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Eliminating a 4" lift block as cheaply as possible

3K views 25 replies 14 participants last post by  Grumpy_old_fart 
#1 ·
So, my buddy has a '05 Silverado 1500 4x4. It's just a daily driver, not a wheeler, but he also tows a ski boat with it. The issue he's having is fairly significant axle wrap.

He had a ~6" ProComp lift installed about 30k miles ago, and, as far as I can tell, that lift consisted of a 2" lift shackle and a 4" block in the rear. No traction bars or ladder bars, and no add-a-leaf. Well, obviously the block has not treated his springs well!

He took the truck back to the stop and they told him he needed ladder bars and it would cost $600 installed. He called me for advice and I'm thinking that it would be a lot better to get rid of the blocks all together and that he shouldn't have axle wrap issues again for a long time, even without the ladder bars, right? I build grocery getters, so I'm not used to dealing with actual horse power :flipoff2:

He doesn't want to go any taller, and he's trying to do this on the cheap. I see that some Superlift, 6" lift springs can be had for under $400, but that's more lift than he wants and I'm not sure if that is the best option? Are there really only two manufacturers that make springs for this truck (Superlift and SkyJacker)??? Should we consider an shackle flip and stock replacement springs?

Thanks guys,
Billy
 
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#5 ·
This looks perfect IF the stock springs aren't shot. Do you think it's more likely that they're wrapping because of the additional leverage the blocks are causing, or because the springs are shot, or both? I guess, even if the springs need to be replaced, this would be the best way to do it, right? It would just be awesome if he could keep his current springs.

Thanks for the response,
Billy
 
#3 ·
I would try to fab up some traction bars, you can buy everything new, fab it, and install it for way cheaper than $600. I aint no expert on lifted leaf springs and what not but i rather install a set of traction bars and know it will help the problem then install different leaf packs and hope it solves the problem.
 
#8 ·
LOL, yeah, thanks for catching that. I was told that this truck had 6" of lift in the rear; I measured a 4" block and verified that there was no add-a-leaf or replacement lift pack, so, I ASSumed that the remaining 2" had to come from the shackle. Since it's in tension, I figured the stock shackle must have been 2" longer than the one on the truck. Well, come to find out that's not the case, so now I'm thinking that this truck must only have a 4" lift. (Jeep Cherokee's don't do shackles in tension :flipoff2: )

Chris at ORD actually helped me realize this when I called them this morning, after initially posting. He also thought the springs should be fine.

Anyway, I'm going to try to find some measurements that confirm this truck only has a 4" lift, and then order the ORD kit.

I appreciate all the help guys!
Billy
 
#9 ·
GM IFS trucks always seem to sit lower in the front than the rear. Lift kits always come the way you explain 6" in the front 4" in the rear or 8" in the front and only 6" in the rear.

I think they do this to allow you T-bars to not be cranked up to be level this way you are pretty much leveled out by lifting the front more than the rear.
 
#10 · (Edited)
remember also that with a shackle flip the diff rotates, so unless your going to re-do the spring perches to get the u-joints back in phase you may have to run a front cv/double cardan joint on the rear driveshaft.


another vote for making an anti-wrap bar and run what you got if you want the cheapest setup possible. check ruffstuff, they got the parts.
 
#12 ·
remember also that with a shackle flip the diff rotates, so unless your going to re-do the spring perches to get the u-joints back in phase you may have to run a front cv/double cardan joint on the rear driveshaft.
I appreciate you pointing that out. I can handle that if need be, but really, the pinion should have been adjusted up when the truck was lifted in the first place, and it wasn't... shouldn't this actually help correct the pinion angle?
Much thanks,
Billy
 
#14 ·
the pinion should be in line with the driveline.
In other words if you drew a line from the crank, through the tranny, and through the t-case to the output then the pinion should still be in that same line.

If you don't, the ujoint closest to the t-case will spin at a different speed than the one closest to the pinion. Then you have a popping u-joint or vibrations.
 
