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Old 09-25-2013, 06:49 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Obamacare premiums average $328

For those who said O-care would send rates through the roof:

From Reuters, so you know its true.

Obamacare's average monthly cost across U.S.: $328 | Reuters
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(Reuters) - Americans will pay an average premium of $328 monthly for a mid-tier health insurance plan when the Obamacare health exchanges open for enrollment next week, and most will qualify for government subsidies to lower that price, the Obama administration said on Wednesday.

The figure, based on data for approved insurance plans in 48 states, represents the broadest national estimate for how much Americans will pay for health coverage under President Barack Obama's healthcare reform law next year. The prices of the new plans are at the heart of a political debate over whether they will be affordable enough to attract millions of uninsured Americans.

Prices were lower in states with more competition among insurers and higher in states with fewer players, the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) said in its report. Americans will be able to sign up for the new plans via online state exchanges beginning on October 1.

"For millions of Americans these new options will finally make health insurance work within their budgets," HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius said during a briefing with reporters.

The Obama administration is counting on signing up 7 million Americans in the first full year of reform through the state exchanges, including 2.7 million younger and healthier consumers who are needed to offset the costs of sicker members.

Debate over whether Obamacare will prove affordable for millions of uninsured Americans has been sharp during the past few months, as states have announced rates. States that have supported the law said it will lead to lower prices. Others that have opposed the reform - including Georgia, Florida, and Indiana - warned of "rate shock" for consumers compared to what they could buy on the individual insurance market a year ago.

HHS said the average price was 16 percent lower than its own projections on premiums. In addition, consumers who earn up to 400 percent of the federal poverty level, or $62,040 for a couple, will qualify for subsidies that will lower the price further.

TEXAS RATES BELOW AVERAGE

The data is mostly based on 36 states where the federal government will operate the insurance exchange. About 14 other states and the District of Columbia are running their own exchange.

Politics aside, states with the lowest average premium tend to have more insurance companies offering plans, the report said. It said eight issuers on average were selling plans in the states with average premiums in the lowest 25 percent, while states with average premiums in the top 25 percent had only three insurers on average.

Texas has been among the Republican-led states most fiercely opposed to Obamacare, but its monthly rates came in below the national average, HHS said. In Austin, Texas, with 76 plans to choose from, a 27-year-old would pay $169 per month for the lowest cost mid-tier plan. In Dallas-Fort Worth, with 43 plans to choose from, that price was $217 per month, the report said.

"The rates in Texas are looking good," said Gary Cohen, who is charged with overseeing the exchanges at the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services.

Enrolling enough consumers is key to making the healthcare overhaul work economically, with price considered the most important factor driving enrollment, according to insurance industry surveys.

Another concern has been that insurance companies will limit access to doctors in order to keep prices low. Cohen said that these so-called "narrow networks" were a trend before the Affordable Care Act went into effect.

The law was adopted in 2010 but two of its main pillars, the health exchanges and the expansion of Medicaid, take effect in 2014. Household names like UnitedHealth Group Inc, Aetna Inc, WellPoint Inc and Humana Inc will sell plans on at least some exchanges. Newcomers such as Medicaid specialist Molina Healthcare Inc will also play a role.
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Old 09-25-2013, 06:53 AM   #2 (permalink)
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And this is from Forbes.

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For months now, we’ve been waiting to hear how much Obamacare will drive up the cost of health insurance for people who purchase coverage on their own. Last night, the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services finally began to provide some data on how Americans will fare on Obamacare’s federally-sponsored insurance exchanges. HHS’ press release is full of happy talk about how premiums will be “lower than originally expected.” But the reality is starkly different.


Interactive Map: In 13 States Plus D.C., Obamacare Will Increase Health Premiums By 24%, On Average
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WSJ: Health Insurance Rates Could 'Double Or Even Triple' For Healthy Consumers In Obamacare's Exchanges
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Ezra Klein And Avik Roy Go Mano-A-Mano On Obamacare, Rate Shock, And The GOP Agenda (Video & Transcript)
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The New York Times Tries -- And Fails -- To Protect Obamacare From Health Insurance 'Rate Shock'
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Based on a Manhattan Institute analysis of the HHS numbers, Obamacare will increase underlying insurance rates for younger men by an average of 97 to 99 percent, and for younger women by an average of 55 to 62 percent. Worst off is North Carolina, which will see individual-market rates triple for women, and quadruple for men.

HHS releases a trickle of data and a load of spin

Earlier this month, I and two colleagues from the Manhattan Institute—Yevgeniy Feyman and Paul Howard—published an interactive map that detailed Obamacare’s impact on individually-purchased health insurance premiums in 13 states plus D.C. As the accompanying article described, Obamacare increased premiums in those states by an average of 24 percent.

