Ok, I'm bored. eventually I'd like to get a tow rig (it's a toss up, between building one of those, and converting clyde to diesel).

So i've been thinking, what would make the best tow rig? A travelall would be nice when I have a family, but it couldn't handle more than one vehicle towed

A standard cab PU would allow a 5th wheel, but limits the number of passengers

a travelette would be nice, except the combined length might be a hassel.

What i've been thinking is start with a travelall, and use it until I need something better, then regulate it for "light duty" towing

as to "better", here's what i'm thinking: a 15xx series cab and frame, lengthened. graft on a section of cab to make an extended cab (or use a travelette body if room allows), then place a mini-truck camper, sideways behind that. after that, graft on a tilt bed. I think that it would still not requre a CDL to drive. however, I'm not so sure about towing a trailer after that, I'd think it would turn it into a combined vehicle.

NQS

How about a Wagonmaster? Not as long as a Travelette, 4 doors, plenty of passenger space, and you can still run a 5th wheel.

Only problem is actually finding one.

Maybe take a Travellete cab and put it on a regular wheelbase P/U. Cut the bed down to a stubby box and run either a gooseneck or a 5th wheel. I'm in favor of a gooseneck over the 5th wheel because the 5th wheel severly hinders any articulation between the tow rig and the trailer. If you never leave nice flat pavement with it, the 5th wheel wouldn't be that bad.....

Originally posted by NotQuiteSane
Ok, I'm bored. eventually I'd like to get a tow rig (it's a toss up, between building one of those, and converting clyde to diesel).


Build the tow-rig. :D


So i've been thinking, what would make the best tow rig? A travelall would be nice when I have a family, but it couldn't handle more than one vehicle towed


A 3/4T Travelall would make a good tow-rig for a single car trailer, and they make great daily drivers, too.

Very handy with the 4 doors and COMFY seating for 5 (6 with a front bench). Open the tailgate and fold down the back seat, and 4x8 sheet of plywood goes inside nicely.

OR.. an air-mattress for a low-buck "camper" for two.

119" WB is still very maneuverable, but long enough to be pretty stable. Roof-rack holds tons of stuff, too.

Make decent wheelin' rigs when the mood strikes you, too. 33s fit well stock.

I like mine. Michelle doesn't care for it, mostly because of the condition it's in (no driver's floor, no bottoms to the rear quarters, ugly and green..)


A standard cab PU would allow a 5th wheel, but limits the number of passengers


Nice tow platform at 131/133" WB.. but definitely cramps it with passengers. We had 4 in Makkat's "OX" at RMIHR.. at least he has a bench still. Personally, I prefer 5 in my Travelette.. but it wasn't cooperating at the time.

As long as it's just you and someone else, the single cab'd be nice.. add a baby.. it's be cramped.. add two, and you're trading up to another truck.


a travelette would be nice, except the combined length might be a hassel.


Well, the long-box tows GREAT but it can be a chore to park. You learn to make 3pt turns into slanted parking spots..

A short-box would be a good compromise.. still 154" WB or so, but comfy seating for 5 or 6 (I have captains up front). Michelle can sleep across the rear bench (I can't). Smaller cab than the T'all, which will make it easier to heat/cool, though less storage area.. but you can run a toolbox or topper.. or camper.


What i've been thinking is start with a travelall, and use it until I need something better, then regulate it for "light duty" towing


Yep. Light tow/daily driver. I think a 3/4T T'all would make a great dual (or three) purpose rig.

Very common and easy to find, compared to a Travelette, too.

The WagonMaster idea is a sorta good one.. it's not really a good 5th wheel rig unless you move the rear axle back a bit. More or less you end up with a Travelall without the interior cargo room but with a little "exposed" cargo area.

Great if you need to haul something "tall" or use a hoist to get something into the bed.. but that's about it.

Cool though.

The Travelette cab on a long-box frame is another good idea.. better than the WM concept.

You lose bed space, but there'd still be enough for a toolbox or three and a gooseneck hitch.

Maybe not the best camper hauling setup though.

By the time you built that montrosity you were talking about, you could buy a 4x4 Loadstar Travelcrew and slap a coffin sleeper on it.

have twice the rig for half the money.

Even if you had to get a CDL to drive it, they aren't that hard to get. I got mine for a total investment of $100 dollars and 7-8 hours practicing.

