Look Mom, No leafs!!!

[xo_jeep]

Originally Posted by xj9140

They are building a HP44 with WJ outers, not quite what you have. And it appears they are using a unit bearing eliminator kitDo yourself a favor and gusset your inner c's. They suck to replace/straighten once they get bent.

They are using a 44 center section with TJ 30 inner Cs and outers (same as 44) as well as the same Warn hub conversion kit as I have and the WJ knuckles. So other than the 44 center section, it's the same axle with the same issues as I have.

http://naxja.org/forum/showpost.php?...0&postcount=45

Also, Just like their coil buckets, mine sit all the way up against the inner C, acting as a upper gusset. I also gusseted the lower C last night. In fact, I think mine is a little beefier than theirs. I will post pics tonight. I just finished all welding and painted it yesterday.

Here's their inner C

Originally Posted by xj9140

Swapping between knuckles requires relocating the trac bar or you'll be all over the road. Just the regular WJ calipers and rotors work fine, locked my 37's up no problem. You can re drill the rotors with a drill press, they are hub centric. Use you old rotors for a templet. I don't see the point in machining the knuckles. Just use .25 plate for the spacers.

I built my track bar with intentions to run it with the WJ knuckles. But I'm smart (or lucky) and have adjustability built into both the frame side and axle side mounts so I can easily change it to match whatever steering/drag link angle I end up with. Thanks for the heads up though.

Black Magic Brakes told me he usually uses a thicker spacer, welds it to the knuckle, and then decks it in the mill to ensure exact spacing and flatness since it has a tendancy to warp during welding. I guess the spacing required is not exactly .250" It does sound a little over the top but he seems like a perfectionist when it comes to his brakes.

My question is why weld the spacer? It appears that the spacer mounts in between the knuckle and spindle (unit bearing if you have one). The 3 bolts go from the backside of the knuckle and thread into the spindle. The spacer is not load bearing. It's only there to align the U-joints with the ball joints so they pivot on the same axis. The is different on the WJ because they have a CV style front end. Maybe I'm missing something....

[xo_jeep]

Originally Posted by xj9140

Yeah, trac bar (panhard). But never-mind looks like he's got some adjustment there in both the brackets, should be able to make it work with both knukes fine. I'm just too much of a perfectionist. Carry on.

My response was a little late. Glad you saw that. Thanks again for your help.

I'm abandoning the WJ knuckles until after this trip. I have enough on my plate already.

[xj9140]

Originally Posted by xo_jeep

My question is why weld the spacer? It appears that the spacer mounts in between the knuckle and spindle (unit bearing if you have one). The 3 bolts go from the backside of the knuckle and thread into the spindle. The spacer is not load bearing. It's only there to align the U-joints with the ball joints so they pivot on the same axis. The is different on the WJ because they have a CV style front end. Maybe I'm missing something....

People trip the F*** out when I tell them I ran my spacers un welded for at least 20,000 street miles, some moderate wheeling and air born at least once. I never had a problem.(37X14.50 tires)
The bearing units are A machined fit into the knuckle, the bolts are only to clamp the uni bearing in place, hence the reason to weld the spacer, to keep the load off the bolts. The machined shoulder is just a cunt hair thicker than .25 Another thing know body ever mentions, you lose .25 axle spline engagement in the gear carrier's side gears, not that it matters.

Originally Posted by xo_jeep

My response was a little late. Glad you saw that. Thanks again for your help.

You betcha

[xo_jeep]

Originally Posted by xj9140

People trip the F*** out when I tell them I ran my spacers un welded for at least 20,000 street miles, some moderate wheeling and air born at least once. I never had a problem.(37X14.50 tires)
The bearing units are A machined fit into the knuckle, the bolts are only to clamp the uni bearing in place, hence the reason to weld the spacer, to keep the load off the bolts. The machined shoulder is just a cunt hair thicker than .25 Another thing know body ever mentions, you lose .25 axle spline engagement in the gear carrier's side gears, not that it matters.

I see the reason now, kinda. Still, you would think with proper torque and some locktite it should be fine.

So if you lose .250" spline engagement is your axle actually .500" wider overall? I wish I would of known that since I just re-tubed my axle and could have compensated for that.

[xo_jeep]

Here are the knuckle gussets and the axle fully welded and painted. The crossmember will be done tonight and then to finish the frame plating and assemble everything.

[xo_jeep]

Spent most of the weekend doing a bunch of little things and finishing plating the frame. I built this model to show my girlfriend why I wasn't spending time with her

[xjbrian219]

Originally Posted by xo_jeep

I built this model to show my girlfriend why I wasn't spending time with her

[moparmaniaccuda]

Any reason you tilted the UCA mount rearward instead of more vertical on the axletube?

Seems like you lost some length on the arm for no reason?

[xo_jeep]

Originally Posted by moparmaniaccuda

Any reason you tilted the UCA mount rearward instead of more vertical on the axletube?

Seems like you lost some length on the arm for no reason?

