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Old 09-18-2005, 07:17 PM   #1 (permalink)
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chevy 454 vs ford 460

ive heard motor debates and i know theres gonna be mixed reviews on this.im a chevy guy personally but i have heard the 460 is a beast if a motor.i also have heard good things about 454s. theres only 6 more cubic inches on the ford that shouldn't make too much difference. so whats youre vote 460 or 454
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Old 09-18-2005, 07:24 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Chebby! Cus it aint a furd.
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Old 09-18-2005, 07:25 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I would say 454!
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Old 09-18-2005, 07:36 PM   #4 (permalink)
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cool i would say 454 too why would i put a 460 in my blazer? just heard alot of good things about 460s.i might not like ford but i have to say the 460 is one hell of a motor
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Old 09-18-2005, 07:40 PM   #5 (permalink)
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i had a 93 ford...(460/5 spd manual, 4.10's) my dad has a 98 chevy (454/4l80e/3.73's)

there was no comparrison... the chevy walked all over my ford when towing and at the stop light... both trucks had around 170K miles, granted the 454 was 5 years newer with newer FI system and what not, but it really was no contest.. chevy hands down..

even at the gas pump the chevy kicked my butt
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Old 09-18-2005, 07:46 PM   #6 (permalink)
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well i can tell you my roller aluminum headed 454 gets out of its own way- now as for durability i have to give the 460 two thumbs up- but parts and horses and such its chevy- Jess
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Old 09-18-2005, 07:46 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FullsizeYota
i had a 93 ford...(460/5 spd manual, 4.10's) my dad has a 98 chevy (454/4l80e/3.73's)

there was no comparrison... the chevy walked all over my ford when towing and at the stop light... both trucks had around 170K miles, granted the 454 was 5 years newer with newer FI system and what not, but it really was no contest.. chevy hands down..

even at the gas pump the chevy kicked my butt

apples and oranges. the gearing isnt even the same.
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Old 09-18-2005, 07:48 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Old 09-18-2005, 07:49 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I would have to say if mike had his 460 powered rig with 44's still i'd really have to plug the nos up to 150 shot though- that friggen rig was a ripper when it stayed together- Jess
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Old 09-18-2005, 07:51 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I wonder which is cheaper to jack up to 800+ horses on pump gas, and which would last longer at that level. (That`s a question, not a thought.)
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Old 09-18-2005, 07:54 PM   #11 (permalink)
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i would say the ford has a tought bottom end and block - so the ford just may win there- but i don't drive with the nos on all the time hehe - Jess
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Old 09-18-2005, 07:58 PM   #12 (permalink)
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No NOS.
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Old 09-18-2005, 08:25 PM   #13 (permalink)
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well.. if you ever take the two apart.. you will see which motor is buit tougher from the get go.. the good stock 454 rods are comparable in size to a 351W rod... 460 rods next to a 454 rod will make you laugh.. Put a 460 crank on a scale next to 454 crank, and there is around a 50lb difference in weight if that tells you anything( yeah, I know rotating mass eats HP, but for strength, i'll live with it)

The nice thing about 460's, is you can find good ones (C9VE, or DOVE) heads pretty cheap still. I know more than a few people that have drove home complete cars For $100, and keep in mind those anywhere from 300hp with a 2bbl, to 375 with a 4bbl.

As far as making 800hp on pump gas, N.A. either way your looking a bit of money, and probably a stroker.
My uncle has around $3K into his 460, with ported stock heads, single carb, but it does have 12:1 comp( but 110 comes from a pump anyways, right?) Power is 580HP @ 5200prm, and 594 LBf-ft @ 4500 or so. But the torque curve is almost flat, over 500 LBf-ft from 1500 rpm up. What really kills it though is the cam, it was a custom(mild) grind to allow it to make 14" of vaccum @1000rpm for the class rules... With a bigger cam, it should make around 650hp or so..
Figure make that motor into a 514, with aluminum heads.. and your probably close to your 800hp... but for alot more $$$.. and probably at the cost of driveability..



As for 93' 460 to a 98' 454...
efi 460's have shit heads... there is really no comparing the two...
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Old 09-18-2005, 08:28 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onetoncv
but i don't drive with the nos on all the time hehe - Jess

Sure ya don't
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Old 09-18-2005, 11:43 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
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apples and oranges. the gearing isnt even the same.

yes and no... yes apples and oranges becuase of the years...vortec heads blah blah...

the point i was getting at, my ford had a lower gear ratio, but the auto (454) out pulled it...

don't get me wrong, the 460 would pull ANYTHING you could load on the trailer, it just took forever to get up to any kind of speed within 2 blocks...
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Old 09-19-2005, 06:13 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I built a 460 for my Scout II, bored .040, balanced, towing cam. Dome pistons and D2VE heads, dual quad intake for propane. I have no idea what kind of numbers it puts out, but I have WAY more power than I need. All in all, I'm very happy with my motor.

