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Old 09-10-2007, 09:49 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Cost for Missle rod?

So I'm told that I should have some 1/8" Missle rod in my rig for use with my on board welder. I'm also told that it costs about $100 per pound.

I tried to google "missle rod" but only got a few references to it, so I'm assuming that I'm searching for a wrong name. Also tried a few on-line welding suppliers but a search of their sites did not locate "missle rod".

Questions:

Is the price of $100 / pound about right?

Can anyone provide a link to an on line retailer, or at least the correct name I need to search for?

Thanks.

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Old 09-11-2007, 08:23 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Any thought given to actually going to your local welding supply?
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Old 09-11-2007, 08:31 AM   #3 (permalink)
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I just googled "MISSILE rod" - note the spelling.

I then found these:
http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=98056
http://www.minibuggy.net/modules.php...wtopic&p=14606

No idea otherwise. Maybe it's called "Super missile rod"? I spent like 30 secs on this so sorry if it's brief.
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Old 09-11-2007, 08:57 AM   #4 (permalink)
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ive used jet rod or jet wire, thats just 7024. but never missile rod, jason.
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Old 09-11-2007, 09:19 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Im a welder never heard of it? I think it is just like NI-ROD (nickel rod)? I dont think there is anthing thats a $100 a pound besides titanium!
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Old 09-11-2007, 09:25 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I'm pretty sure that the "missle rod" or "Super missle rod" is slang for 55% Nickle or 99% Nickle welding rods recommended for welding cast iron
Cost is ~$30/lb

Also might refer to the stainless/20-10 chromium-nickel rod used for joining dissimilar metals, cost is~ 45/lb
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Old 09-11-2007, 09:28 AM   #7 (permalink)
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So I'm told that I should have some 1/8" Missle rod in my rig for use with my on board welder. I'm also told that it costs about $100 per pound.

I tried to google "missle rod" but only got a few references to it, so I'm assuming that I'm searching for a wrong name. Also tried a few on-line welding suppliers but a search of their sites did not locate "missle rod".

Questions:

Is the price of $100 / pound about right?

Can anyone provide a link to an on line retailer, or at least the correct name I need to search for?

Thanks.

Super missle weld

There is a eureka(sp) part no.I dont know it off hand .Call a welding shop ,best bet.

I used it in TIG form ,dont know about stick or MIG

My understanding and experence has been ,dissimalir metals and it work hardens like a bitch.
And it wasnt $100 a pound .(few years ago)

MY .02
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Old 09-11-2007, 09:32 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Super missile is often just 312 stainless and that's it. Carrying something like a 99% or 55% nickel isn't bad either. I'd say carry some 6011/0 and 7018's sealed up and call it done.
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Old 09-11-2007, 09:38 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Super missile is often just 312 stainless and that's it. Carrying something like a 99% or 55% nickel isn't bad either. I'd say carry some 6011/0 and 7018's sealed up and call it done.
-B
Super missle tig
is not just stainless
Alot of trophy truck and suspenion guys used it back in the day before all the crazy one off parts craze .I would think they still do .
Boxing steering arms
making custom pitman arms

Good for welding hot rolled to cast ect....

Do a search and call a weld shop they will hook ya up .

And I agree something like 6011/7018 would be your best bet for trail repair.
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Old 09-11-2007, 09:48 AM   #10 (permalink)
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I have had bad luck carrying 7018 on the trail for a few reasons. Mostly that it just sits in my truck for months at a time and trying to keep it from going bad is a waste of time. I try to weld with it and it's a joke.I have had had some 6011 sitting in my truck for months on end, however, and I whip it out and it's good as the day it was made. I'll never carry 7018 again after switching.
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Old 09-11-2007, 10:30 AM   #11 (permalink)
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6010/6011 is what i carry, better cleaning properties than 7018 and works better on dirty/painted surfaces.
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Old 09-11-2007, 10:44 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Super missle tig
is not just stainless
Alot of trophy truck and suspenion guys used it back in the day before all the crazy one off parts craze .I would think they still do .
Boxing steering arms
making custom pitman arms
And you know this first hand how? Have you used it in a race shop? I have. Have you researched it with those that are respected in the industry? I have. What is often called "super missile" in the racing circles IS just 312 stainless or a very close relative. Super missile is I'm sure what used to be a "special" trade name but now it doesn't tend to mean much. Marketing ploy really. If anyone still uses it for all their work just because it's "super missile" they've missed the intellectual welding tugboat and they're wasting money. There are miscellaneous applications where it is good though.