But those states were largely blue states that had set up their own, state-based insurance exchanges. The big data dump that we’ve been waiting for, since then, is from the majority of states that didn’t set up their own state-based exchange. That data is the responsibility of the Obama administration, namely HHS. Finally, with less than a week to go before the exchanges are supposed to go on-line, HHS has released a slim, 15-page report and a press release that summarize some of the premium data.

“Premiums nationwide will also be around 16 percent lower than originally expected,” HHS cheerfully announces in its press release. But that’s a ruse. HHS compared what the Congressional Budget Office projected rates might look like—in 2016—to its own findings. Neither of those numbers tells you the stat that really matters: how much rates will go up next year, under Obamacare, relative to this year, prior to the law taking effect.

Former Congressional Budget Office director Douglas Holtz-Eakin agrees. “There are literally no comparisons to current rates. That is, HHS has chosen to dodge the question of whose rates are going up, and how much. Instead they try to distract with a comparison to a hypothetical number that has nothing to do with the actual experience of real people.”


Comparing pre-Obamacare and post-Obamacare premiums

The HHS report doesn’t provide enough details about Obamacare’s premiums for us to incorporate the data into our interactive map. Our map compares the five cheapest plans available on the market today to the five cheapest plans available on Obamacare’s exchanges. The HHS report offers only the cheapest bronze, silver and gold plans, and the second-cheapest silver plan.

We look at rates for 27, 40, and 64 year olds; and rates for men and women. (Under Obamacare, rates for men and women are the same, which has the net effect of disproportionately increasing rates for men, who generally paid less under the old system.) The HHS report offers rates for 27-year-olds; and rates for the average-aged exchange participant, a figure that varies by state, but seems to generally land in the mid-thirties.

So, we conducted two comparisons between pre-ACA data and post-ACA data, as reported by HHS. The first comparison is between the cheapest plan available to 27-year-olds pre- and post-Obamacare. The second is between the cheapeast plan available to the average exchange participant, and to the typical 40-year-old pre-Obamacare. We would have liked to have compared rates for older individuals, but HHS didn’t report that data.





27-year-olds will face rate increases as high as 279 percent

As you can see from the map above, many 27-year-olds will face steep increases in the underlying cost of individually-purchased insurance under Obamacare. For the states where we have data—the 36 reported by HHS, plus nine others that we had compiled for our map that HHS didn’t report—rates will go up for men by an average of 97 percent; for women, 55 percent. (In the few cases where HHS reported on states that our map includes, we went with HHS’ numbers.)

Worst off was Nebraska, where the difference between the cheapest plan under the old system and under Obamacare was 279 percent for men, and 227 percent for women: more than triple the old rate. Faring best was Colorado, where rates will decline for both 27-year-old men and women by 36 percent. The only other state to see a rate decline in this analysis was New Hampshire: 8 percent for both men and women.

(Still missing are data from Hawaii, Kentucky, Massachusetts, Maryland, Minnesota, and Nevada. The data from New York and New Jersey should be taken with a grain of salt, as their individual insurance markets are not like those of other states.)





40-year-olds will face rate increases as high as 305 percent

40-year-olds, surprisingly, will face a similar picture. The cheapest exchange plan for the average enrollee, compared to what a 40-year-old would pay today, will cost an average of 99 percent more for men, and 62 percent for women.

For this cohort, men fared worst in North Carolina, with rate increases of 305 percent. Women got hammered in Nebraska, where rates will increase by a national high of 237 percent. Again, Colorado and New Hampshire fared best, with 17 percent and 5-8 percent declines, respectively.

Remember that here, we aren’t conducting an exact comparison. Instead we’re comparing the lowest-cost bronze plan offered to the average participant in the exchanges, to the cheapest plan offered to 40-year-olds today. This approach artificially flatters Obamacare, because the median age of an exchange participant is, in most states, below the age of 40.

In both the 27-year-old and 40-year-old comparisons, we adjusted the pre-ACA rates to take into account people who would be charged more for insurance, or denied coverage altogether, due to a pre-existing condition, using the same methodology we’ve used in the past.

For most people, subsidies won’t counteract rate shock

All of the analyses I’ve discussed thus far involve changes in the underlying cost of health insurance for people who buy it for themselves. Many progressives object to this comparison, because it doesn’t take into account the impact of Obamacare’s subsidies on the net cost of insurance for low-income Americans.

I’ve long argued that it’s irresponsible to ignore the change in underlying premiums, because subsidies only protect some people. Middle-class Americans face the double-whammy of higher insurance premiums, and higher taxes to pay for other people’s subsidies. However, it is important to understand how subsidies will impact the decisions by Americans as to whether or not to participate in the exchanges.

