any one ever tryed this

you would be able to go to a higher gear

like a 5.13 would be lighter

What's the point?:confused:

You mean as a steerable axle?

yes steering axle

might be kinda hard because of the rockwells square tubes? but i dunno, i havent looked at one up close.

I also don't see the point! Used steering axles can be had for $450!

CJ

http://www.admotorsports.com/jeep.org/cjl-tj/01-06-02/clark's/P1010019.JPG

there's some guys at WMS running 14bolt steering axles I think. check it out. pretty friggin expensive tho

-Scott

Originally posted by SCOTTS_4X
there's some guys at WMS running 14bolt steering axles I think. check it out. pretty friggin expensive tho

-Scott

They use d60 outers.

J. J.

Originally posted by patooyee


They use d60 outers.

J. J.

Talked to Cassey a couple weeks ago and he mentioned that they are putting together a 14bolt with rockwell outer's.

Show me a 14 bolt with Mog outers, THEN we'll talk :flipoff2:

show me a 14 bolt with Mog outers, THEN we'll talk what the fawk is the point in that? 14 bolt=DITCH WITCH, mog portal outers= good clearance, why the fawk would you screw up good STOCK clearance with mog portals by welding in a fawkin' DITCH WITCH between em'? :confused:

I'm all for this idea... I haven't searched on here, or researched in general (and generally don't know much about the topic at hand)

But, it seems to me an out of the box rockwell vs an out of the box Dana 60 would net higher strengths. I'm set on having rear steer in my truck as it would be a very do-able option. "manual" control valve (as opposed to running an electric solenoid) 14 bolt pig, and rockwell outers. You could use just about anything outside of pipe for an axle housing (square tube, round tube etc), 2 control cylinders, a lock out pin to stabilize the tie rod for 2 wheel steering (without worrying about the cylinders drifting back and forth)

I'd be more inclined to use the rockwell outers, I'm having problems enough as it is waterproofing my Dana 60, let alone fabbing something up and waterproofing that. From my understanding, rockwell diffs are submersible? (or, less prone to having a river run through them than a Dana 60)

Of course, for the folks in the dryer climates a Dana 60 may be a better option, but who really breaks that many Dana 60 R&P's or carriers? I also understand that you can run axle shafts equal-to if not superior in strength of that of a rockwell shaft.

Can you use an np205 with a PTO for a pump, (for a fulltime stand alone rear-steer pump) or, is it suggested the the transmission be out of gear? Does the t-case have to be in neutral, or can you have the PTO engaged while in 2, 4-hi and 4-lo?

Perhaps a Dana 70 would be a better option than a 14 bolt, since there's many more gearsets available in the aftermarket for it...

On the other hand, some of the pros about a rockwell is a high-pinion and possibility of pinion brake... Which you'd obviously negate with a 14 bolt diff. And you'd (or somebody else) be left with fabbing up some high zoot brakes for it, plus either changing it over to 8 lug or running 6 lug wheels.

Never the less, Daniel, what would some shafts, outer axle housings, knuckles, spindles and hubs (and the the other various general parts run from you? All said and done, using a complete rockwell steering diff would seem more user friendly vs net gain in weight savings and overall price, than fabbing up something of this means... If you have the funds and the place to do it, it'd be a good setup sure...

hey whats the web address for WMS... i guess i am mispelling somethin' but i have been to the page before and now it tells me it can't find it...

PTP

"Let me ride"

this one has 37 spline inners and 4.88 gears

and a airlocker

i think its the way to go if you are making a hybrid rockwell

it also has disc brake outers, on the rockwell hubs:D

what would be cool is 14 bolt center shaved of course, with rockwell outers.

Originally posted by Jeepmangled87
what would be cool is 14 bolt center shaved of course, with rockwell outers.

:confused: I'm pretty sure that's what this thread is about,,,,,,,,, I think maybe you've had enough :beer:,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, :flipoff2:

Originally posted by snoop dogg
hey whats the web address for WMS... i guess i am mispelling somethin' but i have been to the page before and now it tells me it can't find it...