However, if I had to do it again, I'd build a 454 simply because of cost and parts availability.
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Old 09-19-2005, 07:46 AM   #17 (permalink)
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As far as I'm concerned, the ONLY thing the 454 has over the 460 is parts availability and the low price of parts. I'm building up a new EFI 460 (should be in the mid 300hp range and around 600lb-ft.) for my F-250 and the price of parts is ridiculous. This is mostly because I'm messing with EFI stuff, but even still the ford aftermarket isn't what the chevy aftermarket is. If you know the right people, sources, and are willing to custom fab/mix and match parts the price of building a BBF is bearable, but I still cringe at how cheap the chevy boys get their stuff.

Oh, and Jrod-13 the F3TE fuelie heads are actually a great base to start with for a good flowing head. A little porting, bowl blending, and cut the big 2.19/1.76 valves in them and they'll flow VERY well. The aforementioned heads are exactly what I'm running on this new 460 buildup.
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Old 09-19-2005, 08:38 AM   #18 (permalink)
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the F3TE fuelie heads are actually a great base to start with for a good flowing head.
well, I'll give that they are better than the E7TE 460 heads.. but they still suck compared to a D0VE. and your still stuck running the stock efi intake.
If one wants a efi 460, I still think your better just using a older motor, and putting a spyder setup on it..
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Old 09-19-2005, 08:48 AM   #19 (permalink)
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If rotating mass didn't matter, Scat wouldn't sell a 70lb 454 crankshaft (or Crower sell a 55lb 454 crankshaft). That's like half the weight of a 460 crankshaft.

Bearing size matters because the larger the bearing gets the faster the velocity between the surfaces which quickly taxes the oil. So, ideally, you want a wide bearing surface the smallest in diameter that'll support the load/keep the crankshaft from "wobbling".

Rod size... lighter is better... same theory for the bearings. If Ford was really concerned with strength they'd have used H-beam rods. Instead, they used these giant I-beam rods that weigh several times the moon. Well, to get the crankshaft to keep from deflecting they needed a giant heavy one of those to hold up to the reciprocating mass. None of this is that big of a deal until you want it to spin fast. Then to hold all that shit together they needed a block that weighs more than some small cars.

I mean, the 460 is such a GREAT motor that they're used in everything from boat anchors to filler metal for crushers. I mean, they're so popular everyone with a boat has to have one in it. They're such good motors Ford is using them today. haha.

I'm pretty sure the only reason anyone uses a 460 is because they already have one or can get one for pennies... or maybe because they're diehard Ford guys.

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Old 09-19-2005, 08:49 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Ive pulled, raced, and built both engines. I like the prices on aftermarket parts for the 454, but the 460 had better performance in EVERY case. The 460 cost alot more to build though, but you can usually find them for under $400 if you take the whole car. Not always the case with the 454. IMHO Id say the 460.
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Old 09-19-2005, 09:16 AM   #21 (permalink)
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I'll keep my 460s thanks ...or 545 is it The 545 I have is 747hp and 747tq on pump premium and my stock other than mild cam and carb 429CJ is 472hp and 541tq. The price game isn't what it used to be either, good aftermarket parts aren't priced that differently depending on what you are looking at.

this link shows dyno sheets for both and some pics of the 545
motor info

in one pic you can see part of a 400 slopar(mopar) with a 6-71 on it and it only did 600hp
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Old 09-19-2005, 09:39 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrod-13
well, I'll give that they are better than the E7TE 460 heads.. but they still suck compared to a D0VE. and your still stuck running the stock efi intake.
If one wants a efi 460, I still think your better just using a older motor, and putting a spyder setup on it..
True true. However this is simply a torque motor buildup thats going in my tow rig, I don't need anything too radical and properly re-worked the stock EFI components will give me the power I want.

Stage II of this project however, (which will occur when I have an extra $10K sitting around,) will be a 521cu. in. MPI-SEFI stroker motor with a custom tunnel ram intake setup, quite possibly with forced induction. For that I will ditch the EFI heads and go for aluminum SCJ heads. I might even run it off of a TWEECED speed density system for a while, just to piss people off
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Old 09-19-2005, 09:57 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Screw em both...Cadillac 500
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Old 09-19-2005, 11:50 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeepaholik
Screw em both...Cadillac 500


I 2nd that!!! Caddy 500 are cheap to find and put out around 300 hp and 550 lbs of torque bone stock. They are another one people think are boat anchors.. before you throw one in the water give it to me! 500's are similar in design to the Pontiac 455. They also have a higher nickel content in the block which means if you do a rebuild on a 100000 mile engine proably the most your going to have to do is hone it. for the most part all i know is i can crawl all day under 1000 rpm and advance the timing a little i can take it to the dragstrip. thats in a 5500 lb truck too.
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Old 09-19-2005, 11:53 AM   #25 (permalink)
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I've run Chevy 427's and 454's and 427 TD truck motors for some time now with no problems. The 454 was rectangle headed and NOS fed. You find a 4 bolt main 454 or 427 motor and you can beat the hell outta that thing. 5, four bolt mains are impressive and durable. When I was running that 454 a buddy had a roller cammed 460. The thing would really haul ass BUT he found an inherent problem with 460's...They DO NOT LIKE high pressure springs and will eat cam bearings. He did some research and found race shops putting needle roller cam bearing in to solve that problem.

You can keep your ford cheap acquisition costs and expensive fixes and I'll keep my healthy rat motors.
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