fj80 high steer the way you need it

[billybob13]

Originally Posted by Behemoth60

Hello Billy,

After learning about these knuckles, I've decided not to upgrade to a D60 axle, rather, the 80 series. I have a Cruiser, and wanted to the 80 series big birfields, but the lack of a good option for high steering and a strong knuckle has been a real drawback. You've solved that problem.

Have you considered putting caliper ears for running dual calipers on these knuckles. I have a set of 6 shooter knuckles that I was planning to use (before I found yours) and one of the things I really like about the 6 shooters is the ability to run twin calipers.

Peter Straub

to be honest, there's no need for dual calipers as these have stronger brakes than the mini axles even with the upgraded brakes. thanks for finding this, and thanks for the interest!

Originally Posted by Electric-Mayhem

I'm getting super psyched since this is starting to come together....







Steering ram mount done, studs installed, top truss done and I just have to weld the link mounts and such on before mockup of the links and such start.

Still need to figure out what size bolts I'll need for the steering tie rods and where to get the right size spacers to weld in for it. Its still probably going to be a few weeks before I get it all together and back on the road, but besides needing to sand down a few things due to tolerances being a bit off I've been very impressed with the quality on these. Not sure if the pre-load slugs were supposed to be press on, but I had to press the trunion on to it. Seems to be working allright, so I'll assume it is designed that way.

I'm super jealous of that fabbed axle that Ruffstuff is putting together. I could probably afford the housing right now, but I want to go with a Ford 9" one or at the very least a Toyota 9.5" one and can't afford the ring and pinion and a locker for it right now. We'll see how the 8" elocker does me for now.

Anyone know what the caster angle is supposed to be on an FJ80 axle. Seems like the with these knuckles the pinion will be pointed up a bit if steering pivots completely flat, but I'm not sure.

Josh

looking good josh! the trunion pin is supposed to be a press fit into the arm, but not a really tight press fit. i wanted it to be tight in the arm, but loose enough to turn the set screw by hand with an allen wrench to set pre-load.

i understand there may be some minor issues with tollerances in these, but over time i can make adjustments/improvements with help from your feedback.

thanks for all your support, i really appreciate it!

and yes, the ruffstuff housings are sexy and strong, i have one going under my rig soon, just trying to find the time! lol.

[EarlKann]

Originally Posted by Behemoth60

Hello Billy,


Have you considered putting caliper ears for running dual calipers on these knuckles. I have a set of 6 shooter knuckles that I was planning to use (before I found yours) and one of the things I really like about the 6 shooters is the ability to run twin calipers.

Peter Straub

Interesting, I've never seen anyone run dual calipers. Have you done this before?

The reason there are caliper mounts on both sides of the 6-shooters is to make them universal, no right or left side knuckles, the same casting fits both sides. I think that I even mentioned this to Billy early in his process.

[Behemoth60]

Originally Posted by EarlKann

Interesting, I've never seen anyone run dual calipers. Have you done this before?

Yes, but in a different application. With a hydroboost master from a school bus, and a proper hydraulic pump providing the power, I ran 8 4 piston calipers. Braking was not a problem. Breaking was, though.

Originally Posted by EarlKann

The reason there are caliper mounts on both sides of the 6-shooters is to make them universal, no right or left side knuckles, the same casting fits both sides.

Indeed, but you can also double caliper them. I have not done it on the 6 shooters, but I was going to. Twin four pistons on the 6 shooters with hydroboost were in the plans until I stumbled upon a way to use an 80 series birfield. Adding ears to make these knuckls ambidextrous would be awesome for several reasons:

Reduce manufacturing costs, with only needing to make one casting
Reduce the number of spares I have to carry, so a single spare knuckle can repair either side.
I can run twin calipers for super duper braking power.

I have exactly three 6 shooters on my shelf that I will gladly put out in the next garage sale in favour of these. The extra ears would make them perfect for me, so I can order three knuckles and four calipers!

[toy4x4ota]

Originally Posted by Electric-Mayhem

I'm getting super psyched since this is starting to come together....

Steering ram mount done, studs installed, top truss done and I just have to weld the link mounts and such on before mockup of the links and such start.

