Editorial: Driving while Intoxicated

[mountainhead]

I think many wheelers have had a drunken moment or two on the trail. From my experience heavy drinking and wheeling leads to bad things. People get hurt by mistake, climbing lines get careless, rigs get stuck and broken. I am not one to get pissed off when someone rolls down the trail with a beer in a cozy if they are acting resoponsibly. Getting shitfaced and proving how inbred you are doesn't make the trail fun for anyone. I think there is a general attitude with some people that "once in the woods, no rules apply". While it is true that there is no CHP waiting atop winch hill #2, that doesn't mean it is time for a sloshy free-for-all. This sport is about as much fun a person can have without driving a racecar (perhaps even more fun than that). These trails are not cake-walks though. They require good judgement and caution, two things booze impares. Having said that, I would be careful about posting pictures here. I want this sport to be as safe as it can be, but I also know how people take to their privacy being comprimised. Over the years I have seen people wasted, tweeked out, tripping balls etc. on the trail. I can only imagine the response if I had posted photos of them up on the net with names. These encounters have usually been some of the most uncomfortable moments I have had on the trails. Trying to confront these people about their poor choices has usually led to conflict. Ultimately I just try to give these people as much space as I can and not camp anywhere near them if possible. For me and many people out there, this is a family sport. People just need to remember to respect one another up there. So keep your eyes on your friends, keep them in check. It is easier for friends to moderate one-another than it is for stragers to get involved with a wasted idiot. Often there are rangers out on the trail. If someone is being dangerous then using them to resolve the problem is a safer route, IMHO. Is there a radio channel they track that you can call in on? If you do feel you need to act on a personal level to improve things, then hide your identity if at all possible. I would fear the backlash from the one crazy idiot who figures out your personal info and wants retribution.

[440-fide Ramcharger]

Originally Posted by yotee

dude did wrong and manned up to it. he also dosen't act like this any more.

mike

Well if he doesn't act like this anymore, maybe it was what he needed. Glad to hear he came around.

[Tinman]

Originally Posted by mountainhead

I think there is a general attitude with some people that "once in the woods, no rules apply".

Trying to confront these people about their poor choices has usually led to conflict.

To the first, sadly it seems to be on the rise.

To the second, too true.

[steveh]

I attended the Rubicon Trail Patrol Meeting last Month. The El Dorado County Sheriff supervisor of the off-road enforcement task force spoke, as well as Merlin, who lives on the Rubicon and works for the sheriffs dept.

First point they drove home: Always be safe. Do not approach obviously intoxicated and agitated people on the trail. Observe, get pictures, get license plate #'s, and report them at the first opportunity. It may not lead to an immediate arrest. However, LE will not be on the lookout for them. Eventfully they will get busted, if they keep being asshats.

If LE can be notified there is a situation they are needed for, and they can respond, let them. You can be a good witness later.

If LE shows up, and determines they need backup, the will back off and wait for help. Remember, they will bring in the #'s to keep themselves safe.

The story told to drive it home was this: 2 drunk guys are fighting, neither is getting the upper hand. If the Deputy intervenes, now it is 2 drunk guys vs one deputy, good chance of getting hurt. Deputy stays back, lets 2 drunk guys wear out, which is exactly what will happen. If one guy is really pummeling the other, they call for backup. In other words, they use numbers of deputy's to overcome the the odds to stay safe.

Be smart out there, do not put your self in a dangerous situation even when your right. It's not worth getting hurt. Eventually the asshats will get caught as we build our relationships with LE, and continue to educate each other and those new to the sport.

[Icemanii]

Excellent advise here, glad I decided to read this thread. It always worries me when people have to justify having a drink to have fun. Is the trail itself not enough fun without the booze? How often is the phase "I've only had a couple, I can handle it" heard?

If you really can't get thru the day without the 1 or 2 beers, there may be a problem. Living in MI, I can only imagine having trails like this within driving distance to enjoy, why risk ruining it?

Just my thoughts, not yours.

[Tinman]

Originally Posted by Tinman

Well, I agree and disagree.

Drinking while driving is wrong. Drinking and driving after if not drunk is a judgement call but never a good idea.

I will agree that there is a lot of other behavior that has nothing to do with drinking that is equally as bad and should not happen.

Examples:

Driving off trail.

Not using a toilet or digging a latrene.

Picking a fight for no reason.

Being plain obnoxious (loud at night, etc.)

Just because one is out in the forest doesn't mean it's a free for all.

That's reserved for the Hammers!

This was said as a joke but a good friend pointed out it was not a good idea to joke like this so I am editing it out with this explanation.

Thanks Jes. You are right. Never a good idea to allow a free for all!

Thanks again Jes!

