you to rag on them and call em down for whatever, BUT they've been around MUCH longer than ANY board on the internet and "they" as a collective have been wheeling and building since any of you chumps could wrap your head around shifting a vehicle into 4 wheel drive.... So, I'd expect they'd have more knowledge, experience and general know-how (plus the number of shops just dieing to give FREE knowledge, experience and technical support just to get a plug in a mag) than any of "us" backyard mechanics.

Anything else?

Edit: Sorry for biting your head off Grampy jeep, I just re-read your post. Remove any animosity I have towards when you read this.

Mike, that's an excellent illustration. Great find... Tapered bearings will hold the load side-to-side along the same plane as the axle shafts. ie: Installing shims to get contact pattern, torqueing adjusting rings to get contact pattern etc.... And they'll last a long time doing that under high loads. BUT were never intended to maintain any sort spec, or even hold onto an adjustment for any sort of measureable period when thrust continually thrust forward against the race.

Chad.

Originally posted by MR4WD

If you don't understand that, then neither of you old bastards should be behind the wheel of anything with gears in it.


I didn't understand it either, but I do know that when I break an axle, my truck pulls like shit.

I also know that all the mud and rocks and fish and sticks and stuff in my hubs does more to shorten the life of my bearings than torsional stress. :) :flipoff2:

But hey... cool tech.

Fish in your hubs!? You're more hardcore than me!

Tim, have you ever broken a Dana 70 shaft? What sort of maintanence do you perform on the front axle, other than gear oil changes? (In reguard to assisting the life of the shafts for as long as possible) I've broken a plethora of 30 spline stubs, but I get that junk for free from PAT'S (along with driveshafts). If I stepped into a set of 35 spliners I wouldn't get free stubs anymore, hence I ask if the leap of strength is any greater? I have an open front diff for now, so once one side goes dead I've either got to repair it or I'm 2 wheeling it out of the bush.

Originally posted by MR4WD
Dear Lloyd. Eat my asshole and die.

Dear Gramps, make like Lloyd...

Ask any millwright. It's not open for discussion like for instance what tire do you think works better, what tubing thickness should I use on my driveshaft, do you think my old flatty with stock tires and a 2.3 ford is a hardcore rig etc.... It's more like, will the sun come up tomorrow? Will I be taxed on my earnings? I don't feel the requirement to draw you some sort of half-assed picture explaining rotational loads and variances of torque due to sideloading, but I think I may if I have an excess of time on my hands later on today... JUST so I can give the bitchslap both of you need. Simply because you're older and crustier than me doesn't mean that you know more about gears than me. Ignorance would lead one to beleive that though.

I don't remember asking if nor claiming that my Jeep was hardcore. I thought we were talking about something else entirely. You're right, just because I'm older than you doen't mean I know more about gears than you, but its painfully obvious that I do.

Originally posted by MR4WD
To get the marble rolling around in either of your dimwitted skulls, think about when the pinion turns the ring gear; How does it go about turning the ring gear? Leverage, or torque applied from one tooth to another. Now, if the carrier bearings weren't there to locate it along the same axis that the pinion is on, wouldn't it buck sideways? RIGHT! (it would, I'm just hoping you got it right)

Right, I'm glad you at least see why there is sideways pressure on the bearings. It's from the ring and pinion, not the shafts.


Originally posted by MR4WD
Now that's all fine and dandy for say like the other guy said 2000 miles... The axle shafts are located into the side of the carrier and in turn being driven by the carrier in some sort. A positive side effect of that is, however something similar to a gyroscope.

OK, now you just lost me. WTF does a gyroscope have to do with this? Do you even know what one is?


Originally posted by MR4WD
The axle shafts (full floating as well) will have equal amounts of torque (all things being equal) being delivered to them, therefore maintaining the directional rotation of the carrier. With one axle shaft though, it will cause it to deflect.

Why would it deflect? There is no reason that I can see for that to happen. Since you can't explain it, maybe you should ask your milwright.

Originally posted by MR4WD
We're not talking burn the bearings up and toss them into the teeth in a hundred feet deflection, but perhaps .001" at first for example. You should know by know that any slop in bearings will cause them to rapidly deteriorate. Engine power, driving style, tire size, gear ratio and type of axle will all play roles in the length of time it will take before your ring gear and pinion get into a brawl with one another and barf out of the cover, but it will happen.

If there was some sort of deflection, I wouldn't disagree here.

