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AMS247 2nd Generation Build

19K views 51 replies 14 participants last post by  859054  
#1 · (Edited)
I decided to start a build page on this site and maybe gain some guidance and info on how to to take the build further.


The goal for the truck is to build it for crawling, some medium speed trails and to retain it as a daily driver as it's my only vehicle.


This is a diesel, and I realize that building something with an engine this heavy usually isn't the preferred choice, but this is the 2nd diesel Dodge that I've owned and I love the engine platform. I own most of the engine tools, it's simple, reliable and I can build lots of power with it once I decided to spend money in that direction. Plus, at the time that I'm writing this, I'm on 41.5" tires and still retain close to 20 mpg on the hwy which I'm happy with :)

This is a REALLY slow build. I've already been working on this for approximately five years, and I'm not someone who always thinks about taking pictures so I definitely lack them along the way.


I took this picture the day I bought the truck:
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A little later...
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I've had a bad experience in my last truck where the CAD actuator failed and left me in a hard spot when I needed 4x4. So the next thing to do was the Ford manual hub conversion to eliminate Dodge's set-up. I followed 79FordGirl's thread (http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/dodg...dge/874442-dodge-ram-2500-4x4-dana-60-hub-removal-converison-ford-knuckles.html) and went from there.

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One of the first things that I did was swapping the bed and wheels to convert it from DRW to SRW. The process was very simple. The front axle only needed the dually wheel adapter unbolted from the front and that itself was enough to convert the front. I never touched the rear axle and just bolted on SRW wheels and it looked fine. The DRW axle in these trucks do have a wider wms-wms than the single, but it wasn't noticeable.

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#2 · (Edited)
I decided to attack the KDP, re-torque the interior timing case bolts (5), install a Fluidampr and switch out to the newer style oil pump.

The thing I was interested in most was the difference between the original 12v oil pump and the revised 12v/24v oil pump that came in the 24v trucks. This revised pump is also the pump Cummins now provides to us 12v guys. My engine is a 98' 12v, so I was even curious to see if this model had the better pump in it. The newer 12v/24v pump is advertised to flow more fluid, and help the higher RPM engines more with the oil output. Sure enough, there was a noticeable change between them.

Factory 12v Oil Pump on the LEFT, Revised 12v/24v Oil Pump on the RIGHT.

Obviously the placement of the gears have changed. The mounting block beneath the gears have exactly the same exterior proportions.
I do apologize in advance, at the time I took these pictures I did not have a micrometer in my possession.

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Here you can notice under the gears with the pump on the LEFT has a deeper dish under it than the RIGHT pump.

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Gear sizes are exactly the same.

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The back sides appear the same, but in fact are different.

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Here is the factory 12v Oil Pump installed on the engine. Notice where the gear sits on the crank.

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Revised 12v/24v Oil Pump sitting farther back on the crank. Still in complete contact.

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So there is in fact a difference of interior volume between the factory 12v oil pump and the revised 12v/24v oil pump. I do not know how accurate the Cummins oil pressure gauges are, but even the gauge for the truck was showing an increase in oil pressure.

Hopefully that answered any ones questions if they were ever curious of the difference like I was. The extra oil flow will definitely help any of you higher spinning engines guys out there.
 
#3 ·
Lastly, here is a picture of the Fluidampr installed. You can see the re-located crank position sensor (RPM Sensor) for the Fluidampr that comes with the purchase. One down side I did not realize is that to change the belts on the truck you now have to loosen the sensor since it is on the exterior of the belt routing. Adjusting is extremely easy and takes about ten seconds to do, but just pointing it out to every one. Driving with this dampener installed, I felt a significant difference going towards 2,000 RPM and above. There is definitely a lot less vibrations.

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#4 · (Edited)
Here is the difference between Thuren 3" Coils and factory warn out ones.

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3" coils, Overland shocks, sway bar extended links along with longer stainless steel brake lines. I also put in new rubber spring isolaters with the Carli ring on the bottom, which added a little more lift.

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Bought some Method Wheels at this time as well. My plan since day one was to be on 40"+ tires so I was thinking 20" wheels would be a good choice. You'll later see that I changed my mind with a different wheel size.

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At this time I came across a great deal for a Spartan Locker through 4ws.com that I couldn't pass up, so I bought one!

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Spartan Locker installed. One of the easiest things to do! From knocking out the roll pin to remove the spider gears to installing the roll pin back in for the Spartan Locker took me about 3 minutes to do.



