I have a moderately built Rubicon that I drive to then wheel at Big bear, the Wells, Done the Rubicon a couple of times.

I'm on the cusp of buying a buggy that is certainly NOT street legal. It has a totally different engine (LS1) and drivetrain but is based on a 1983 Jeep so should be able to get a green sticker. If I'm wrong, let me know that too.

Where can I take this to wheel?
I've heard a brief rumor that there might be a tire size limit coming at the Rubicon is this true or not?

Is it still possible to use it at Big Bear? The Rubicon, Ocotillo Wells?

I only been to these three places in CA but looking online I see other SVRA areas...
* Carnegie SVRA
* Clay Pit SVRA
* Heber Dunes SVRA
* Hollister Hills SVRA
* Hungry Valley SVRA
* Oceano Dunes SVRA
* Ocotillo Wells SVRA
* Prairie City SVRA

Are there more than these that I should be thinking about?

What about some of the other places further out that I've never been like moab, etc?
Any places in Arizona, Nevada where I wouldn't run into problems?

I'm wondering if selling my Rubicon to buy a tow rig and a trailer will be severely limit the places I can go wheeling using the buggy, compared to just keeping the Rubicon and going places in a street legal Jeep.

Any and all input is welcome. I have to make a decision by tomorrow or the next day.

Thanks,
Thor

Seems to me Big Bear requires licensed vehicles and does not allow green stickers. If you're going buggy, you would be pretty bored at Big Bear anyway. Calico and Stoddard Wells would be other options for places to go. The Hammers, Cougar Buttes and Truckhaven would be logical places to take a buggy and the most fun for you in a rig like that anyway. I think the rest of the ones you listed will accept green sticker but don't know for sure. Have fun.

What he said. I believe that all of the SVRA's allow green sticker vehicles. Big Bear is street registered only. If you have a buggy in SoCal then Johnson Valley and the Hammers is where to go.

occotillo wells is green sticker friendly, but doesn't have much to offer for rock buggies. there's a bunch of good mud hills, dirt notches that are fun though. superstition (just south of occotillo wells) has some good trails with good obstacles and waterfalls kind of like the hammers, only smaller.
and of course if you want the ultimate trail experience, there's johnson valley. more wheeling there than you can imagine, including the famous hammer trails.

you beat me to it donald.:p

This thread may be of interest to you:
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=286572

Buy the buggy and come to JV. God's country for buggies! :D

Thanks a lot for the guidance, it turned to be right on target and pointed me in all the right directions.

So, here's some updated info:


Two different people at the California DMV have given me the following information:

If I buy the buggy, all I have to do is bring it into the DMV and when it's inspected, tell them that it is for offroad use only. They will register it as such and will issue a green sticker.

There is a second option:
Getting a nonresident OHV use permit. THIS you don't need to do ANYTHING to get. You just show up to a vendor on the list and pay your $30.00 good for a year, I just have to show my drivers license from out of state that I happen to have. The nonresident OHV permit seems to give you all the same privileges as a green sticker and you don't have to do anything to get it. Check this out!:
http://ohv.parks.ca.gov/?page_id=25669

Third option: This thing is actually registered, plated and was until just recently INSURED for the street here in Texas! I could get insurance on it again, keep the registration up to date here and when I'm in California, be "just visiting". I'm sure I would get pulled over a lot just because it is so obviously not meant for the road. I talked to the CHP in Sacramento and they said that as long as a portion of the frame is 31" or less from the pavement and I can attach some sort of trucker mud flaps to it while on the road, I can't really get a ticket for anything being out of state and all. True, this would be more expensive than option 1 or 2 but it would have the advantage of allowing use at places like big bear.

I'm almost ready to pull the trigger and buy this thing unless someone here can convince me not to. Apparently this rig was built for something in excess of 100K and I will be able to get it for a lot less. Worse came to worse, I could probably sell off chunks of it and make my money back. So... Thoughts, anybody, everybody?

i get option 2... but i am also military.. i have an old plate on mine and it's expired from NC, but at least it's on there.. then i just get the purple out of state sticker for 30 bucks..

all I have to do is bring it into the DMV and when it's inspected, tell them that it is for offroad use only. They will register it as such and will issue a green sticker.

Thats going to be your biggest issue. Getting it inspected at DMV. Transfering vehicles into CA that were not previously registered here is a PITA. When I bought my YJ it had a NM title. They wanted to see the VIN on the dash, firewall, and somewhere on the frame (which I could never find).