PTP

"Let me ride"

www.wagonermachine.com

Originally posted by PYRO


:confused: I'm pretty sure that's what this thread is about,,,,,,,,, I think maybe you've had enough :beer:,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, :flipoff2:

BAHAHAHAHA

you know what i think would be cool

a dana 30, shaved of course. with 14 bolt outers :rolleyes: :flipoff2:

This is gay. Who cares about weight in your axle. the more weight is down there the happier I get. I will have somewhere in the range of 2400 pounds of unsprung weight and when I get done that will be more than the sprung weight I will have. Just flip the 3rd member and go with a rockwell. cut the bottom, get better than a nine inch clearance, have your drive shaft coming in 6 inches higher than the closest axle and get those new selectable lockers that are coming out for them. If you still think it is too much weight, get more power and a bigger contact patch, Problem solved and you will be be way more likely not to roll over. My rockwell frontends weigh about 825 pounds with the custom disc brakes and every pound of it is lowering my center of gravity and making me more stable!:rolleyes:

Originally posted by jeeper111
This is gay. Who cares about weight in your axle. the more weight is down there the happier I get. I will have somewhere in the range of 2400 pounds of unsprung weight and when I get done that will be more than the sprung weight I will have. Just flip the 3rd member and go with a rockwell. cut the bottom, get better than a nine inch clearance, have your drive shaft coming in 6 inches higher than the closest axle and get those new selectable lockers that are coming out for them. If you still think it is too much weight, get more power and a bigger contact patch, Problem solved and you will be be way more likely not to roll over. My rockwell frontends weigh about 825 pounds with the custom disc brakes and every pound of it is lowering my center of gravity and making me more stable!:rolleyes:


WTF? Everbody's rig needs to be just like your's or it's gay? BTW, alot of body care about weight, you believe that you what too and that's fine but don't make like everyone else is a bunch of idiots. There is good info here on something different, your just saying the same thing you always say, we got your view point on this many times before. Unless you have somethink new to add,,,,,,,,,,,,:rolleyes:

jeeper111


why dont you tell us about the weight when you get that pease
of shit running

if mine only sat in the shed i would not care how much it weight
ether

Originally posted by CJ Lagos
I also don't see the point! Used steering axles can be had for $450!

CJ

i see the point.. where are you finding a steerable axle that's stronger than a 14 bolt center section w/ rockwell outers.. and don't say a whole rockwell front cause one of those would suck ass for my application

Originally posted by jeeper111
This is gay. Who cares about weight in your axle
BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH. My rockwell frontends weigh about 825 pounds with the custom disc brakes and every pound of it is lowering my center of gravity and making me more stable!:rolleyes:

Do you even wheel???? :laughing:

Until you get out and prove everyone how great your ideas are, NOBODY CARES!!! You chime into every thread with this BS and you're a running joke with many of us :flipoff2:

My shits on jackstands, your shit sucks, heavy junk rules, I know it all even though I don't wheel, get a bigger contact patch (because it's that easy :rolleyes: ).....

AWWWWWWWW shut the fuck up already.

Originally posted by slotoy


i see the point.. where are you finding a steerable axle that's stronger than a 14 bolt center section w/ rockwell outers.. and don't say a whole rockwell front cause one of those would suck ass for my application

That's cool...I'm sure the finished product will look cool. I just think if your at the point where you need rockwell outers, why can't you run the whole diff...and save a lot of money. I can already see a custom 14bolt with rockwell steering ends isn't gonna be cheap.

CJ

Originally posted by flmanyj
jeeper111


why dont you tell us about the weight when you get that pease
of shit running

if mine only sat in the shed i would not care how much it weight
ether

why don't you post some pics of your "pease" of shit....

Originally posted by 84 SheepDog


why don't you post some pics of your "pease" of shit....

His "piece" will squash your open diffs and D35. I've seen the pics :flipoff2:

My rear is being built and I'm not in debt:flipoff2: Oh and Lee's will squash both of your "peases" if he'll hurry up and finish it.

Originally posted by 84 SheepDog
My rear is being built and I'm not in debt:flipoff2: Oh and Lee's will squash both of your "peases" if he'll hurry up and finish it.

"my rear is being built"- I call BS unless you just placed an order this morning :p

"I'm not in debt :flipoff2:"- Most people in the US are in some kind of debt (house, car, etc), so it's not something you can really make fun of someone for. Maybe if my parents made my car payments, paid my car insurance, and bought me HD flat screen TVs (when you're 25 and have my own job) then I could be as cool as you :rolleyes: Make sure you wash that silver spoon every once in a while :flipoff2:

"Oh and Lee's wil squash...."- Using someone elses rig to talk shit because yours can't hang :eek: That's sissy if I ever heard it. On top of that it's a rig that isn't even finished yet :eek: Good one :shaking:


You should go back to the pee-wee league with your attempt at smacks :laughing:

Originally posted by jeeper111
This is gay. blah...blah...blah...whatever...lowering my center of gravity and making me more stable!:rolleyes:

I think you, my friend are the gay one. That seems to be all you talk about...gay and heavy. It seems funny that Sheepdog is fighting for you, you know what they say about sheep ( he must be heavy too ;) )

You are getting to be almost as annoying a MR4WD.

