Someone mentioned in another thread, that Sway-away is now having their limit straps made in China (the black ones at least).

I just picked up a pair of 18" straps from Avalanche.

I was shocked when they limited travel about 3" too late. I took the strap off and measured it... well:

http://home.off-road.com/~bassettsbeast/images/tech_photos/suspension/rearend/straps/straps2.jpg

http://home.off-road.com/~bassettsbeast/images/tech_photos/suspension/rearend/straps/straps1.jpg

The strap on top is an unused one, the strap on bottom is the one I just used once in the driveway to test mounting location.

You can see the brand new one is already 1/2" too long. That 1/2" too long is the 1/2 I accounted for the strap to eventually stretch too when I ordered "18" Limit Straps".

Oh, as for the bungee remark, here's the strap once it finally decides to stop stretching:

http://home.off-road.com/~bassettsbeast/images/tech_photos/suspension/rearend/straps/straps3.jpg

This strap is on a 60 1/2" wide high pinion 9" rearend with 36" TSLs on aluminum wheels. this application shouldn't call for dual straps should it??? Am I right in thinking I was sent foreign-manufactured sh*t?

I wouldnt think you would need duals... those look like cheap ones or something. you woulve had to order like 15" to have it stop travel where you want it to.. man that stinks...

The problem with any shorter straps is I would almost have to bolt them to the middle of my lower arms, else they'd effect the desired range of travel.

Take off 1 end of the strap and twist it around once and re-mount, Lance has good success doing this. Retest your drrop and then if you need more apply anothere 1/2 twist or a full rotation and see where that gets you.

Sweeeeeet!

Thanks Kevin!


Chris
(aging myself with sweet. ;))

No problem, every full twist should take up about an 1" of droop. Re-post back and let us know how it went.

Buy cheap straps, get cheap straps. :flipoff2:

My beards were dead nuts for length and didn't stretch much over 1/2". Of course they were quad thickness...

http://www.redart.com/limiting.asp

Thanks for kicking a guy when he's down fuhknutz! :flipoff2: I have to run these this weekend. Maybe I'll see if Avalanche will take this sh*t back, and I'll get the Beards, if the twisting idea doesn't work.

What else are groomsmen for, numbnutz? :D

Soon you'll learn and buy yourself somethign with a FRAME!

Aren't you supposed to allow for 1.5" instead of .5" of stretch when bottoming. I've talked to a few manufacturers and they all pretty much give the same stretch factor. That being said, I still only ordered mine 1" too long and now I'm worried cuz they're the same straps as yours. Guess I won't know until I start raising tires with the lift :mad:

Easy

I had to put a twist in my front strap to keep my front end from unloading, been like that for the past six months no problem. Under tension about 1" per twist, looks like a lot more withour weight on it.

Paul

The strap I've already stretched once twisted two full turns easily. The brand new one just makes it between the mounting bolts with two full twists. I'm going to work the suspension tomorrow morning b4 heading for the Rubicon. Will post the results of the two full twists.


Easy, I suppose that's one question I should've asked Avalanche when I ordered. :cool:
I asked them only what to expect in terms of strap stretch. They told me to expect only .5" of stretch.
However, all that aside, my 18" Sway-A-Way straps came 18.5" out of the box, and stretch to 21.5"; that's 3" of stretch on the first use.

Mastercraft, will make them any size and any thickness. When I used to race off road we would make the mount on a grade 8 bolt with a mounting point on it that slid through a tube. The bolt would still have the threaded end to take up any slack or make adjustment.

Yep, I looked into M/C; they were ~$9 more each. I ASSumed Avalanche wouldn't sell cheap sheyat so I went for the bargain price....D'OH!

I guess it's that same old thing, you get what you paid for. I think that sometimes you should just buy the one that cost the most in the first place. At least that way you won't have to buy it twice.

If you're unsure of the strecth the strap might have or want to have a bit of adjustability.....

strap pic (http://www.solidaxle.net/lapics/full_droop.jpg)

Try this with the top mount. It's threaded so can be adjusted and spring loaded to keep it taught when loose.

I've linked to the image because it's large and making it smaller might not show the detail needed....

Fair enough M/C Man. However, buying from Avalanche I didn't think I was getting the Walmart Specials.