[cruzila]

Originally Posted by Icemanii

Living in MI, I can only imagine having trails like this within driving distance to enjoy, why risk ruining it?

Just my thoughts, not yours.

I wish more people in California could have empathy with this.

[GRIDWNC]

I agree completely with your editorial.

Well done.

[camo]

I am an advocate of personal responsibility as well as the greater good.

[lttlbddy]

Originally Posted by camo

I am an advocate of personal responsibility as well as the greater good.

Are you running for Congress?

[camo]

Originally Posted by lttlbddy

Are you running for Congress?

last I checked personal responsibilty was not a common trait amoungst congressmen

[lttlbddy]

Originally Posted by camo

last I checked personal responsibilty was not a common trait amoungst congressmen

Having it and being an "advocate of" are two totally different things. Answers that don't really pick a side of the fence are common traits amongst the politicians (and website owners ).

[camo]

having it and using it are also completly diffrent.

so..


I have, use and advocate personal responsibility

[lttlbddy]

Politician gloves off. Does that mean you think it is okay to drink and drive on the trail?

Yes or No

[camo]

Originally Posted by lttlbddy

Politician gloves off. Does that mean you think it is okay to drink and drive on the trail?

Yes or No

YES I think it is ok to have a drink on the trail as long as your capable of maintaining your personal responsibility.

NO I do not think it is ok to be drunk and irresponsible on the trail.

but my philosphy extents far beyond the DRINKING issue. apply my statment to any aspect of the sport and or life and we will all be much better off. Both personally and as a group.

I am not trying to rain on Tinmans parade or his editorial.....I am right there with him on the subject...

[lttlbddy]

I respect that. Good to hear it said, instead of dancing around it with words. While I think a beer at lunch is okay and drinking at camp is fine, while driving just isn't necessary. The philosophy in general, I agree with.

Steve Gardiner

PS It easy for me to take a stand since I don't drink alcohol at all

[camo]

Originally Posted by lttlbddy

PS It easy for me to take a stand since I don't drink alcohol at all

I don't burn USA flags but I will fight for peoples rights to do so.

I don't drink very often and usually not while wheeling, but to me the issue isn't drinking....it is being responsible. I have seen plenty of sober irresponsible idiots. It just bugs me that people think that drinking is the issue when it is irresponsible people in general. In the same way we know not all wheelers are bad, not everybody who has a beer on the trail is the problem. again...personal responsibility.

[lttlbddy]

I hear you. They have outlawed drinking and driving but it is still legal to be stupid and living.

[jethrodeg]

Originally Posted by camo

I don't drink very often and usually not while wheeling, but to me the issue isn't drinking....it is being responsible. I have seen plenty of sober irresponsible idiots.

Alcohol has a tendency to make the irresponsible person less responsible.

Originally Posted by camo

not everybody who has a beer on the trail is the problem. again...personal responsibility.

Agreed

[Lord Orange]

Originally Posted by jethrodeg

Alcohol has a tendency to make the irresponsible person less responsible.

Alcohol seems to impair judgement, not responsibility.

[cruzila]

It also seems to loosen inhibitions, making the irresponsible, worse. It also makes her clothes fall off.

[jethrodeg]

Originally Posted by Lord Orange

Alcohol seems to impair judgement, not responsibility.

But it is the irresponsible person that willingly puts themselves in a position of impaired judgment when their judgment is marginal to begin with.

[Lord Orange]

Originally Posted by jethrodeg

But it is the irresponsible person that willingly puts themselves in a position of impaired judgment when their judgment is marginal to begin with.

But your version of impaired judgement is different to my version of impaired judgement.

And has your mom told you that judgeing people isn't nice.

[jethrodeg]

Originally Posted by Lord Orange

But your version of impaired judgement is different to my version of impaired judgement.

Agreed

Originally Posted by Lord Orange

And has your mom told you that judgeing people isn't nice.

Judge them as you find them. Never prejudge anybody, based upon any of those things that sometimes people are prejudged on. Norman Schwarzkopf


IMO it is foolish not to judge people by their actions....how can you hate the evil and love the good if you refuse to judge?

Yes this is getting off topic.

[Lord Orange]

Originally Posted by jethrodeg

Yes this is getting off topic.

I am good at that. Your welcome.

Back on topic....

For the retards who don't know how to enjoy and adult beverage, thanks alot. You guys/girls/retards are effecting my individual freedom, to drive my toy on free land.

I have had a drink or two and have been behind the wheel. I am not a retard, can be a responsible, and I am being punished because of some idiots, preventing the idiots from becoming true to their form....idiots.

There is no true line between drinking and driving, because people react totaly different to alcohol consumption. That is why people are stupid idiots sometimes.


I will finish my thoughs later...