I'm selling my Rubi 44's and looking for new axles. I plan on going with a Waggy 44 out front, but cant decide on a rear. Dana 60 or Dana 44. Im running 35's now, but I do plan on running larger tires down the road. I've been researching and just looking for some advice or information from those that have done such conversions. Pros and cons and such.

Come on man, youve been here since oct 08 and all you tell us is your running 35s but plan to go bigger.

60
More weight
Less clearance
Stronger gears
FF if you know what your looking for
Possibility of 1.5" shafts

44
Less weight
more clearance
weaker gears
not FF

With the info you provided thats all your going to get back.

Not really HC but Ive hated enough already:flipoff2:

OH and where do you live? If your in VA you should go 60 and buy mine :D

I went hp44 waggy width and toyota tacoma/t100 rear for lighter weight with my 4cyl. Ill probably regret it (the 44) someday but then ill know better by personal experience

how hard do you plan on wheeling and how much $money do you have to spend. you can build a bad a$$ 60 for under 2grand. the waggy 44's if i'm now wrong are 61" if you get a 14bolt, shorten the long side 6inches and you can use 2 short side stock shafts and it puts the axle at 61" to match the front. thats what Im doing in my next jeep. just my .02 on axles. with disc brakes on the 14bolt you can run 15" wheels with 8lug wheels.

you've already said enough to make it the D44/D60 combo hands down

If you plan on going with 35's or bigger and you actually wheel it, you'll appreciate the 60 out back

Only thing is, the Waggy Dana44 front is 59" WMS ,which is very narrow. Most Dana60 rear ends are around 67" WMS. Unless you want a funny looking track width where your rear axle is much wider than your front, I recommend using an '80-87 J-truck or '80-83fullsize Cherokee front Dana44 which is 65.5" WMS......or using a high-pinion Ford front D44 from a late-70's truck/Bronco.

you've already said enough to make it the D44/D60 combo hands down

If you plan on going with 35's or bigger and you actually wheel it, you'll appreciate the 60 out back

Only thing is, the Waggy Dana44 front is 59" WMS ,which is very narrow. Most Dana60 rear ends are around 67" WMS. Unless you want a funny looking track width where your rear axle is much wider than your front, I recommend using an '80-87 J-truck or '80-83fullsize Cherokee front Dana44 which is 65.5" WMS......or using a high-pinion Ford front D44 from a late-70's truck/Bronco.

That's funny, my uncut Waggy D44 front measured 62.5" wms-wms with the
stock 6 lug hubs. It's now 63.5" with the 8 lug hubs.

That's funny, my uncut Waggy D44 front measured 62.5" wms-wms with the
stock 6 lug hubs. It's now 63.5" with the 8 lug hubs.

stock Wagoneer front Dana44 axles from '74-79 were right around 59", the rears were 57.5. The '80-up Waggy Dana44 fronts were around 60". Either way, huge wheel spacers would be necessary to match up to the rear. I wouldn't use any wider than a 1.5" wheel spacer

stock Wagoneer front Dana44 axles from '74-79 were right around 59", the rears were 57.5. The '80-up Waggy Dana44 fronts were around 60". Either way, huge wheel spacers would be necessary to match up to the rear. I wouldn't use any wider than a 1.5" wheel spacer

Still doesn't account for my passenger drop D44, which means it's a 74-79
being 62.5" wms-wms stock. BTW, I KNOW it came from a Waggy.

stock Wagoneer front Dana44 axles from '74-79 were right around 59", the rears were 57.5. The '80-up Waggy Dana44 fronts were around 60". Either way, huge wheel spacers would be necessary to match up to the rear. I wouldn't use any wider than a 1.5" wheel spacer

FWIW,my D44 is psd,waggy axle 4 sure. 62.5" wms to wms.Later...

i think you should keep your front rubi 44 and add bobby long's new CV axle shafts. then you could get some spidertrax adapter spacers that turn the bolt pattern to a 5x5.5 which will make it easier to find a rear axle that matches the front. for example a good ford 9" which can be just as strong as a dana 60 and definately stronger than a dana 44 or maybe a tj specific axle from one of the vendors. I just think that the waggy 44 is a waste of money if you already have a d44, and with cv axle shafts from bobby it would make the axle very strong for a d44, and we all know the weakest point is the u-joint of the 44 which the CVs get rid of this weakest point.

