Lets hear it, the good, the bad, the ugly. Best mod, worst mod, fugliest mod.

Best: New front bumper, and rock sliders.

Worst: spending money on the project Scout, instead of parting it out.

Ugliest: Reused bumper.
<IMG width=418 height=292 SRC="http://www.pirate4x4.com/ubb/uploads/JD-Bump.jpg">

Joe

Originally posted by jdjanda:
<STRONG>Lets hear it, the good, the bad, the ugly. Best mod, worst mod, fugliest mod.

Best: New front bumper, and rock sliders.

Worst: spending money on the project Scout, instead of parting it out.

Ugliest: Reused bumper.
<IMG width=418 height=292 SRC="http://www.pirate4x4.com/ubb/uploads/JD-Bump.jpg">

Joe</STRONG>

I kinda like them Jerry Can brackets you made too. No comment about the rear bumper. <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

My favorite mod is the line lock I added. I did however, find the scout across the street after a very cold night last year.

Next on my list is a home-made on-board welder. I will love that every time it saves my ass.

Best mod for me was probably the Holley Projection. Really improved over my less than perfect Thermoquad. I havent really got a worst mod on this Scout, except maybe the Smittybilt tube bumper on the front.

Best Mod - SOA w/massive body trimming
Worst Mod - I keep replacing those damn step bumpers on the rear, when I should just build an indestructable one to match the front

Worst mod:
1)Spending all the time putting in the Chevy motor and then adapting it to a Dana 20 (who knew that lower gears would be available for everything else..I mean lower than 3.15)

2) Edelbrock carb

Best Mod:

1) Chevy Motor swap (if I could only keep it cool <IMG SRC="smilies/frown.gif" border="0"> )

2) I don't know yet, but I am assuming that the Atlas that I am buying will be top on this list.

3) I am also assuming that the Q-Jet that I am trading for my edelbrock will be on here as well.

4) Dana 60 rear <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

5) ditching the POS stock springs for longer wider springs.

Originally posted by Aubrey:
<STRONG>Best Mod - SOA w/massive body trimming
Worst Mod - I keep replacing those damn step bumpers on the rear, when I should just build an indestructable one to match the front</STRONG>


Hey, everyone....a NEWBIE


<IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> Welcome newbie <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

[ 10-23-2001: Message edited by: Scout Dude ]

Well since I just got started on my scout it's kinda a lame list

Best Mod:

1. Adding a 4bbl intake

2. Putting a "clean" fender on

3. And looking to the future here: Putting a nice coat of paint on it. then trashing it on the trail

Worst mod:

1. Putting a gas-leaking 4bbl QJ on my new intake

Ok, you caught me. I've been on the BB for years, and have been around IH's since I was born, but somehow I just now heard about this group. I already know a few of you though. So, what does it take to go from Newbie to Rock God (or Goddess in my case)?

Lesse.. on Tigger..

Best mods? Front Locker, ONBOARD AIR!!, V8 (both the stock 304 and the built 345 were upgrades from the 196..), and the wide T19 is kinda up there.

Worst mod? Skyjacker Lift Springs. Also the "mods" that resulted in the tailgate not opening, the doors not closing, and the top not fitting.

On "Little Devil"

Best Mods - Gryphin 304, Gryphin 727 w/ manual valvebody, High-stall converter.

Worst Mods - The Sch40 'cage that was given to me, and putting ME in the driver's seat.

Travelall?

Best - 33x12.50s and ONBOARD AIR. Buying the rig for $200.
Worst mod? Trying to make a tow-rig out of a 1/2T Travelall..

'74 200 - Best? ONBOARD AIR (see a theme here?), new tires, and the 10k-lbs receiver hitch (gooseneck plate soon)
Worst mod? Waiting this long to buy a real tow rig.

Originally posted by Aubrey:
<STRONG>Ok, you caught me. I've been on the BB for years, and have been around IH's since I was born, but somehow I just now heard about this group. I already know a few of you though. So, what does it take to go from Newbie to Rock God (or Goddess in my case)?</STRONG>

You'll need the Gift o' Gab. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Welcome, Aubrey! <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

FWIW, there's already a picture of your Scout floating around here under the "HUMMMM" thread.

Best: Has got to be the lockers. Although, the rear SOA is way up there.

Worst: Trying to make the stock TQ work. I actually paid someone to rebuild that piece of crap! <IMG SRC="smilies/mad.gif" border="0">

Ugliest: Well, the body mods I acquired on 21 Road last weekend are pretty ugly.

Originally posted by Aubrey:
<STRONG>Best Mod - SOA w/massive body trimming
Worst Mod - I keep replacing those damn step bumpers on the rear, when I should just build an indestructable one to match the front</STRONG>

Welcome newbie. Don't I know you???