Along with that, since I have Ford Dana 60 outers on my front axle, I decided to ditch the factory style spindle nut design and I picked up some Stage 8 X-Lock spindle nuts. If I plan on jumping this truck down the line, I'll need to be confident my wheel won't fall off with the ride home. The Stage 8 Spindle nut is beefier than the original, and more simple to install as well.

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Stage 8 X-Lock Spindle Nut

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How the truck loked at this state after I installed the Method wheels.

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#5 · (Edited)
I ended up buying a 2nd set of steering knuckles. I sent them off to fourwheelsupply.net and had them machine the knuckles for their high steer arms. I still haven't got around to utilizing the high steer arms, but my plan from on this is to use some EMF joints and build a double shear set-up. At that time I'll switch out the bolts for Reid high steer studs.

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Dynatrac Ball joints installed, Knuckles with high steer arms have been added as well as a RuffStuff differential cover.
 
#6 · (Edited)
I flared the bedsides approx. 4" per side. Now my tires are completely covered. They were sticking out quit a bit and I wasn't really interested in being pulled over.

Before and After picture:
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Puchased a RuffStuff shackle flip kit as well. This paired with a 6" shackle gave the truck a perfect rear height.

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Hamilton Cam Valve Springs w/ retainers and Keepers, Hamilton heavy duty pushrods and 4k GSK.

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#7 · (Edited)
Installed long arms.

I was able to drop the axle to remove the springs and hardware without spring compressors this time around and that was pretty awesome.

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Switched out the Thuren Overland shocks for King 2.5's from Thuren.

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Pushed the axle up through the motions to clearance everyhting out. All together I had to clearance the body mounts, track bar mount and some things on the axle.

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Since I was pushing my axle farther forward than usual, I decided to open the coil buckets up on the axle and body. Opened up the hole to 4.5". I figure if the Carli Dominator guys open theirs up to 4.5" with a larger shock than 3.0, and how they smash through the desert at high speeds, I'll be more than fine. After opening the holes up, 4.5" made it work perfectly.

Fitting up the shock.

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Since I was throwing Boogie Bumps on this, I was planning on welding them on. After fitting the shock and figuring out max up travel, I had to bring the mounting down and wouldn't be able to just weld them onto the factory cups; unless I wanted to destroy my shock...
Removed the old factory bump stop cups, being very careful of the brake line.

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Before I welded the new bump stop mounts up, I put on my limit strap mounts. Used a double shear mount on the axle end, and a clevis mount at the frame end. The alignment looks off in the picture, but that's because my axle is over 1' lower then what fully extended would give me which swing the axle back. At full droop, the mounts are in line.

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#8 · (Edited)
Before when I pushed the axle up for full bump, I had the track bar disconnected. I bolted it back up to check clearance on the diff cover. As you can see below, I was in direct contact with the straight bar design that I had...

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Since I needed a new track bar, I REALLY liked Carli's new design. So I bought the updated version of the Carli Track bar which features a uniball at one end, a Johnny Joint at the other along with 3/8" wall tubing. Carli claims that this bar has lasted a whole heck of a lot longer than their other bars with the bushings on their trips to Mexico, so this should last me forever!


Threw the Carli bar in, and had to clearance my mount to clear the bend. Other than that, the mounting of the ends was a nice tight fit.

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And Excitingly, the bar clears the diff cover!

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#9 · (Edited)
Another picture showing the bar, and the clearancing to the backside of the track bar mount.

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Aligning the bump stops for the truck that the Boogie Bumps will be mounting to before I weld them on completely.

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Bump mounts are welded on and painted.

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I decided to use Cam delete bolts on the front. I'm not sure if this was by design, but the washers were way to big to fit into the cam slots on the axle bracket. I placed all 4 of them on a bolt, sinched them together and flattened the sides to make them fit.

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Now they are a press fit :)

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FINISHED PRODUCT!
I still have my high steer arms not being used. Because of my track bar bracket, with the track bar fully collapsed, the axle still sits more towards the passenger side. Everything still clears, and BARELY on the driver side but it works for the time being. I'll be modifying the bracket to center everything out, but first I need to plan what I would like to do with my steering and high steer arms. Because the track bar after all needs to follow the angle of the drag link.

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#10 ·
This will give a little insight to how I was able to pull my bedsides out 4" per side.

Pics showing how the flare looks compared to the body.

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Showing how the body lines of the bed do not line up anymore. You can also see how I opened up the wheel well to allow my 37's to clear the body with ease.

