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Old 04-24-2012, 01:50 PM   #51 (permalink)
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How so?
Infighting and then everybody hated Romney, bashed Romney and now are grudgingly supporting him. I think the Republicans have hurt his campaign greatly.
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Old 04-24-2012, 02:03 PM   #52 (permalink)
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What we need is a benevolent Dictator. I vote Fatdan
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Old 04-24-2012, 02:07 PM   #53 (permalink)
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How many Solyndra workers still have a job?
I don't know, but my hopeful answer will be, "There should be none."

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I know you think you really pinned me to the wall there, but I don't see anything in your post that argues why one type of government aid is different than another.

How about this-do you respect a postal worker more or less than a UPS worker? Personally, I always remember that a portion of the postal worker's wages came from federal money that was forcibly taken from me. UPS only gets the portion of my money that I voluntarily hand over.

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I wasn't arguing a point, I was asking a question that you have failed to answer. USPS and FedEx/UPS are two different. One has been around for ages and is a government entity, the others are corporations. They serve different purposes. If you'd like your mail (and everyone else's) delivered by a private corp, expect to pay more.

If you feel that your taxes are "forcibly" taken from you, stop paying them, and in doing such, stop using the things that the taxes pay for. Don't get me wrong, I don't enjoy paying taxes, but I'm willing to pay my fair share and will vote for the politician that's least likely to waste it. (I realize that politicians will waste, regardless)

I respect FedEx/UPS workers just as much as I do USPS workers. They are both individuals who've applied and taken a job that is productive. My dad also retired from 36 years of working for the postal service, still farms, and I work with him when I'm not working on an oil rig for a major company. (Gasp)
Oh noes! We're all on the welfares!

Nothing has ever come free for us, regardless of what money came from where or what was subsidized, gov't run, tax break, blah, blah, blabbity blah... everything I, my family, and my friends have came from one thing.

Hard work.

If more people put effort into hard work and taking pride in doing so you and I wouldn't be bitching on the internet about what does and does not constitute "welfare aid".
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Old 04-24-2012, 02:33 PM   #54 (permalink)
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I don't know, but my hopeful answer will be, "There should be none."



I wasn't arguing a point, I was asking a question that you have failed to answer. USPS and FedEx/UPS are two different. One has been around for ages and is a government entity, the others are corporations. They serve different purposes. If you'd like your mail (and everyone else's) delivered by a private corp, expect to pay more.

If you feel that your taxes are "forcibly" taken from you, stop paying them, and in doing such, stop using the things that the taxes pay for. Don't get me wrong, I don't enjoy paying taxes, but I'm willing to pay my fair share and will vote for the politician that's least likely to waste it. (I realize that politicians will waste, regardless)

I respect FedEx/UPS workers just as much as I do USPS workers. They are both individuals who've applied and taken a job that is productive. My dad also retired from 36 years of working for the postal service, still farms, and I work with him when I'm not working on an oil rig for a major company. (Gasp)
Oh noes! We're all on the welfares!

Nothing has ever come free for us, regardless of what money came from where or what was subsidized, gov't run, tax break, blah, blah, blabbity blah... everything I, my family, and my friends have came from one thing.

Hard work.

If more people put effort into hard work and taking pride in doing so you and I wouldn't be bitching on the internet about what does and does not constitute "welfare aid".
My taxes are taken from me at the threat of imprisonment. How the heck is that not force? Your point about just not paying taxes, and withdrawing from society is also not possible. Unless, of course, you're talking about renouncing citizenship.

Working for an oil company isn't something to be ashamed of. Working for the postal service is. It's an entity that always operates in the red, but isn't allowed to fail. In their defense, postmasters often ask to be allowed to close failing branches, and congress doesn't let them. So part of their retardation is forced on them. Still, though, why don't you pay attention next time you see a UPS guy. They typically bust their asses. The USPS, on the other hand, is typically overpaid for the quality of work they do. Government dependence breeds that. I don't see how that's not a just comparison.

As far as your question that I didn't address, I assume you're talking about your request for me to name every company on the government take. Yeah, that's totally a reasonable request, I'll spend the next decade putting that together for you.

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Old 04-24-2012, 02:46 PM   #55 (permalink)
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Infighting and then everybody hated Romney, bashed Romney and now are grudgingly supporting him. I think the Republicans have hurt his campaign greatly.
I thought they intended to lose in 08... Kind of feel the same way now. Not because of the infighting though. That wouldn't be happening if passionate conservatives weren't seeing the gop throw the election again by forcing a liberal candidate in the populous.
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Old 04-24-2012, 02:54 PM   #56 (permalink)
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My taxes are taken from me at the threat of imprisonment. How the heck is that not force? Your point about just not paying taxes, and withdrawing from society is also not possible. Unless, of course, you're talking about renouncing citizenship.
As per COTUS.........................................

Section 8.
The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States; but all duties, imposts and excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

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Old 04-24-2012, 02:57 PM   #57 (permalink)
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As per COTUS.........................................