Me, I'm saving pennies for a certain DCO-400 thats for sale.

250 horse, 10 speed, convert the sleeper to a rear seat, it turns sharper than Tom's T-ette ever will, and comfortably hauls 3-4 rigs.

Or maybe a 4370 with 450 horse and suicide 16. easier to get into, but harder to horse around corners.

Originally posted by That Mick

Me, I'm saving pennies for a certain DCO-400 thats for sale.

250 horse, 10 speed, convert the sleeper to a rear seat, it turns sharper than Tom's T-ette ever will, and comfortably hauls 3-4 rigs.


:flipoff2:

First you need to get that Terra finished... so you have a reason to have a tow-rig. :D

JG's 4700 Travelcrew is for sale...

Originally posted by tsm1mt


:flipoff2:

First you need to get that Terra finished... so you have a reason to have a tow-rig. :D



It coming, I don't have the disposable income that some poeple do, and eating is more importent than the Terra right now.

OTOH, I'm looking at that Volvo axle thread on Gen4x4 and thinking TAX CHECK!!!

Lift smift, I've got portals :D

Probably won't happen, but I can dream.

Loadstar :D

Originally posted by Sully
How about a Wagonmaster? Not as long as a Travelette, 4 doors, plenty of passenger space, and you can still run a 5th wheel.


Nope. for the same reasons Tom posted. IIRC, the WM was a salesmans idea, not an engineers

Only problem is actually finding one.

Mr Travelall, Meet Mr. Sawzall and Mr. Welder :flipoff2:

NQS

Originally posted by TORC
Maybe take a Travellete cab and put it on a regular wheelbase P/U. Cut the bed down to a stubby box and run either a gooseneck or a 5th wheel. I'm in favor of a gooseneck over the 5th wheel because the 5th wheel severly hinders any articulation between the tow rig and the trailer. If you never leave nice flat pavement with it, the 5th wheel wouldn't be that bad.....

Ok, wait a sec. I tink I have my terms mixed up.

isn't 5th wheel & goosneck the same?

for articulation, a pintle is probably the best. I do plan to leave pavement, but only to get to/from drop off points

NQS

Originally posted by NotQuiteSane


Mr Travelall, Meet Mr. Sawzall and Mr. Welder :flipoff2:

NQS

Yep, in THAT case...

Start with a rusty Travelall.. fix the front floors.. :D

Then Cut at the C pillar and dump the rear quarter glass.

Dump the rear gas tank and side spare tire.. move the axle back 12".. there's even room enough to move the spring hangers back a good ways - just cut the rivets and move.

Run dual front tanks.. get a fender and tank from a pickup.

Cut the lower quarters off much like all those Jeeps (and Scoutaholic's Aristocrat n' Hayraker's Traveler).

That'll move the axle back so you can actually use the gooseneck plate.

For that matter, install a married 'case to the transmission, sawzall the front fenders a little and install some ARBs and you can put some 235/85-16s on and tow, or some 36/37/38s on, air up the ARBs, and go wheelin'.

I still want to see someone fab a soft-top for the "chopped" part of a WagonMaster so it looks like a drop-top Travelall.. :D

Originally posted by NotQuiteSane


Ok, wait a sec. I tink I have my terms mixed up.

isn't 5th wheel & goosneck the same?

for articulation, a pintle is probably the best. I do plan to leave pavement, but only to get to/from drop off points

NQS

Close, Joe.

5th is what you had on your big truck.

Gooseneck is sorta the reverse.

A 2 5/16" ball in the middle of the bed, that the gooseneck drops onto, allowing you to articulate with the trailer.

The 5th is the flat mounting plate with a pin on the trailer that slides into it.. and doesn't like going over Kelly Humps..

Originally posted by tsm1mt
[B]

Build the tow-rig. :D

Of course. I mistyped. It's a toss up which I'll do first. But building a to rig first would allow me to drop if off at Lukas's and have him do the mods i'm unable to do

Very handy with the 4 doors and COMFY seating for 5 (6 with a front bench). Open the tailgate and fold down the back seat, and 4x8 sheet of plywood goes inside nicely.

OR.. an air-mattress for a low-buck "camper" for two.

I was thinking of building a false floor, with a slideout drawer, then a front support for when the rear seat is folded down.

