I just yanked my replacment scout 44 last night and I refuse to crawl under one again looking for parts to just Band-Aid the jeep back together. :mad:

This scout 44 rear will be babied until I can get my hands on a FF D 60 or 14bolt. From what I read the 14 Bolt is the way to go. Because of the possiblities or swapping the lug pattern and the overall width of the axle compared to the 60.

I'll make this simple. I want to keep my 35's and still run 15" wheels. I can get new wheels for cheap. I read up on the toyota swap but if I am going to jump into this project I want Beef.

That being said, I should look for a 14 bolt from a cab and chassis correct? It should be around 64" right? My front 44 now is out of a cherokee cheif so its pretty wide already. I am pretty sure I have some hubs to convert that to 8 lug.

I have time to work on the new rearend over the winter, im just tired of breaking this damn 44, so I want to get a jump on it. And since I stretched the jeep, I may want to go with 37's or 38's next winter.

Your help is appreciated.

from my point of veiw it's a matter of what you can get ahold of. I got 2 60's for free so that's what I'm running. I have access to a lathe so I can take the spindles off the spare axle ahd have them run out to a 1.6" opening and then I can run 1.5" shafts like the 14 bolt. now if you can get the 14 for the same or less than you can get the 60, do it! you can get it in a useable width, it has a 10.5 inch ring gear and already has 1.5" shafts, so no more modification is needed. anyways....just my thoughts on the subject.

-Scott

I agree with that which ever you can get the cheapest but I would use the 60 because chevys suck

I got my 60 out of a chevy :flipoff2: :flipoff2: 0

-Scott

there is a sht load of fords withem though and they were not built buy chevy

Originally posted by GPN Family
I would use the 60 because chevys suck

Good reason moron! :flipoff2:

The rear 60 in stock form is not the strongest axle on the market for sure but if you bore the spindles and upgrade to the 1.5" 35 spline axle its all good.

The 14 bolt is a beefy strong, BIG SOB, with 1.5" shafts and a disc conversion can be done for less than 200 bucks. I would say that 38" tires are a mininimum on that sucker, because it is sort of a rock anchor! I run 40's on my 14 now and have 12" under the diff.

Originally posted by TPIJeep


Good reason moron! :flipoff2:

The rear 60 in stock form is not the strongest axle on the market for sure

The 14 bolt is a rock anchor!

None of this really matters both the axles are far to big and heavy forMOST jeeps to even think about running.99% can use a 44 or a 9 inch and save all the weight and head aches. I personaly would use a 9 inch lots more options and easyer to weld link mounts to.you can get them all day long for cheap with 31 spline shafts 65" wide out of F-150's. The poster stated he wanted to keep his 35" tires and a 14 bolt would be draging the ground with those. A 9 inch would be the best choice in this situation.and if its not enough beef they have 33,35,and40 spline shafts to.:flipoff2:

Trailhawg:fj:

Hehe... At least this time you gave a reason for your statement rather than stating the good ole, Chevy Sucks, Ford Sucks, you suck mentality!

14bolt + 35's = Big giant trench carved into ground.

I put a Duallie 14bolt in my Scout knowing that I'd be stepping up to 38's ....and cause the front 60 took all my money. Well, I had to run 36's for a while (Which are for sale btw:D ) and the 14 hung on everything.

If you don't mind spending some money, get a FF60, cut it down and make a SF 35spline 60 out of it. You will be much happier. I even thought about doing this on my Scout next year...and I still might.

BTW, you can do the same with a 9", but it has a low pinion and you need a new carrier to fit 35 spline axles. (You really only need 31 spline axles with 35's though)

Originally posted by TPIJeep
Hehe... At least this time you gave a reason for your statement rather than stating the good ole, Chevy Sucks, Ford Sucks, you suck mentality!

Its much easyer to have reasons on sunday morning,then on saturday night:D I dont know why;)

Trailhawg:fj:

Whoa!!! :eek: i just got back from a buddies house that has a 14 bolt with 39.5's. Damn that thing hangs low. I got a pic of another friends ff 60 with 36's and that looks like what I will go with. 60's around here are also easy to come buy but i havent done much research on that subject.

