what is more worth having in the rocks, the 8 ply in the regular swampers, or the side lugs on teh SX's? teh SX's are only 6 ply. the regular swampers are about 0.4" taller as well, for what that is worth. this is for a toyota T100 if it matters.

I am surprised no one has replied to this yet. Not even with the necessary "Search First" post!

Anyway, I like the regular TSLs due to their price, but would run SXs if I wasn't so damn cheap and if I didn't run primarily in mud. For rocks as a priority, I would definitely go SXs.

HTH.

The only advantage to running an sx in a 36 is for the side wall. The tsl will work better because of the more flexible side wall. I wouldn't think of running SX's without beadlocks I've always had to run them at 5 pounds or less and with a tsl you can run 8-10.

Originally posted by zachv
I am surprised no one has replied to this yet. Not even with the necessary "Search First" post!

Anyway, I like the regular TSLs due to their price, but would run SXs if I wasn't so damn cheap and if I didn't run primarily in mud. For rocks as a priority, I would definitely go SXs.

HTH.

i did search.

Love my 36 tsl's , run 'em at 7 psi with no beadlocks with only a few lost beads.Side walls are super burl and once broken in they flex really well,I did however cut the hell out of em,all blocks cut, to get them to work and really hook up.Next tire on the rig are gonna be 39.5's and that is it for a while

the SX's are great for rocks, but the tread is slightly rounded as compared to a regular TSL, which makes them not as good in the mud. For mud or all around, TSL. for mostly rocks, SX.

Rocks - SX
Combo - TSL
Mud Only - Q78 TSL ;)


TEX

Q78's rock.

Couple of pics of them on a hilux - love the barwork too guts. Looking good man :)

http://jjj.image.pbase.com/u15/ruff_hilux/upload/4703797.ttc2002008.jpg

http://jjj.image.pbase.com/u15/ruff_hilux/upload/4703834.ttc2002009.jpg

Got my Q's on last night! :D
http://www.northeastonlinewheelers.org/yabbse/attachments/CJ91202c.JPG :D

Anybody got a measurement on a Q78 swamp?!? Isnt it somewhere @ 36.5 inches or so?!? As I remember, the Q78 fills the gap between a 34x9.5 and a 38x12.5 right?!? Somethin like a 36x11 or so? Thanks fellas.

-j-rOd

according to www.intercotire.com they measure 35.5x10x15

Mine off the rig were 1/2" shorter than a 36" SX, both at street pressure.

well maybe Ill just run my 36 sx's on the mud truck that Im building, I want all the ground clearance I can get.... course the lugs on a 36 tsl are significantly larger than those on my sx's so I dunno. Ill just have to try them out and see what works.

-j-rOd

The 15" version of the Q78 is right at 35.0" measured horizontally on my 7" rims, ditto for all the other guys I know who have them. The 16" version is 1/2" taller.

For reference, a 36X12.50 TSL is 35.5" true diameter, a 38X12.50/15 is 36.0" true diameter, and and 38X12.50/16.5 is 36.5" true diameter.

If you need a little more height in a pizza cutter, I'd look at R85 Buckshots. They're advertised as 37X13, but they actually come out narrower. They're normally run on 6-8" wide rims. On the 6's, they'll be about 36.5" true diameter & about 1/2" shorter on 8's. And they're 28/32's of tread depth :) You can also get Buckshots in Q78 size.


TEX

Thanks TEX I definitely have some things to think about now.... I cant decide whether to go with the tall skinny diggers or lean more towards floatation with a wider tire. Floatation has worked out pretty well for the small block samurai that we have been campaiging for the last coupla years out here in va. We have a set of 35x14.5 bogger on 15x14 wheels Samurai Pic (http://home.off-road.com/~rt_604/images/March%203rd%202002/Sami1.jpg) it works well in pits that arent rutted up too bad but it has some prblems with high centering now that we put d44s under it. We are going to a 10 inch rim to hopefully get some more height out of the tire for the rest of the season.

peace and birfield grease,

-j-rOd

Another picture of my Q's. Is it possible to cut too much? :flipoff2:

http://archiegallup.homestead.com/files/NewQ78s/TestQs05.jpg

I will recomend the Q's for the mud over the SX's. The lugs are more square and it has more tread depth. Nothing digs like a Q. You will be faster with the Q's compared to the wider tires.