Thier biggest issue was that the vehicle seemed to have been "constructed". :shaking: Finally I convinced them that it was off-road only, not stolen, and not assembled from parts of lesser vehciles. Ok, maybe that last part IS true. :laughing:

Oh, and how about posting some pics of this 100k rig!

Seems to me Big Bear requires licensed vehicles and does not allow green stickers.

There are lots of Green Sticker trails in the San Bernardino Mtns. Most are single track or 40" (50"). John Bull used to be Green Sticker but will not be soon.

There are lots of Green Sticker trails in the San Bernardino Mtns. Most are single track or 40" (50"). John Bull used to be Green Sticker but will not be soon.

Okay, if you want to get technical here's the skinny - John Bull is already off limits for green stickers per the rangers so that's out for the buggy guys. Holcomb Creek, Gold Mountain and other trails in the area are still green/red sticker but you have to tow your vehicle to the staging area at Pinnacle or Cactus Flats. You cannot drive a green sticker on any of the forest roads leading to any trail or you will get a ticket - period. So you have to tow and unload at the staging area to jump off on any trail. That is the official low down from the Rangers. Happy wheeling. :)

For the OP - I still would not bother taking a buggy on any of those trails as I would be bored silly.

Now that it's mine as of 30min ago I can post a picture of it.
This changes the WHOLE game for me. I better up my game quick!





























http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii290/thordehr/photo-11.jpg

Wow, that's quite a jeep! Looks like fun.

Don't bother taking that to Big Bear, you'd be bored to death.

That buggy has "JOHNSON VALLEY" written all over it :)

Jeff

Wow...looks like she's a big ol' girl. Specs??

One cell phone pic with no specs does not equal an appraisal, and that front axle does look like it has some kind of bling on it, but that doesn't really look like a 100k buggy to me. Just sayin.

Don't bother taking that to Big Bear, you'd be bored to death.

That buggy has "JOHNSON VALLEY" written all over it :)

Jeff


I would wheel that in Big Bear......in two wheel drive.....with the rear locker off.

Here's a little more information about it from when it first came out.

http://www.jpmagazine.com/featuredvehicles/63298_1983_jeep_cj_8/index.html

A number of things have been modified since then:

It now has a psc ram installed on the rear of the front axle above the driveshaft. A hydroboost is thrown into the mix as well.

The u-joint/axle shaft problem it had was fixed by removing the bronze bushings that were supporting the outboard portions of the axles and doing some sealing. They seemed to not allow any whip, or allow lateral displacement when the axles were steering. This ate a couple of the bushings and a lot of components. I'm trying to recall the axle shaft manufacturer but they have the CTMs in there. Some seal mounting plates were manufactured and welded into the axle ends to mount proper axle seals.

The upper links have been relocated from a sort of spider cage frame mount to a 2x4 crossmember. This crossmember made it possible to install a carrier bearing in the front driveshaft and really improve the angles. No more driveshaft issues like it had before.

The 1/2 inch chrome molly plate center sections have been shaved for a lot more clearance than they had previously. Only ring gear section comes below the tubes now.

It has a combination of tires on it now. (seems popular in Texas) Rock tires in the front, mud in the back.

A 300W amplifier has been added to the CB. Apparently they wanted to be heard.


The day before yesterday when I took that picture, I had been wheeling it all day wringing it out and seeing how it worked. A very capable rig. Far more capable than I am right now. Really easy for me to scare myself in. Perfect.


I already have a short list of immediate improvements in mind for when it arrives on the hauler.

The first thing is that I'm going to have to get into the computer with some edit software and lower the idle rpm. It's sitting even with the converter at 900 rpm. With that, you have to hold it back with the brakes or it will start climbing all by itself. Also, since it's loading the transmission at idle in drive, you can hear it skipping the parking pawl when you shift it to park unless you shift to idle or shut it down for a few seconds beforehand.

I'm going to swap in the seats I have in my current Rubicon. The Corbeau seats are worn and nowhere as comfortable as the mastercraft suspension seats, specially when bouncing around.

The rear steer works well enough but it's on the short list to address too. The control valve is still between the seats and comes to hand easily but there's a couple of problems. It gets hot even when not being used so there's some pressure restriction there that could be used better elsewhere. Also, when you're climbing and using your left hand to hang onto the dash bar to see overboard, you only have one hand left to steer and/or rearsteer. I've looked at a electrohydraulic pump to run the rear system. It is a bi-directional power pump with internal linelocks. Would kind of make it a set it and forget it setup. The plan is to install a thumb rocker on the dash bar so it can be controlled while looking over the side and steering the front.

