I'm gonna be picking up my beagle pup from SilverZuk in a couple weeks and I'm starting to put together plans for the kennel. Of course, that's not too difficult. My difficulty is coming in trying to convince my wife that a dog can be happy and live in a kennel. She's never been around hunting dogs or any dog for that matter that wasn't treated like family royalty. :laughing:

We've had inside dogs, outside dogs, and taken in strays but no huntin dogs yet. I've tried to explain to her that the dog will be exercised plenty, out of the kennel everyday for training/exercising/playing etc. And I've also tried to convey the point that when you see a dog hunt and truly follow it's training and instincts you've never seen a happier more satisfied dog.

What else could help her get comfortable with the idea? I know time and experience will be best and that's what it's gonna take I'm sure. I was just wondering in anyone else has had this issue and any success convincing the better half. :D

Problem is I agree with your wife. I personal don't like the idea of having kennelled or even outdoor dogs. All my dogs have been indoor dogs. Anyone I know that has kennelled or outdoor dogs, the dogs are starved for attention. They make the time at first but as the dog gets older it trails off. I do however totally back you up that a hunting breed is never happier then when they are on the hunt, period. They just can't get enough of it.

So, is it possible to have and indoor/house dog that is an effective hunter. Seems like the dog ought to know when he gets out he's going hunting and that would be hard to do with a housedog I'd think. No?

My dog lives in the house too. He would be to lonely living outside. But he is not a hunting dog either. I would think that if the dog lives inside and only goes out to hunt, then he will always be in hunting mode when he goes outside?

I know several people that have indoor/outdoor dogs that hunt and they say they're great hunters. I also know people who kennel their dogs and they only come out to hunt or train. I don't have any personal experience to say if there's any difference.

It's my feeling that the dogs kept exclusively in a pen outside do starve for attention.

My Golden and Yellow Lab can go in and out of the house as they wish. They also sleep on my bed. :)
They don't hunt, but get exercised every day, chasing balls.

<----- Has his own bed in my room and retrieves ducks for a living. Any area that he is lacking in is due to my laziness.

My uncle's Brittany Spaniel sleeps inside the house (in a crate) and is a phenomenal hunting dog. He acts totally different inside and outside.

Dogs that live in kennels are not happy dogs. Especially hunting dogs. They want to be active and they want to make you happy. One day a week won't be enough attention for a Beagle or any other sporting dog.

ok Andy, you know as well as I do that when you bring that pup home your 3 kids are gonna have it in the house 24/7. Explaining things to M is one thing but how are you going to convince the kiddos that the new puppy needs to live outside all alone in that cage you call a kennel???? good luck with that!!

on another topic.... I have some papers for you still:flipoff2:

I cant see that you need a kennel but I would definitely get a crate for the dog to sleep in. I love my Boxer but it drives me nuts that I let her sleep on the bad and I'm not going to try to change it after years of allowing it.

The kids won't have inside all the time cause mama won't let'em. I'm not opposed to inside, outside, or a kennel. It just seems like a kennel would be best. Inside full time is out of the question outside with the invisible fence (like the other dogs) seems like it would be difficult and not the best thing for the dog (hunting wise).

I cant see that you need a kennel but I would definitely get a crate for the dog to sleep in. I love my Boxer but it drives me nuts that I let her sleep on the bad and I'm not going to try to change it after years of allowing it.

I actually just made this transition and was surprised at how easy it went.

My two Jack Russells had been sleeping in bed with me their entire lives. The oldest for five years and the youngest for two years. Girlfriend moved in over a year ago and brought her two terriers, so we had four dogs in bed with us and we couldn't move at all, let alone have secks. So she bought a crate and I wasn't sure how my dogs would take this new sleeping arrangement. To my surprise, the oldest Jack Russell went right in on her own and took a nap the first day the crate was in the house. Three of the four dogs actually enjoy sleeping in there. The fourth one doesn't like it but doesn't whine or anything.

So it may be worth it to give it a shot. Remember that dogs are den animals by nature so they usually like to have their own little "fort" to hide out in where nobody will bother them. I have my crate on the floor in the bedroom so the dogs can still see me and that may help with possible separation/abandonment issues.

MossMan, try the Beagle out with the invisible fence. Start it at a young age and it will know the difference between back yard time and hunting time. And try to keep rabbits and squirrels out of your yard. :laughing: That will help a lot too.

My dog usually stays outside when I am gone and he comes in when I get home. I do keep him inside when it gets below 0* though.

As a puppy, my black lab (used for commercial hunts) stays in a kennel in my room or in the kitchen. It is his safe spot, if he's scared or whatever he goes in there. As a full grown dog, he will sleep in my room with the kennel door open so he can go in there if he pleases. He's outside for more than a few hours a day, unless the weather goes to shit. My roommate (another one of the hunting guides) treats his lab the same way. Both dogs are trained to know the difference between fucking around and hunting, but when either one of us gets stern or makes a command, all play stops and they become serious. Kind of an off-shoot thing, anyone looking at a lab puppy should check out www.roddydogs.com and look at his DVD. He trained my older lab, and is helping me with my younger dog. The puppy DVD is a great tool for first time dog owners, especially lab owners. /shameless plug. :laughing:

One more thing...The more social a puppy is (aka around other dogs) up to 6 or 8 months, the better off he will be as he grows older.

so you're a hunting guide for a living? I hate you.