Thanks for the advice Archie, how do they do in a pit that really doesnt have much of a bottom?!? Do they have to dig dog before they are effective or do they propel you forward pretty good too? THe mud bogs around here vary from a clay pit witha hard bottom to a sandy pit where you can dig to china if you dont have forward momentum. I appreciate all yalls reponses.

-j-rOd

Well, I've just got them on, so I haven't done much on my rig with them. But from watching the mud drags and mud bogs in Maine, unless you are pushing 500+hp (ie: a mud rail skimmer) you will be faster in both pits with the Q's then a 12.5 or wider tire. This is based on observation and not personal experence. I also like the 38.5x11 bogger :D

I'm with Arch on this one. We've got some pretty heavy hitters around here who ALL got faster when they tossed their 35" Boggers in favor of Q's. Everything from my 340HP 408" mouse to a guy with a 472" full roller in a Bronco, nobody's running 35" boggers in the slop anymore. And actually, the thicker the mud, and the more rutted it is, the better these work. When it's REALLY loose mud & REALLY wet, the Boggers are still competitive. The thicker it gets, the worse they do. The Boggers also work well if it's REALLY shallow, as in mud "Drags". But, for the deep stuff, there's not a Bogger smaller than the 38.5 that I'd even bother with.


TEX

Thanks and stuff to ya fellas, I am gonna end up with either the Qs or 36x12.5 tsls on 8 inch wheels for sure. I will probably go with the 36s just so I can maximize my ground clearance with toy axles. I will have plenty of engine so the small difference in height wont matter too much or I can adjust the ratio of my chain drive accordingly if I have a problem. Have a good weekend boys I'm off to the bogs in about 4 hours.

-j-rOd

For what it's worth...I'm running 36 12.5 tsls on 7.5" alloy rims. They measure a true 36" on my rig (FSJ weighs in approx 4800), and do better than a buddys 37 bogger. There's a lot of mud around here and I find that the boggers suck up too much hp. With the exception of the 38.5 pizza cutters, I wouldn't run another tire.

just a note... when you hear "ply rating" it's a reference to how much weight the tire is rated for, not how many plies it has in the sidewall. almost all bias ply tires will have 4 polyester/nylon plies throughout the sidewall and tread, and almost all radials will have 2 polyester/nylon sidewall and tread plies, and an additional 2 steel tread plies.

so a ply rating of 8 is just a weight rating, really. you want tougher sidewalls, get more rubber.

granted, a higher ply rating means the sidewall will be a bit more stiff (i.e., tougher, too), but when comparing sidewall toughness on a 6 ply SX vs a 8 ply TSL, the SX will win.

Originally posted by jhama78
I will probably go with the 36s just so I can maximize my ground clearance with toy axles.

I'm running Toy axles as well. And actually, I too was concerned when I went from the 38X12.50's to the Q's about losing clearance. But, it's only 1/2" less clearance & since the Q's bite so much harder, I found I go farther & faster on these than I did on the 38's.


TEX

Originally posted by Mrlo
For what it's worth...I'm running 36 12.5 tsls on 7.5" alloy rims. They measure a true 36" on my rig

That sounds about right. Most of the ones I've seen have been on 10" rims & then they come up around 35.5". You're getting an extra .5" of height due to your narrower rims.

TEX

Originally posted by Scott Graham


I'm running Toy axles as well. And actually, I too was concerned when I went from the 38X12.50's to the Q's about losing clearance. But, it's only 1/2" less clearance & since the Q's bite so much harder, I found I go farther & faster on these than I did on the 38's.


TEX

What are the specs on yer rig TEX? Got any pics?

I would go with 38x12.5s but I want to stay inthe small tire class around here, thats why I am looking for the tallest 36 that I can find.

take it easy man,

-j-rOd

Originally posted by jhama78


What are the specs on yer rig TEX? Got any pics?