I have access to a lathe to turn the ID of the spindles. Scott's-4X, I'll prolly be picking you brain on that one.

I guess I really need to find out what year dana 60 I need to get. I should prolly just go ahead and keep it FF and swap the front to eight lug to match and get it over with.


Thanks all.

Originally posted by "D"
Whoa!!! :eek: i just got back from a buddies house that has a 14 bolt with 39.5's. Damn that thing hangs low.

Get yer shave on.:flipoff2: :flipoff2:

Go 14 bolt;) - shave it, disc brake it, and never worry about it again other than to change the fluid :D . Plus Detroits are dirt cheap for them when compared to others
I have a FF D60 laying in my garage, and a 14 bolt, the FF D60 sure look swimpy next to the 14 bolt.
Either is a good choice mind you - go which evr you can get the best deal on. But I would lean in 14 bolt direction

:flipoff2: :flipoff2:

The 14B is just to big for 35's, hell a 60 is overkill for 35's! anyway look for older Ford F250's like 85 and older. I don't think you should have a problem with the 44 rear , but hey some people do like the gas pedal.:rolleyes: you won't need to bore the spindles and swap custom 35 spline shafts in, I know plenty of people that run 38's + tires with stock 30 spline Dana 60 rear shafts with no problems, but hey your :nuke: the 44 with 35's so who knows.

Hay keep your eye out for a dana70 too!!! Its a d60 but you dont have to upgrade it. 35spline 1.5in shafts are common, .56in thick axle tube, and has the same diff cover as a d60 so with some easy grinding it dosent hang too low. Harder to find then a 14bolt but buy on e if you find one!!! more locker options on the d60 then d70 so look into your locker needs first. but its a good option. Aloso 65in WMS to WMS.

i say get the 14bolt. it is cheaper and stronger thna a dana60. they are trench diggers in stock form but you can shave a bunch off of them. i ground off the bottom lip on 14bolt rear and my d60 front and now my 14bolt is only about 1/4" lower than my 60 with the ground down lip. if you can find a 35spline 60 then that is what i would go with but 14bolts are easy to find and as stated before cheap and beefy!

Well this guy said he wants to keep his 15" rims and by that and knowing he is pulling out a scout rear that means he wants to keep his 15" 5x5.5 wheels. So with that said ditch the whole 14B idea becuase though it is possible to make 5x5.5 wheels work it is a hell of alot of work to do. So that leaves a 60 or a 9" as stated earlyer. I say get any old 60, cut off the spindles, weld on some 9" ends and order you up some new 35 spline axles and the locker of your choice and be done with it.

Hey guys, I'm new to the board and looking forward to finding out more info. I'm building a CJ-7 with full width D44 (Chevy) front and 14 bolt rear with Detroit. Can anyone give me some info. on this disc conversion kit for $200? I guess I need to trim my "boat anchor."

Originally posted by 66CJdean
Well this guy said he wants to keep his 15" rims and by that and knowing he is pulling out a scout rear that means he wants to keep his 15" 5x5.5 wheels. So with that said ditch the whole 14B idea becuase though it is possible to make 5x5.5 wheels work it is a hell of alot of work to do. So that leaves a 60 or a 9" as stated earlyer. I say get any old 60, cut off the spindles, weld on some 9" ends and order you up some new 35 spline axles and the locker of your choice and be done with it.
:rolleyes:


Originally posted by "D"
I want to keep my 35's and still run 15" wheels. I can get new wheels for cheap. IMy front 44 now is out of a cherokee cheif so its pretty wide already. I am pretty sure I have some hubs to convert that to 8 lug.


:flipoff2:

14-bolt, cheap, super easy to find, and super easy to setup gears on, no pressing and shiming, removable pinion suport, three pinion bearings, super beefy in stock form. 38's are probably a minimum unless you plan on plowing fields with the diff, but you can shave a lot.

Well for right now I am looking at a semi floater 60 , using a ff60 welding on big bearing 9" ends and having moser build me some semifloating 35 spline axles.

I am not however sold on the idea of it quite yet.

How much can you shave off of the housing on a 14 bolt before you weaken the integreaty of it?

