Friends of Fordyce Annual Public Meeting

[Tinman]

This years public meeting will be at the Cal 4x4 Association office at:

8120 36th Ave.
Sacramento, CA 95824

Date:

Thursday, April 19th

Time:

7pm

On the agenda will be our plans for this year and the public will be able to voice their questions, concerns and ideas.

Refreshments will be served.

Hope to see you there!

[scottz]

in!

[tunaman]

^yep, me too. time for some signage

[JDunn]

Originally Posted by tunaman

^yep, me too. time for some signage

I like the way you think! I think signage will help tremendously.

Some signs like:

PLEASE
USE NEW TRAIL
This trail is being rehabilitated
Thank YOU for helping keep Fordyce open!


I'll see everyone there!

[chainrnng]

oh great turn it into the look of the rubicon. I recently went to the rubicon for the first time and was amazed at the amount of signage and rules. It has the feel of a rule infested nightmare.
Signs are not the answer after signs comes fences then closure
jason

[pepe]

I'm still looking for the "FREE BEER" sign.

[tunaman]

Originally Posted by chainrnng

oh great turn it into the look of the rubicon. I recently went to the rubicon for the first time and was amazed at the amount of signage and rules. It has the feel of a rule infested nightmare.
Signs are not the answer after signs comes fences then closure
jason

i understand your frustration with the rubicon. but the signs i was talking about for fordyce are replacing the ones at the trailhead that people have destroyed and i wont speak for FOF but something might be needed at the bypasses that were constructed because no matter the barrier people just drive over or around them (multiple times)

[chainrnng]

Im new to 4x4 hobby but have made about a dozen trips through fordyce this last season and fell in love with the remote and challeging nature of this trail. I recently about a month ago did my first trip to rubicon and was expecting a similar experience. That was not the case it was like a asphalt highway of signs,rules,paving stone lined water crossings and tree hugger snow shoe and cross ski fanatics. This was not a great experience.

[Tinman]

Originally Posted by chainrnng

oh great turn it into the look of the rubicon. I recently went to the rubicon for the first time and was amazed at the amount of signage and rules. It has the feel of a rule infested nightmare.
Signs are not the answer after signs comes fences then closure
jason

The Rubicon and Fordyce are two completely different animals. As was mentioned the Adopt-a-Trail signs need replacing due to vandalism.

As for other signs we do want to clearly mark the trail in several areas since we've had so much "I couldn't tell where the trail was so that's why I was off trail." The old trail sections are definetly going to get so blocked this year they will be unusable. We're going to try and get a ripper into the mudhole section too so it will return to natural conditions much faster.

The FOF is not an advocate of excess signage. However there have been a couple of suggestions that are worthwhile. One being a sign pointing to the bypass of Winch Hill 1. We had an incident recently where a group was stuck on the winch hill forever not knowing there was a bypass 50 feet away. This type of sign will be for safety.

Rest assured,, the FOF will never advocate signs marking the trail every100 feet or reflectors glued to the rocks. Those things were a neccessary evil at the Con but there should never be a need for them on Fordyce.

[tunaman]

^ couldn't agree more

[JDunn]

Originally Posted by tunaman

^ couldn't agree more

Same here, well said Bret. I think we all are on the same page. With a couple well placed signs we can accomplish a lot.

Our issue like Bret said is people have the potential to drive on an old route because they do not know it is old and need to use the new trail.

We all love Fordyce for the same reasons and want to keep it that way.

[beefdawg]

Originally Posted by JDunn

Same here, well said Bret. I think we all are on the same page. With a couple well placed signs we can accomplish a lot.

Our issue like Bret said is people have the potential to drive on an old route because they do not know it is old and need to use the new trail.

We all love Fordyce for the same reasons and want to keep it that way.

yep,

[yotasmob]

I'll be there.

[kdub0013]

I am planning on attending.

[JDunn]

Back to the top!

See all of you in a few weeks.

[Tinman]

Hope to see you all at the meeting this Thursday at the Cal office. We'll have dessert's, coffee and tea. Hot chocolate for the kids too!

Our agenda will include information on our workdays, an early season clean up trail opening run and discussion about meetings I have attended on the PG&E relicensing that is ongoing. This may effect the water release profile for years to come on the Fordyce river.

We'll have an open discussion time as well.

Time and location is at the top of the page.

[atvobsession]

Originally Posted by chainrnng

Im new to 4x4 hobby but have made about a dozen trips through fordyce this last season and fell in love with the remote and challeging nature of this trail. I recently about a month ago did my first trip to rubicon and was expecting a similar experience. That was not the case it was like a asphalt highway of signs,rules,paving stone lined water crossings and tree hugger snow shoe and cross ski fanatics. This was not a great experience.