Originally posted by bigdude
AWWWWWWWW shut the fuck up already.

Bwaaaahaaaaa :flipoff2:

I'm calling bullshit on the smack you tried to pull on him earlier. How long was yours in your garage? An axle swap isn't even close to what he is doing either. Besides, he's already run your basic setup and didn't like it. Oh and I finally ordered the axle this am. Now, I just have to wait another year till I can afford a front.

Originally posted by 350 Samurai


It seems funny that Sheepdog is fighting for you, you know what they say about sheep ( he must be heavy too ;) )
Bwaaaahaaaaa :flipoff2:

And you know what they say about people from Tennessee. Squeel like a pig boy!!! --Just kiddin'

Oh, and I'm a lightweight.:flipoff2:

Originally posted by 84 SheepDog
How long was yours in your garage? An axle swap isn't even close to what he is doing either. Besides, he's already run your basic setup and didn't like it. Oh and I finally ordered the axle this am. Now, I just have to wait another year till I can afford a front.

I built mine in 4 months from scratch. That include chasing axles and motor, etc. This was in a regular garage, not a shop, with basic tools and a 110 welder.

http://www.rattlerock.com/samurai_on_rockwells.htm

Originally posted by 84 SheepDog
How long was yours in your garage? An axle swap isn't even close to what he is doing either.

Mine was in the garage for 3 months and I changed the following: front and rear axles, suspension, skid plate, tranny mount, driveshafts, wheels, tires, body trim. Sorry I didn't change the motor/tranny/t-case but there was no need. What's your point again???

Why don't you tell us about all the work you've done there lightweight??? Don't try to ride his heavy coat tails, tell us about everything you did to your rig??? Tell us about paying someone else to bolt on your TJ rubicon express lift and mount your 35s. Tell us about bolting on your winch and running the battery cables. Huh, I guess that's about it. Oh wait, now you can tell us about ordering a bolt-in rear axle. Since that won't take too long to talk about, why don't you tell us about all your wheeling experience and how you know his theory is correct on being heavy.

I've known you for about 1 year and the only wheeling you've done is riding shotgun in my rig. You shouldn't waste your fingers fighting this losing battle. You're my friend and your parents may have more money than me, but as far as wheeling/building experience goes....... AWWWWWW shut the fuck up already

:flipoff2: :flipoff2:

Have fun with that hoochie tonight, all 6' 3" of her:eek:

Originally posted by bigdude


Mine was in the garage for 3 months and I changed the following: front and rear axles, suspension, skid plate, tranny mount, driveshafts, wheels, tires, body trim. Sorry I didn't change the motor/tranny/t-case but there was no need. What's your point again???

Why don't you tell us about all the work you've done there lightweight??? Don't try to ride his heavy coat tails, tell us about everything you did to your rig??? Tell us about paying someone else to bolt on your TJ rubicon express lift and mount your 35s. Tell us about bolting on your winch and running the battery cables. Huh, I guess that's about it. Oh wait, now you can tell us about ordering a bolt-in rear axle. Since that won't take too long to talk about, why don't you tell us about all your wheeling experience and how you know his theory is correct on being heavy.

I've known you for about 1 year and the only wheeling you've done is riding shotgun in my rig. You shouldn't waste your fingers fighting this losing battle. You're my friend and your parents may have more money than me, but as far as wheeling/building experience goes....... AWWWWWW shut the fuck up already

:flipoff2: :flipoff2:

Have fun with that hoochie tonight, all 6' 3" of her:eek:

Actually jeeper111 was the one that put the majority of my lift on for me. Partly because I took this job and had about 1 week to get it ready to ship it down here. And my "bolt on" lift kit was a hell of a lot more involved than changing out leaf springs. I never said anything about having more money or whatever, just defending the fact that I am saving up for the parts rather than racking up credit card debt. I'll be the first to admit that I'm mechanically challenged. I'm just making a point that his buildup is a hell of a lot more complicated than yours was, so it's wrong to get on him about taking so long to do it.

Oh and she is one big mutha...I'm hoping for some confederate flag thong action tonight.