Still need to figure out what size bolts I'll need for the steering tie rods and where to get the right size spacers to weld in for it. Its still probably going to be a few weeks before I get it all together and back on the road, but besides needing to sand down a few things due to tolerances being a bit off I've been very impressed with the quality on these. Not sure if the pre-load slugs were supposed to be press on, but I had to press the trunion on to it. Seems to be working allright, so I'll assume it is designed that way.

I'm super jealous of that fabbed axle that Ruffstuff is putting together. I could probably afford the housing right now, but I want to go with a Ford 9" one or at the very least a Toyota 9.5" one and can't afford the ring and pinion and a locker for it right now. We'll see how the 8" elocker does me for now.

Anyone know what the caster angle is supposed to be on an FJ80 axle. Seems like the with these knuckles the pinion will be pointed up a bit if steering pivots completely flat, but I'm not sure.

Josh

the housing is looking great. I just got mine all sptripped and ready to roll with leaf spring perches, and now my roomate talked me into going links up front. Are you going to doing a 3 or 4 link. I am really wanting to go four link up front, but with out any experience with links, they are both intimidating. Looking forward to seeing what you go for. I am still collecting parts, and now even more with the new thought of going links.

Dallas

[zukijames]

How was koh? These knuckles and ruff stuff housings are going to be very popular in the ultra 4 world I think.

Billybob is the ruff stuff axle your using a 8 inch ring gear or 9.5?

[Electric-Mayhem]

Originally Posted by toy4x4ota

the housing is looking great. I just got mine all sptripped and ready to roll with leaf spring perches, and now my roomate talked me into going links up front. Are you going to doing a 3 or 4 link. I am really wanting to go four link up front, but with out any experience with links, they are both intimidating. Looking forward to seeing what you go for. I am still collecting parts, and now even more with the new thought of going links.

Dallas

Its going to be a 4 link for me. Truss up front is for full hydro, and I'm using the Ruffstuff horizontal link mount for the uppers. Pulled my mini-truck axle out last night and will be starting to get it all mocked up with the this axle pretty soon. I was going to do 3 link, but decided that I would rather not try to cram so much stuff into an already busy area. Going 4 link allows for a simpler setup. One partial downside is that you need to go Full Hydro with it due to it not getting along well with a steering linkage. Not really a downside since I think its a good match for this, but it makes it less highway friendly. I like it though as its super beef and allows you to put the axle wherever you want to since you don't have to link it to the steering box anymore.

This is my first time setting up links too, and while it is seemingly daunting its not as bad as you think. Definitely takes more time for a newb, but I'm being slow and methodical and did a ton of reading and such to get ready. There are a couple threads on Pirate that are worth looking at that are all linked in the Toyota Bible thread and if you search. I would say the only two things I can recommend is that its worth taking your time and doing it right, and to use brackets that allow for adjustment wherever you can. I'm taking my own advice and I have a feeling I will be happy to have the ability to make changes without having to cut brackets off and such.

Billy can get you a decent deal on anything Ruffstuff, and so far the Ruffstuff brackets and heims are doing a great job for me.

I do wish they made a FJ80 specific Truss, as I had to spend a few hours modifying the FJ40/60 one to fit (most specifically that it didn't provide a wide enough platform to mount the links wide enough). Otherwise, no complaints and seems to be top notch, well designed and thought out stuff.

I have my axle all painted up and the upper link mount tacked on. Once I have the frame cleaned up a bit I'll have the lower link mounts tacked on and will do some bind testing and will have some more interesting pictures to look at. Should be there by the end of the week, but we'll see.

[Electric-Mayhem]

Originally Posted by billybob13

to be honest, there's no need for dual calipers as these have stronger brakes than the mini axles even with the upgraded brakes. thanks for finding this, and thanks for the interest!


looking good josh! the trunion pin is supposed to be a press fit into the arm, but not a really tight press fit. i wanted it to be tight in the arm, but loose enough to turn the set screw by hand with an allen wrench to set pre-load.

i understand there may be some minor issues with tollerances in these, but over time i can make adjustments/improvements with help from your feedback.

thanks for all your support, i really appreciate it!

and yes, the ruffstuff housings are sexy and strong, i have one going under my rig soon, just trying to find the time! lol.

I actually meant the trunnion bearing onto the trunion pin/slug, not the pin/slug into the arm itself. It takes a bit to get the slug into the hole for the arm (like a solid thwack with a hammer or just using the bolts to push it gently), but I definitely had to press the trunnion bearing onto the pin.