Which every way you go, remember that you could have had a good dana 60 for close to the same price as a built waggy 44. your options are endless, but i really think you are down grading by moving to a waggy 44 from a rubi 44. at least go to a high pinion 44 if you are gonna stick with a dana 44.

oh and this isn't hardcore.

yeah i guess i too am confused as to why your swapping out a rubi 44 for just another 44. i would think the gain in strength is marginal and for the same money and less hassle you could build your 44 to handle anything a waggy 44 would handle.
the rear i would say go 9 since you can build it basically as strong as need be.

yeah i guess i too am confused as to why your swapping out a rubi 44 for just another 44. i would think the gain in strength is marginal and for the same money and less hassle you could build your 44 to handle anything a waggy 44 would handle.
the rear i would say go 9 since you can build it basically as strong as need be.

The Rubicon D44s have thinner wall tubes and D30 outers. They're weaker than a Waggy D44 because of that.

stock Wagoneer front Dana44 axles from '74-79 were right around 59", the rears were 57.5. The '80-up Waggy Dana44 fronts were around 60".

You must really suck with the tape measure as any Waggie front is the same, regardless of year, and are 62.5" WMS to WMS. Maybe you're thinking Scout 44s. :confused:

Only thing is, the Waggy Dana44 front is 59" WMS ,which is very narrow.

stock Wagoneer front Dana44 axles from '74-79 were right around 59", the rears were 57.5. The '80-up Waggy Dana44 fronts were around 60". Either way, huge wheel spacers would be necessary to match up to the rear. I wouldn't use any wider than a 1.5" wheel spacer
Like previously said, you must be thinking of something else.

My late 70s pass drop Waggy front is ~62 WMS w/ Ford Outers
My early 80s pass drop Waggy rear is ~60 WMS


With that being said; I wish I would have gone with a 60 rear. I have broken a rear shaft and R&P with a 2.5L.

If you stick with 35s I would recommend a 60/60. A rear 60 is good for 35-40 inch tires. A 14 bolt is cheaper than a rear 60 (final cost with 35 splines) and is good for even bigger tires, but maybe not 35s. I don't like 44s for 35" because they break. I like being able to turn the wheels all the way and throttle it without worrying about the front ujoint/stub shaft. And getting on verticle and not haveing my rear pinion deflect.

If you stick with 35s I would recommend a 60/60. A rear 60 is good for 35-40 inch tires. A 14 bolt is cheaper than a rear 60 (final cost with 35 splines) and is good for even bigger tires, but maybe not 35s. I don't like 44s for 35" because they break. I like being able to turn the wheels all the way and throttle it without worrying about the front ujoint/stub shaft. And getting on verticle and not haveing my rear pinion deflect.

You realize that FF D60s are 30 spline right? There is no gain in usable strength on a 30 spline rear 60 over a Dana 44. Sure the ring gear is stronger, but the axleshafts remain the weak point, so effectively you've swapped in something heavier, with less ground clearance and the same spline count as what you had.

You'd be better off with a 14 bolt, Sterling 10.25, Dana 70, or 35 spline 9", for strength.

As for the front 60 I don't think anyone will argue that one.

the 30 spline 60 is a corse cut. its stonger than a 44 but not up to par with a 35 spline 60.

I would do d44 front and 9" rear. Put 35 spline in the 9" and you will never break it. I'm runnin a 35 spline 9" with 42's and have never had a problem and I beat on it. I sure know it's nice having all that clearance. I have a buddy runnin 36's on a stock waggy 44 with a 4.3 and has never had a problem.

You must really suck with the tape measure as any Waggie front is the same, regardless of year, and are 62.5" WMS to WMS. Maybe you're thinking Scout 44s. :confused:

62.5" was very likely wide track axle found under full size cherokees, a jeep that looked pretty damn similar to a waggie since the cherokee was based off one and was produced 74 to 83.

I've never seen a waggie or grand waggie sporting an axle that wide, but then again, we are talking about an AMC product and you kind find LOTS of variation back then, even on the same model years. But, as far as I know, all waggies or grand waggies had an axle width of anywhere from 58-60", I would say they should all be 59.5" and people just can't measure. Either way, certainly not 62.5" as those were wide tracks and there was never a wide track waggie/grand waggie. That was reserved for the cherokee.

