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Old 09-17-2008, 04:42 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Help me with 4th grade math (seriously)

My daughter brought home her homework. They don't have a textbook to reference from. Just a crappy copy with questions on it. I don't know what the hell they are asking and can't look it up.

Here's the question:

Write and solve a repeated groups division problem with unknown group size.

Never heard of that shit.

.
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Old 09-17-2008, 04:46 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Can anyone explain the difference between:

1:Array Multiplication
2:Repeated Groups Multiplication
3:Repeated Groups Division with Unknown Multiplier
4:Repeated Groups Division with Unknown Group Size

Google doesn't help much.

I'm tired and my brain hurts.

It's fourth fuckin grade for crying out loud.
.
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Old 09-17-2008, 04:47 PM   #3 (permalink)
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wtf is that shit....i didnt even touch on that in any HS math class
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Old 09-17-2008, 04:51 PM   #4 (permalink)
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wtf is that shit....i didnt even touch on that in any HS math class
It's a test to determine which parents cheat by doing the math for their kids.
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Old 09-17-2008, 04:53 PM   #5 (permalink)
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It's a test to determine which parents cheat by doing the math for their kids.
Makes sense
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Old 09-17-2008, 04:54 PM   #6 (permalink)
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It's a test to determine which parents cheat by doing the math for their kids.
I'm not doing it for her...and not just because I can't

I would like to understand the concept so I can help her with it.

.
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Old 09-17-2008, 04:56 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpine4x4 View Post
Makes sense
Well, I think I get what it's saying. It's the unknown group size that causes the issue. For example, division as repeated subtraction:

30 / 6 = ??
30 -6 -6 -6 -6 -6 = 0

The group size would be 6.

So if you don't know the group size:

30 / x = ??
30 -x... wait how many times would that be?
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Old 09-17-2008, 04:59 PM   #8 (permalink)
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what the fuck? i have no idea...
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Old 09-17-2008, 05:30 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Well, I think I get what it's saying. It's the unknown group size that causes the issue. For example, division as repeated subtraction:

30 / 6 = ??
30 -6 -6 -6 -6 -6 = 0

The group size would be 6.

So if you don't know the group size:

30 / x = ??
30 -x... wait how many times would that be?

But...what if you know the multiplier...wait....multiplier?...I thought this was division. Yup read it again. Thats what it says.

Like 30 / x = 5

How's this?

Johnny has 30 bullets and 5 math teachers. If Johnny shoots each of his math teachers equally, How many holes does each teacher have?

30/5=6

Six

.
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Old 09-17-2008, 05:34 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Johnny has 30 bullets and 5 math teachers. If Johnny shoots each of his math teachers equally, How many holes does each teacher have?

30/5=6

Six

.
Ha, that's grounds for expulsion these days.
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Old 09-17-2008, 05:38 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jeepyj View Post
But...what if you know the multiplier...wait....multiplier?...I thought this was division. Yup read it again. Thats what it says.

Like 30 / x = 5

How's this?

Johnny has 30 bullets and 5 math teachers. If Johnny shoots each of his math teachers equally, How many holes does each teacher have?

30/5=6

Six

.
only if johnny is a good shot... you would need to touch on probibility and statistics because after the first 2 the other 3 would be ducking and weaving
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Old 09-17-2008, 05:39 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Ha, that's grounds for expulsion these days.
What if I change it? Johnny's dad has 30 bullets...

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Old 09-17-2008, 05:40 PM   #13 (permalink)
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He will only get off like 6 shots before swat gets there. And only three of the six will hit. One of the three that hits will kill. and he will do 40 to life for it. 30/6-3%1==40+ get it.
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Old 09-17-2008, 05:44 PM   #14 (permalink)
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only if johnny is a good shot... you would need to touch on probibility and statistics because after the first 2 the other 3 would be ducking and weaving
OH! WAIT! What if Johnny is on a moving runway that accelerates at the exact muzzle velocity of Johnnys gun, in the opposite direction of his aim, at exactly the same moment that the gun fires?

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Old 09-17-2008, 05:55 PM   #15 (permalink)
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He will only get off like 6 shots before swat gets there. And only three of the six will hit. One of the three that hits will kill. and he will do 40 to life for it. 30/6-3%1==40+ get it.
That make perfect sense. I like it. Its better than this useful bit of internet help

Quote:
Originally Posted by somefuckingwebsite
Forward references are obviously only useful if they're inside a repeated group. Then there can be situations in which the regex engine evaluates the backreference after the group has already matched. Before the group is attempted, the backreference will fail like a backreference to a failed group does.

If forward references are supported, the regex (\2two|(one))+ will match oneonetwo. At the start of the string, \2 fails. Trying the other alternative, one is matched by the second capturing group, and subsequently by the first group. The first group is then repeated. This time, \2 matches one as captured by the second group. two then matches two. With two repetitions of the first group, the regex has matched the whole subject string.
Oh OBVIOUSLY

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Old 09-17-2008, 06:16 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
originally posted by somefuckingwebsite
forward references are obviously only useful if they're inside a repeated group. Then there can be situations in which the regex engine evaluates the backreference after the group has already matched. Before the group is attempted, the backreference will fail like a backreference to a failed group does.