There's some wiring cleanup to do too. I'm not sure if that's going to be a cleanup or a full replacement, we'll see when I start digging into it.

The dash installed powerwelder has a throttle vernier that isn't hooked up right now so I have to get that sorted.

Later on the list is to relocate the battery boxes again to make room for a third seat.

Further down the line is to stretch the rear even more.

There was talk of the rig costing $150,000 to make at the time. Talking to some of the people involved at the time, it seems the axles alone cost somewhere between 20-30k to make. The axle shafts apparently cost in the neighborhood 3-4K(that might be included). A lot of money went into the polished engine (god knows why a polished engine, but there it is). The transmission was ungodly expensive. The Atlas was a pretty custom job too. The fabrication throughout shows a lot of quality. This is a huge step up for me and I am going to be careful that the improvements I make are up to snuff with the rest of it.

Anyone have a trailer for sale that can comfortably haul a 6200lb rig?

Wow she's a fawkin monster!!! I'd love to check that thing out in person....why not come on out to JV for NYE.

It'll be here day after tomorrow and yea I'd do that but I don't have a tow. Have to sell the Rubicon and get a tow rig. I've been looking at pre 2007 Dodges with the Cummins. Also have to get a trailer. One crazy thing I've been thinking about doing instead is getting a used Freightliner (or something along those lines) One with a sleeper cab would give me some room. I could make a deck where the 5'th wheel plate would be with a climbing step past the rear wheels. Climb the buggy up there, latch it in and just drive off. You can get a used big rig for about 15K or less, where a used diesel truck is about 20K or more and you have to get a trailer too... Just thinking..... If you have the semi as an RV, you don't even need a special license for it...

I remember the original Poison Spider Customs had those axles on their site as one-offs, not for sale. Are these the original ones or did they make more than one set?

These are the ones. Collaboration with PSC. These are the Avalanche Titan Axles. 1/2 chrome moly tubes, plate and machined parts. Turned out they were too expensive to market. These days though, who knows, people are spending a lot of money, although not quite that much.

Good deal, sounds like you scored big time. Refresh my memory, the axles were D60 based correct...and they have fabricated knuckles?

Post up some more pics if you could please...axles and more of the rig.

Good deal, sounds like you scored big time. Refresh my memory, the axles were D60 based correct...and they have fabricated knuckles?

Post up some more pics if you could please...axles and more of the rig.

Follow the link in post#19.

The axles are rockwell based with f450 outers and 40 spline 300m shafts!

Ahh thanks, serious unobtanium there:eek:

$30k for an axle! :eek:

"4-inch-diameter 0.500-wall chrome-moly axletubes" - "300M 40-spline shafts" - Very cool but wow that seems like overkill (and I LOVE overkill). What was really gained though? With only an LS1 on 44's a stock rockwell should've been plenty strong for a fraction of the money. And on top of all that they still used the stock Rockwell 3rd.

Regardless it looks like fun. Anything less than backdoor covered in snow at night and you won't be doing that rig justice.

I'm not sure, maybe it was, or it might have been 30K for both axles, but I know they were expensive. As far as I can tell it was an engineering exercise and a way to have a balljoint knuckle on the ends. In a way it looks a bit more like a conventional axle when you see the round tubes. I have a lot of learning to do about Rockwell axles. I don't have any experience working on them at all.
I have a feeling that a lot of things that wouldn't be a challenge for the rig will be a challenge me as I learn how to drive it and figure out what it's capable of.

Front axle:
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii290/thordehr/photo-12.jpg
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii290/thordehr/photo-14.jpg
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii290/thordehr/photo-15.jpg
And the Rear:
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii290/thordehr/photo-16.jpg
One overall shot:
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii290/thordehr/photo-16.jpg
I'll get some additional pictures tomorrow, now have to work on the tow rig....

Awesome, when and where is the maiden voyage?

Well, currently selling my Rubicon, that should give me the money to buy a tow rig. Then I can get out there and use it! My plan was to buy a Semi Tractor and put a deck over the rear. You can get a used Volvo 770 for cheap! Turns out California is the worst state to do this though, impossible to register it as an RV like you can in other states. I could get a nice Dodge diesel and a trailer instead but my whole idea was to avoid getting a truck AND a trailer. Now I'm considering a used hydraulic roll back flat bed tow truck.
We'll see what happens!