Worst mod??? not yet
Bast mod? my susp <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">
http://www.snort4x4.com/~crash/run/walker/kev5.jpg

Originally posted by Scoutillac:
<STRONG>Worst mod??? not yet
Bast mod? my susp <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">
http://www.snort4x4.com/~crash/run/walker/kev5.jpg </STRONG>

<IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0"> OMG! You just made my fawkin day! <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0"> That is some beautiful shite!

Originally posted by Scoutillac:
<STRONG>Worst mod??? not yet
Bast mod? my susp <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">
</STRONG>

NICE, Kev!

OTOH, you could also say, "Worst Mod - susp"

http://www.snort4x4.com/~crash/run/walker/kev2.jpg

<IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Or maybe that's the axle's fault for bein' too narrow. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!! I just got a bit greedy <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

my beloved scout is now R.I.P. but in fond memory

best mod was:

lincoln locked rear.

worst mod was:

trying to remove body cancer and painting it. i should of just got a tetness shot and called it good. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by camo:
<STRONG>my beloved scout is now R.I.P. but in fond memory

best mod was:

lincoln locked rear.

worst mod was:

trying to remove body cancer and painting it. i should of just got a tetness shot and called it good. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

You finally sold it? That was a nice rig fo sho. I hope you got the $ you were asking for! A year from now you will regret selling it and buy a new one only to spend another ten grand on!

<IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by Aubrey:
<STRONG>Ok, you caught me. I've been on the BB for years, and have been around IH's since I was born, but somehow I just now heard about this group. I already know a few of you though. So, what does it take to go from Newbie to Rock God (or Goddess in my case)?</STRONG>

Welcome newbie <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> to the dark side <IMG SRC="smilies/vader.gif" border="0">

Joe

Best: Dodge quad Cab W/'16 flat trailer
Worst: Dents thats ruin my spray can paint job

http://www.pirate4x4.com/ubb/uploads/tabasco2a.jpg

Originally posted by ScoutDork:
<STRONG>Best: Dodge quad Cab W/'16 flat trailer
Worst: Dents thats ruin my spray can paint job

http://www.pirate4x4.com/ubb/uploads/tabasco2a.jpg </STRONG>

Another Newbie welcome <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Joe

Thanks for the welcome everybody, it sounds like this will be more entertaining than the BB. As far as the gift of gab, I may be into Scouts but I am still a girl - gab is often my middle name!!

Sure enough, there is already a pic of my truck up. Apparently my reputation precedes me.

Hooper - you might know me, I have been at RMIHR for the past 6 years, on the RMIHR committee for the past 2, my dad is big into Scouts as well (Steve Cavender), I made it to the Nationals this year (not with the Scout though - it is parked in CO for the time being).

Question - How come when i post my little picture doesn't come up on the left hand side? <IMG SRC="smilies/frown.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by Aubrey:

Question - How come when i post my little picture doesn't come up on the left hand side? <IMG SRC="smilies/frown.gif" border="0">[/QB]

Because you are a newbie <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> All in good time grasshopper, it shall become clear <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by JoshC:
<STRONG>Next on my list is a home-made on-board welder. I will love that every time it saves my ass.</STRONG>

Why would you make an on-board welder, you can't even weld. <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Joe <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by jdjanda:
<STRONG>Why would you make an on-board welder, you can't even weld. <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Joe <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"></STRONG>


uhm.... <IMG SRC="smilies/rasta.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by tsm1mt:
<STRONG>NICE, Kev!

OTOH, you could also say, "Worst Mod - susp"

http://www.snort4x4.com/~crash/run/walker/kev2.jpg

<IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Or maybe that's the axle's fault for bein' too narrow. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

<IMG SRC="smilies/laughing.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/laughing.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/laughing.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by ScoutDork:
<STRONG>Best: Dodge quad Cab W/'16 flat trailer
Worst: Dents thats ruin my spray can paint job

http://www.pirate4x4.com/ubb/uploads/tabasco2a.jpg </STRONG>


My God...they're everywhere...


<IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> Welcome NEWBIE <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Best: Teralow 4:1 gears
Worst: Using the Eldorado calipers (cable actuated parking brake) with the rear disk brakes - parking brake doesn't hold worth a damn. Need to go to a line lock instead.

Originally posted by Aubrey:
<STRONG>Thanks for the welcome everybody, it sounds like this will be more entertaining than the BB. As far as the gift of gab, I may be into Scouts but I am still a girl - gab is often my middle name!!

Sure enough, there is already a pic of my truck up. Apparently my reputation precedes me.

Hooper - you might know me, I have been at RMIHR for the past 6 years, on the RMIHR committee for the past 2, my dad is big into Scouts as well (Steve Cavender), I made it to the Nationals this year (not with the Scout though - it is parked in CO for the time being).