I would go with 38x12.5s but I want to stay inthe small tire class around here, thats why I am looking for the tallest 36 that I can find.


1980 Toy longbed, 408" mouse 234/244 cam, 10.2:1 compression, Performer RPM intake, 600 Holley (need more carb), TH350/ 2.28 Toy T-case, 4.37 gears, 3" Rancho lift (need to lower the rear), 3" BL.

http://www.gumbo4x4.com/MNT344.JPG

I run 2nd gear, lowside, though my wife ran 3rd gear immediately after this pic was taken & didn't do too bad. Runs a lot better in 2nd though. I got a lot of 2nds & 3rds and the occasional 1st in our 36" Measured height class, but started taking a lot of 1sts when I went from the 38X12.50's to the Q's. Now, I'm back to taking a lot of 2nds & 3rds as all the guys who did have 35's & 36's are on Q's like me :(


TEX

Here's another pic with the Q's

http://www.gumbo4x4.com/MNT065.JPG

And one from when I had the 38X12.50's

http://mmor.com/mudslide1.JPG

TEX

Sweet truck, Im puttin together an 87 xcab with @ 400 horse 383, th350 w/ 3500-4000 stall, double chain drive to toy axles w/4.10s and either q 78s or 36s with 2 inch body and as little suspension lift as I can get away with. I am also gonna move as much weight back as possible, i.e. rad, battery fuel cell etc. Im still in the gathering parts stage now but I have most of the major components already, got the motor and truck last weekend, and I bought a parts truck for the solid axle yesterday. All I need now is for it to get cold so I will stop playin and start building.

ALso, do you primarily bog your truck or mud drag with it?!?

l8r

-j-rOd

Originally posted by jhama78
I am also gonna move as much weight back as possible, i.e. rad, battery fuel cell etc.

Careful with the rules. Some groups won't let you move that stuff around in a "Street" class, which I assume you'll be in since the cutoff is 36" tires.

ALso, do you primarily bog your truck or mud drag with it?!?


My truck was built for bogs & I only occasionally do "drag" events with it. It does "okay" in the drags, but I need a lot more stall (stock converter) and softer rear springs. In the bogs, the deeper it is, the more likely I'm in the money. Depending on where I run, the class cuts off at "less than 36.0 stamped", "Up to 36.5 stamped", "Up to 37.0 measured height", or "Up to 38.0 stamped". And actually, a REALLY nasty pit where nobody goes 40 feet isn't to my advantage either. Best bet for me is one where the entire class gets stuck, but they get close to the finish line. Some of the guys who are geared lower than me hit 3rd in the shallower stuff, but when it's nasty, they have to stay in 2nd & I end up with more tirespeed. Plus, I'm king in the ground clearance department, so deep ruts are a good thing :)


TEX

THere arent really any rules so to speak around here so far as moving stuff around, so untill someody tells me something different Im gonna build it that way. At the worst Ill have to move the radiator and battery back under the hood.

Regarding the deep rutted bogs thats where Ive made my best showings also with my 84 this season, ground clearance will take you farther than a powerful engine for sure.

So with your combination you are spinning the wheels at approximately 42 mph when your engine is turning 6000 in low lock 2nd gear. I hope to be spinning mine at approximately 50-55 mph in second gear at 6000-6500 in 2nd gear with a 2:1 reduction in the chain drive. SO hopefully between ground clearance and wheel speed I will take home a few trophies next year.

enough of me blabbin,

l8r

-j-rOd

Originally posted by jhama78
So with your combination you are spinning the wheels at approximately 42 mph when your engine is turning 6000 in low lock 2nd gear

Yup, that's about what we're doin'. Got the rev-limiter set at 6,400 & only on those RARE occasions does it get up against the limit. Turning 5,500-6k most of the time.


TEX

OK man have a good one Im headed out to work on my buds rocky to get it ready for bodatious. We got a pair of front axles in it along with a new rear end. ANyway keep the dirty side down.

-j-rOd