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The fender wells are bonded together with the bedsides with an adhesive. On one side of my bed, after cutting the inside fender well, the outer side which should have been adhered to the bedside separated. I guess that is expected from a vehicle about 18 yrs old. So, I drilled a bunch of holes on the bottom of the lip going around the wheel opening. Then, placing the inner sheet metal wheel well against it, I spot welded each hole to make it flush and continue to hold that piece in. That sheet metal inner piece is crucial because that is what I was going to weld the supports to hold the flared look.

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For the actual spreading, I used a porta power which made it easy. For those who do not know, that is a hydraulic ram tool for prying, pushing or lifting. I used some scrap 2x4 wood and placed on end slanted and braced against the frame/leaf springs and another side against the bed to disperse the pressure more evenly over a larger area so I did not create any dents.

I slowly, but surely spread the bedsides making sure not to crease anything. About 2" out, it seemed the lower rear of the bed was keeping it from spreading. There is a support underneath near the bumper that had to go to spread the bed more. I wanted to clearance the bed anyways, so it wasn't a big deal for me.

Here you can see not only how the bottom of them bed is cut at an angle which you can see from the outside, but also the support is gone. It is cut right where the metal piece seems to be parallel with the ground.

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After cutting the support, I was able to freely push the bed out further. I pushed it out 4", I could have gone more, but my main purpose was to cover my rear tires, and that's what 4" did.

For the supports, I cut some 1/8" flat plate, and welded it in. At this point I was tired, and the metal wasn't very clean so the welds look horrible. It isn't an important structural part, so I didn't care too much, I know the welds penetrated fine.

Lastly, because I just wanted the extra reassurance that If someone hit my bed, or I tagged a branch with the bedsides that it wouldn't all of a sudden break all the supports I put in and go back to the way it was. I had some larger 1/8" plate scap that I drilled 3 holes in for a bolt in process. 2 bolts were going to go through the inside of the wheel well, and 1 bolt was going to go through the inside of the bed that you would be able to see.

I didn't mind the 1 bolt per side, I'd rather have the reassurance than the supports breaking. The sheet metal is thin, so even though I made proper penetration with the weld, there was a lot of tension pushing the bedsides out that far.

Showing all the supports welded in, along with the bolt on piece.

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#11 ·
Lastly, since the bedsides were now angled, instead of being perpendicular to the ground, the fuel lines to the fill up were pointing down, and the hoses were too short.

I picked up some longer hoses and cut to length. Approx. 4" longer. Then, there are 4 screws holding the fill cap onto the plastic box container on the bedsides. I loosened the bottom screws the most, with the upper screws the least, letting the fill tube straighten out and once again look normal.

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Showing the bolt going through the bed, You can spot it out on top of the fender well on the right side of the picture.

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Overall, the bodylines do not match up, and there is a bolt going through my bed where you can see. I don't mind that, and if I did, I could have used a different type of bolt and flipped it. My main thing was covering my tires since they stuck out so much and I achieved just that. I'd definitely do it again if I had to.
 
#13 · (Edited)
Next part I got into a rear axle swap, and shortened the truck. I really wanted rear disc brakes, and looking into disc brake conversions for the Dana 80 that I already had, they were about $450. Because of that I decided to just swap another axle entirely and went with an AAM 11.5 out of a 2010 Ram truck.

Gutted it:

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Picked up these goodies for it:

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Trussed:

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Painted:

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I realized posting this today I never took any pictures after I installed the new years and carrier. I did find out that the crush sleeve on these rear ends took an immense amount of torque. The 1/2" impact wrench that I had weren't capable of crushing the sleeve on the pinion. So I ended up buying a torque multiplier for lug nuts, and welded up some scrap to hold the pinion flange.

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The scraps I had sitting around were pretty thin so I ended up reinforcing it a little. This help keep it straight, and bolted to the pinion flange let me crush the sleeve to spec with the torque multiplier.

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After all said and done, the square tube did start to cave in on the inside where is wasn't reinforced. It was only .125 thickness in that area, but that is all I had laying around.
 
#14 · (Edited)
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I put a lot of thought into cutting the frame down for a short bed. I've seen it done many ways online and finally made a choice on which route I wanted to take. The 2nd gen frame in a 2 piece frame from the factory. The back half is riveted on using eight rivets on the front leaf spring hanger, four rivets on the upper side of the cross member and two rivets on the bottom side of the cross member. Fourteen all together.

I knew that sixteen total inches needed to be cut from the frame itself between the axles. So to make sure I did it just right, I ended up taking measurements and welded some scrap straight bare to the side and top of where the two frame halves met.