Question - How come when i post my little picture doesn't come up on the left hand side? <IMG SRC="smilies/frown.gif" border="0"></STRONG>


How are your shocks mounted in the front?

http://student.fortlewis.edu/~aecavender/Pictures/Blanca%202000/Blanca%206-me.jpg

Originally posted by sdscouter:
<STRONG>Best: Teralow 4:1 gears
Worst: Using the Eldorado calipers (cable actuated parking brake) with the rear disk brakes - parking brake doesn't hold worth a damn. Need to go to a line lock instead.</STRONG>

Keep in mind that the line locks can bleed down. My did real bad..until I changed my master cylinder
.
O-yea,
.
.
.
.
.

.
.
. <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> Welcome Newbie.

I may not have posted much, but I've been lurking around here longer than you've been here <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by sdscouter:
<STRONG>I may not have posted much, but I've been lurking around here longer than you've been here <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

So just change you name to Shy Scouter <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by sdscouter:
<STRONG>I may not have posted much, but I've been lurking around here longer than you've been here <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

How do you know? Maybe I was lurking too. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Hooper:
[QB]
How are your shocks mounted in the front?

Just the stock mounts up top for now (shock hoops will get put in one of these days), and we just welded some shock tabs to the axle tube for the bottom. The problem is, they are too short, but that is the only thing that keeps my driveshaft from binding.

Why do you ask?

Hopefully now my little picture will show up - thanks Hooper <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by Aubrey:
<STRONG>[QUOTE]Originally posted by Hooper:
[QB]
How are your shocks mounted in the front?

Just the stock mounts up top for now (shock hoops will get put in one of these days), and we just welded some shock tabs to the axle tube for the bottom. The problem is, they are too short, but that is the only thing that keeps my driveshaft from binding.

Why do you ask?

Hopefully now my little picture will show up - thanks Hooper <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

You are SOA, right? It looked like your shocks were limiting your travel in this picture.
http://student.fortlewis.edu/~aecavender/pictures/blanca%202000/Blanca%206-me.jpg

What are you planning for upper and lower shock mounts?

BTW, I think this picture is a bit better for your sig image.

http://www.ihssii.org/Hooper/Images-OtherRigs/Wheeler.jpg

My driveline does not bind, even under full droop/stuff. With the truck jacked up and jackstands under the frame rails, full, even axle droop, I don't get any binding, although my zerk fitting doesn't fit. I think Tom M had to clearance his front yokes a bit. It doesn't take much though. You want to grind those yokes a little and really take advantage of the flex. It is fun to really flex up the axles!!! <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by Hooper:
<STRONG>You are SOA, right? It looked like your shocks were limiting your travel in this picture.

my zerk fitting doesn't fit. I think Tom M had to clearance his front yokes a bit. It doesn't take much though. You want to grind those yokes a little and really take advantage of the flex. It is fun to really flex up the axles!!! <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"></STRONG>


Flex is overrated! <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

http://tigger.tmcom.com/~tsm1/scout/jpg/trail_rides/elkhorn_4_25_2000/Image4.jpg
http://tigger.tmcom.com/~tsm1/scout/jpg/trail_rides/elkhorn_4_25_2000/Image6.jpg

I clearanced the yokes on the race truck, and still had to pull the zerk fittings to keep it from binding. I think I need to plug the zerks on Tigger, too - every time I go to grease the front driveshaft I find the zerk fitting broken off or missing.. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

[ 10-25-2001: Message edited by: tsm1mt ]

<IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">Good day, NEWBIES <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/usa.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by Shadow man:
<STRONG> <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">Good day, NEWBIES <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/usa.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

Ahhh, you're late! Where the hell have you been? <IMG SRC="smilies/pissed.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by tsm1mt:
<STRONG>
Flex is overrated! <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

http://tigger.tmcom.com/~tsm1/scout/jpg/trail_rides/elkhorn_4_25_2000/Image4.jpg
http://tigger.tmcom.com/~tsm1/scout/jpg/trail_rides/elkhorn_4_25_2000/Image6.jpg

I clearanced the yokes on the race truck, and still had to pull the zerk fittings to keep it from binding. I think I need to plug the zerks on Tigger, too - every time I go to grease the front driveshaft I find the zerk fitting broken off or missing.. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

[ 10-25-2001: Message edited by: tsm1mt ]</STRONG>

Hehehe. Yeah, that's what I said. Till I got flex. Remember, you are the one who pushed me into the soa instead of lift springs up front!!!

I gotta get out wheeling and get some good, flexy, poser pics!!! <g>

<IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by Shadow man:
<STRONG> <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">Good day, NEWBIES <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/usa.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

Must be nice to be able to sleep till noon old man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by Hooper:
<STRONG>Hehehe. Yeah, that's what I said. Till I got flex. Remember, you are the one who pushed me into the soa instead of lift springs up front!!!

