Ford Hub / Chevy Caliper Bracket Problem

[Ben Segrest]

Fuckity fuck fuck fuckin fuck!

So I'm finally wrapping up my front axle install (histeer with chevy knuckles/spindles/brakes and ford hubs/rotors) and of course I ran in to a little problem. I didn't have brake backing plates, so I ordered a set from Blackbird Customs. Problem, apparently 3/4t chevy D44 plates space the caliper differently than 1/2t chevy D44 plates. This put the plate too close to the rotor and there isn't enough room for the brake pad. So. . . What are my options?

1. Find new backing plates. I've got $140 bucks in these and had to grind on them to fit since I'm using aftermarket knuckles, too. I talked to Randy earlier today, before I realized that 3/4t and 1/2t plates are different, and he said I could return them, but I don't think that would be fair to him.

2. Is there another hub that will work with the backing plate I have? I've been looking through the Ford section, but I haven't found anything yet. Figured some of you guys might have run across something in your wanderings.

Here's what I've got

[Ben W]

Not only do they space it differently, but the caliper will probably be too high. 3/4 ton rotors are a little bit bigger diameter. You're going to need to get the right backing plates. I would bet that RustoleumWhite has at least 6.5 sets of the backing plates you need scattered about his properties.

[uglyscout]

I have the same freakin' picture from when I tried to use Dodge hubs....



I have nothing to offer.

But if you need Chevy 1/2 ton caliper brackets and can't get them locally - I bet they will fit in a large flat rate box and someone could get them to you for $15.

[RustoleumWhite]

Originally Posted by Ben W

I would bet that RustoleumWhite has at least 6.5 sets of the backing plates you need scattered about his properties.

just might


if need, I'll check for you (probably this weekend) ben.


Then sell the Blackburn plates, or return them if he's going to be cool about it.

[Ben Segrest]

Originally Posted by RustoleumWhite

if need, I'll check for you (probably this weekend) ben.

I'll call Blackbird tomorrow and see if he doesn't make a 1/2t plate. The weird thing is that I asked him about this specific setup and he rattled off all the parts I used. I'll let you know after I talk to him.

[SSGTWC]

I think I ran across a set the other day. I'll check tonight, and get back with ya.

[Mechanos]

I scrapped a couple of pairs of them a little while back when I was cleaning out the garage at the old house.

I did run across a pair of small bearing 6 bolt spindles and a pair of Ford hubs though.

[SSGTWC]

Ok, Ben I have the brackets. PM me your address and I get them sent off Monday. Will that work for ya?

[Dgeman]

Just a quick question. Are these brackets made for a 5 bolt spindle? Sorry for the hijack but I am trying to use GM brakes instead of Ford on my 44HD in my Jeep and a lot of people told me I had to make my own brackets.

[RustoleumWhite]

The brackets in question are for a 6-bolt Chevy/Jeep spindle.

You might be able to redrill the brackets. Or could re-drill the knuckle to take the GM spindle and brackets. You have to do some measurements to make sure all the spacings are right.

Don't know, just speculating. Or just swap the knuckles as well for GM/Jeep knuckles and loose all the ford stuff except for the hubs/rotors. You could go with flat-tops and develop high-steer as well.

[Ben Segrest]

Originally Posted by SSGTWC

Ok, Ben I have the brackets. PM me your address and I get them sent off Monday. Will that work for ya?

That would be awesome. PM inbound.

[Ben Segrest]

So I got this shit put together and it won't stop worth a crap.

Specs:

Ford rotors @ all 4 corners
Chevy Calipers @ all 4 corners (AA brackets in the back stock backing plates in the front)
Wilwood adjustable prop valve currently set wide open
Corvette 1.125" disc/disc master (1970ish)
Stock Scout II booster and pedal assembly.
36" SX's

From my research, scout calipers are 3.1" diameter piston and chevy calipers are either 2.934 or 3.146 diameter. Stock scout master is 1.125" bore as is the corvette master I have. I have bled and bled and bled some more. Speed bleeders, old fashioned two person method, homemade vacuum bleeder using my shop vac and a speedy bleed kit. I still have what I think is excessive pedal travel. The pedal does stop well before the floor, doesn't bleed down. Even if I stand on the pedal, it will not lock up the brakes. It's not stopping well enough to even take out of the neighborhood. Today I blocked off the rear driver side caliper, which I would think should increase pressure to the right rear, still no lock up. The girlfriend just got home, so I'm going to switch the plug to the left rear to see what that caliper will do. Any thoughts are appreciated.

p.s. I'm 85% confident in the master. I swapped in the spare that I had just to rule it out. bench bled the shit out of it, was able to get to down to around the 1/8" of piston movement that the instructions specified.