If forward references are supported, the regex (\2two|(one))+ will match oneonetwo. At the start of the string, \2 fails. Trying the other alternative, one is matched by the second capturing group, and subsequently by the first group. The first group is then repeated. This time, \2 matches one as captured by the second group. Two then matches two. With two repetitions of the first group, the regex has matched the whole subject string.
WTFO? I got up to differential equations in college (started off as an aerospace engeineering major and then said fawk that) and I have no clue WTF this math stuff is.
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Old 09-17-2008, 06:39 PM   #17 (permalink)
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WTF???

Quote:
Originally Posted by smewhtguy View Post
He will only get off like 6 shots before swat gets there. And only three of the six will hit. One of the three that hits will kill. and he will do 40 to life for it. 30/6-3%1==40+ get it.



OK fine I'll let my nerdy side show:
The only thing that's remotely familure to me there is the array multiplication, and I don't recall ever seeing that until upper level engineering classes (in college...)!

Array Multiplication is pretty easy. An array is basically a set of numbers: 1, 4, 8, 5, 16, ..... to however many places there are. IIRC to multiply an array you just have a multiplier in front of each block. So multiply the above array by say 3 you have 1x3, 4x3, 8x3, 5x3, 16x3


Awe f*ck it, just send the homework back with a note along the lines of "Where is my daughters math book and Wtf kind of shit is this?" Or simply reference a huge URL from Wikipedia for the answer... Don't worry if it works or not, teach won't check.
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Old 09-17-2008, 07:00 PM   #18 (permalink)
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WTFO? I got up to differential equations in college (started off as an aerospace engeineering major and then said fawk that) and I have no clue WTF this math stuff is.
That stuff is my home territory, but it has nothing to do with math. Regular expressions are a syntax that has to do with text manipulation.

This url looks useful, but I'm guess our young student is in bed by now.
http://www.homeschoolmath.net/teachi...ubtraction.php
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Old 09-17-2008, 07:08 PM   #19 (permalink)
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That stuff is my home territory, but it has nothing to do with math. Regular expressions are a syntax that has to do with text manipulation.

This url looks useful, but I'm guess our young student is in bed by now.
http://www.homeschoolmath.net/teachi...ubtraction.php
That actually makes a hell of a lot more sense. Seriously, write the note asking WTF the text book is and to have the teacher explain stuff better.
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Old 09-17-2008, 07:28 PM   #20 (permalink)
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This url looks useful, but I'm guess our young student is in bed by now.
http://www.homeschoolmath.net/teachi...ubtraction.php
Thanks...and yes she is. This seems to make sense if we use multiple assumptions with the original question. It's still just "division" though. How many ways are there to divide a number? Is there a non-repeating-groups division?

thanks guys. I LOLed

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Old 09-17-2008, 07:35 PM   #21 (permalink)
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They make elementry school math courses goofy as fuck nowadays. When I was in diff eq in college(calculus 4 in some places) I couldn't help my wife with her class that was teaching her how to teach math to elementary school kids. They just do a shitty job of explaining what it is.
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Old 09-17-2008, 07:37 PM   #22 (permalink)
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repeating groups division may be related to dividing as a repeated subtraction. 36/6 is the same as 36-6-6-6-6-6 times.

Then array multiplication is also known as matrix multiplication, but that's pointless to know without an actual application.

I'm sure it's all pretty simple stuff, they just keep coming up with new and complicated names for things that they didn't have even when I was taking algebra 10 years ago.

I remember trying to help someone my freshman year in college do an algebra problem involving something called "rationalizing the denominator". Confused the hell out of me until i realized it was just getting the square root out of a fraction, but i'd never heard it called rationalizing.

Justin
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Old 04-11-2011, 04:36 PM   #23 (permalink)
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WTF It's not just 4th grade

My grand daughter has been bringing math home all year with this array crap. I'm 54 years old & don't understand a bit of it & when you ask the teachers for help all I ever get is " we went over it in class!" I don't give a flip about what they went over, she doesn't understand & niether do I. I'm sick of this school system.
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Old 04-11-2011, 05:03 PM   #24 (permalink)
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My daughter brought home her homework. They don't have a textbook to reference from. Just a crappy copy with questions on it. I don't know what the hell they are asking and can't look it up.

Here's the question:

Write and solve a repeated groups division problem with unknown group size.

Never heard of that shit.

.
Goggle "Math [thing at the top of the paper]"

Like this: "Math Repeated groups division"
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Old 04-11-2011, 05:07 PM   #25 (permalink)
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My little 3rd grader was stumped on her math homework the other day. I could answer the questions (division with remainders) but I could not for the life of me do it the way the teacher wanted it done. Made no fucking sense at all.
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