I gotta get out wheeling and get some good, flexy, poser pics!!! <g>

<IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

Yeah, I know, and I'm pissed that you beat me to it. <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

The lack of rear flex is b/c of the rear e-brake cable in the pic.. and the front isn't flexing b/c I didn't bother disconnecting the anti-sway bar.. it'll flex the 33s right into the fenders up front. I'm a bit impressed with how well the 4" springs will work when I want them to.. but not impressed enough to keep 'em and not go SOA.

I just want the ground clearance for the snow. :-)

Best mod- buying scout for $250/ new harness for $75

Worst mod- getting it all one color. what a PIMA.

Matt

Long Live <IMG SRC="smilies/usa.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by lilgreenscout:
<STRONG>Best mod- buying scout for $250/ new harness for $75

Worst mod- getting it all one color. what a PIMA.

Matt

Long Live <IMG SRC="smilies/usa.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

Muawahahaaaa <IMG SRC="smilies/devil.gif" border="0">

Welcome <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> Newbie

My scout is mostly the color of granite

Originally posted by lilgreenscout:
<STRONG>Best mod- buying scout for $250/ new harness for $75

Worst mod- getting it all one color. what a PIMA.

Matt

Long Live <IMG SRC="smilies/usa.gif" border="0"></STRONG>


<IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> Newbie <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by lilgreenscout:
<STRONG>Best mod- buying scout for $250/ new harness for $75

Worst mod- getting it all one color. what a PIMA.

Matt

Long Live <IMG SRC="smilies/usa.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

Haven't I taught you the beauty of the flat-black rattle can yet?

Why wash it when you can just repaint it!!

Uh, I think he means the harness was all one color, not the Scout. (maybe that was too!)

Originally posted by tsm1mt:
<STRONG>Haven't I taught you the beauty of the flat-black rattle can yet?

Why wash it when you can just repaint it!!</STRONG>

I'll have to have you do the touch-up on the 800. Seems the PO decided flat black was an acceptable color to paint a commanche! <IMG SRC="smilies/pissed.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by Scout Dude:
<STRONG>Uh, I think he means the harness was all one color, not the Scout. (maybe that was too!)</STRONG>

Dang, you're probably right. I'm gettin' slow in my old age. <IMG SRC="smilies/frown.gif" border="0">

The Good: buying a (mostly) rust free scout
Having my bumper rewelded/modified
Rollbar

never really did much to it

The bad: firestone tires.
D&C bumper
SSII top/doors/inserts

The ugly?

parking next to jeeps <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by NotQuiteSane:
<STRONG>The bad:
SSII top/doors/inserts</STRONG>

Explain why the SSII setup is bad? A lot of owners would give a nut to have the SSII setup. BTW how much do you want for the setup, I'd take the top and inserts.

Joe

Originally posted by jdjanda:
<STRONG>Explain why the SSII setup is bad? A lot of owners would give a nut to have the SSII setup. BTW how much do you want for the setup, I'd take the top and inserts.

Joe</STRONG>

The SSII setup isn't bad, but it's just cosmetics. the money I spent on it could have been spent better elsewhere. It's drafty, but then so are a lot of IH's with metal top/doors.

You can't have inserts, I just made a deal with Mark that includes them. However, I've just e-mailed a guy who was interested, he has till friday to respond, then I'll have the top and skins up for sale again, I want $365 ($15 box) + shipping with a maximun cap of $425 (if more to ship i'll cover)

Dunno weight, but I'm at zip 84107

e-mail me if you're interested

Joe

Best mod GM HEI dist on IH 345, worst mod front buggy springs

Originally posted by NotQuiteSane:
<STRONG>The bad: firestone tires.
D&C bumper
SSII top/doors/inserts</STRONG>

I was looking at the D&C bumpers.... what do you see as bad points to them?

Originally posted by TORC:
<STRONG>I was looking at the D&C bumpers.... what do you see as bad points to them?</STRONG>

Well, for starts, Damian needs some more practice welding, it has very bad penetration. the weight of mine also caused my rear crossmember to crack (solved by designing backing plates) we had to cut out and reweld the post on straight.

he also stole me and my fabricators idea for the hi-lift mount.

I took pics of the damage done before repairs and sent copies to damien, but never heard back from him.

Joe

Originally posted by NotQuiteSane:
<STRONG>Well, for starts, Damian needs some more practice welding, it has very bad penetration. the weight of mine also caused my rear crossmember to crack (solved by designing backing plates) we had to cut out and reweld the post on straight.</STRONG>

OK. I was wondering about that, from the pics it looked like the rear bumper mounts are T's and four bolts per side. I would also use straps, or angle to tie into the factory locations along the frame rails. This will provide support during pulling forces. Lifting forces still need to be address, even with the backing plates, the rear cross-member is weak at best. On my front bumper, I used angle to create C's to mount the bumper with bolts through the top of the front Cross-member, then used four bolts through the front of the cross-member into a 3/16" backing plate. The front bumper is not going anywhere.