I like mine. Michelle doesn't care for it, mostly because of the condition it's in (no driver's floor, no bottoms to the rear quarters, ugly and green..)

geez Tom. haven't you learned yet to cater to the whims of She Who Must Be Obeyed? :flipoff2:

As long as it's just you and someone else, the single cab'd be nice.. add a baby.. it's be cramped.. add two, and you're trading up to another truck.

Right. Right now, a PU might be best, I'm not involved with anyone, and I'd perfer to finish school before having children, but I've long since learned life doesn't always work out how you planned it. but by the time I'd need a PU, it would be time for a trailer that could haul 2 scouts. which I don't anticipate in the near future. even though I can think of 4 diffren senerios off the top of my head that would requre it.

Well, the long-box tows GREAT but it can be a chore to park. You learn to make 3pt turns into slanted parking spots..

I was thinking the problems of the combined lenght of truck and trailer. what are you at? 250-300 inches, front bumper to rear ramp?

Yep. Light tow/daily driver. I think a 3/4T T'all would make a great dual (or three) purpose rig.

Right. and watching the BB, I belive I can pick a decent one up for <$1500

NQS

Originally posted by tsm1mt


Close, Joe.

5th is what you had on your big truck.

Gooseneck is sorta the reverse.

A 2 5/16" ball in the middle of the bed, that the gooseneck drops onto, allowing you to articulate with the trailer.

The 5th is the flat mounting plate with a pin on the trailer that slides into it.. and doesn't like going over Kelly Humps..

Ok, that I understand.

so then what do I have in Clyde now, with the regular reciver in bumper and hitch ball?

NQS

Originally posted by NotQuiteSane


Ok, that I understand.

so then what do I have in Clyde now, with the regular reciver in bumper and hitch ball?

NQS
You have a bumper pull. Go with the gooseneck mount the ball 6 inches in front of the rear axle. This put more weight on the front axle and adds to the stability and you don't get bounced around as bad on rough roads. You also have a great turning radious.

I'd suggest a couple inches forward.

6 might be a little extreme, unless you've got a D70 front...

Originally posted by NotQuiteSane


I was thinking of building a false floor, with a slideout drawer, then a front support for when the rear seat is folded down.


That'd work. Makkat did that in the bed of his 200 pickup. Nice flat platform over the wheel wheels for the air mattress with storage underneath.

Not much for head room though..


geez Tom. haven't you learned yet to cater to the whims of She Who Must Be Obeyed? :flipoff2:


:D Why do you think BUGM will be for sale?


PU, it would be time for a trailer that could haul 2 scouts. which I don't anticipate in the near future. even


We're also looking at two pickups and two trailers to tow two Scouts.

Michelle wants a camper.. which makes it hard to pull a gooseneck.

I could put a camper on a 25' gooseneck.. but that makes it hard to put two rigs on it.. so I'd need a 40' gooseneck.. 'course, I *could* put three rigs on the deck then instead of a camper..

But in the end, 25' goosenecks aren't exactly common or cheap.. and I have two pickups.. one trailer, and a tow-bar already.


I was thinking the problems of the combined lenght of truck and trailer. what are you at? 250-300 inches, front bumper to rear ramp?

NQS

I'm at about 40' overall.

Truck is real close to 20' by itself, bumper to bumper.

Trailer has a 16' deck, plus the tongue.

I guess I'm just shy of 40'.. but not by much. 40 is the number I go by.


I'm trying to decide if I want to try and pull the front wheels of a second Scout up onto the rear of the trailer to pull two to RMIHR.. real tempting.

Limiting factor at the moment is the 5500lbs on the trailer axles with just one rig in tow.. and the 6000lbs combined axle rating. ;)

Upgrade it to two 7k axles.. but that'll run close to $700... almost as much as the trailer cost. ;)

Need to find a big gooseneck...

Tom, how will you be set for tounge weight if you have 2450 lbs of Scout pressing on the very end of the trailer?

Do you have enought length in front of the axles to keep decent tounge weight?

Also, and FWIW, the extra trailer will reduce you from a 40 acre turning radius to a 160 acre radius. Use all 4 lanes for a right hand turn :D:D

Originally posted by That Mick
Tom, how will you be set for tounge weight if you have 2450 lbs of Scout pressing on the very end of the trailer?


I'm (no matter what) planning on moving my tire-rack forward and up, so it sits on top of the "wall" at the front of the deck/behind the toolbox.

That'll let me move the Scout farther forward on the deck to generate more tongue weight if I need it.