If you click on the “Your Decision” tab on our interactive map, you will now find the results, as assembled by Yevgeniy, for the 13 states plus D.C. in our original database. Here’s the bottom line: most people with average incomes will pay more under Obamacare for individually-purchase insurance than they did before.



In the 13 states plus D.C. (which I will abbreviate as 13+DC), a 27-year-old would have to make 59 percent of the median income of his peers, or less, to come out ahead with regard to Obamacare’s subsidies. A 40-year-old would have to make less than 57 percent of the median income for his peers. On the other hand, older people fare better; the average 64-year-old who makes less than 111 percent of the median income for 64-year-olds will spend less on premiums than he did before.

However, the overall results make clear that most people will not receive enough in subsidies to counteract the degree to which Obamacare drives premiums upward. Remember that nearly two-thirds of the uninsured are under the age of 40. And that young and healthy people are essential to Obamacare; unless these individuals are willing to pay more for health insurance to subsidize everyone else, the exchanges will not serve the goal of providing coverage to the uninsured.

The bottom line: Obamacare makes insurance less affordable

For months, we’ve heard about how Obamacare’s trillions in health care subsidies were going to save America from rate shock. It’s not true. If you shop for coverage on your own, you’re likely to see your rates go up, even after accounting for the impact of pre-existing conditions, even after accounting for the impact of subsidies.

The Obama administration knows this, which is why its 15-page report makes no mention of premiums for insurance available on today’s market. Silence, they say, speaks louder than words. HHS’ silence on the difference between Obamacare’s insurance premiums and those available today tell you everything you need to know. Rates are going higher. And if you’re healthy, or you’re young, the Obama administration expects you to do your duty and pay up.
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Old 09-25-2013, 06:55 AM   #3 (permalink)
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That's why MY rates have gone up dramatically. SOMEONE has to pay, and it sure is hell is NOT the people going on Obamacare.

So go fuck yourself, you selfish piece of shit.
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Old 09-25-2013, 06:57 AM   #4 (permalink)
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and here are the maps
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:02 AM   #5 (permalink)
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That's why MY rates have gone up dramatically. SOMEONE has to pay, and it sure is hell is NOT the people going on Obamacare.

So go fuck yourself, you selfish piece of shit.

This.

The worst part is insurance increased when the bill was passed so many have been paying more for years now.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:07 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I lowered my coverage and I'm still paying more than I ever have. It continues to go up every year. So yeah, you're welcome.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:16 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:23 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Back when I had insurance 03-09 the rates were going up every year
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:25 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Back when I had insurance 03-09 the rates were going up every year
Mine did too, but it was NOTHING like the rate hikes we've seen since obamacare was initiated.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:25 AM   #10 (permalink)
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My wife's rates are going up 50% and her benefits are being cut to conform to ACA according to her insurance company. At my job the same deal, my rates are going up 7% and my benefits are getting cut.

So yeah... not helping me out that is for damn sure.

Last year my premium increased by 72%...

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Old 09-25-2013, 07:29 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Back when I had insurance 03-09 the rates were going up every year
While rates will always rise.
The mrate hikes we had before obamacare passing were sustainable.
The rate hikes we are seeing now are not sustainable and there is no way the government being involved will make them any cheaper.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:31 AM   #12 (permalink)
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I've had health insurance plan from the same employer since 97.

Up until obamacare the typical rate increase was on par with inflation.

Since obamacare my rates have gone up significantly, and my coverage has gone down.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:33 AM   #13 (permalink)
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389 sounds great for an insurance plan until you look at it. I was paying 425 for my single employee's and it was a BCBS Cadillac plan before Obamacare began. Now, that same plan is 615. It is no secret what the .gov is doing.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:38 AM   #14 (permalink)
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My insurance rates used to go up about 2-3 dollars a year. Since 2010 they went up 5-10 a year. Started out in 2009 around $45 a pay check. This year, had I kept my original plan (I should have), it would have been $70 for the whole package (health, dental, eye).
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:42 AM   #15 (permalink)
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My wife's plan went up $125 a month this year and it's just her. Plus the coverage went down, and copay went up.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:44 AM   #16 (permalink)
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So go fuck yourself, you selfish piece of shit.
hey! thats my line!


but you can use it anytime you want to because i know it fits so well.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:45 AM   #17 (permalink)
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hey! thats my line!