Originally posted by bigdude


Mine was in the garage for 3 months and I changed the following: front and rear axles, suspension, skid plate, tranny mount, driveshafts, wheels, tires, body trim. Sorry I didn't change the motor/tranny/t-case but there was no need. What's your point again???

Why don't you tell us about all the work you've done there lightweight??? Don't try to ride his heavy coat tails, tell us about everything you did to your rig??? Tell us about paying someone else to bolt on your TJ rubicon express lift and mount your 35s. Tell us about bolting on your winch and running the battery cables. Huh, I guess that's about it. Oh wait, now you can tell us about ordering a bolt-in rear axle. Since that won't take too long to talk about, why don't you tell us about all your wheeling experience and how you know his theory is correct on being heavy.

I've known you for about 1 year and the only wheeling you've done is riding shotgun in my rig. You shouldn't waste your fingers fighting this losing battle. You're my friend and your parents may have more money than me, but as far as wheeling/building experience goes....... AWWWWWW shut the fuck up already

:flipoff2: :flipoff2:

Have fun with that hoochie tonight, all 6' 3" of her:eek:

Actually jeeper111 was the one that put the majority of my lift on for me. Partly because I took this job and had about 1 week to get it ready to ship it down here. And my "bolt on" lift kit was a hell of a lot more involved than changing out leaf springs. I never said anything about having more money or whatever, just defending the fact that I am saving up for the parts rather than racking up credit card debt. I'll be the first to admit that I'm mechanically challenged. I'm just making a point that his buildup is a hell of a lot more complicated than yours was, so it's wrong to get on him about taking so long to do it.

Oh and she is one big mutha...I'm hoping for some confederate flag thong action tonight.:flipoff2:

Originally posted by 84 SheepDog


I'm just making a point that his buildup is a hell of a lot more complicated than yours was, so it's wrong to get on him about taking so long to do it.

saving up for the parts rather than racking up credit card debt

Funny, I just re-read my posts and nowhere did I say a word about how long his build up is taking. Looks like you really need to practice with your smacks :laughing:

My point about his wheeling was that he can't sit and preach without having results to back it up. that applies to every aspect of life.

Right now he gets on this board and pops off about how people who believe in light weight are full of shit and don't know what they are talking about. He rambles about contact patch and acts like he's got it all figured out. The problem myself and many others have with this is that he has absolutely nothing to back it up! His shits on jack stands, he doesn't compete, he doesn't offer trip reports about conquering the un-conquerable trail with ease, he doesn't have others saying how well his stuff works, he doesn't have SHIT! But he'll sit here and talk like he knows everything about everything :rolleyes:

Something else you might not realize is that building credit is not a bad thing :eek: If you can make payments and manage your debt, what's wrong there :confused: That said I'll promptly be paying my credit card off should I bring home any cash from the supercrawl, where if I'm not mistaken, J111 won't be competing and showing us how correct he is :laughing:

SheepDog, who are you?? I am Wes with the yellow cruiser from Waco. I graduated from from Baylor, and moved to Phoenix about 2 months ago.


OK, here's the deal - Lee is one of my best friends, but he is an asshole. He knows it, everyone he knows knows it, he is a complete dickhead most of the time. He is an asshole on the board, and an asshole in person. Whn I first met him, i thought - jeez what an asshole! But, after hangign out with him, i can tell you he is one of the most intelligent people i have ever met. Unfortunately he is also one of the most indecisive people I have ever met, too. SO, this year he is on a heavyweight kick. He's not building his rig for competition, BTW. He's building to take back to Alaska, and find some rockcrawling there. It will be able to go anywhere, and run competition lines easily, but that's not what it is being built for. If he wanted to build a lightweight buggy for comps, well, it would be cool. We have sat around many nights planning the "ultimate" rockcrawler, who hasn't??

My point about his wheeling was that he can't sit and preach without having results to back it up. that applies to every aspect of life.

Bigdude, don't rag on him for not having the time to finish what he started right now. I disagree with your quote, because you don't have to try something to know it's not going to work. EG: Using CV halfshafts from a 1ton chevy truck in a rock buggy. I don't have to try that to know that they will break - ALOT! If people had to do everything before they were allowed to state their opinion about it, where would this country be?? Well, for one thing we would all still be living in another branch of the British Empire.

I sput my mouth off all the times about things I haven't done yet, but know i can do. Like going to a competition. I know I am a good enough driver to compete, and that's all that matters. Of course no one else will belive that until I do it, but everyone else doesn't have to be down on me for saying I can do it before I have tried it. Some things in life, you just know without having to experience them.

now, on a personal note...