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From there I removed the rivets and separated.

After it was separated, I measured out sixteen inches on the front of the frame, and removed.

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Putting the frame back together was as simple as lining the parts up and sliding them into each other. The back of the frame had a smaller height than the front half because the factory tapers the frames together. Removing the last sixteen inches also took that taper out.

So measuring the differences in my frame, the void of space left between them was 1-15/16". So to fill this I got some 2"x2" .250 tubing and removed 1/16" from the top. Slide that piece in and welded it all up. The frame itself is welded on the horizontal meetings of the frame.

I read a lot online about welding to frames, and one things i wanted to stay away from was welding vertically and creating a weak spot for the frame to crack.

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#16 · (Edited)
Took some pictures when my new tires arrived, bald 37" Toyo MTs next to the 41.5" PBRs.

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Ordered TR Hardrock wheels from Ben at Filthy Motorsports as well. These wheels are advertised as 17x10 wheels. I went ahead and ordered the spacer for thick beaded tires as well and even with the spacer, the wheels measure exactly 10" wide.

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All mounted up. 37" Toyo MT on a 20" Method wheel, next to the new 41.5" PBR mounted on 17" TR wheel.

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All mounted up. Since this picture I've mounted a short bed and rebuilt the front axles with 35 spline chromoly axle shafts, and Yukon hubs.

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#19 ·
I still need to mount my ARB compressor for the axles. I'm stuck on where I should mount it.

I like the idea of mounting it under the passenger seat since that's a spot I can't see being used for anything else. If I mounted it and used some rubber bushing that should help decrease some sound and vibrations, but for those who have mounted theirs in the cab, does anyone find it bothersome?

Second choice would be to mount it inside my tool box in my bed. It wouldn't take up that much space in there, but I do like having as much room in there as possible. Plus It might be more difficult for the compressor to suck air as compared to a cleaner cab?

Any thoughts on where I should mount the compressor?
 
#22 ·
Certainly! I just built them out of scrap and something easy since this wasn't a permanent solution. My plan is to later build some quick detachable mud flaps so when I hit the trail is takes a mater of seconds to remove and throw in the bed.

I really like what you've done with the truck. Slick job on shortening the frame, it seems lots of guys wind up butchering it.

How far forwards did you move the front axle relative to stock?
Thanks!
I moved the front axle approximately 2" forward from where it sat from the factory.
 
#26 ·
I'm really happy with the way that it rides. Flex has very noticeably smoother transitions. Also easier to work on since I don't need coil compressors to remove the coil springs now ;)

I'm running a 12" stroke shock. If my fender's weren't in the way, I would be achieving 7.5" of up travel, which is what I was at while on 37" tires. I WILL be cutting up the fenders to gain my up travel back this summer. I'm procrastinating since I'll be doing it in a way for it to still look good and retain Dodge body elements. As it sits now, I'm limited to approximately 6" up travel.
 
#27 ·
HUGE difference if you're comparing from stock, or even Thuren Overland shocks. If I were to describe it in any way, I would say the jump from Overlands (which I believe are emulsion type Fox shocks) to King 2.5's provide a large jump in a planted feel. I was very impressed how well these shocks soaked stuff up compared to what I was used to.

At the same time I switched shocks, I also threw the long arms on, so that is going to change it as well. I would not be able to give an isolated change just on what the shocks did alone, but the planted feel is attributed to shocks in themselves.
 
#28 ·
Since I've owed this truck and put in some A pillar gauges, I've had about 3 instances in my time driving over the past few years where a car was hidden behind the a pillar in a blind spot and it would surprise me. Since I do drive this vehicle on the daily, I wasn't comfortable with that and finally decided to relocate the gauges.

I thought I'd post these pictures up since I think it makes a large enough difference and clearly shows how much more bulk having A pillar gauges creates for a blind spot. This picture was taken approximated where my head sits while driving.

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#32 · (Edited)
Lol, Yes I wasn't too concerned with towing when I decided to go with these tires :) I did my research though. If any of you have seen the Poly Performance truck, that thing has been running these same tires for years now. Originally they were on a 17" wheel then later went to the same tire on a 20" wheel. I talked with one of the guys who worked at Poly and they were towing with them quite regularly. Of course the 20" wheel move was to take out all that side wall flex they had problems with while towing. Good thing I'm not building this as a tow pig though :)

that gives me some ideas thanks for the post!

question whats your take on those rear shackle mounts?
RuffStuff put's out quality stuff at great prices. I wouldn't hesitate to buy them for another truck :)