Originally posted by NotQuiteSane:
<STRONG>I took pics of the damage done before repairs and sent copies to damien, but never heard back from him.

Joe</STRONG>

Are you going to post them?

Joe

[ 10-29-2001: Message edited by: jdjanda ]

Originally posted by jdjanda:
<STRONG>OK. I was wondering about that, from the pics it looked like the rear bumper mounts are T's and four bolts per side. I would also use straps, or angle to tie into the factory locations along the frame rails. This will provide support during pulling forces. Lifting forces still need to be address, even with the backing plates, the rear cross-member is weak at best. On my front bumper, I used angle to create C's to mount the bumper with bolts through the top of the front Cross-member, then used four bolts through the front of the cross-member into a 3/16" backing plate. The front bumper is not going anywhere.

</STRONG>

Joe's account isn't the first I've heard of the rear x-member failing when a bumper like that is mounted to the "face" of it.

I, too, would run angle along the frame rails to bolt to.. *OR*, the better approach I've seen..

Cut the round center-hole out of the rear crossmember, and just slide some steel tubing inside. Through bolt it side to side/top to bottom and there ya go. Attach the rest of the bumper to your tubing "inserts".. and you'll also end up reinforcing the wimpy rear x-member in the process.

Originally posted by tsm1mt:
<STRONG>Cut the round center-hole out of the rear crossmember, and just slide some steel tubing inside. Through bolt it side to side/top to bottom and there ya go. Attach the rest of the bumper to your tubing "inserts".. and you'll also end up reinforcing the wimpy rear x-member in the process.</STRONG>

That's a dam good idea, my thoughts on this method. I would use 2" square tube, then use the round spacers the factory bumber uses cut down to prevent the frame from crushing. It is important to shim the piece for a snug fit or you run the risk of deforming the material. Tom you got any pics of this method?

Joe

Originally posted by jdjanda:
<STRONG>That's a dam good idea, my thoughts on this method. I would use 2" square tube, then use the round spacers the factory bumber uses cut down to prevent the frame from crushing. It is important to shim the piece for a snug fit or you run the risk of deforming the material. Tom you got any pics of this method?

Joe</STRONG>

I haven't seen it done yet - at least, I don't have any pics.

I bought the steel for my bumpers 3 years ago.. but I still have the smashed stockers, and it's too late to save the tub from carnage. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

I got caught up in lifts, engine building, etc..

Originally posted by tsm1mt:
<STRONG>Yeah, I know, and I'm pissed that you beat me to it. <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

The lack of rear flex is b/c of the rear e-brake cable in the pic.. and the front isn't flexing b/c I didn't bother disconnecting the anti-sway bar.. it'll flex the 33s right into the fenders up front. I'm a bit impressed with how well the 4" springs will work when I want them to.. but not impressed enough to keep 'em and not go SOA.

I just want the ground clearance for the snow. :-)</STRONG>

And it is snow time. You are really going to be hating those snow plows under the bumpers <g>

Yeah, I kicked the idea around a bit, then just dove in head first. Fortunately, you guys bailed me out every time I got in trouble

<IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Best mod- The new sheet metal work Hooper and I put in my right front quarter at NWRCA a few weeks ago. <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">

Worst mod- Hmnn. I'll have to think about that. I've screwd up alot of stuff under there. <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0">

I forgot to include the sheet metal work I've done lately <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

<IMG width=640 height=480 SRC="http://www.pirate4x4.com/ubb/uploads/JD-Stuck.jpg">

When the time comes, I need new sheet metal all the way around. Before I sell this one, I'll buy a parts rig and do the swap. <IMG SRC="smilies/rolleyes.gif" border="0"> You'll never know the difference.

Joe

Originally posted by tsm1mt:
<STRONG>
Flex is overrated!</STRONG>

I think your just jealous that you don't got any!

>> the weight of mine also caused my rear
>> crossmember to crack

The crappy condition of your stock weak crossmember is not my problem. You decided to modify the bumper and carrier after receiving it. You also decided not to reinforce it to the frame (which is common place for people towing). My customers have had their Scouts picked up and dragged (yes dragged) backwards out of canyons by sky-lift cranes - BY MY BUMPERS. So what went wrong with yours - Pilot error?

>> I took pics of the damage done before
>> repairs and sent copies to damien, but
>> never heard back from him.

I never – at any time - received ANY pictures - just a bunch of claims. I asked for pictures numerous times as well as the bumper back ~ so if there WAS a problem - we would fix it. You just kept complaining something about the bumper not complying with Utah's new bumper law. Then again, you knew that these bumpers are for off-road use only - didn't you? (I mean you did agreed to that before you bought the bumper) If you're going to be a pavement pounder, perhaps you should have contacted SmittyBuilt.