Rockwells are heavy

:rainbow:

everyone just STFU! we werent talking about if weight was gay, or if someones mommy and daddy paid for their shit, or if someone cant talk because they have no experience.

LETS GET BACK TO THE DISCUSSION ABOUT A HYBRID AXLE!!!!!!!!!!!

:rolleyes:

LETS GET BACK TO THE DISCUSSION ABOUT A HYBRID AXLE!!!!!!!!!!!

okay, let's.

I think the time and $$ spent to do the hybrid isn't worth the result. All you get is maybe a 100 lb. lighter axle, and choice of gears. But, you lose the shaft strength, and hi pinion of the rockwell. Unless you broach the detroit in you 14bolt for 1 5/8" 16spline(not sure if that is even possible for a 14b detroit.) If you don't braoch, you are forced to re-spline the rockwell shaft down to 1.5" 30spline, and that will break just the same as a regular D60 shaft, so why bother to do it????!!!

If you want a 60, get a 60, if you want a rockwell get a rockwell, end of fawking story! A hybrid 14-rockwell is not worth the effort IMO. 6.72 gears are livable on the road if you have an OD.

that's what i think. And no, i have never built a 14b rockwell hybrid before, but you know what? I still know it would be a waste of time.

Originally posted by elf_cruiser

1) It will be able to go anywhere, and run competition lines easily


2) you don't have to try something to know it's not going to work. If people had to do everything before they were allowed to state their opinion about it, where would this country be??

3) I know I am a good enough driver to compete, and that's all that matters. Of course no one else will belive that until I do it, but everyone else doesn't have to be down on me for saying I can do it before I have tried it. Some things in life, you just know without having to experience them.



1) I call bullshit until it's proven. You can talk into one hand and shit in the other, tell me which fills up first.

2) But you have to prove something will work, with results, before anyone will take your word for it (which is what he's doing preaching- trying to convince and prove a point). That is true in life, that's what bugs me. He spouts off like its fact, never defends himself when questioned, and has no shit to back himself up. Why formulate an opinion based on thin air? That makes NO SENSE, so myself and others call his BS until he backs it up.

3) How do you know you're a good enough driver without having a front locker in your rig? I question how much you could test yourself to make that decision when you don't even have the full experience of four wheel drive. Everyone doesn't have to be down on you :shaking:, quit crying. Expect people to call you on bull shit if you can't back it up or show proof. That's not phrased eloquently but if it was you can apply it everywhere. Walk into a job interview and say "I know I can save/make you a million dollars a year. I don't know how, I don't know what I'll do, but I know I can." See how far that will get you when you compare to a guy with experience in said example situation.

I guess I'm not like you. I can't SERIOUSLY sit and say something will or won't happen unless I have experience with it. I also won't sit here and let someone preach to me about something that they have no experience with. I'll call BS so that someone who is uneducated or uninformed won't make a bad decision based on bad infomation. In summary...

1) I don't see why anyone would believe that a heavy Rockwelled Jeep on 42s would be so kick ass when compared to other vehicles. You do, that's fine. Preach to me about it and I'll call BS all day (which is about how long it's taking me to type this).

2) Light weight has been proven to work well by winning competitions and kicking much ass on the trail. Dispute it if you want, but show some evidence to prove it wrong. If not then shut the fuck up because "he said this" doesn't hold any water.

3) Talking amongst friends is great. Posting shit on the internet about how you know this and know that without anything to prove it (whether it be competition driving, building the ultimate rig, etc), expect your critism and don't cry.


I'll talk shit about competitions because I've done 5 major comps this season on the east coast (where there aren't many) and I'm about to do my sixth. I'll talk shit about being a good spotter because I am. How can I say that??? Because in have 3 out of 5 events I have top 5 finishes with 2 of those being wins. I'll talk shit about how a 4-banger isn't that bad because I have one and many from this board have seen me wheel it and do pretty good. I'll talk shit about light weight being great because I've seen it displayed in front of me on numerous occasions and without fail it worked well. I guess I'm not the type of person to take a serious stand on something without have proof to back it up, therefore it's my mission to call BULLSHIT on those that do (until they prove it). You and J111 being those types of people, you often find yourself getting called out, sorry about your luck :flipoff2:


Hey 9V- STFU because thread jackings happen :D

http://www.wagonermachine.com/wheelin_pics.htm

Here's some proof that heavy rigs work, if you build em right. Call WMS, and talk to Casey about his Jeep with Rockwells, and the crazy vertical stuff he can climb with heavy ass rockwells...