Originally posted by MR4WD
Now, if for example you wanted to run one axle shaft out of a spool style carrier and maintain any kind of service life, you'd need a support bearing (with some sort of intermediate stub shaft), a carrier bearing, the carrier, another carrier bearing and then the axle shaft or vice versa. This however is COMPLETELY unfeasable....

You've completely lost me here. (Actually, I think it's you who is completely lost) You're saying that if I was to install a stub shaft in place of the missing axle shaft with a support bearing than all would be well? That makes no sense at all. Why on earth would it matter if there was a stub shaft installed or not. I thought the problem was the unequal amount of torque applied. A stub shaft isn't going to help that any.

Originally posted by MR4WD
A 14 bolt full floater with a pinion support bearing would be a great example. One bearing after the pinion yoke. Then, another bearing after it jumps into the drop out. THEN! another bearing after the pinion gear itself supporting the nose so as to not allow any deflection.

Dude most axles don't have a third carrier bearing. 14 bolts and 9 inches are just about the only common ones that do. While I believe that makes these Ring and Pinion assemblys stronger than a comparatively sized ring and pinion it is by no means necessary.

Originally posted by MR4WD
If you don't understand that, then neither of you old bastards should be behind the wheel of anything with gears in it.

I think you are the one who should stay away from gears.

Originally posted by MR4WD
Now, as far as the second lamer brought up, the greater torque applied to the wheels with a bigger ring gear theory of mine isn't a theory.... It's something that was discussed not all too recently in either Four Wheeler or 4 Wheel and Off-Road... Sure, I expect you to rag on them and call em down for whatever, BUT they've been around MUCH longer than ANY board on the internet and "they" as a collective have been wheeling and building since any of you chumps could wrap your head around shifting a vehicle into 4 wheel drive.... So, I'd expect they'd have more knowledge, experience and general know-how (plus the number of shops just dieing to give FREE knowledge, experience and technical support just to get a plug in a mag) than any of "us" backyard mechanics.

Anything else?

I don't know where Lloyd found that quote, but if you can't see the error in that statement then you have no clue how torque multiplication works. None! Nada! Zip! The fact that you misread it in print (or if it really was a greivous error on their part) means nothing. You have absolutely no concept of logical thinking. BTW where was this article. I'd like to see this for myself.

Interesting discussion here. I will add my two cents worth as well.

Driving on one shaft will just flat suck....like one gent said ANYONE that has done it will find a way to avoid it in the future;-)
Although I have done it with both a Detroit and a spool, and the spool was MUCH easier to drive. But still suxxxxxxed (just my observation)

As for the rather heated debate on bearing wear and such I will toss in sum additional thought to consider. Regardless of the forces involved anyone ever notice how frequantly high mileage Dana 60's have spun drive side carrier bearing bores?...Since they run two shafts (usually) and most I have seen were open diff equipped, I have always sort of chalked this up to deflection under torque. Just would seem the wear I have witnessed in these housings would be rather un shaft related.

P|n-BaLL

Originally posted by MR4WD
Dear Lloyd. Eat my asshole and die.


Fuck you and the horse you rode in on.

Originally posted by MR4WD

Dear Gramps, make like Lloyd...

Ask any millwright. It's not open for discussion like for instance what tire do you think works better, what tubing thickness should I use on my driveshaft, do you think my old flatty with stock tires and a 2.3 ford is a hardcore rig etc.... It's more like, will the sun come up tomorrow? Will I be taxed on my earnings? I don't feel the requirement to draw you some sort of half-assed picture explaining rotational loads and variances of torque due to sideloading, but I think I may if I have an excess of time on my hands later on today... JUST so I can give the bitchslap both of you need. Simply because you're older and crustier than me doesn't mean that you know more about gears than me. Ignorance would lead one to beleive that though.


I don't think that being "older and crustier" means that I know more about gears. Get your half-assed drawing out and post it, and we'll see. And exactly where are you heading with your "ignorance" insunuation? After spending more than 25 years being paid to pull wrenches I earned a Ph.D., and I'll bet that you've never even SEEN the second-order nonlinear partial differential equations you'll need to begin your stress analysis the right way. You want to do the math, MR4WD? Bring it. :vader:

Originally posted by MR4WD

To get the marble rolling around in either of your dimwitted skulls, think about when the pinion turns the ring gear; How does it go about turning the ring gear? Leverage, or torque applied from one tooth to another. Now, if the carrier bearings weren't there to locate it along the same axis that the pinion is on,

The only thing I can think of that's on the pinion axis is the driveshaft. It doesn't seem relevant...