but you can use it anytime you want to because i know it fits so well.
I've gone much further than that in the past, I was trying to be nice.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:49 AM   #18 (permalink)
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For those who said O-care would send rates through the roof:
are you going to post up your premiums/coverage when you sign up next tuesday? i think we're all curious what the rest of us are in for after our employers drop coverage alltogether.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:51 AM   #19 (permalink)
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are you going to post up your premiums/coverage when you sign up next tuesday? i think we're all curious what the rest of us are in for after our employers drop coverage alltogether.
you havent been paying attention. he already has been bragging about paying $320ish a month and how awesome Obamacare is and he is happy about it.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:52 AM   #20 (permalink)
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White House report: Tennesee men face 290%, women 197% Obamacare hike

White House report: Tennesee men face 290%, women 197% Obamacare hike | WashingtonExaminer.com

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The White House today released a report on the costs of Obamacare for most Americans, heralding their interpretation that 95 percent of the nation will be able to buy health insurance premiums below “earlier projections.”

But note the words “earlier projections.” That doesn’t mean that the insurance Americans will have to buy, or be fined, under Obamacare will be cheaper than what they pay today, before Obamacare kicks in.

We know this because at the same time the White House was releasing its broad study, Tennessee Sen. Lamar Alexander released his analysis of the report's portion on his state. He found that Obamacare will cost far more than what many of his constituents are paying today, some by as much as 290 percent.

— Today, a 27-year-old man in Memphis can buy a plan for as low as $41 a month. On the exchange, the lowest state average is $119 a month-a 290% increase.


— Today, a 27-year-old woman in Nashville can also buy a plan for as low as $58 a month. On the exchange, the lowest-priced plan in Nashville is $114 a month-a 197% increase. Even with a tax subsidy, that plan is $104 a month, almost twice what she could pay today.

— Today, women in Nashville can choose from 30 insurance plans that cost less than the administration says insurance plans on the exchange will cost, even with the new tax subsidy.

— In Nashville, 105 insurance plans offered today will not be available in the exchange.

Said the Republican senator, “Why should a 27-year-old male in Memphis be forced to pay nearly three times more than what he pays today for health insurance? Why should a young woman in Nashville have to pay twice as much? This isn't what President Obama promised Tennesseans, but it's what he's giving them-higher costs and less choice-two of the most urgent reasons Obamacare must be repealed and our health care system fixed."

The White House blog, however, focused on other states and details in their report.

“Nearly all eligible uninsured Americans (about 95 percent) live in states with average premiums below earlier projections. And nearly all consumers (about 95%) will have a choice of health insurance companies, each of which offers a number of different plans,” wrote Jeanne Lambrew, deputy assistant to the president for health policy.

She focused on Texas, not Tennessee: “Premiums are even lower for workers and families qualifying for tax credits. For example, in Texas, an average 27-year-old with income of $25,000 could pay $83 for the lowest-cost bronze plan, $133 for the lowest-cost silver plan, and $145 per month for the second lowest-cost silver plan after tax credits. For a family of four in Texas with income of $50,000, they could pay $57 per month for the lowest bronze plan, $239 for the lowest silver plan, and $282 per month for the second lowest-cost silver plan.”
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Old 09-25-2013, 08:04 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Up until obamacare the typical rate increase was on par with inflation.
The real question is how much of the rate hike can be attributed to the actual costs of Obamacare -- and how much of it is attributed to the uncertainty and/or speculation of the costs of Obamacare?

It's more of a rehtorical question, because I doubt that any of us really know the answer, but just throwing that out there.
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Old 09-25-2013, 08:12 AM   #22 (permalink)
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The real question is how much of the rate hike can be attributed to the actual costs of Obamacare -- and how much of it is attributed to the uncertainty and/or speculation of the costs of Obamacare?

It's more of a rehtorical question, because I doubt that any of us really know the answer, but just throwing that out there.
Think about that for a minute.

If our rates are rising because of the uncertainty in obamacare, then that is an actual cost of Obamacare.

I get the hair that you are splitting, and at a low level I agree. But in the grand scheme of things it really doesn't matter.

It's not like our rates are going to go down, and the more we find out about this crap legislation the more it costs us.

I REALLY wish I could have had Pelosi on the stage right after she said it has to pass to know what's in it. I really wish I or someone could have walked up with a contract, covered it all up except the signature and said sign. When she declined, tell her, she MUST sign it to find out what is in it.
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Old 09-25-2013, 08:19 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Mark me down as another who's paying more and getting less.

Speculative or not, I know the dollars leaving my wallet are real, and I know I won't be getting them back.
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Old 09-25-2013, 08:28 AM   #24 (permalink)
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$1938 for our family coverage through Anthem. PPO, $40 co-pays, $750 for person deductibles.

$24K per fucking year.
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Old 09-25-2013, 08:46 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Mine went up 325 a month this year. So it's about 580 a month now. Sweet. Loving that free health care.
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