What do you do with the area you shaved off? Cast iron weld a plate back on it?

keep em coming.

Do a search on shaved housings. I know I have posted some photos and so have quite a few others. Try the Jeep board and the General board.

shaved 14 bolt all the way

Originally posted by MotoFrugals
Hey guys, I'm new to the board and looking forward to finding out more info. I'm building a CJ-7 with full width D44 (Chevy) front and 14 bolt rear with Detroit. Can anyone give me some info. on this disc conversion kit for $200? I guess I need to trim my "boat anchor."

www.shakerbuilt.com has a rear 14 bolt disk brake conversion kit. Real nice and cheap. For e-brake, use 76-78 eldorado calipers and rotors, then get an adjustable prop valve. Non e-brake use 73-87 chevy 3/4 ton rotors

Or off-road unlimited sells a complete bolt on kit with calipers and rotors.

Depends mostly on money. 14 bolts are already 1.5 inch shafts. Super easy to work on. A 60 is going to cost more if you want 1.5 inch shafts - a LOT more. Also, changing gears (if you have to) is going to cost way more in a 60 - but the 14 doesn't have the gear selection.

If you are goin cheap, go 14 bolt, just keep in mind they hang down low. I haven't had a chance to shave mine yet, so I'm not sure how much you can 'cure' this problem yet, but it certainly was cheap to get it, swap disks on, and swap gears in (no expensive setup with the dial adjusters) - also super easy to work on - if I can do it, anyone can!

14 bolt would be def. be cheapest way, but if your staying with the 35's i would not advise the 14 bolt at all. You are going to be dragging your ass end everywhere you go. Go with the 60. BUT if you seriously plan on going to 38's then you might consider doing the 14 bolt, but IMO you should do the 60, plenty strong for your application and will not drag as much as the 14 b. i run 42s on my Dana 70 and i still have clearance issues in many places.

Damn it! I cant make up my mind!!

I can shave a 14 bolt. I am a class A cert Mach op so that isnt a issue.

The issue is i may end up havving to stay with the 35's for a while.
This 44 is not going to hold up.

Both axles are cheap here. May be hard to find out which one i need to match the front cherokee cheif 44 but cheap none the less.

I already have the caddy calipers on my scout 44 anyway.
Damn it!

Is a shaved 14 bolt going to have enough clearance not to be a major fawking annoyance on the trail?

My shit isnt huge with just 35's but my right foot is.

I thought I had it all planned out a few days ago, Now i dont know what the fawk to do.

I have about $1000 to screw around with $900 if you count the rearend.

Here are some pics of the 14 bolt that 1TONTJ shaved. Should give you an idea of how much you can save by shaving it. Almost exactly the setup I am working on right now.
Before
http://jeep-club.irtech.com/phils_mods/14Before.jpg
After
http://jeep-club.irtech.com/phils_mods/14after2.jpg

Ths is how much he shaved off. If I recall, he said he has almost the same clearance now as his stock D35. He shaved his ring gear as well.

http://jeep-club.irtech.com/phils_mods/14Removed.jpg
http://jeep-club.irtech.com/phils_mods/14After.jpg
I still vote for a 14 bolt, especially given your occupation and ability to this no prob yourself!
:D

Originally posted by 1TonCJ-7
Here are some pics of the 14 bolt that 1TONTJ shaved. Should give you an idea of how much you can save by shaving it. Almost exactly the setup I am working on right now.
http://jeep-club.irtech.com/phils_mods/14After.jpg


That is plain sick!!! Awesome work.

Im getting ready to shave my 14 bolt, do you have any more After pics? How much was removed from the ring gear?

Thanks.

Originally posted by Jeepin_NC


That is plain sick!!! Awesome work.

Im getting ready to shave my 14 bolt, do you have any more After pics? How much was removed from the ring gear?

Thanks.

Best bet is to PM him or do a search for postings by him (1TONTJ). He has several threads here to do with the work he did on his D60 and 14 bolt shave job. I think he took 5/16" off the ring gear. I was reading stuff on Randy's Ring and Pinion website that says you can alot of a ring gear before it even bets close to effecting the strength of the teeth.

here's some pics of my 14 being installled. you can atleast get an idea of what your looking at width wise. (actually just trying to sike you up enough to go with a 14 bolt). :)


that sucker already drags!;)

width (67") and rust....