bigdude, you make good points, and yes arguing on the net is gay. I was just standing up for a friend, as you would in my place. oh, and just because I don't have a front locker - doesn't mean that i have never driven a rig with a front locker - :flipoff2:

Originally posted by ROCKTOY74
what the fawk is the point in that? 14 bolt=DITCH WITCH, mog portal outers= good clearance, why the fawk would you screw up good STOCK clearance with mog portals by welding in a fawkin' DITCH WITCH between em'? :confused:

Ummm, to increase the clearance of the 14 bolt? :rolleyes:

Your glass is half empty I guess:flipoff2:

I find this very interesting, but don't know much about rockwells.

Does anyone have a close up of the outers on a rockwell? Is the inner yoke welded to the square tube? What's the rough dimensions of the tube, they look like they are about 4" square, but it's kinda hard to tell in picture. It would seem to me that you could cut the ends off of a rockwell, add a flange type coupling, like daniel, and jack do for the unimogs, then respline the axle shaft to match 35 or 40 spline carrier (14 bolt/D60 or D70), then bolt it all together. What's the spline count on a rockwell? Are the shafts thick enough to support 40 spline ends.

It sounds expensive, but considering what D60 fronts run, it might not be all that bad. Plus you'd end up with much stronger u-joints, and yokes without the disadvantage of the supper low gearing, and high drive shaft clearance problems. Maybe a good options for those in the 38"-42" tire range that keep breaking 60's

chad

WMS jeep dont climb waterfalls becouse it has rockwells
it can do it becouse it has 15feet of wheel base

that is why there other jeep that has a 14bolt front end can do the same thing

right FLMANYJ, I did not say that you NEED rockwells, i was just saying that heavy rigs can work. How much lighter do you think a 14b-60 hybrid front is than a rockwell. My guess is 80 lbs lighter. Do you think that really matters??

This conversation is kinda like asking how to put Jeep 1/2ton wheel hubs on rockwells :flipoff2:

CJ

okay, heres how i see it. i would NOT do a 14B/Rockwell hybrid. i would do a D70/Rockwell hybrid, because of its ability to be broached out to 1.71" 40 spline at least, maybe more. it can be shaved as well as a D60, to get as much clearance (or more) than a stock D44. not to mention the lower gearsets available for it.

the other main advantage that i see over running a standard rockwell is the amount of lift you need to clear the oil pan. with a D70 pig under there, most guys could run the same or only SLIGHTLY more lift than what they currently have. this keeps them low and allows them to run a lower center of gravity (WITHOUT more unsprung weight).

the rockwell axle is great overall, but it does have some shortcomings, such as physical size of the pumpkin. a hybrid axle would solve this issue.

D60 front were, up until about 2.5 (pun not intended) years ago, considered the ultimate beef, and to many they still are. however, i can count on one hand the number of actual differential failures i have heard of. sure, plenty of broken shafts and ujoints, but not many gears or carriers.

has anyone recently priced out a pair of aftermarket knuckles for a D60? they arent cheap. i think WelderBoys are about $2000 for a pair? for far less than that amount you could have a D70 center section, with the beefy rockwell outers. this would solve the problems associated with each axle choice, IMO.

elf, i know you will fight this to the death because you are a rockwell fanatic, but you have to understand that what suits your application is NOT neccessarily what suits everybody elses. just like the hybrid axle would not suit yours.

anyways, thats how i see it :D

amen brother

Originally posted by elf_cruiser
right FLMANYJ, I did not say that you NEED rockwells, i was just saying that heavy rigs can work.

The issue you're addressing in that WMS example has everything to do with wheelbase and nothing to do with weight. If you can crest you're front tires before climbing your rears, due to wheelbase, the required force to climb the rears becomes much less. Jesus do you not wheel either :shaking:??? That's common knowledge.

Stick that long wheelbase, heavy rig on some obstacle proportional to what a short light weight has to climb and see if it works the same.

the jeep with the 14 bolt is 800# lighter

look at the info on the two on the web sight

I feel like I'm trying to listen to a conversation in a bar with two guys in the back ground going "it tastes great - no it's less filling"

9V you said it much better than me, but that was basically the point I was trying to make. Take a standard 1 ton rear available anyway $100-$200 add outers from a rockwell, presto all the good stuff of a 60 with the great stuff from a rockwell, without any of the bad (okay the high pinion and low low gears are good for some people but not everyone). I think I've seen steering rockwells go for around 1000-1200, does anyone know of a source for just the outers without buying the whole thing. Maybe you could be ones that have shot center sections cheap. But with a standard 60 going for $1000 easy (yeah I know you found one in a junk yard ready to bolt in for $50, but the rest of us can't) it wouldn't cost that much more, and would seem to provide a lot more beef in the parts that people seem to break the most.