That was the main issue I had with tolerances. I do know that it would be slightly easier if it was a tight slip fit like the Toyota caps are, since you could drop it in from the top before bolt the the arms on, but its not that bad.

The only other spot I had to clearance a bit was one of the holes from the preload need a tiny bit of work with a carbide burr because one of the threaded holes was restricting the preload slug. Nothing big and nothing I wouldn't expect from a custom casting but if you are QCing its something to check maybe.

Like I said above....I'll be posting pictures as things progress. The more I work with these the more I think I made the right choice. More importantly, your thought process shines through in the design and I have zero worries about these lasting a lifetime and providing a very strong basis to build my rig off of.

[zukijames]

I think next is a Trunion eliminator kit for these axles

[carslut]

did anyone run a set of these knuckles on a rig in KOH? im wondering how well an axles with these would hold up to that kind of abuse vs. a d-60 with aftermarket knuckles or something of the likes.

[toy4x4ota]

Originally Posted by Electric-Mayhem

Its going to be a 4 link for me. Truss up front is for full hydro, and I'm using the Ruffstuff horizontal link mount for the uppers. Pulled my mini-truck axle out last night and will be starting to get it all mocked up with the this axle pretty soon. I was going to do 3 link, but decided that I would rather not try to cram so much stuff into an already busy area. Going 4 link allows for a simpler setup. One partial downside is that you need to go Full Hydro with it due to it not getting along well with a steering linkage. Not really a downside since I think its a good match for this, but it makes it less highway friendly. I like it though as its super beef and allows you to put the axle wherever you want to since you don't have to link it to the steering box anymore.

This is my first time setting up links too, and while it is seemingly daunting its not as bad as you think. Definitely takes more time for a newb, but I'm being slow and methodical and did a ton of reading and such to get ready. There are a couple threads on Pirate that are worth looking at that are all linked in the Toyota Bible thread and if you search. I would say the only two things I can recommend is that its worth taking your time and doing it right, and to use brackets that allow for adjustment wherever you can. I'm taking my own advice and I have a feeling I will be happy to have the ability to make changes without having to cut brackets off and such.

Billy can get you a decent deal on anything Ruffstuff, and so far the Ruffstuff brackets and heims are doing a great job for me.

I do wish they made a FJ80 specific Truss, as I had to spend a few hours modifying the FJ40/60 one to fit (most specifically that it didn't provide a wide enough platform to mount the links wide enough). Otherwise, no complaints and seems to be top notch, well designed and thought out stuff.

I have my axle all painted up and the upper link mount tacked on. Once I have the frame cleaned up a bit I'll have the lower link mounts tacked on and will do some bind testing and will have some more interesting pictures to look at. Should be there by the end of the week, but we'll see.

thanks for the resonse. I am going to do full hydro, just with a single ended ram though. I look forward to watching your build to see what you do. I have researched a ton already, and I still have a ton more to do. Right now it just thinking and buying parts.

[zukijames]

Originally Posted by carslut

did anyone run a set of these knuckles on a rig in KOH? im wondering how well an axles with these would hold up to that kind of abuse vs. a d-60 with aftermarket knuckles or something of the likes.

im not sure if they did or not but i have a feeling there will be people running them next year..

if things go good i would like to make it to the lcq and see how my little zuk does

[billybob13]

Originally Posted by Electric-Mayhem

I actually meant the trunnion bearing onto the trunion pin/slug, not the pin/slug into the arm itself. It takes a bit to get the slug into the hole for the arm (like a solid thwack with a hammer or just using the bolts to push it gently), but I definitely had to press the trunnion bearing onto the pin.

That was the main issue I had with tolerances. I do know that it would be slightly easier if it was a tight slip fit like the Toyota caps are, since you could drop it in from the top before bolt the the arms on, but its not that bad.

The only other spot I had to clearance a bit was one of the holes from the preload need a tiny bit of work with a carbide burr because one of the threaded holes was restricting the preload slug. Nothing big and nothing I wouldn't expect from a custom casting but if you are QCing its something to check maybe.