Section 8.
The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States; but all duties, imposts and excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

Interesting that congress ignores the last portion ...
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Old 04-24-2012, 03:14 PM   #58 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by OHV Wildcat View Post
My taxes are taken from me at the threat of imprisonment. How the heck is that not force? Your point about just not paying taxes, and withdrawing from society is also not possible. Unless, of course, you're talking about renouncing citizenship.

Working for an oil company isn't something to be ashamed of. Working for the postal service is. It's an entity that always operates in the red, but isn't allowed to fail. In their defense, postmasters often ask to be allowed to close failing branches, and congress doesn't let them. So part of their retardation is forced on them. Still, though, why don't you pay attention next time you see a UPS guy. They typically bust their asses. The USPS, on the other hand, is typically overpaid for the quality of work they do. Government dependence breeds that. I don't see how that's not a just comparison.

As far as your question that I didn't address, I assume you're talking about your request for me to name every company on the government take. Yeah, that's totally a reasonable request, I'll spend the next decade putting that together for you.

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You're generalizing and stereotyping, so understand a few things first. My dad walked his mail route, he didn't sit on his ass, he didn't say that he wouldn't do it without a DJ, he walked it. I'm friends with several UPS drivers and yes, they do bust their ass. They're also paid to do so, that's what people paid for. They're paid to get X amount of packages delivered on X day. The postal service is paid to deliver along a specific route, same stops day after day.
There's a difference there. In the closing of smaller POs, rural carriers have had increased workload, so now they're busting ass too. There's also a difference in pay scale, but I'm sure you already knew that.

You can take this next part as lightly, or as "to heart" as you'd like.

Ready?

You are a fucking idiot if you think that people who work hard at the USPS should be ashamed or embarassed of their employment. That takes a pretty condescending, elitist attitude. Your opinion of government employees seems to include a bit of stereotyping and maybe it's all in what you've seen. That's not for me to decide. However, I stick with my "You are a fucking idiot" line all the same.

I'm getting off track here. How about the guy that's on a contract for building a road? Is he on welfare also? That's government money he's getting. Oh shit.... that's your tax dollars paying for that road... damnit, that's mine too! Well, we need shit like that.

Before I forget, thanks. Thanks, but I don't need you to tell me that my job isn't shameful or embarassing. I know full well how hard I work, just like I know full well how hard my dad worked and still works. You might be used to a offices full of essentially worthless employees, and believe me, I've seen my share too, but I've seen plenty of people that are paid in tax dollars working much harder than some in the private sector.

I think the original question that you didn't answer was more of a statement and I should have put a "?" at the end of it.
Here it is again:

"So an employee that's working for an employer that either recieves government subsidies, some form of tax break or anything of the sort, is the same as recieving welfare aid?"


The question that you left for me to provide a decade's worth of research to answer was a rhetorical one. It's damn near unpossible to answer that because 99.9% of business in this country are, in some form or fashion, operating on tax money if you look at it the way you worded it earlier. Even if it's fifteen dollars, that's what you would classify as welfare, yes?

Believe me, not much pisses me off more than the entitlement system in this country, the total waste of tax dollars on needless things, and the politicians spending it faster than the government can borrow it.
I can understand the frustration that comes with some bitch at the DMV giving you shit because you're the next person in line and she'd rather be somewhere else soaking up a check... however that person isn't a representative of the whole workforce and that particular branch isn't representative of the rest of the government workforce. ... and so on, and so on, and so on.


*** Just as information sharing. Did you know that FedEx sells franchise routes? They do. The guys that I know that run those routes are paid about 1/3 of what a company driver earns. Yet we still pay the same rate for delivery of the same package whether it's a franchise or company driver.***
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Old 04-25-2012, 08:29 AM   #59 (permalink)
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Infighting and then everybody hated Romney, bashed Romney and now are grudgingly supporting him. I think the Republicans have hurt his campaign greatly.
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I thought they intended to lose in 08... Kind of feel the same way now. Not because of the infighting though. That wouldn't be happening if passionate conservatives weren't seeing the gop throw the election again by forcing a liberal candidate in the populous.
This campaign is no different than any other. If anything Romney has done a good job of staying away form any serious implosion. We may not agree on the candidate but the end game is far more important and the paramount issue is to stop the current regime. Romney has shown a willingness to be forced right. For instance his now accepting the Ryan budget. He is far more conservative than liberal despite some asinine historical duh's. He is also more palpable to the general electorate. I as with most members of the GOP will coalesce around him and support him. I may be voting against Obama, not for Romney but I will never have my perfect candidate and the dire straights we are in deem it necessary to make a choice that is the lessor of the two evils. I would rather save the nation now than believe their is some golden conservative god that will save is later. We are beyond the point of no return and over the cliff if Romney is not elected.

We are not throwing any election. As I have stated in other post this election is all but over provided Romney doesn't choke. Obama is in serious danger of a landslide and historical dictates say that is what he faces. He is in panic mode hence his hurried rally of his base. I do not believe the pundits who say it will be close. I believe the political scientist who have studied elections since the late W's.
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