Chad

Ummm to increase the clearance of the 14 bolt there is still no way even if you shave the 14 bolt to offer the clearance of the STOCK mog axle. if you can't live with the gear reduction of the mogs, maybe you don't need mogs. however mercedes does offer the other models to suit your :rainbow: needs such as the ML320 or the GELANDEWAGEN oy yeah btw my :beer: is full , i think your drinkin' the wrong stuff:rasta: :flipoff2:

Alright I see I should check this shit more often.

First off
Pyro, I am just giving people a hard time. Its what I do. I would get better at spelling before I started calling people idiots! Just a suggestion. If you are so great at all pertaining why dont you put up or shut up. I will be on the big Island from the 21st of dec to the 2nd of jan. Why dont you show me what you know and take me where you go and well see just what you know and how hard core you are. nuff said.

second
Big Dude, you can talk about comps all day long but that is not real rockcrawling! There I said it. Sorry if it offends anyone. Real rockcrawling is the art of picking lines, not being forced to take one. This becomes more of just pitting the machine against the rocks then actual rockcrawling. I very rarely see anyone have a choice of lines. Therefore the truck has to be built differently. If I were building a comp truck, I would definitely have portals.

As far as the weight thing goes, I am not all for weight. It all depends on where this weight is located. I was just simply stating in asshole fashion that the weight down low is good weight. I dont have to have driven a truck like the one I am building to know that it can work well because it is physics. You know those laws of the universe that cant be broken and all that bullshit. HAHAHA :flipoff2: Your good for a laugh though man.
As far as wheeling goes I have done my fair share and as elf_cruiser who is also an asshole in his old age will attest to, I have done it in many different configurations of vehicle because of the indecisiveness that he mentioned. All this has led to knowing exactly what I want and what works and that is what I am building. Sure I spent too much money along the way but not without coming into very useful knowledge about what to do and what not to do when building a rig. Not for comps but for real rock crawling. I dont have any problem with competitions but I just dont link the two.

You should all grow a thicker layer of skin. HAHAHA

As far as hurrying up with the project, I would love to but as long as my ART HISTORY professor is weighing my ass down with tests and papers, it is hard to get out there to work on it. Now that is weight I dont need. It is my future so I have to attend to it. That way I can get out and make some real money and maybe recover some of the funds that have been dumped down what wes called indecisiveness but what I call research because it makes me feel better to do so.

and finally

Casey and Wes. You guys are assholes too (well maybe not Casey) but you guys rock! Bear 4x4 rules and we have something coming for the rest of you assholes but you will have to wait!!! :flipoff2:

Originally posted by jeeper111


You should all grow a thicker layer of skin. HAHAHA


:laughing:

I never give this shit a second thought unless I'm on here reading it. The only reason I get into it then is because I'm bored (you would be too if you had my job :D )

I'll give you the same junk you threw to pyro (who is the hawaii TTC champ by the way). Why don't you show everyone how hard core you are :shaking: 'Nuff said :laughing:

*edited so the grammar police don't get me

Originally posted by jeeper111
I dont have to have driven a truck like the one I am building to know that it can work well because it is physics.

Ummm, I dont' know much ummm about physics, maybe you could enlighten me on what properties you are relying on to determine a lot of unsprung weight is a good thing. OR that weight is a good thing:rolleyes: :flipoff2:

Originally posted by jeeper111
Alright I see I should check this shit more often.

First off
Pyro, I am just giving people a hard time. Its what I do. I would get better at spelling before I started calling people idiots! Just a suggestion. If you are so great at all pertaining why dont you put up or shut up. I will be on the big Island from the 21st of dec to the 2nd of jan. Why dont you show me what you know and take me where you go and well see just what you know and how hard core you are. nuff said.



*Pyro, I am just giving people a hard time. Its what I do.*

Yes, being an Asshole is what you do, your friend has already said that.