I'm confused. If you were there in February, how could it have been an asphalt highway....there was at least 1 foot of snow on the trail on most of the trail. How far did you go? Because in February, I saw no tracks at ALL past Little Sluice.

This was the trail on Feb 4, 2012...and I've been on the trail every weekend and haven't seen anyone beyond this point. (RIP old tree)



Since you are new....you need to understand, the Rubicon is under tremendous pressure for closure and behavioral reform of the users. In 2005, a whole section was closed due to human feces (over 700 lbs removed) and it's been a climb uphill to remain open since then. The old ways don't work anymore. There's too many people and signage and behavioral modification is the only way to change. The trail now, is cleaner than it has ever been since Jeeps started wheeling it over 60 years ago. So it's obviously working.

For now...the Fordyce has escaped the same pressures. But trust me, if a certain group (and the regulars know who) were to set sights on it....there's no way the trail would survive in current form. 3 water crossings? Without bridges....no chance.

As for the Rubicon...I know that trail backwards and forwards. There are LOTS of signs at each entrance (Loon, Tahoe, Wentworth). But once you leave the start, there are only mile marker signs placed by a Boy Scout to earn his Eagle Scout and occasional tree signs to help users stay on the trail. So I'm unclear what you are referring to the trail as a "highway of signs". The mile marker signs are for safety, since people come from all over the world to run the whole trail, if there was an emergency, the mile markers would help in terms of getting a location.

Welcome to the wheeling world....unfortunately, understanding the politics, is a requirement these days.

[atvobsession]

It appears likely I will be able to attend, if anyone wants to ask questions regarding the Rubicon, and what RTF is up to.

[pepe]

Originally Posted by atvobsession

I'm confused. If you were there in February, how could it have been an asphalt highway....there was at least 1 foot of snow on the trail on most of the trail. How far did you go? Because in February, I saw no tracks at ALL past Little Sluice.

This was the trail on Feb 4, 2012...and I've been on the trail every weekend and haven't seen anyone beyond this point. (RIP old tree)



Since you are new....you need to understand, the Rubicon is under tremendous pressure for closure and behavioral reform of the users. In 2005, a whole section was closed due to human feces (over 700 lbs removed) and it's been a climb uphill to remain open since then. The old ways don't work anymore. There's too many people and signage and behavioral modification is the only way to change. The trail now, is cleaner than it has ever been since Jeeps started wheeling it over 60 years ago. So it's obviously working.

For now...the Fordyce has escaped the same pressures. But trust me, if a certain group (and the regulars know who) were to set sights on it....there's no way the trail would survive in current form. 3 water crossings? Without bridges....no chance.

As for the Rubicon...I know that trail backwards and forwards. There are LOTS of signs at each entrance (Loon, Tahoe, Wentworth). But once you leave the start, there are only mile marker signs placed by a Boy Scout to earn his Eagle Scout and occasional tree signs to help users stay on the trail. So I'm unclear what you are referring to the trail as a "highway of signs". The mile marker signs are for safety, since people come from all over the world to run the whole trail, if there was an emergency, the mile markers would help in terms of getting a location.

Welcome to the wheeling world....unfortunately, understanding the politics, is a requirement these days.

Well said Ken, Amend brother!

[atvobsession]

Originally Posted by Tinman

Rest assured,, the FOF will never advocate signs marking the trail every100 feet or reflectors glued to the rocks. Those things were a neccessary evil at the Con but there should never be a need for them on Fordyce.

The reflectors are on solid granite, where the direction of the trail to new users is unclear. Secondarily, the reflectors are on private property. The entire Granite Bowl is on private property, and the land owners requested that there be some means to denote the direction of the trail to prevent users from wandering around aimlessly. We looked at many alternatives, and felt a few reflectors that would work day or night, was the best solution.

I think it was a fair trade off....access for reflectors.

[Tinman]

Originally Posted by atvobsession

The reflectors are on solid granite, where the direction of the trail to new users is unclear. Secondarily, the reflectors are on private property. The entire Granite Bowl is on private property, and the land owners requested that there be some means to denote the direction of the trail to prevent users from wandering around aimlessly. We looked at many alternatives, and felt a few reflectors that would work day or night, was the best solution.

I think it was a fair trade off....access for reflectors.

I wasn't slamming the FOTR. I fully understand the need on the Con. The Fordyce is a totally different situation and our users are pretty anti-sign unless we have a great need. I'll go over signage at the meeting for those that are interested in what we have planned.

[randii]

I'm triple-booked for Thursday night... how late do you think you'll be going?

Randii

[JDunn]

Good meeting last night!

[atvobsession]

Definitely....Great to see you all and put some faces to online names.


And Brett....Totally know, you know...I mentioned that last night. It's for others benefits...that do not know the who/why and where's.