If you can provide documentation or solid information to prove a different statement than my own I'll be more than happy to analyze and accept it. Never have I been able to find "super missile" filler composition info on the web, nor do I recall being able to even find a company that claimed to make it. However, your proof better be more extensive than my own personal research.
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Old 09-11-2007, 11:14 AM   #13 (permalink)
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So I'm told that I should have some 1/8" Missle rod in my rig for use with my on board welder. I'm also told that it costs about $100 per pound.

I tried to google "missle rod" but only got a few references to it, so I'm assuming that I'm searching for a wrong name. Also tried a few on-line welding suppliers but a search of their sites did not locate "missle rod".
Questions:

Is the price of $100 / pound about right?

Can anyone provide a link to an on line retailer, or at least the correct name I need to search for?

Thanks.


Missile rod - are you crazy or is that fellow just messing with you?

Super Missile weld is nearly impossible to torch grind cut or do anything else with. That chit is super hard. We use it on our dump truck and rebuilding dozer blades and that is it. I would never use it on a trail vehicle. I doubt you can find it online, many of the speciality rods have to be special ordered through a store because ther are really expensive. It would not surprise me if super missile is up above $500 for a box. BTW - it is hard to buy small qtys of it and I doubt that a car welder could even burn the rod properly.


And for the guy using 6011 or 6013 - that stuff splatters too much but it will go on anything easily but is a general purpose rod that should not be used for strength due to the penetration. Just take a wire brush with you and use 7018 if you welder is powerful enough.

It is silly to ever use super missile rod, stainless or anything other exotic rod if you are not welding on an exotic steel that the rod was INTENDED for. The rod is supposed to be the same types of steel as what you are welding. If you are using a 170000 psi rod on mild steel, the steel will rip apart long before the weld and you just wasted $$ on that fancy rod.

Personally, I use 7018MR on most everything I arc weld on my vehicles. It is stronger than the steel on the frame and axles but it has enough stainless in it that it does not rust easily and it is priced about right and uh put the rod in a rod tube to keep it from going bad due to moisture. I have about 200lbs of 7018 that is over 18yrs old and it works like the day it was bought which is better than the 5lbs of 7018 generic crap I purchased two weeks ago.
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Old 09-11-2007, 11:54 AM   #14 (permalink)
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And you know this first hand how? Have you used it in a race shop? I have. Have you researched it with those that are respected in the industry? I have. What is often called "super missile" in the racing circles IS just 312 stainless or a very close relative. Super missile is I'm sure what used to be a "special" trade name but now it doesn't tend to mean much. Marketing ploy really. If anyone still uses it for all their work just because it's "super missile" they've missed the intellectual welding tugboat and they're wasting money. There are miscellaneous applications where it is good though.

If you can provide documentation or solid information to prove a different statement than my own I'll be more than happy to analyze and accept it. Never have I been able to find "super missile" filler composition info on the web, nor do I recall being able to even find a company that claimed to make it. However, your proof better be more extensive than my own personal research.
EUREKA part #505a 1/8th TIG $13.27 a pound
Super missile Weld is Lincoln Electrics Name under the Harris Division
Super missile Weld J W Harris division Part #3-S-MW (Welco)

www.harrisproductgroup.com
I'm sorry that you are so miss informed read a little .
And yes I use it in my race shop.

And again its not 312 ss
Jeff
SORRY

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Old 09-11-2007, 02:03 PM   #15 (permalink)
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And for the guy using 6011 or 6013 - that stuff splatters too much but it will go on anything easily but is a general purpose rod that should not be used for strength due to the penetration. Just take a wire brush with you and use 7018 if you welder is powerful enough.