Originally posted by MR4WD
wouldn't it buck sideways? RIGHT! (it would, I'm just hoping you got it right) Now that's all fine and dandy for say like the other guy said 2000 miles... The axle shafts are located into the side of the carrier and in turn being driven by the carrier in some sort. A positive side effect of that is, however something similar to a gyroscope. Now you're babbling.

Originally posted by MR4WD
The axle shafts (full floating as well) will have equal amounts of torque (all things being equal) being delivered to them, therefore maintaining the directional rotation of the carrier.

The axleshafts do not "...maintain... the directional rotation of the carrier." They only transmit torque to the hubs.

Originally posted by MR4WD
With one axle shaft though, it will cause it to deflect.

I'm not intending to pick on your grammar or choice of words, but you've got to admit that this sentence isn't particularly clear. Ambiguity on false logic is a poor way to construct an argument. This is where the vector calculus is useful, as it completely eliminates ambiguity; there is no provision for bullshit, and things can be proven in mathematics. I'll bet you're not very comfortable with that, eh?

Originally posted by MR4WD

blah blah blah....

If you don't understand that, then neither of you old bastards should be behind the wheel of anything with gears in it.

Thank you for your opinion. Just as soon as you're elected the Emperor of Earth, someone might give a shit what you think. Probably some of us never will.

Originally posted by MR4WD

Now, as far as the second lamer brought up, the greater torque applied to the wheels with a bigger ring gear theory of mine isn't a theory.... It's something that was discussed not all too recently in either Four Wheeler or 4 Wheel and Off-Road... Sure, I expect you to rag on them and call em down for whatever, BUT they've been around MUCH longer than ANY board on the internet and "they" as a collective have been wheeling and building since any of you chumps could wrap your head around shifting a vehicle into 4 wheel drive.... So, I'd expect they'd have more knowledge, experience and general know-how (plus the number of shops just dieing to give FREE knowledge, experience and technical support just to get a plug in a mag) than any of "us" backyard mechanics.

Anything else?

Edit: Sorry for biting your head off Grampy jeep, I just re-read your post. Remove any animosity I have towards when you read this.

Grandpa Jeep: That quote came from the Rockwell axle wrap thread http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=78317 on or about page 2 now. It isn't a theory, as worded; it's a stinking crock of shit. No reason for thinking anything this ridiculous was published; probably it was just misread, misinterpreted, or just a hallucination.

I've never meant to argue that driving on one shaft was a good idea. In case it was missed, I'll say it again: same magnitude force as with two shafts, different direction. Direction doesn't matter.

MR4WD, you've got a suite of serious problems; of which gear analysis is probably the least significant. I suggest that you consult a mental health professional soon.

Originally posted by MR4WD
Tim, have you ever broken a Dana 70 shaft? [/i]

Yes, rear, 23 spline 1.5 inch. Drove around for an hour or so without noticing. Didn't realize until someone pointed out that I didn't have a locker in the back (I did). Pulled the shaft and it was broken about 3 or 4 inches in from the end.


What sort of maintanence do you perform on the front axle, other than gear oil changes?

I usually pull and repack or change my hub bearings about 2 or 3 times a year depending on the amount of water or mud they've seen. If I had brand new spindles, I could likely get away with less, but my inner wheel hub seal is not that tight anymore on the spindle, so stuff tends to get in.


(In reguard to assisting the life of the shafts for as long as possible) I've broken a plethora of 30 spline stubs, but I get that junk for free from PAT'S (along with driveshafts). If I stepped into a set of 35 spliners I wouldn't get free stubs anymore, hence I ask if the leap of strength is any greater? I have an open front diff for now, so once one side goes dead I've either got to repair it or I'm 2 wheeling it out of the bush.

The leap in strength is substantial enough that I haven't broken one 35 spliner yet and I would regularily break the 30's about 3 or 4 a year. I used to break hubs more than anything (like 8-10). Since I changed to 35 spline full time hubs I haven't broken either. Robin I think went through 5 or 6 30 splines this year. He's upgrading too.

PN for the outer stubs is Spicer #3-82-871 if you need some. About $200 of our bucks from Pat's. The 35 spline full time lockouts are Warn#39346, about $200 US.

Tim

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Grandpa Jeep
I don't think he knows shit.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



I think that sums it up nicely.

I think he knows about as much about gears as he does nuts and bolts :flipoff2: Bwah ha ha ha ha !!

Lloyd and Grandpa Jeep....

Never argue with an idiot...They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

This has to be the most amusing thread I've ever read on here. It really goes to show you that some people know what they're talking about and others only think they do.

