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Old 10-27-2009, 12:22 PM   #1 (permalink)
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A fix for the RD99 ?

Hi,

I have read the many posts on the RD99 problems but I see the cause of the problem being the fact that as there is not much space in there it only gets about 2 mm engagement, with a redesign and some new parts I think we can get the full 7mm collar engagement like the older designs that didn't have these problems,

Before we make a prototype I wanted to ask if this has been done before,

any feedback would be appreciated,
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Old 10-27-2009, 01:11 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Spidertrax makes it.

http://www.spidertrax.com/RD-99-Enga...&category=5078
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Old 10-27-2009, 01:18 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Ask Blown349 about that.
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Old 10-27-2009, 01:24 PM   #4 (permalink)
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but isn't that just a different material? Not more engagement?

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Old 10-27-2009, 01:40 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Hi,

I am aware of the spidertrax collar, we are already using these,

these collars last longer than the ARB ones but the problem is caused by only 2.5mm engagement not the materials used for the collar.

the redesign give 7mm engagement like the earlier designs that didn't have these problems,
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Old 10-27-2009, 01:51 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Dave, I have been working on this for the last week and have some prototype stuff being built.

I would be more than willing to share my ideas with yours.

If you could give me a call I will let you know where I am at and if you take over, using some of my ideas of not, great.

I've got another fish to fry.
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Old 10-27-2009, 02:42 PM   #7 (permalink)
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OK, thanks,

I will give you a call,
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Old 10-28-2009, 10:47 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Let me test it for ya?

I'd love to see a fix and try it out.

Last edited by Blown349; 10-28-2009 at 10:50 AM.
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Old 10-28-2009, 10:49 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Let me test it for ya?

I'd love to see a fix and try it out.
I will post up if it works out,
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Old 10-28-2009, 11:42 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Just curious, how do you plan to get 7mm of engagement on a collar that's only ~7mm thick? If all of the collar is on the side gear then none of it is on the case, which equals a non-working locker in my mind. If you're planning on machining the case deeper, and making a thicker collar I can see how that would work, but I'm not seeing the space in the current case.
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Old 10-29-2009, 07:52 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Couldn't the new design have internal and external "teeth" and engage the case with the external teeth and the spider gear with the internal teeth as it does now? I have no idea if the ARB case would support that but I believe that is the theory they are working on here. that way you don't have to split your engagement as it is now.
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Old 10-29-2009, 08:12 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StinkBug View Post
Just curious, how do you plan to get 7mm of engagement on a collar that's only ~7mm thick? If all of the collar is on the side gear then none of it is on the case, which equals a non-working locker in my mind. If you're planning on machining the case deeper, and making a thicker collar I can see how that would work, but I'm not seeing the space in the current case.
External teeth to engage the case.

It looks like there is space in the current case, although a new part would be required anyway.
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Old 10-29-2009, 11:58 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Yep, external teeth, like the older designs,

new end flange and new locking collar

Dave
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Old 10-29-2009, 12:02 PM   #14 (permalink)
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As of today we have 2 options.

The ARB starts out with .080" engagement, the old design 31 spline had .150".

Option 1, Modify the existing case half for inner and outer splines, slight machining on the large case half, and build a new locking collar and have .200" engagement.

Option 2, build a new case half with inner and outer splines, possible slight machining on the large case half, and build a new locking collar and have .275" engagement.

I have a case half being modified and prices being quoted for modification and new.

I have talked to Tom at Spidertrax and they would build us the new locking collar if that is the route we choose to take.
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Old 10-29-2009, 12:05 PM   #15 (permalink)
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We are sharing ideas with ashtrans to hopefully end up with the best option at the lowest cost for everyone.
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Old 10-29-2009, 12:47 PM   #16 (permalink)
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A change I would like to see in the outer part of the Flange cap Assembly.

The new flange cap assembly has a square edge where the seal housing runs which allows for a better o-ring seal. On the older modal the bearing support edge was rounded and the outer o-ring would run right at the edge of the rounded lip, when you would get a little deflection in the seal housing air would leak past the outer o-ring causing the locker to dis enguage under load. I would like to see an 1/8 inch wider area for the o-ring housing to run on and some type of three bolt cap that would hold the o-ring seal housing in place against a new adjustment nut. You would probable need about 3 thousandths of play to allow for seal housing movement.

I've been one of the drivers that has been testing the spidertrax locking collar for more then two years and Tom has developed a great fix for the RD99. It seams that I now can contribute my locking collar problems to the above paragraph. Since I changed the Flange cap assemble to the new and improved piece I have not lost my lock.
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Old 10-29-2009, 01:15 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I suspect the Spidertrax engagement gear has stripped on mine. Hopefully it's that and not the case half that's stripped.

Last edited by Blown349; 10-29-2009 at 03:09 PM.
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Old 10-29-2009, 05:04 PM   #18 (permalink)
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zukstur, I am well aware of this.

If we build a new flange cap we will leave more length. With enough length it would not need bolts.
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Old 10-29-2009, 06:19 PM   #19 (permalink)
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zukstur, I am well aware of this.

If we build a new flange cap we will leave more length. With enough length it would not need bolts.

ARBs parts were not machined to their own drawings causing this issue.

It took me 4 years to get it improved to the point it is now and it was complete hell.

I still have not gotten a thank you from anyone only Pirate bashed for saying it was a problem and trying to get it fixed.
Thanx.

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Old 10-29-2009, 10:32 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Sounds like a great start ashtrans.



Quote:
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I suspect the Spidertrax engagement gear has stripped on mine. Hopefully it's that and not the case half that's stripped.
So when are you going to pull it apart to see whats going on inside?
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Old 10-30-2009, 03:53 AM   #21 (permalink)
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zukstur, I am well aware of this.

If we build a new flange cap we will leave more length. With enough length it would not need bolts.
Very true. One other thing I ran into and I told Tom about it. When we put the rebuilt arb and third member back into car I was checking the locker to make sure it was locking in. I didn't have the tires on and when I would flip the switch and rotate the hub forward slowly I could turn the hub from 12 oclock to 2 oclock before it engaged. It worked four out of five times this way, on the fifth time I had to rotate from 12 oclock to 6 oclock before it would engage and this is rotating it slowly with 130 psi. I checked the rear axel and had the same results. So at speed I'm wondering how many revolutions before they engage. Just not enough engagement for high HP and 40 plus tires.

your on the right track, and I didn't know that the old model locked in at 150"

Thanks guys
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Old 10-30-2009, 10:19 AM   #22 (permalink)
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zukstur, that is something very interesting.

I have thought about what spline system on the o.d. would be the least susceptible to bind.

It sounds like it is more important that I originally thought as maybe there is a binding issue going on also.

Thanks for your input.
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Old 10-30-2009, 01:39 PM   #23 (permalink)
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V I could turn the hub from 12 oclock to 2 oclock before it engaged. It worked four out of five times this way
This is due to the "Timed Locking Gear". The older style clutch gear and side gear has twice the number of teeth, this allowed the locker to engage under spin faster. However it also allowed the spider gears to mesh with the side gears in two different positions.

By matching the locking teeth with the drive teeth on the side gear, ARB has been able to ensure that the locker locks the spider and side gears in when they have the most support. However by doing so, the locker must rotate an extra position (compared to the older style).
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Old 11-15-2009, 03:48 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Old 11-16-2009, 05:08 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Rd 99

Hi not as much progress as we would like primarily because I have been away on vacation. The design is finalised and a 'test' lock ring made. We plan to make the new end cap in approx 2 weeks then check assemble. If all OK then make two prototypes for testing in our 'Force9' diff. Regards
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