Personally, I use 7018MR on most everything I arc weld on my vehicles. It is stronger than the steel on the frame and axles but it has enough stainless in it that it does not rust easily and it is priced about right and uh put the rod in a rod tube to keep it from going bad due to moisture. I have about 200lbs of 7018 that is over 18yrs old and it works like the day it was bought which is better than the 5lbs of 7018 generic crap I purchased two weeks ago.
Well I had a bunch of high quality 7018 that I was using and went to weld something and couldn't even strike an arc but granted I am not the world's best stick welder. Can you explain your statement regarding 6011 and penetration? I have had very good luck with this rod and I keep my rod wrapped in plastic in a piece or pvc glued on one end with a screw cap on the other. I'm curious about your experience. Thanks.
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Old 09-11-2007, 03:25 PM   #16 (permalink)
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This is probably no help whatsoever, but when I worked in a hydraulics shop, the machinist used to grind down dents in the chrome cylinder rods and use what he called a missile rod to fill back in. Then he would machine it back down smooth. Worked well for repairing huge rods rather than making expensive new ones. Seems unnecessary for an on board welder.
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Old 09-11-2007, 05:41 PM   #17 (permalink)
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This is probably no help whatsoever, but when I worked in a hydraulics shop, the machinist used to grind down dents in the chrome cylinder rods and use what he called a missile rod to fill back in. Then he would machine it back down smooth. Worked well for repairing huge rods rather than making expensive new ones. Seems unnecessary for an on board welder.
Yes


The only thing I could see is you can get it in stick form(arc welding) In the right hands you could make a good repair ,trail or not .On say a steering knuckle or engine block motor mount ?lots of good uses really if you know whats you are doing .

Jeff
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Old 09-11-2007, 08:04 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Personally, I use 7018MR on most everything I arc weld on my vehicles. It is stronger than the steel on the frame and axles but it has enough stainless in it that it does not rust easily and it is priced about right and uh put the rod in a rod tube to keep it from going bad du. to moisture. I have about 200lbs of 7018 that is over 18yrs old and it works like the day it was bought which is better than the 5lbs of 7018 generic crap I purchased two weeks ago.
Given that the Lincoln filler that they call 7018MR is going to be a E7018 H4R (Lincoln Jet-LH 78 MR etc,) I am curious how you came to the conclusion that this filler "has enough stainless in it that it does not rust easily" when the alloying one would normally associate with SS such as Cr, Ni & Mo are limited to 0.30%, 0.20% & 0.30% respectively? Even E7018-A1 H4R (Lincoln's Excalibur 7018-A1 MR) is going to bring the Mo content up to a whopping 0.400.65% which is going to have SFA for an effect on the final products ability to resist rusting.
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Old 09-11-2007, 09:11 PM   #19 (permalink)
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You guys really know about ur rods
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Old 09-11-2007, 09:13 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Ok guys, thanks for all the info.

I now realize that it was 'missile' was spelled 'missle' in the info given to me.

I found some at a local welding shop for $35/lb. I'm guessing that the "$100" was for a multi pound pack at a to the trade price.

"Personally, I use 7018MR on most everything I arc weld on my vehicles. It is stronger than the steel on the frame and axles but it has enough stainless in it that it does not rust easily and it is priced about right and uh put the rod in a rod tube to keep it from going bad due to moisture. I have about 200lbs of 7018 that is over 18yrs old and it works like the day it was bought which is better than the 5lbs of 7018 generic crap I purchased two weeks ago."

Good to know, Thanks.

So, is there a consensus opinion on what's the most practical to use for trail repair with a Premier Power Welder?

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Old 09-11-2007, 09:22 PM   #21 (permalink)
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All the opinions I gave are based on use with my PPW. If I'm at home I tig or mig.

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Old 09-12-2007, 07:56 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Given that the Lincoln filler that they call 7018MR is going to be a E7018 H4R (Lincoln Jet-LH 78 MR etc,) I am curious how you came to the conclusion that this filler "has enough stainless in it that it does not rust easily" when the alloying one would normally associate with SS such as Cr, Ni & Mo are limited to 0.30%, 0.20% & 0.30% respectively? Even E7018-A1 H4R (Lincoln's Excalibur 7018-A1 MR) is going to bring the Mo content up to a whopping 0.40–0.65% which is going to have SFA for an effect on the final products ability to resist rusting.