Kevin's suggestion did the trick. I ended up having to put FOUR full twists in my straps, to get them to limit travel where they were supposed to in the first place. Due to their elasticity however, I had to first twist up the rig on the slabs (at Spider) to stretch the straps, then I twisted them and bolted them up. Also, one strap seemed to have more elasticity than the other, so I had to move it to my lower mounting hole on the axle. End result was that the suggestion worked, and I was able to run the rest of the weekend without pitching a coil..... not before I pitched one half way into Soup Bowl though!:eek: Put the twists in the next day, and it allowed me a successful run through the Box without a coil spitting out on me.

Thanks again Kevin!:beer:

How much stretch is necessary/good?

I'm kinda curious, 'cause once you've got a limit strap, its length is pretty well set. If you've gotta get a limit strap in quickly, and don't have the time to order one up (or can't get one the length you need off-the-shelf), is it bad to use a material that doesn't stretch much?

Maybe it'd be better to put the non-stretching-material as the "hard limit" and stretchy straps a "soft limit" so it cushions the drop, but doesn't rely on the stretchy ones to stop stretching?

Where I'm going with this is, I ended up needing a rear diff limit strap on the Mantis with the ongoing changes--and buying one that's about right, then twisting it and hoping that my driveshaft doesn't bind on a hard hit, doesn't sit well with me. So I made a superstubby "winch extension line" out of the tail off a spool of synthetic winch rope. The stretch is less than 1% on the stuff, up to the ragged edge of break strength. I'm not sure if it'll shock load the chassis excessively if the suspension tops out, but if it does, I can fix it. Just wondering if anybody sees a serious problem with it.

Why don't more people do this: Go to the hardware store, buy $10 worth of steel cable and some crimps, make custom-length limiting straps and save the $40 you probably spent on straps? The way I see it, cable stretches A LOT less than nylon, if you break one, it's a cheap fix, and you don't have to wait 5-7 business days to receive them in the mail. Also, if you brake them, you can run to the hardware store and get replacements easily.

J. J.

Scott,
I didn't want any stretch at all, other than the .5" Avalanche told me to expect.

I considerd that JJ, but the crimps I saw at the local HW store are rated for only a couple klbs. The forces on limit straps have to potentially way exceed that.
Maybe I'll look into better crimps.

Right on Chris! Glad to hear it worked. Hopefully see ya at CalRocs this weekend.

Why don't more people do this: Go to the hardware store, buy $10 worth of steel cable and some crimps, make custom-length limiting straps and save the $40 you probably spent on straps?
A Hamilton won't buy a cable that could hold my dog back. :(

...cable stretches A LOT less than nylon...
Straps, mebbe, the UHMWPE winch line, no.

To do this with cable best, you'd need a hydraulic swedger (sp?) and some serious clamps...

Randii

I think I'd want some stretch to my limit straps to prevent the shock load.

Shock-load would have a higher liklihood of ripping the mounts off, or the strap.

Just like you don't (generally) just use a steel block for a "bump stop" - usually there's some rubber, or poly or SOMETHING in there to give it a little *cushion*.. otherwise, why not let the axle tube smack the frame? :D

Given that, the more stretch to the strap, the better, as long as you know how long it ULTIMATELY will be.

That way it slows it down for the last inch or two before it bottoms..

Originally posted by patooyee
Why don't more people do this: Go to the hardware store, buy $10 worth of steel cable and some crimps, make custom-length limiting straps and save the $40 you probably spent on straps? The way I see it, cable stretches A LOT less than nylon, if you break one, it's a cheap fix

That's pretty much what I was thinking, except that I have no steel cable available to do that with, and I do have synthetic winch line. And it was 1AM when I was doing this, so "running to the hardware store" wasn't an option either. Prolly two or three feet of line, two thimbles, and 15 minutes spent braiding a double-eye line, and I'm good to go, with a total cash outlay of less than $10. But it's also a convenience thing... I can only do what I just described, because I happen to have the synth. line already.

TSM (Tom?)... I'd let the axletube smack into the frame, but my coils bind before my tubes hit. :) My truck doesn't go fast enough to generate much of a shock load, but this might be a very very bad thing to do to something that does go fast enough to top out hard.

Any comments on a soft limit and a secondary hard limit? That seems to me to be potentially optimal (kinda like desert race guys do with air bumpstops that hit the axle 4-6" from bottom-out) for cushion.

Use overhead door cable. 1/4", it's stainless and it'll stretch very little. Cheap like a zuki, and it should last a LONG time... You can make it to any length you'd like, and all you need are two ovals per length. I have the swaggar for that size, but it cost 90 bucks. I'm not sure you'd want to buy that for a one-off limit strap... So, my advice is to go out and buy a whole wack of cable (50') which usually won't sell for more than .25cents per foot, a bunch of 1/4" aluminum ovals that cost about 50 cents... Make a loop at one end of the cable and slide it through the oval. Smash the oval with a hammer, and it'll be a good a crimp as any. To cut the cable, use a sharp chisel and hammer, hammer it against a vice or concrete and it will give you a good clean cut. A slightly more expensive albeit adjustable alternative would be to use 1/4" crosby clips, and make the cable whatever length you desire, but you'd have to use 2 clips per side, which may get in the way or take up too much space...

As far as suspension bottoming out down travel, I doubt it would bottom hard enough to resemble anything close to hitting the bumpstops from too much up travel, plus there's a slight amount of give in drawing the cable up tight, so, I'd use cable. Plus it's a cheaper more reliable alternative.

(as far as the backyard crimping and cutting methods, I find it unlikely that most people would have the tools to cut 1/4" cable effectively or crimp it for that matter)

Originally posted by Scott@Rockstomper

TSM (Tom?)... I'd let the axletube smack
into the frame, but my coils bind before my tubes hit. :) My truck doesn't go fast enough to generate much of a shock load, but this might be a very very bad thing to do to something that does go fast enough to top out hard.

Any comments on a soft limit and a secondary hard limit? That seems to me to be potentially optimal (kinda like desert race guys do with air bumpstops that hit the axle 4-6" from bottom-out) for cushion.

I agree with a soft limit and a hard-limit. Sounds good to me. Of course, if the "soft" limiting stuff is setup right, you'd never need the hard one. :-)

But if your stretchy limit straps stretch a touch too far, then a solid limit would work, and still be better than JUST solid, since it would slow down just before snapping to a halt.

I do catch air and I've ripped my shock mounts off more than a few times before getting things dialed in right. :D

I think you could generate enough force to snap something just by driving over a big boulder and having one tire droop suddenly off the other side, dangling in the air, and have it come to the end of travel.

Don't think it'll happen that fast? What if you're over the obstacle and then your rear bumper gets hung up - wham - on the rock? Tire in the air..

What does a 44" TSL on a steel wheel weigh again? :D Especially with coils, which don't have any inherent friction to slow descent like a leaf would. The only thing slowing down the droop is your shock, and near the end, the limit strap.

-Tom

Cutting cable is EASY! Just use those cable clippers that we all have that we normally use to cut the locks on gates to private land! (JUST KIDDING!)

Hell, we've used the same clippers to crimp, too. We were doing it on a winch line for an ATV. We used several crimps on the loop and they haven't come off to this day! (And believe you me, we've pulled ourselves out of some DEEP SHIT!)

If you're worried about the ends fraying, weld them.

I know this is booty fab, but who the hell cares! It works! :D

J. J.

Originally posted by tsm1mt
Don't think it'll happen that fast? What if you're over the obstacle and then your rear bumper gets hung up - wham - on the rock? Tire in the air..

Bumper? Whazzat? :) Once my tires are over, the whole truck is over--my rear tires stick 20" or so past the tail of the truck.

But I do see your point, and I see other situations where it could be an issue, even for my truck.

What does a 44" TSL on a steel wheel weigh again? :D Especially with coils, which don't have any inherent friction to slow descent like a leaf would. The only thing slowing down the droop is your shock, and near the end, the limit strap.


'Bout 175ish, I think. A little more than I do. I keep the shocks pretty high (4ish) most of the time, so it's pretty smooth. I think I'm gonna have to try this setup and see how it works--I've changed enough at this point, that I'm not sure I even know how to drive it any more.

cbassett,

Here is a bad photo of how I make the straps adj. It's hard to see, however I use a long grade 8 bolt that I weld a tab to the head end of the bolt. The thread end slides throught a tube welded to the frame. Then as you tighten the nut it adj. the strap. I hope that this works for you.

Brad

Thanks for the tip M/C man!