Then you hinted that you towed something with it... without the frame tie-ins that come stock on Scouts meant to tow - when I brought that up, you ceased communication with me. No returned emails, no bumper, no pictures (after many, many requests). Now here, no facts, just a bunch of claims. Sorry it didn't meet your state laws, but NO ONE has EVER complained or had any problems with ANY weld or product of mine. If you’d like me to send you or anyone reading this a list of recent customers (or my original customers for that matter) for references – just let me know.

In short, your full of it Joe - 100%
Welding practice? Give it a rest. I’ll dispute that bitterly..

<IMG SRC="smilies/massey.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by tsm1mt:
<STRONG>Joe's account isn't the first I've heard of the rear x-member failing when a bumper like that is mounted to the "face" of it.</STRONG>

True, Joe is the 2nd person to complain about the weak crossmember. The first was Ken and Jen Farmer (locals to our shop) and it happened after they loaded 3-4 bikes on a reciever mounted Bike Rack, a 32" spare, hi-lift, a jerry can and a few other things to the carrier. Those 8 Grade5 bolts were clinging tight to the crossmember but the crossmember was no match for the wieght.

The stock Scout step bumpers have these tie-ins from the factory. Interestingly enough, we actually offer frame tie-ins that secure the bumper to the bottom of the frame (in the stock sleeved frame holes) Both Joe and the Farmers didn't originally go with that option. The Farmers came back and we fixed the broken crossmember for free, then added the frame tie-ins. No problems since.

Originally posted by Snoopy:
<STRONG>>> the weight of mine also caused my rear
>> crossmember to crack

The crappy condition of your stock weak crossmember is not my problem. You decided to modify the bumper and carrier after receiving it. You also decided not to </STRONG>

Uh, damien? I stuck a licene plate and a high lift on it, along with 30" spare and a full jerry can. thats not a heavy load, i'd guess around 50 lbs

Originally posted by Snoopy:
<STRONG>reinforce it to the frame (which is common place for people towing). My customers have </STRONG>

no damien I didn't mount it to the frame, because i never towed with it!

Originally posted by Snoopy:
<STRONG> had their Scouts picked up and dragged (yes dragged) backwards out of canyons by sky-lift cranes - BY MY BUMPERS. So what went wrong with yours - Pilot error? </STRONG>


I trusted someone I thought was a freind

Originally posted by Snoopy:
<STRONG>>> I took pics of the damage done before
>> repairs and sent copies to damien, but
>> never heard back from him.

I never – at any time - received ANY pictures - just a bunch of claims. I asked for pictures numerous times as well as the bumper back ~ so if there WAS a problem - we would </STRONG>

let me get them scanned and i'll post

Originally posted by Snoopy:
<STRONG>fix it. You just kept complaining something about the bumper not complying with Utah's new bumper law. Then again, you knew that </STRONG>

no, Damien. I advised you to modify them to comply in future orders. find some good compromises to make them as legal as possible.

Originally posted by Snoopy:
<STRONG>these bumpers are for off-road use only - didn't you? (I mean you did agreed to that before you bought the bumper) If you're going to be a pavement pounder, perhaps you should have contacted SmittyBuilt.

Then you hinted that you towed something with it... without the frame tie-ins that come stock on Scouts meant to tow - when I brought that up, you ceased communication with me. </STRONG>


actually, You never replied back. And once again, I never towed. I was looking at the possibility of doing so, but a trailer (much less a hitch) has never been connected to that bumper

Originally posted by Snoopy:
<STRONG> No returned emails, no bumper, no pictures (after many, many requests). Now here, no facts, just a bunch of claims. Sorry it didn't meet your state laws, but NO ONE has EVER complained or had any problems with ANY weld or product of mine. If you’d like me to send you or anyone reading this a list of </STRONG>

So the stories I heard about your project 1 being re-did by aval;anch was incorrect?

Originally posted by Snoopy:
<STRONG>recent customers (or my original customers for that matter) for references – just let me know.

In short, your full of it Joe - 100%
Welding practice? Give it a rest. I’ll dispute that bitterly..</STRONG>


whatever.