:flipoff2:

I know plenty of people who hunt their indoor dog/best friend dog. A good hunting dog just knows and I feel the time it spends bonding and playing with the family only makes it want to preform better on the hunt. Most of my personal hunting dog experience is with spaniels, particularly Boykins but I am sure it is the same with others. The best hunting dogs I have known have been treated as family pets and getting to go hunting is is a treat for them. I am biased of course but a Boykin Spaniel is the best duck dog you can get:

http://www.puppypurebred.com/images/boykin%20spaniel%202.JPG

not to mention the best family pet you could ask for. One of these days I will get another but the wife and I have a 2 dog limit and our Beagle mix and Cavalier are filling it currently. Our Beagle is a sweet dog but he was hers before we met and lets just say hunting him is out of the question. Totally gun shy...

I know plenty of people who hunt their indoor dog/best friend dog. A good hunting dog just knows and I feel the time it spends bonding and playing with the family only makes it want to preform better on the hunt.
Ditto.
It has been mentioned above alot and I agree dogs that are kept in kennels or tied up outside beg for attention. I wonder why people even have dogs when that is how they treat them. Pisses me off. My Aunt and Uncle have a lab and that is how they treat him never give him any attention and they are out of town almost every weekend with the kids. They bring the dog here by my house sometimes on the weekend. And man that 14yr old dog is like a puppy again when he is here because we are always doing something with him.

I also know pletny of people who have indoor dogs and they are absolutely amazing hunting dogs. :skull:

My kennel is 100' of welded wire fence (with the small holes so a pup can't get its head through). My kennel is roughly 25'x25'.

I have never had a problem with my dogs digging out, thought the could. Kevin (at the bottom of the hill) has one that is a digger. He has her on a run inside her pen.

I had one beagle that would climb out, so I ran a strand of electric fence around the top. I never saw him get into it, but I took it down a month later and he never climbed out again.

I personal don't like the idea of having kennelled or even outdoor dogs.

I think it is wrong to keep large breeds indoors. Hounds have to be confined, if not - they will be hunting. They will run deer, fox, or whatever they please. Most get run over, if they become a nuisance someone will shoot them. It is not safe to let them run unsupervised, and it is fair to neighbors who have to listen to them chasing rabbits around their house at night.

Crating dogs is inhumane. You put a dog in a box for 8 hours while you sleep. You wake, take the dog for a walk. Put it in the crate 9 hours while you go to work. Let the dog out in the evenings in the house. Sorry, that is no better than the people the put them in a pen in the backyard and don't do anything with them.

I think the invisible fence is great for my dogs and it is expandable. However, I don't know how effective it would be with a beagle when there are rabbits running around right across the line. And they are there all the time. Maybe if I bring the pup up with the fence it would work, but would it be confusing? or otherwise hinder the hunting abilities? I think it probably would.

With other gun dogs there may be a more obvious change of setting for the hunt. For instance, bird dogs. A lab (or whatever) can be pretty sure that with no water or ducks anywhere in sight of the yard, we're not going hunting when I take it outside. For a beagle, my yard and the rest of the neighborhood look like pretty good hunting grounds.

My Lab is an indoor dog. My buddy has a lab that is indoor and is a great bird dog. I really don't like the idea of having outdoor pups.

Lots of mis-information in this thread.

My dogs get attention daily, they are out of the pen to run rabbits several times a week. They don't yap. The pen is big enough for them to run and chase each other. My cur dog is out most every evening.
I hand feed twice a day, they all get talked to and petted.

As far as being happy.
In the winter, I let them in house to visit. That way we can socialize with them longer because it is not cold. Some of them would have been content to lay on the couch forever. However, about half I have had come in for a while and then they are ready to leave.

I had one that was very ill. We tried to bring him in the house. Though he was almost too weak to stand, he got up and stood at the door. I opened the door and he went back to hi dog house. That is where he was comfortable.

I buried our house dog a month ago. There will be no more dogs living in the house. They can come into visit, but they aren't living there. Hair, odor (he didn't have an odor until he got older), can't go out to eat after work because we have to go home and let the dog out. Have to have someone take care of him on vacation. He was a pain, and it is a relief now he id gone.

Beagles have a dog odor. I don't care how often you bath them, they still have that dog odor (most hounds do). Also, I have had my dogs roll in crap, dead animals, get sprayed by a skunk, and everything else.
When I come in from hunting, clean rabbits, get warm, eat, and prepare to go coon hunting. I don't want "having to bath a beagle" added to my list.

I don't think an invisible fence will keep a beagle in. It may work as a pup, but once older I guess that they will figure 10' of pain to freedom is a small price to pay. :laughing:
Mine run through the electric fence pretty regularly. Rabbits will run out of the woods and into the corn. Sometimes they give a little "yelp" but don't ever lift their head.