You guys have done a great job explaining the basic principles and thoughts of transmission design, but unfortunately you will never beat it into his thick skull.

Here's to you and your superior knowledge of gears MR4WD.
:flipoff2:

I feel a photo would be appropriate at this juncture.....

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?s=&postid=832331

I also enjoyed your electrical theory in the other post. Damn near pissed my pants.

One more from the newbie...:flipoff2:

I heard all these smacks echo in Jeep talk :laughing:


Somebody get mrs4wd a bag of ice and a :flipoff2:

Originally posted by big97redtj
Lloyd and Grandpa Jeep....

Never argue with an idiot...They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

This has to be the most amusing thread I've ever read on here. It really goes to show you that some people know what they're talking about and others only think they do.

You guys have done a great job explaining the basic principles and thoughts of transmission design, but unfortunately you will never beat it into his thick skull.

Here's to you and your superior knowledge of gears MR4WD.
:flipoff2:

I don't really care if MR4WD learns a damn thing. I'd just hate to see someone actually take his advice.

Originally posted by big97redtj
I also enjoyed your electrical theory in the other post. Damn near pissed my pants.

One more from the newbie...:flipoff2:

That was a good one. I loved how he contradicted himself several times, changed his theory completely and still maintained *I* didn't know what I was talking about.

Like I said above. I don't think he knows shit.

I would be concerned with sending the full torque of the engine and gear multiplication to only one axle shaft for a long period of time. When you have two axle shafts, torque is split between the two shafts evenly, until you go around a corner,hit uneven sufaces, etc... but those instances are temporary, and breif.
I just see fatigue of that one shaft being a possibility after months of use.

My vote is for spool it and live with the tire wear.

Guess I missed that one (electrical). What a shame. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by Lloyd


After spending more than 25 years being paid to pull wrenches I earned a Ph.D., and I'll bet that you've never even SEEN the second-order nonlinear partial differential equations you'll need to begin your stress analysis the right way. You want to do the math, MR4WD? Bring it. :vader:



Lloyd, I'm not trying to step on toes, but I *believe* you can use linear equations for that purpose... not that it makes any real difference, MR4WD cant get his arithmetic right any way.

MR4WD, 2+2=4, dig???

Matt

MR4WD, you have got to be one of the biggest ignoramous'es'es'es'es I have ever had the displeasure of coming across.

The only fact you've expressed is that you're talking completely out of your ass. Face the facts jack, you've already earned a "rep."

Now, take it elsewhere. It isn't welcome 'round these parts.

cm "rotating carriers .... BWAHAHAHA" k

just run a spool and rotate your tires often. i have for the last year..no big deal.

LOL

Well if MR4WD wasn't the best Gearman, Axle tech hero, Porn Star or maybe that was male slut, and general Hero and man among men, Physics and electrical genius, what would we do...?

I mean for his 22 years of age he must have had to go back in time to learn all of the facts (not to mention the arrogantness) ) Or possibly he is a MENSA dropout reggie bubba.

Anyway I think the open carrier might show a similar loading as to the locked one side and no axle on the other side (read load). So make sure you call up the big three and let them know that bearing wear will be accelerated.

LOL what fun you are...

Originally posted by Matthew S. O'Bryan


Lloyd, I'm not trying to step on toes, but I *believe* you can use linear equations for that purpose... not that it makes any real difference, MR4WD cant get his arithmetic right any way.

MR4WD, 2+2=4, dig???

Matt

Sure you can, it just depends on how much detail you want to include. In normal operating conditions linear is a much better route, and it falls out of Euler's equations directly. If you stress a part past yield it's no longer "rigid" but you can still approximate brittle fracture with a Heavyside step and a separate set of linear equations. A Lagrangian treatment would be much better (a mixed Eulerian-Lagrangian treatment usually gives best results for cost) and of course one could do the full tensor analysis. Or, instead of n second-order equations one can use 2n first-order equations; ie. Hamilton's. These hold for nonconservative systems, so we can also treat friction - which raises the issue that mechanical properties of real materials are usually temperature-dependant. Now if you're actually cooking your bearings the steel is sloooowly crossing a phase boundary.....

I'd be thoroughly astonished if he could do the simple high-school physics version, and that's all that's really needed to answer the question. But hey, I'm "ignorant" so don't listen to me.
Thanks for posting this, Matt. Not only is it good for discussion, it shows clearly that when people (anyone!) put something up here, it'll be scrutinized by other people who know WTF is up - just like peer review in scientific journals. It adds credibility to the forum. ;)