Like I said above....I'll be posting pictures as things progress. The more I work with these the more I think I made the right choice. More importantly, your thought process shines through in the design and I have zero worries about these lasting a lifetime and providing a very strong basis to build my rig off of.

the pins are made to the same tollerances as the stock pins, unfortunately even all the stock pins i've worked with were a PITA to remove. it's hard to say what the magic number is, but a little looser would make things easier. it's hard because i'd rather have moving parts tight than loose, it helps them last longer by avoiding premature wear.

Originally Posted by carslut

did anyone run a set of these knuckles on a rig in KOH? im wondering how well an axles with these would hold up to that kind of abuse vs. a d-60 with aftermarket knuckles or something of the likes.

not yet. but the big dogs with 400hp+ and 5,000lb cars probably aren't interested in toyota axles. some of the strongest parts available get destroyed in that race, i would think the best yota axle ever built could suffer some damage if under one of those fast heavy cars.

[zukijames]

i think a 400 horse light rig could benifit from toyota axles..


those big heavy rigs are spending thousands trying to get strong light parts.. front and rear ruff stuff fj80 axles weigh the same as a front dana 60!

if you run a stock 80 series you save even more weight..

the thing is 400 horse is lowend for koh..

i have 300 maybe just a hair over.. and will be running a 35 hp shot of nitrous.. or 70 not sure yet..


i will let everyone know how things are holding up once i get everything put together

[billybob13]

Originally Posted by zukijames

i think a 400 horse light rig could benifit from toyota axles..


those big heavy rigs are spending thousands trying to get strong light parts.. front and rear ruff stuff fj80 axles weigh the same as a front dana 60!

if you run a stock 80 series you save even more weight..

the thing is 400 horse is lowend for koh..

i have 300 maybe just a hair over.. and will be running a 35 hp shot of nitrous.. or 70 not sure yet..


i will let everyone know how things are holding up once i get everything put together

i hear you on that james.

but the nitrous, that may not be beneficial in a race like KOH. on a 10 second hillclimb, sure. or if you just need to pass.

looking forward to seeing you in action with the new set-up.

[zukijames]

i think it could be quite beneficial for a pass or to keep in the power and not have to down shift half way up a hill ... and probably a little shot here and there out of the corners to help my little 4.0 get up to speed..

but i can see how if you got to happy with it it could ruin a day fast

im pretty excited about the new set up too..

the old one i was always worried something was going to blow up .

this set up will be alot more reliable and hopefully hold up to some serious abuse!

[Dirty Rock Star]

I dont suppose anyone has a set of these knuckles they would be willing to onsell?
i need a set for a comp in 4 weeks and seeing what backup plan may be out there.

[billybob13]

Originally Posted by Dirty Rock Star

I dont suppose anyone has a set of these knuckles they would be willing to onsell?
i need a set for a comp in 4 weeks and seeing what backup plan may be out there.

if grant doesn't hand over the set that was coming back to me, i'll be willing to send you my personal set next week. this means my rig will be down longer, but you'll hopefully be able to get yours ready for your comp.

[zukijames]

Originally Posted by billybob13

if grant doesn't hand over the set that was coming back to me, i'll be willing to send you my personal set next week. this means my rig will be down longer, but you'll hopefully be able to get yours ready for your comp.

now thats some customer service right there!

anyword on when the batch will be done?

[Dirty Rock Star]

billy that is the best customer service i have heard of.

thanks champion thats unreal and puts my mind at rest.

EDIT-
From last feedback i will need your personal knuckles mate.
Billy if you can sort this out in time i will mention you in my memoires!

[Dirty Rock Star]

hey billy anyupdate champ?

[billybob13]

pm's replied, thanks guys.

[Dirty Rock Star]

ive just paid for the last set around.
bloody stoked now to sort out pickup.

[billybob13]

Originally Posted by Dirty Rock Star

ive just paid for the last set around.
bloody stoked now to sort out pickup.

you hould have these tomorrow, thanks!

for everyone else, these should be ready to ship in a week.

[Dirty Rock Star]

The 3rd party still won't hand them over. how annoying.

EDIT: billy still no joy if i cant get access to them by midday wed aussie time can i get a refund as i need to make a move one way or the other??
cheers
Twon

[Dirty Rock Star]

billy i cannot get a response from the 3rd party which is uncool i wanted to run these at tuff truck next week.
Grant still says he hasnt heard from youto confirm payment???
Ive gotta get my fab guy to make something now.
Can you sort me out a refund please if grant wont let me have the knuckles ive paid for.

Tony.