[JetFxr]

Check the line diameter I am going to replace the lines on my Travelette because the smaller lines will not allow enough fluid flow. The drum brakes wheel cylinders use much less fluid to move than the pistons on the disc. I know that on my Scout I had to pump the peddle to get enough fluid to lock up the brakes.

[Ben Segrest]

Would such a condition prevent the fronts from locking up either? Also, I'm not getting any noticeable pedal creep. I would think something like restrictive lines would cause pedal creep, no?

[Ben Segrest]

Here's a couple of quick pics of my pedal travel. First is engine running at rest, second is engine running, standing on it. Tip of the tape is in the same spot for both pics. Readings are 5 3/4" and 2 1/2". About 3 1/4" of pedal travel.

[SSGTWC]

Ben,

I truly apologize not getting those brackets to you. I feel really bad about that. There has been way too many commitments every month.

(back on topic) Are you running a vacuum booster, or a hydro?

[brewchief]

You do have the calipers on the correct sides don't you? Bleeder up?

[Ben Segrest]

Originally Posted by brewchief

You do have the calipers on the correct sides don't you? Bleeder up?

Technically the calipers in the back are on the wrong sides, but yes the bleeders are up.

ETA: Passenger rear (just bled this one, that's why it looks wet)



Passenger front

[Ben Segrest]

Originally Posted by SSGTWC

Ben,

I truly apologize not getting those brackets to you. I feel really bad about that. There has been way too many commitments every month.

(back on topic) Are you running a vacuum booster, or a hydro?

No worries, I got some from Rusty. The front end has been back together for over a year, then it was a matter of finishing the tbi before I could drive it again. I've been fighting the brakes off and on for months now.

Booster is a vacuum disc/drum scout unit.

[Ben W]

If you pump the brakes do they hold better?

[Ben Segrest]

Originally Posted by Ben W

If you pump the brakes do they hold better?

no

[Ben W]

Have you tried bypassing the wilwood valve?

Do you still have the stock proportioning valve in place?

[rkscout]

I ran into a similiar problem on a buddies jeep. CJ7 with ProRock 60's front and rear. Chevy 1/2 ton calipers front and back on 37"s. Corvette master w/aftermarket booster. Stopped like shit, wouldn't lock them up. Bought new ProRocks that had the F350/E350 dual piston calipers. (there were a number of reasons for the new prorocks than just the brakes) With the bigger pistons, had real low pedal and still bad braking. Found a bigger master that had a 1 1/4 bore that bolted up just the same as the corvette one. I believe it was for a early '80s chevy c30. The pedal was now right, but it still stopped for shit. Ended up being a bad booster. It now puts you through the window if you stab them hard. That would be what I would check on yours. FYI, on my 800 I'm running a '70s corvette master with chevy 1 ton front calipers and 1/2 ton rear chevy's, no booster, on 38"s, and I can lock them up.

[binderbound]

That shit looks rusty and old. Have somebody push on the pedal and you watch the calipers. See if they move at all or just push the rotor side to side. I had a similar issue years and years ago. My shitty junkyard calipers werent clamping, just the piston pushing out. Worth a look.


BTW, my scout uses a mustang MC with no booster and the same caliper/rotor set up you have. Worked like a charm if you remember.

[Ben Segrest]

Originally Posted by binderbound

That shit looks rusty and old. Have somebody push on the pedal and you watch the calipers. See if they move at all or just push the rotor side to side. I had a similar issue years and years ago. My shitty junkyard calipers werent clamping, just the piston pushing out. Worth a look.

Remember I live in South Louisiana. Right now it's midnight, 82 degrees and 85% humidity. I bought all of the rotors(new) and calipers (rebuilt I guess) from the auto parts store. That shit rusted like that sitting in my carport. I'll still check em.