#19 ·
In theory you don't even need a full ladder bar. Just a single link attached to either tube, near the bottom and preferably near the center section, with the other end anchored to the frame or a crossmember. The forward attach point should be in line with the forward spring mount. In this arrangement the forward half of the springs acts as the upper links while the actual link is the lower member. The lift block provides suitable separation between the two "links", effectively giving you a 3 link. All you need is 3 feet of DOM, two weld-on bushing mounts, urethane bushings with sleeves, and a pair of brackets for the axle and frame.

You notice I prefaced this with "In theory". It looks good on paper, and I see no reason why it wouldn't work, but it isn't the best setup. Just the cheapest. OTOH, lift blocks are not the best setup either, so a single link would save him money when he decides he really should get either proper springs or a flip kit :D
I think you guys should stop giving advice. One of you is telling him to point his rear axle at the tcase output. This would be correct if he has a CV rear driveshaft. Stock it doesn't and he did not specify what he has for a driveline configuration so stop making assumptions and giving him advice in advance.

In theory, your traction bar does nothing than cause a bind in the rear suspension. You need a triangulated bar attaching to the top and bottom of the axle tube (a radius arm) in order to make the bar go up and down during axle wrap. Then you need to attach it to the frame.

Depending on how much of a mall crawler you have, this can be fixed point with a single bushing if you want to kill wheel travel. This would be fine on a street machine. You would really want a hinging shackle with two pivot points to allow the bar to change length during wheel travel while keeping the bar from level to eliminate axle wrap.

The very fact that someone needs to ask on Pirate how to eliminate a lift block is pretty :rainbow:
 
#15 ·
To verify the above most lifts are shorter in the back to level the truck since when stock they are higher in the rear.

For most lift blocks being tapered that is true, but the shackle flip does the same basic thing. Don't put too much thought into it because it's not rocket science...there is the absolute ideal angle, acceptable angles, and then the angles that will require some correction.

My vote would be for the shackle flip. A traction bar will take care of the axle wrap but it's a band-aid for the blocks you still have. I doubt a traction bar would be any cheaper and would be more labor intensive as you would have to fabricate it.
 
#16 ·
if its not a wheeler do the traction bar. who ever quoted you 600$ or what ever must like beer or something cause there certainly aint no where near that in materials or labor. unless he's real good or something
 
#17 ·
here's the whole kit- ready to weld with all parts: http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/AWKIT.html

they're using DOM which is little more expensive, but is very rugged. i used square tubing, less expensive. if you know someone with a welder and a grinder it takes a couple hours to weld one up. one note: the longer you can make it the better.
 
#18 ·
In theory you don't even need a full ladder bar. Just a single link attached to either tube, near the bottom and preferably near the center section, with the other end anchored to the frame or a crossmember. The forward attach point should be in line with the forward spring mount. In this arrangement the forward half of the springs acts as the upper links while the actual link is the lower member. The lift block provides suitable separation between the two "links", effectively giving you a 3 link. All you need is 3 feet of DOM, two weld-on bushing mounts, urethane bushings with sleeves, and a pair of brackets for the axle and frame.

You notice I prefaced this with "In theory". It looks good on paper, and I see no reason why it wouldn't work, but it isn't the best setup. Just the cheapest. OTOH, lift blocks are not the best setup either, so a single link would save him money when he decides he really should get either proper springs or a flip kit :D
 
#23 ·
I agree with what you are saying but the cost justification is flat out stupid.

By the time you add up the cost of building this supposed one link traction bar, you may as well just get rid of the lift blocks which suck in every aspect and do a shackle flip.

The other argument is that if you cannot afford the slight increase in cost to build a radiused trac bar that attaches to the top and bottom of the axle tube, you shouldn't be in this sport. The Ruff Stuff kit isn't exactly breaking the bank.

A one link bar that was described on here technically will keep the axle from wanting to wrap but it will be pushing against the leaf spring and the center pin on the axle. That force of the trac bar has to be opposed somewhere in the suspension. When I say radius arm (commonly referred to as a link used in the front of an old Ford, Rover, or Cruiser), I mean that it is attached top and bottom at the axle.
 
#24 ·
a ladder bar with a pivoting front link will plant the tire and allow plenty of axle movement if properly set up.

You are correct in stating that a single link bar to the bottom of the axle is a waste of time.... Thats something even I wont argue. I hate those things. They belong on mall crawlin shit that is used to pick up chicks at the local high school.
 
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