Yeah I did it on purpose. As a general rule you want your upper shorter than the lowers. For one thing, this keeps your caster more consistent throughout travel. Since the Jeep sees street driving, I thought it was a good idea. My upper is not very much shorter than the lowers. If I would have put the upper axle mount vertical, the upper would have been longer than the lowers. This would have caused the pinion to rotate up during uptravel and caster to move towards zero. Not enough caster could mean death wobble on the street.

[JeepFreak21]

Originally Posted by xo_jeep

Yeah I did it on purpose. As a general rule you want your upper shorter than the lowers. For one thing, this keeps your caster more consistent throughout travel.

With your upper link shorter than your lowers, your pinion is going to point down during extension. My upper is 36.5" and my lowers are 35" and my pinion stays pointed right at the t-case at every point in the suspension cycle.
Billy

[xo_jeep]

I realize that also. Either way there is compromises. The upper is probably 1.5" shorter than the lowers. The driveshaft barely moves during full travel. The choice was sacrifice pinion angle or caster. I had death wobble before from running 6" lift on short arms. It pushed my caster to zero and if you hit a bump at speed and the suspension drooped at all it would turn into a shopping cart wheel.

Another minor reason for pushing the upper behind the front axle was so I didn't have to hang the panhard way in front of the axle and interfere with the steering.

[HRDROKN]

Originally Posted by xo_jeep

Spent most of the weekend doing a bunch of little things and finishing plating the frame. I built this model to show my girlfriend why I wasn't spending time with her

Lol.... and how did that work out for ya?

[moparmaniaccuda]

Originally Posted by xo_jeep

The upper is probably 1.5" shorter than the lowers.

I doubt it will matter then, like you said. The pic made it look like it was significantly shorter.

[xo_jeep]

Originally Posted by HRDROKN

Lol.... and how did that work out for ya?

She wasn't as impressed as I hoped, but she said it was shiny and pretty

Originally Posted by moparmaniaccuda

I doubt it will matter then, like you said. The pic made it look like it was significantly shorter.

I'll double check the lengths tonight, but they're close.

[ford_n_toy]

Originally Posted by xo_jeep

She wasn't as impressed as I hoped, but she said it was shiny and pretty



I'll double check the lengths tonight, but they're close.

I think they are closer to the same length, with in a 1/2". The lower combo bracket pushes the lower link mounting pretty far back. And when we mocked up the upped mount vertical It put the pan hard to far forward of the axle. I think it also looks better with the upper rotated back.

btw Your still going to be putting this thing together on the lake bed

[xo_jeep]

Originally Posted by ford_n_toy

Your still going to be putting this thing together on the lake bed

You guys are assholes. It wasn't my fault last year! I'm waaayyy ahead of schedule this year, even if the axle still isn't attached to the truck right now... I just got everything back from powder coat and should have my driveshaft tomorrow. Very little fab is left and then it's just put it all back together. Easy, right???

[ford_n_toy]

Originally Posted by xo_jeep

I just got everything back from powder coat

This is why its your fault this year

[xo_jeep]

Originally Posted by ford_n_toy

This is why its your fault this year

I deny everything. The powdercoater had that shit for a month! I planned ahead.... It's everyone else who screws it up for me.

[xo_jeep]

I checked and the lowers are 33 1/2" and the upper is 32"

Got all my stuff back from powder coat finally. Now time to get the tires mounted up, axle back together, and under the truck.





And the m*$&%rf#cking frame plating is pretty much done. Maybe 20 minutes of welding, then some paint. It really is a pain. Maybe I shouldn't have used 3/16" plate for all of it but that's just how I build shit. I'm really happy with how it came out, but it took way too long. Too much intimate time with my grinder. I need a plasma

[xo_jeep]

Had a blast at KOH. Watched some awesome racing and ran some good trails.

Enjoy

[christyle]

So, drive it around the block or anything, or afraid to since i'm not there to come save you?

[xo_jeep]

Ya I drove it to the mall a couple times

They have some creative parking spots there

[xo_jeep]

Originally Posted by xo_jeep

It's surprisingly stable. I always thought I would need a sway bar but it's not that bad at all. I would like to add a sway bar in the rear to make the front suspension work harder but I don't feel i need one for stability. I think outboarding the springs the extra 2 inches helped a lot. I drive it around town and feel very safe. I'm not worried about getting into a sticky situation and losing control because the Jeep doesn't handle right.

After finishing the front three link, I would like to officially retract this statement. It needs a sway bar for the street. I think the fact that the front suspension couldn't hardly articulate before made it more stable. Now that everything is soft and free of binding, it makes it sway and roll much more under normal driving. Even just normal accelaration in a straight line it dips and torques to the side (torque steer). It does 60 through the desert better than it does 60 on the street.

But on another note, its getting a grizzly for the front right now. The limited slip truetrac wasn't cutting it. I need a real locker.

[xo_jeep]

Did some wheeling at Hollister last week. One of my friends works there, so we got to test out the new area. It's going to be awesome.

[xo_jeep]

Oh, and we found out the cage is solid haha