Because it does not rust easily from experience. Kepp your formulas to yourself, I am going by what I have seen.

My 7018 is not lincoln rod.

dee deedee
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Old 09-12-2007, 11:25 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Because it does not rust easily from experience. Kepp your formulas to yourself, I am going by what I have seen.

My 7018 is not lincoln rod.

dee deedee
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Jason, don't worry bout it. No need to debate with hillbilly injuneering. Sometimes it's great, sometimes it ain't, but I can promise you what it always is and that is not debatable.
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Old 09-12-2007, 11:47 AM   #24 (permalink)
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EUREKA part #505a 1/8th TIG $13.27 a pound
Super missile Weld is Lincoln Electrics Name under the Harris Division
Super missile Weld J W Harris division Part #3-S-MW (Welco)

www.harrisproductgroup.com
I'm sorry that you are so miss informed read a little .
And yes I use it in my race shop.

And again its not 312 ss
Jeff
SORRY
Do you subscribe to hype or actually know something about it. Like I said, I'm more than happy to accept more research, but it must be good. I'm reading, but can't find. You must read better than I. So help me. I'm much more interested in it as solid filler form and not as a covered electrode but they're similar.

I'm digging for your part numbers as I've done before and nowhere can I find "super missile" or any of your part numbers broken down into chemical compositions. I promise you whatever it's called nowadays or what the new thing that's called "super missile" is nothing special and just some kind of stainless/nickel-like blend. Give me data, I'd really like to know more.

You got me this far, but nowhere further than I've gotten previously:
http://www.eurekagroupindustries.com/images/alloys.gif <--No #505a here

Here you can find a little info:
http://www.harrisproductsgroup.com/consumables/msds.asp

They won't give you the chemical breakdown cause they want to convince you of the snake oil. Compare the strength and elongation numbers to 312, 310, and such. Very similar. I'm sticking by the fact that super missile is in the 310/312 family with some small composition changes to make it "special" and more expensive. Again, this is what my research led me to conclude the first time. I'd know more if I were to experiment with some, but I have no inclination to ever buy something to weld with unless I have published specs on its composition. That way I know what I'm using and not taking some manufacturer's or salesman's word. I'm not saying it's bad stuff, I'm just saying it ain't "special". I'm still willing to accept some difference if it's PROVEN.

I think it'd be fine as a covered electrode for trail repairs, but there's better options and similar options that are cheaper. It is classified as a "maintenance/repair" filler metal which is the niche they found to try and take your money.
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Old 09-12-2007, 02:26 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Do you subscribe to hype or actually know something about it. Like I said, I'm more than happy to accept more research, but it must be good. I'm reading, but can't find. You must read better than I. So help me. I'm much more interested in it as solid filler form and not as a covered electrode but they're similar.

I'm digging for your part numbers as I've done before and nowhere can I find "super missile" or any of your part numbers broken down into chemical compositions. I promise you whatever it's called nowadays or what the new thing that's called "super missile" is nothing special and just some kind of stainless/nickel-like blend. Give me data, I'd really like to know more.

You got me this far, but nowhere further than I've gotten previously:
http://www.eurekagroupindustries.com/images/alloys.gif <--No #505a here

Here you can find a little info:
http://www.harrisproductsgroup.com/consumables/msds.asp

They won't give you the chemical breakdown cause they want to convince you of the snake oil. Compare the strength and elongation numbers to 312, 310, and such. Very similar. I'm sticking by the fact that super missile is in the 310/312 family with some small composition changes to make it "special" and more expensive. Again, this is what my research led me to conclude the first time. I'd know more if I were to experiment with some, but I have no inclination to ever buy something to weld with unless I have published specs on its composition. That way I know what I'm using and not taking some manufacturer's or salesman's word. I'm not saying it's bad stuff, I'm just saying it ain't "special". I'm still willing to accept some difference if it's PROVEN.

I think it'd be fine as a covered electrode for trail repairs, but there's better options and similar options that are cheaper. It is classified as a "maintenance/repair" filler metal which is the niche they found to try and take your money.
In are ASW meeting this after noon I brought up your comments we got a laugh .

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