[ 10-30-2001: Message edited by: NotQuiteSane ]

Originally posted by Snoopy:
<STRONG>I think your just jealous that you don't got any!</STRONG>

Yep, just call me NO FLEX.

http://walnut.tmcom.com/~tsm1/scout/jpg/rmihr99/rti/image2.jpg

It was ONLY good enough for 4th place at RMIHR that year.. behind Dave King, Stude, and Schwartz. I was pretty bummed about that. NOT! <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by tsm1mt:
<STRONG>Yep, just call me NO FLEX.

http://walnut.tmcom.com/~tsm1/scout/jpg/rmihr99/rti/image2.jpg

It was ONLY good enough for 4th place at RMIHR that year.. behind Dave King, Stude, and Schwartz. I was pretty bummed about that. NOT! <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

Too bad the truck you actually wheel doesn't flex like that <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by Scoutillac:
<STRONG>Too bad the truck you actually wheel doesn't flex like that <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

That's big talk from a man who was wheelin' a TAHOE last weekend! <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Heh. I'm thinking of throwing Lockers in it and putting a windshield back in and sayin' fawk-it to the trail rig. Whaddya think? <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Wait, I'd need to add a driver's mirror, too, to finish making it street legal. <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

[ 10-30-2001: Message edited by: tsm1mt ]

Originally posted by tsm1mt:
<STRONG>That's big talk from a man who was wheelin' a TAHOE last weekend! <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

Heh. I'm thinking of throwing Lockers in it and putting a windshield back in and sayin' fawk-it to the trail rig. Whaddya think? <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Wait, I'd need to add a driver's mirror, too, to finish making it street legal. <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

[ 10-30-2001: Message edited by: tsm1mt ]</STRONG>


Two problems with making it street legal:
1. Too much flex for the street <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0">
2. Too dam ugly for the street <IMG SRC="smilies/laughing.gif" border="0">

Joe

Originally posted by jdjanda:
<STRONG>
Two problems with making it street legal:
1. Too much flex for the street <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0">
2. Too dam ugly for the street <IMG SRC="smilies/laughing.gif" border="0">

Joe</STRONG>

Heh. I drove it to Motor Vehicles to renew my driver's license! <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

I pulled up in front of their window, flipped off the ignition with the toggle, took off my mandatory goggles (no windshield), popped the 5-pts, then climbed out of the 'cage in my shirt, tie, n' slacks.


Walked in, renewed my license, and left. <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

I was actually quite bummed about the whole deal - I kept hoping a cop would pull me over, but everything was legit - licensed, insured, skinny tires that didn't stick out, brake lights, rearview mirror, hand signals, wipers, goggles..

Never gave me a second glance though. <IMG SRC="smilies/frown.gif" border="0">

Rides nice, handles great, but highway RPMs are a little excessive. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> Had a hard time controlling the rear-wheel spin, too. I once smoked the tires an entire city block after short-shifting 1st-2nd in the 727.

It's a fun ride around town. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

But yeah.. damn ugly. Not as bad now since I got rid of the big ugly "L" brackets the PO used on the tilt clip, installed a new SSII grille, and added some more stickers to cover the flat-black rattle can job..
It did pretty well considering it's open/open the one time I did take it wheelin'. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by jdjanda:
<STRONG>I forgot to include the sheet metal work I've done lately <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

When the time comes, I need new sheet metal all the way around. Before I sell this one, I'll buy a parts rig and do the swap. <IMG SRC="smilies/rolleyes.gif" border="0"> You'll never know the difference.

Joe</STRONG>

You call THAT "body work" or "trail damage"? I laugh! <IMG SRC="smilies/laughing.gif" border="0">

I already have just about an entire new Scout in my storage shed that needs installed. I still need to order the front body mounts and one rear pillar/tailgate mount and I'll have it all. I'm keeping the front fenders, hood, and windshield frame (I can straighten them out enough), and one inner quarter panel - that's it.

Anyone have a good place to buy a bulk of dzus fasteners? I figger I might as well dzus the new 'glass quarters on - I KNOW I'm going to break 'em.

Originally posted by Snoopy:
<STRONG>Those 8 Grade5 bolts were clinging tight to the crossmember but the crossmember was no match for the wieght.
</STRONG>

At best, the stock rear x-member is a POS.

<STRONG>
The stock Scout step bumpers have these tie-ins from the factory. Interestingly enough, we actually offer frame tie-ins that secure the bumper to the bottom of the frame (in the stock sleeved frame holes)</STRONG>

Just a tip - if you're going to sell "off-road" bumpers, maybe you should include those "frame tie-ins" with the bumper. I imagine they're nothing more than a foot of angle.. and it would avoid this type of problem.

I've seen WAYYY too many rednecks attach receiver hitches and big hooks to that rear x-member.. and just about every Scout I've seen has at least one of the four tiny welds that hold that thing on broken.

Which customer had his/her Scout air-lifted out? Did you build their suspension, too? <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">

BTW.. you never did explain how a Z-draglink fixes bump-steer with a 4" SUA lift..

I can't even notice the bump-steer with my straight draglink.. and it's plenty stout. (stronger than the frame or tie-rod.. <IMG SRC="smilies/rolleyes.gif" border="0"> )

Originally posted by tsm1mt:
<STRONG>You call THAT "body work" or "trail damage"? I laugh! <IMG SRC="smilies/laughing.gif" border="0">
</STRONG>

Does this count? courtesy of open front diff.


http://bbs.off-road.com/wwwthreads_uploads/40-497767-bodydamage.jpg

Originally posted by Hayraker*:
<STRONG>Does this count? courtesy of open front diff.