Also, plan would be to use something like a "sling" or lift like a wrecker uses.. which would keep the towed Scout more "level" and closer to the ground, which would keep some of the weight off the trailer (and/or from making a teeter-totter out of the trailer).

Another option that I'm less in favor of.. is to tow-bar the 800 behind the trailer. Already have a ball and a 4-prong wiring harness at the rear of the trailer.

Actually, in that case I'd swap positions and put the heavier 800 on the deck, and Devil on the ground. I'd feel better if I was pulling a gooseneck first and I'd have to double check some laws between here and there.. and know it's illegal in WA so we'd have to drive one into Washington.

Putting one half on the trailer tho'.. I think that still counts as one trailer. :D


Also, and FWIW, the extra trailer will reduce you from a 40 acre turning radius to a 160 acre radius. Use all 4 lanes for a right hand turn :D:D

I wasn't planning on making any turns.. well, just one or two.. from I-90 to I-25.. and I-25 to I-70 or so and into RMIHR (OK, the last 150 miles could be ugly..)

Could drop the second rig for the final approach, too - just drive it in.

Not too worried about turning and such in that great expanse of eastern MT and Wyoming.. not like there's even traffic...

Make me 50-55' long... and people hate trying to pass me as it is. :D

Originally posted by That Mick
Even if you had to get a CDL to drive it, they aren't that hard to get. I got mine for a total investment of $100 dollars and 7-8 hours practicing..

Ah, but remember, I do have a CDL. still need to change over to OR DL, at which time I loose the CDL, but thats not the problem. with my leg, I can't get past the medical test.

And I gotta take that test by the 31st :(

Originally posted by tsm1mt


Michelle wants a camper.. which makes it hard to pull a gooseneck.

Why not do similar to what I was going to. place a mini truck camper behind the cab, sidewise, with a extension over the cab (should be able to fit a bed up there, and have a kitchen in the lower part. then behind that mount a shortbed box, and mount the

NQS

This is what you need :D

Big ol' gooseneck - sleeper cab - 2 large trucks.....

Oh and a CDL cause your way over weight!!!

I am sure if you ran a lighter weight gooseneck and a slide-in style pickup camper and only one truck you'd be pretty close to under wieght.

But man the double truck combo sure draws a crowd especially when he is passing you doing 80 on the freeway!

http://pics.montypics.com/chrispucci72/2002-12-06/gilbert5.jpg

Originally posted by uglyscout
....gooseneck and a slide-in style pickup camper...How do you propose to pull that off?:confused: Are you talking about putting the slide-in camper on the tongue of the gooseneck? That would look pretty :rainbow: :flipoff2:

Originally posted by That Mick
I'd suggest a couple inches forward.

6 might be a little extreme, unless you've got a D70 front...
Hitch manufacturers say to put the ball 2 to 4 inches in front of the axle. I ran for 6 years grossing out at 18,000 lbs. with a Dana 44 front on a 1/2 ton dodge

Originally posted by NotQuiteSane


Why not do similar to what I was going to. place a mini truck camper behind the cab, sidewise, with a extension over the cab (should be able to fit a bed up there, and have a kitchen in the lower part. then behind that mount a shortbed box, and mount the

NQS

I've thought of something similar.

Keep the 4-door long-box.

Build a custom camper.. enough "upright" area to stand up.. or sit on the toilet while cooking on the stove.. and then a queen sized cab-over sleeper.

That'd be just fine by me.

Also be a lot of work, or a lot of money, and probably both..

Still leave enough room to walk around the gooseneck hitch to get inside though.

A variation on that would be to do the same thing, but on the trailer, with the sleeper on the "step up deck" of the gooseneck.

If I found a short enough/cheap enough camper to do that with, that'd be great.

Still another idea, that's closer to reality..

Is to buy a 30' gooseneck with a ~8' step-up deck.

then get a pop-up tent trailer. Remove the axle, and mount it to the step-up deck.

Nice n' relatively low when towing, get where you're going and crank it open..

In the end, the goal is *economical* as well as useful.

And it's probably better to just run two trucks.. one with a camper, one with a gooseneck.. and take the camper truck w/ a single trailer for those types of events..

Well, i figured out mhow to rig a sleeping compartment in a t-all, and I knew all along, since I had the idea before using a scout.

Hang a hammock from the cage.

NQS