*I would get better at spelling before I started calling people idiots! Just a suggestion.*

I wasn't calling anyone an idiot, maybe you should get better at reading, here you go again, now funken focus and read

-snip-WTF? Everbody's rig needs to be just like your's or it's gay? BTW, alot of body care about weight, you believe that you what too and that's fine but don't make like everyone else is a bunch of idiots. There is good info here on something different, your just saying the same thing you always say, we got your view point on this many times before. Unless you have somethink new to add,,,,,,,,,,,,-snip-


*If you are so great at all pertaining why dont you put up or shut up. I will be on the big Island from the 21st of dec to the 2nd of jan. Why dont you show me what you know and take me where you go and well see just what you know and how hard core you are. nuff said.*

I don't go around saying I'm great at all, I think It's what you do, not what you say.
But for the record, over here, I'm the guy to bet, I've entered all 6 events held here in the last 18 months, 4 frist places, 1 second and DNF, I have won the Hawaii TTC two years in a row and have a huge following here in the Islands. This is what I've done , not just talked about doing.

As far as taking you to my trails? BAHAHAHAHA,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,frist you insult me, then you ask me to "Prove myself" to YOU by taking you for a ride?
I don't have to prove anything to anyone, Especially YOU, I don't hang out with local assholes, why the fuck would I want to hang out with a tourist asshole? Your fucken nobody in my eyes:flipoff: :flipoff: :flipoff: nuff said

BTW: When you come to Hawaii, You'd be best off leaving that asshole attitude home, The Hawaiians , Tongans and Samoans have less patiences then I do for that shit.

Originally posted by PYRO
But for the record, over here, I'm the guy to bet, I've entered all 6 events held here in the last 18 months, 4 frist places, 1 second and DNF, I have won the Hawaii TTC two years in a row and have a huge following here in the Islands. This is what I've done , not just talked about doing.

As far as taking you to my trails? BAHAHAHAHA,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,frist you insult me, then you ask me to "Prove myself" to YOU by taking you for a ride?
I don't have to prove anything to anyone, Especially YOU, I don't hang out with local assholes, why the fuck would I want to hang out with a tourist asshole? Your fucken nobody in my eyes:flipoff: :flipoff: :flipoff: nuff said

Smack

Smack

Smack

http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums/images/smilies/owned.gif

Originally posted by bigdude


Smack

Smack

Smack

http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums/images/smilies/owned.gif

BWAAAAAAHAAAAAAAHAAAAAAFUCKINHAAAAAAA!!

I guess you bit off more than you can chew this time, huh Sphincter111. :flipoff2: :flipoff2: :flipoff2:


(Jeeper111 thinking) OK, cancel Christmas vacation in Hawaii (Jeeper111 thinking)

Lee, you're gonna need a backhoe to dig yourself out from under this one, dude...

I said my piece...

bigdude

are you going to ocala this month for the
florida 4 wheel drive camp out there will be about 300 people

i cant remember the date

You guys need to take it easy. Im just fucking around. Peace!!!

Sorry guys I've read most of the posts, but the real topic for this discussion doesn't even merit the mog/2.5/60/14b fight. building any kind of a CUSTOM 14B is ridiculous, if you want more clearance under one shave it and run bigger tires, quit wasting money on stupid shit. The great thing about a 14B is that they are FAWKING CHEAP! you can swap disk's on them easy and pretty much :nuke: proof. The good thing about Mog axles are the select-able locker and greater clearance do to the portal hubs = NO DON"T NEED A FREAKIN' 14B CHUNK, plus they are :nuke: proof. And the last one the 2.5, great driveshaft clearance, cheap, and can get awesome clearance at diff and :nuke: :nuke: proof. If you want light get a moly tubed custom 60, if you want heavy, cheap, & durable get one of the above. The whole DITCH WITCH post sums most of this up, the real debate is over weight and that's a personnel preferrance it seems.;) I think all of us should be wrenching and wheelin more but hey then we couldn't be :rainbow: ass web wheelers that talk a bunch of chit to one another:flipoff2: ps- why try and reinvent the wheel?

I aggree, if your going to run a 14 bolt it needs to be shaved and I would turn down the ring gear also. I dont think it would hurt as it isn't the weakpoint. If you want to run rear steer then I would say that isn't the axle. You could try using those 1550 outers from sunray but you will probably run into the same problem as the titan axles. Too small of joints. Has anyone thought of running lighter duty rockwells with the planetary outers??? Like the new monster trucks.

Originally posted by flmanyj
bigdude

are you going to ocala this month for the
florida 4 wheel drive camp out there will be about 300 people

i cant remember the date

I'm going to the SuperCrawl next week and will be gone for 5 days. That takes up my wheeling limit for the month of October (guess who makes that decision :D )