</STRONG>

Nice. I usually get those kinds of scars from NOT having an open front - the "locker walk".. seems I'm always side-hilling in the snow so that the driver's side is uphill.. thus the passenger side has gotten a bit too intimate with a few too many trees. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Everything's fine until BOTH front tires spin and ZOOM straight downhill it goes.

Same with the LS equipped rear, but not as bad.

Originally posted by tsm1mt:
<STRONG>Nice. I usually get those kinds of scars from NOT having an open front - the "locker walk".. seems I'm always side-hilling in the snow so that the driver's side is uphill.. thus the passenger side has gotten a bit too intimate with a few too many trees. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Everything's fine until BOTH front tires spin and ZOOM straight downhill it goes.

Same with the LS equipped rear, but not as bad.</STRONG>

I was spinning the driver side front a little too fast when it finally took hold, and the tree magically sucked me into it. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by tsm1mt:
<STRONG>Nice. I usually get those kinds of scars from NOT having an open front - the "locker walk".. seems I'm always side-hilling in the snow so that the driver's side is uphill.. thus the passenger side has gotten a bit too intimate with a few too many trees. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Everything's fine until BOTH front tires spin and ZOOM straight downhill it goes.

Same with the LS equipped rear, but not as bad.</STRONG>

Can you say twin stick? I know another project that needs to be completed <IMG SRC="smilies/sleep.gif" border="0">

Running around in rear 2-low is nice, no locker steer.

Joe

Originally posted by Hayraker*:
<STRONG>Does this count? courtesy of open front diff.


http://bbs.off-road.com/wwwthreads_uploads/40-497767-bodydamage.jpg </STRONG>

See International was way ahead of their time, including crumble zones in the Scout II design. How many other cars/trucks had crumble zones?

Originally posted by Snoopy:
<STRONG>>> ......., but NO ONE has EVER complained or had any problems with ANY weld or product of mine. If you’d like me to send you or anyone reading this a list of recent customers (or my original customers for that matter) for references – just let me know.</STRONG>


OK, I hate crapping on people, but if your going to take this stance and attitude, then:

I know of at least ONE of your "customers" that was very disappointed in your work. So much so that he took it to Gryphin Auto to be completely redone.

Now Mr. C. is a good friend, and even when I pried he would not speak of the details, because that is the way he is, but I know the welding work was one of the issues.


Be careful what you say, I've heard your work has improved, and I applaud you for that, but be warned when people can call your bluff.


I'm done
-mark

BTW,

Best mode: 392, Pro-jection, wide ratio, D300, R-SO.

Worst: NOT getting around to the front SO, Pro-jection, being sloppy and re-arranging the fenders, again.... and again.....

[ 10-31-2001: Message edited by: RustoleumWhite ]

My rear cross member has about one more good pull in it before it rips right off.

New thread coming up.

Best way to reinforce that rear cross member.

Nix that.

Best reasonable way to reinforce that rear cross member.

Originally posted by RustoleumWhite:
<STRONG>BTW,

Best mode: 392, Pro-jection, wide ratio, D300, R-SO.

Worst: NOT getting around to the front SO, Pro-jection, being sloppy and re-arranging the fenders, again.... and again.....

[ 10-31-2001: Message edited by: RustoleumWhite ]</STRONG>

Mark, what Pro/Cons have you experienced with the projection?

Joe

best: locker in front, twin stick 4to1's, r-soa, dual arm cross over steering, mallory dist, fix first r-spoa,lengthen frame/move axle fwd (2nd time).

worst: edelbrock 4bbl, bungled first r-spoa attempt, not moving axle fwd enough first time, not enough lift, buying used tires-tires to small should have bought 40's min to start, steering need hydro assist,

Originally posted by NotQuiteSane:
I trusted someone I thought was a friend


That goes for me as well - I thought we had a fairly good *relationship* until I saw this post.

Either way, I'll try and contact you personally and see what happened.
<IMG SRC="smilies/massey.gif" border="0">

[ 11-01-2001: Message edited by: Snoopy ]

Originally posted by Coolih:
<STRONG>best: locker in front, twin stick 4to1's, r-soa, dual arm cross over steering, mallory dist, fix first r-spoa,lengthen frame/move axle fwd (2nd time).

worst: edelbrock 4bbl, bungled first r-spoa attempt, not moving axle fwd enough first time, not enough lift, buying used tires-tires to small should have bought 40's min to start, steering need hydro assist,</STRONG>

Yoyu haven't figger out how to tune the AFB yet <IMG SRC="smilies/rolleyes.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0">