I think it is wrong to keep large breeds indoors. Hounds have to be confined, if not - they will be hunting. They will run deer, fox, or whatever they please. Most get run over, if they become a nuisance someone will shoot them. It is not safe to let them run unsupervised, and it is fair to neighbors who have to listen to them chasing rabbits around their house at night.

Crating dogs is inhumane. You put a dog in a box for 8 hours while you sleep. You wake, take the dog for a walk. Put it in the crate 9 hours while you go to work. Let the dog out in the evenings in the house. Sorry, that is no better than the people the put them in a pen in the backyard and don't do anything with them.

My next door neighbor who is a great guy has two labs he keeps in his fenced in back yard. Those bastards bark all fucking night sometimes. Drives the wife crazy. Me, I am used to it.

I agree with crating but as you pointed out about your dogs, I have witnessed dogs that absolutely LOVE their crates. It is all how you train them. So who is to say that just because they like something that it is good for them.

Now if you interact with your dogs regularly, that is great. That is how it should be. I am just saying that makes you part of a VERY small percentage of owners who keep their dogs outside.

Now if you interact with your dogs regularly, that is great. That is how it should be. I am just saying that makes you part of a VERY small percentage of owners who keep their dogs outside.

That's what it all boils down in IMO. The dogs have to be exercised and loved on. No one could ever claim SilverZuk's dogs lack attention. And you're right that there are not enough folks that give enough attention. I agree completely that to leave the dogs penned up most of the time with little interaction or exercise is wrong. I totally plan on running or working with the pup in some form everyday. Even if it's just to get out for a while to play with the kids and the other dogs.

Kids, dogs, horses, etc. - Some people should not have them.
If you don't have the time and money to take care of them, and treat them humanely - you shouldn't have them.

But that never stoppped anyone. And no law is going to stop those types from reproducing, or buying a dog and chaining it up the back fence and leaving it there until it dies of old age, or buying a horse and putting it in a 1 acre yard, never shodding or riding it.

As sad as it is, the animals are there property and they can do what the see fit (it is a free country). They can keep a dog in a wire cage with food and water, and it is legal (as it should be). I am not telling them what to do with their animals, and no one is going to tell me what to do with mine (remember the part about being free, that is free to be stupid).

Back to Mossman's beagle pup. It is going to live a rough life with 3 kids and wife that loves dogs. He better make that dog house real nice, because the beagle may end up in bed with his wife while he sleeps in the doghouse.

Back to Mossman's beagle pup. It is going to live a rough life with 3 kids and wife that loves dogs. He better make that dog house real nice, because the beagle may end up in bed with his wife while he sleeps in the doghouse.

troof! :laughing:

so you're a hunting guide for a living? I hate you.




:flipoff2:

Life is hard....Go to school at Ole Miss with thousands of good looking girls, then head over to the Delta to make some $$ doing what I would be doing anyways. :flipoff2:

My dogs have the option via a dog door. They sleep inside at night and get the run of the house and 3 acres fenced (5' field fence). I own both hunting dogs (labs/Chessie) and pet dogs.

My favorite gun dog trainer is Bill Tarrant. His opinion was that the more you bond with your dog - the better your hunting relationship. Take 'em everywhere, share food and sleeping accomodations, etc. Lucky me, my first Lab and I had a tight relationship and hunted great together because of the time we spent NOT hunting. To me, my dogs serve two purposes: hunting and a buddy. The more I hunt and older I get, the more value I actually put on the buddy and just "being" there in the field. They've earned all access.

Just me though, I have no problem with kenneling if thats your thing and you are responsible with attention. I agree with SilverZuk can't stand the SOBs who crate or tie off the dog all day...

Side note: there are some updated pics of the pups in this thread.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=802117

There is one I am ready to cull. I like the actions of 2 of the males the best so far. However, I wouldn't mind keeping any of the other 3 males or the female.

As I have them out in the yard every evening, I'll learn more about them and make my decision which one I plan on keeping.

:laughing: Remeber this thread? Did ya see my new pup thread? Well the new pup just went to bed with my wife! :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

keep a towl nearby. Pups are great, they'll be so comfortable that they'll just pee and never move. :D

My dog lives inside the house with a doggie door to her backyard of about .25 acres where she chases squirrels, eats acorns, sunbathes and generally makes a mess.

my brother has a wiemeraner that is an awesome hunting pooch. It stays inside the house.

dogs belong outside..that is all.

IMO...A dog is a pack animal, and is more complete when it is with it's pack. That being said if you do let him in the house, consider your rank at all times. Letting a dog that is supposed to work for you on the same level with you, i.e., in the bed, or on the furniture, is letting the dog rank on you. It will screw up the working relationship. Maybe a little and not so noticable, or maybe it will manifest in other ways while you are trying to get him to respond to a command in the field, commonly referred to as the dog giving the handler the "paw".

As long as you provide any working dog with rank and proper social order you will not find a way to replace that level of commitment and obedience to orders. It is difficult to do that with the dog living outside.

Also I would not use an invisible fence. Electricity can manifest issues in a dogs performance. Ecollars seem to be all the rage. I believe that it should be a last resort not an accepted tool. Set up a small outdoor run with good link, concrete floor with a dog house when you can't leave him inside. Just my .02