As for the swap, my wife's jeep will get the same axles as mine.

Waggie D44 up front, Waggie AMC20 out back. That 20, especially after you truss it, is as strong or stronger than a D44. (I would say the strength differences between 28 and 30 spline are debateable.)

62.5" was very likely wide track axle found under full size cherokees, a jeep that looked pretty damn similar to a waggie since the cherokee was based off one and was produced 74 to 83.

I've never seen a waggie or grand waggie sporting an axle that wide, but then again, we are talking about an AMC product and you kind find LOTS of variation back then, even on the same model years. But, as far as I know, all waggies or grand waggies had an axle width of anywhere from 58-60", I would say they should all be 59.5" and people just can't measure. Either way, certainly not 62.5" as those were wide tracks and there was never a wide track waggie/grand waggie. That was reserved for the cherokee.

with a straight edge on both sides rear of my grand waggy was just shy of 59" and front was just over 62" and when i pulled it there wasnt any of those goofy fenders on it and the tires were nice and tucked away.... dont kno what your talking about.

62.5" was very likely wide track axle found under full size cherokees, a jeep that looked pretty damn similar to a waggie since the cherokee was based off one and was produced 74 to 83.

Fawk.

No sir. I've had a '79 Wagoneer and a '76 non-Chief Cherokee (Edit: only the Chief was wide track since you failed to mention that and grouped all Cherokees together) along with several other narrow track FSJ 44s along with a couple of wide track FSJ 44s. I'm quite aware of the difference in the models as well as the WMS of each.:shaking:

62.5" was very likely wide track axle found under full size cherokees, a jeep that looked pretty damn similar to a waggie since the cherokee was based off one and was produced 74 to 83.

I've never seen a waggie or grand waggie sporting an axle that wide, but then again, we are talking about an AMC product and you kind find LOTS of variation back then, even on the same model years. But, as far as I know, all waggies or grand waggies had an axle width of anywhere from 58-60", I would say they should all be 59.5" and people just can't measure. Either way, certainly not 62.5" as those were wide tracks and there was never a wide track waggie/grand waggie. That was reserved for the cherokee.

Eh, wrong.

You must be thinking scout axles, which are 58.5" wms, I should know, I own a pair. The waggys came in a 61-62" ish width narrowtrac, and a 64-65" ish width wide trac.

My Waggy front is 62.5 WMS - WMS. That is why they work prefectly for TJs.

I seem to recall measuring mine out, that came out of a waggie at 59.5". 6 lug spindle, 6 lug hub. I remember thinking that during the build I would end up being 1" narrower over stock which was 60.5".

Go searching online and you can find measurements for the front end all over the place.

You just need to buy my 44/60 combo I have for sale on here

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=814391&highlight=

You could look in the FAQ at the op of the forum to read the whole thread about Cherokees vs Wagoneers and what got Narrows, what got Wides. Its been covered before.

But I think the OP is gone, anyway.

Rear 60 with 35s = rock anchor.

I seem to recall measuring mine out, that came out of a waggie at 59.5". 6 lug spindle, 6 lug hub. I remember thinking that during the build I would end up being 1" narrower over stock which was 60.5"....62.5" was very likely wide track axle found under full size cherokees, a jeep that looked pretty damn similar to a waggie since the cherokee was based off one and was produced 74 to 83.

I've never seen a waggie or grand waggie sporting an axle that wide, but then again, we are talking about an AMC product and you kind find LOTS of variation back then, even on the same model years. But, as far as I know, all waggies or grand waggies had an axle width of anywhere from 58-60", I would say they should all be 59.5" and people just can't measure. Either way, certainly not 62.5" as those were wide tracks and there was never a wide track waggie/grand waggie. That was reserved for the cherokee.


The rear axle, sure... the front, as others have stated, is right around 62.5".
Here's a pic of my 6 lug (6x5.5) axles from a '91 Grand Wagoneer.
http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o61/dexter643/jeepstuff015.jpg

No tape measure on them in the pic, my bad. I can take another pic for you tomorrow if you'd like. :flipoff2:

No hard feelings, but you're trying to spread misinformation. And that's not cool.:shaking: