I have been reading until my eyes bleed.

I bought a 3 axis CNC Knee mill and I am looking for design software to use with the machine. The mill is a servo and it uses G code programming.

For the home/hobby guy what is the most practical software to buy? I have read about MasterCam, GibbsCam, BobCam and all of those as well as AutoCad and simular products.

I have no experiance with any design software but Bend Tech Pro.

Any suggestions?

Between this and trying to figure out the phase converter issues you run into with CNC I have had some pretty late nights online.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=829012

Here is the Mill I am talking about.

PM sent

I like to do my design work in either Solidworks, or Pro E. I have used both, and they are very similiar, and both work pretty good. As for Cam programs I don't have too much experience, but can say that I have used MasterCam once, and it was fairly easy to use, and intuitive.

Been doing this for 20 years.
I am in Bloomington,In and can help you with the basics.

Get a 3D design package like Solidworks...a student version is about. $150.00...I can help you get that thru the University here.

Cam is another story.....simple things can be taught into your controller in either canned cycles or simple conversational programming. After you achieve these objectives, time to look into a CAM seat, if you really need it.

What are you wanting to do? Are you looking for a design package or are you looking for a CAM package to actually run your mill.

I personally like Mach3 for as a simple CAM program, and it can also be used to update your dated control system.

If you want design packages it depends on what you want to do. If you want to do mostly flat layouts something like googles scketchup is good. Older version of autocad can be had fairly easily online and are cheap if legality is a concern. I still use autocad 14 to do quick layouts when I'm sending parts out to be cut. Its 3 or 4 generations old but a legal copy was $20.

If you want 3d design, I prefer CATIA and IDEA. IDEAS is outdated and CATIA is extremely expensive so probably out. Solidworks is a good economy program. ProE is also a good tool. The student version is reasonably priced. It also has a very good interface with MasterCAM.

I would recommend updating the system to run off of Mach3 as well. CHeck cnczone.com if you haven't already.

This is the problem I really dont know yet what all I have in mind for the mill or the software. I have never owned a mill before and really dont know all that much about them.

I am always building stuff in the shop and saying if I had a mill this would be so much easier or if I had a lathe...

I bought a lathe already and I cant belive how much I use it. I dont know how I have made it this long w/o one. I have a feeling the mill will be the same way.



Should I start with a basic/free 2D software and kinda see where I need to go from there?

This is the problem I really dont know yet what all I have in mind for the mill or the software. I have never owned a mill before and really dont know all that much about them.


Need to search for a decent write up, basically:

CAD Computer Aided Drafting (sketch it)

CAM Computer Aided Manufacturing -- change that drawing into "tool paths"
producing "G code"

G code driver (takes the G code, and converts to movement for X/Y/Z movement).


There are books on G-code, with computer simulation. I would start with the G-Code and work back. Couple of reasons, If I need six holes drilled on a 4.5" bolt pattern.... you can write that in G-Code. For a lot of basic x/y machining a little G-Code gets you there.

There is a ton of stuff out there, so I'd play with the G-code to get up and running first.

Do you really need the CNC part of the mill? Can you put manual controls on it and use it that way?

It already has the manual controls on it. I just thought I would buy everything I need to get started.

If I had the space I would also be in the market for a CNC plasma table but I will either have to add on to what I have now or find a shop somehere else.


I already have way too much stuff in a 25'X30' shop.

I was in the same situation last year and did a lot of research into this. I wanted CAD & CAM but price was a major issue for me. I downloaded loads of trial packages - too many actually because I never tried all of them.
Loas of people suggets Solidworks and it does look good but a real seat is way too expensive for a home shop. (I think the student version runs out after a while???) And then you have to find a CAM package that works with it.


Finally I picked BobCAD - this is CAD with an integrated CAM. It also has some addons available like BOBArt (this is great - you can scan a part on a standard PC scanner and vectorise it with this). Also there are simulators and G code editors available as add ons.

You will read some negative stuff about Bobcad on the net. Some of it was deserved in the past as they had some bugs inprevious releases - but they resolved things and the current version V23 is very good.

The great thing about Bobcad is that you can bargain them down from their initial asking price. I think the price on their website is $2500 but I got it for less that $500.
You might have to play hardball with the sales guys but stick to your price and you will get a good deal. Make sure on your first time purchase that you get as much as possible thrown in - especially the training videos - these are very helpful.

You will need two things... CAD for making drawings of parts, or outlines for toolpaths, and you'll need CAM. What kind of parts do you want to make? 2.5D? 3D?

For CAD, there are some low-cost options. You can look for 2d or 3d CAD. I have an ancient copy of AutoCad for 2d work (you should be able to pick up an old copy cheap). I recently bought a full-blown copy of Alibre Design, which is a pretty good 3D package, when they had it on special for $99. The latest version of that is on sale for $395 iirc. http://www.alibre.com

I also downloaded the fully functional free version of CoCreate Modeling. This is also 3D. This is the company that used to be Cadkey, which was damn nice software back in the day. This software looks promising but I haven't had much time to dig into it yet. http://www.cocreate.com

For CAM there are some low-cost options and hella expensive ones. I've used CamBam (http://www.cambam.co.uk/), g-simple (http://www.gsimple.eu/), and a few other cheap/free ones that were less than impressive.

Andy

I have been reading alot about BobCad and with the CAD/CAM built in features it seems like a pretty good option.

What other software is simular to BobCam? What I mean is there much else on the market right now that is CAD/CAM in one program like BobCad?


Thanks for the replies I have done hours and hours of reading and playing with the free demo software so hopefully I can find what I am looking for soon.

FabricatorsFileExchange.Com


Jeep07 this site is a great idea and I hope to contribute as much as I can. I already have several Bend Tech Pro designs I plan to put up.

I would love to see the site filled with more drawings though.

You will need two things... CAD for making drawings of parts, or outlines for toolpaths, and you'll need CAM. What kind of parts do you want to make? 2.5D? 3D?

For CAD, there are some low-cost options. You can look for 2d or 3d CAD. I have an ancient copy of AutoCad for 2d work (you should be able to pick up an old copy cheap). I recently bought a full-blown copy of Alibre Design, which is a pretty good 3D package, when they had it on special for $99. The latest version of that is on sale for $395 iirc. http://www.alibre.com

I also downloaded the fully functional free version of CoCreate Modeling. This is also 3D. This is the company that used to be Cadkey, which was damn nice software back in the day. This software looks promising but I haven't had much time to dig into it yet. http://www.cocreate.com

For CAM there are some low-cost options and hella expensive ones. I've used CamBam (http://www.cambam.co.uk/), g-simple (http://www.gsimple.eu/), and a few other cheap/free ones that were less than impressive.

Andy


I forgot about Alibre - tried it briefly and it seems good. Gets good reviews too. I wish their cheap version included the sheetmetal design option though. On that subject - can anyone recommend sheetmetal design software that is reasonably priced?

Do you really need the CNC part of the mill? Can you put manual controls on it and use it that way?
Yeah, but its kind of like having sex with a dry condom on....

If you are good at running your machine, even for simple parts a CNC mills is faster and easier.

twentyfootdaredevil - try making some tabs and brackets with the CNC, its not as fast as a plasma, but they come out nicer. For a home shop with a choice of a CNC mill or a CNC plasma, I'd choose the mill any day, its slower but more useful. You have to get creative about clamping/fixturing your plate steel (tip, drill your bolt holes first and then use the holes to bolt down to a tapped piece of scrap aluminum with big washers, then cut them out).

For modeling software, I've used ProE, Solidworks and AutoCAD. ProE and solidworks are a toss up for 3D stuff, but AutoCAD is much nicer for 2D work. For toolpaths I've used ProE's NC add on, which sucks balls, and MasterCAM, which is nice as hell. MasterCAM's modelling is pretty nice too, very similar to AutoCAD (you couldn't model a whole buggy with every component in it, but for single parts its nice)

CAD: I use ACAD, but lots of people don't like it. I taught it to myself with the help of my MIL who is a architect, so any question I had, she could typically work me through it.

CAD/CAM: I like ArtCam pro (~$10,000) for artsy stuff, it is quite expensive. Vcarve Pro (~$1500) is nearly identical to ArtCam and is much more affordable, still geared toward mostly art type work but both have a fairly intuitive CAD side and excellent CAM side.

Cheap CAD/CAM: Look into CamBam, it works and was the only thing I had for a long time. There is a free basic version and a "pro" version that IIRC is less than $100. It works well, but it is quite operator entry intensive, especially when it comes to the CAM side. It doesn't keep tooling libraries and such, so every time you setup a tool path you have to completely enter all the criteria for the cutter. Dolphin partmaster is supposed to be good and will do some limited 4th axis work. I have no first hand experience with it, but I believe it falls in the inexpensive category at $600 for standard and $1000 for pro, but I am told they offer a deep discount for hobby purchasers, you just need to inquire.

Mastercam is nice, but it is pricey, It is "modular" though, in that you can buy the cam modules that you will need, it will still mean lots of cash.

Good Luck,
Jason

Yeah, but its kind of like having sex with a dry condom on....

If your screwing and your hat is dry, then you should make sure she's still alive or maybe she died laughing at you. :flipoff2:

You want flat, smooth as a babies ass cuts use a cnc mill. I'd choose to farm out to a lasercutter or waterjetter to reduce overhead and not waste ALOT of my time. But I've seen some asshats make a laser cutter cut worse than my cnc plasma can too though...:p