Here is my 14 Bolt with my Disc Brake conversion on it..... I bought the brackets from???? And bought the rest from Auto Zone a little under 200 bucks. I little over if you dont have core for the calipers.

yeah the 14 bolt sounds good right now too!

Whats the widths I should look for, those look super wide!

Lots wider than my front.

Any specific years to stay away from? or look for?

thanks nice pics!!!

like i said, my in 67". that is standard fullwidth. do a search for the pictures of the different style hubs from single rear wheel to dual rear wheel (SRW to DRW). that will help you differentiate b/w the differnt kinds of 14 bolts in the junkyard. if you need it to be closer to 60" then look for a CC truck. i think those run about 62-63". might want to consider a front end swap as well if you going to to do it. not sure what your running now, but it is WAY easier to just buy a matching set of diffs. you can find em all day long for under $400. matched gears, widths, conditions, etc, etc.

-russel

try here for a CC....

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=88184

just out of wild curiousity
has anyone EVER seen a 14 bolt ring gear thats been shaved, fail?
it sounds in no way likely, i just wonder what impact on stregnth, if any, milling the ring gear has?

~John

Originally posted by JohnBuuu
just out of wild curiousity
has anyone EVER seen a 14 bolt ring gear thats been shaved, fail?
it sounds in no way likely, i just wonder what impact on stregnth, if any, milling the ring gear has?

~John

Here is a little info on gear grinding.http://www.randysringandpinion.com/gear/g0500.shtml It doesn't tell a whole lot, but there is some good info there.

Well you can shave a 60 too.
http://www.respite.org/images/cj66dean/shaved604.jpg http://www.respite.org/images/cj66dean/shaved605.jpg

The price of a 14bolt is hard to beat though. If you need to narrow one down and can't find dually hubs then you can cut down the long side and run 2 short side axles and that will bring it down to about 61" WMS 2 WMS. I have 2 friends that did this.

If anyone is not prepared to re-shaft a FF D60 with 35 spline shafts, the 14 bolt is a nice option. I have a D60 FF and a 14 Bolt FF laying in my garage. I yanked the shafts from both and took pics today. Can't post pics from geocities.com I think, so here are the links to the pics.
http://www.geocities.com/deanharkema/axlecompare/D60FF_VS_14boltFF.JPG
http://www.geocities.com/deanharkema/axlecompare/D60FF_VS_14boltFF_1.JPG
width on the whole axle is within 1" of each other. D60 is 66" wms and 14 bolt is 67".
Any other measurements you want from a stock 14 bolt I can get you easy if you want since it is laying on my garage floor.:D

Dean

Both are 30 spline axles: one out of a 14 bolt, the other a Dana 60
http://www.alaskaoffroad.com/images/Tech/14vs60Raxle.jpg
http://www.alaskaoffroad.com/images/Tech/14vs60Raxle_2.jpg

I bought a new Ford 8.8 with limited slip and 3:73 gears and I am running a 350 chevy and NV4500. All you will ever need.

I run a 60 with 14 bolt ends on it but you will of course have to get axles made to do that but it is nice to not have to bore out the spindles to get the 35 spline axles to fit. From about 1980 up the 60's have big enough spindles to fit 35 spline axles though but my 60 was a 73.

Originally posted by olivesman
here's some pics of my 14 being installled. you can atleast get an idea of what your looking at width wise. (actually just trying to sike you up enough to go with a 14 bolt). :)


that sucker already drags!;)


that thing drags SO much it ain't moved in 2 years....

when is that thing gonna roll?

Originally posted by 1TonCJ-7


Here is a little info on gear grinding.http://www.randysringandpinion.com/gear/g0500.shtml It doesn't tell a whole lot, but there is some good info there.

thanks man...interesting tidbits, that makes me pretty confident in a shaved 14 bolt ring gear...thats still a hell of a lot of real estate left on that gear.
~John