aww, crap. Corvette master cylinder doesn't fit - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
 
Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum  

Go Back   Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum > Brand Specific Tech > Jeep - Hardcore Tech
Notices

Reply
 
Share Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-07-2004, 12:15 AM   #1 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Member # 7354
Location: Rocklin, CA
Posts: 2,402
aww, crap. Corvette master cylinder doesn't fit

I just tried to install my new Corvetter master cylinder but it's too long and interferes with my shock hoops. The stock MC is about 5.25" and the vette one is 8". Does anybody have a measurement from the back of the mounting flange to the very end of an E350 MC or another one that would work. 97 XJ with 1 ton front discs and 3/4 ton rear.

Thanks

Sean
__________________
If you are not pissed off, you are not paying attention.
SeanP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2004, 07:53 AM   #2 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Keith Strong's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Member # 477
Location: The Peeplz Republik
Posts: 12,254
Send a message via Yahoo to Keith Strong
Sean call me tonight and I will measure mine for you
__________________
[CENTER][SIZE="5"][URL="http://www.strong-arms.com"]Strong Arms "Survival Slings" For Sale PM me for a PBB only price[/URL]
[/SIZE][/CENTER]
Keith Strong is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 05-07-2004, 09:55 AM   #3 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Member # 7354
Location: Rocklin, CA
Posts: 2,402
Thanks Keith. I sent a PM to loppy too.

The threads on this board refering to the E350 state it is best to use that master for rear drums and to use the corvette for rear disc applications. I don't know what this is. The master doesn't have any special valving for residual that I can see, the prop and resid are usually downstream from the MC. Granted I am not a brake system expert, I am hoping that someone chimes in here.

SeanP
__________________
If you are not pissed off, you are not paying attention.
SeanP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2004, 11:00 AM   #4 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Member # 25770
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 185
Good Luck with it. I put a Corvette manual master on mine months ago and it stops but not very well. It has stock D60 calipers on front with Gm 1/2 tons on the rear. No proportional valve, rear brakes run directly to rear bowl, with residual. Front brakes run to front bowl. I even put Russell speed bleeders on the calipers to make bleeding easier.
I have already swapped the master out twice thinking it was a poor reman job. Could it be possible that Ghettozone gave me 3 bad ones? I don't know but the pedal feels spongy like it has air in it. I'm 100% positive it doesn't (yes I did bench bleed).
Like I said...Good Luck.
__________________
Safety Yellow & Handicap Blue CJ with 5.3 Vortec/400/Atlas/Tons/Roks/Locks and Airshocks.
Toss me one of them Skullbusta's!
RedRooster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2004, 12:13 PM   #5 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Keith Strong's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Member # 477
Location: The Peeplz Republik
Posts: 12,254
Send a message via Yahoo to Keith Strong
Sean, I bet ya money that the ford one works fine
__________________
[CENTER][SIZE="5"][URL="http://www.strong-arms.com"]Strong Arms "Survival Slings" For Sale PM me for a PBB only price[/URL]
[/SIZE][/CENTER]
Keith Strong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2004, 01:33 PM   #6 (permalink)
Pirate4x4 Addict!
 
Join Date: May 2000
Member # 940
Location: Lincoln, Ca
Posts: 6,459
What about the one for a 78/79 Eldorado that has 4wheel disks and has the large rear calipers. They are a normal length
__________________
WWW.PCRYO.COM
Deep Cryogenic Tempering Service
Find all my products at
www.KICKASSOFFROAD.COM
916-434-6978
Custom Sway Bars and Axles built to order.

Got 40 spline? I have the hubs, spindles, and axles you need to kickass!
Custom Hummer wheels and centers
Axle Resplining
66CJdean is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2004, 01:49 PM   #7 (permalink)
Registered User
 
LOPPY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Member # 1108
Location: Nor Cal
Posts: 4,199
Yeah, I can measure too when I get home Sean. I bet Strong is right though, the E350 would work just fine. Mine kicks major arse, but I do run rear drum for now.

Dean may be onto something. Check it out!
__________________
Those who forge their swords into plows will plow for those who do not.
LOPPY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2004, 02:28 PM   #8 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Member # 7354
Location: Rocklin, CA
Posts: 2,402
I spoke with Adam T. today. He mentioned that there might be a small residual valve in the MC where the rear line attaches. This is removable. Can anyone confirm?

thanks Dean, I'll look at the Caddy MC if the E350 doesn't work.

SeanP
__________________
If you are not pissed off, you are not paying attention.
SeanP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2004, 04:39 PM   #9 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Member # 23445
Location: Vermont
Posts: 372
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedRooster
I have already swapped the master out twice thinking it was a poor reman job. Could it be possible that Ghettozone gave me 3 bad ones? I don't know but the pedal feels spongy like it has air in it. I'm 100% positive it doesn't (yes I did bench bleed).
Like I said...Good Luck.

Everything I have been told is NOT to use a reman unit but a NEW unit only. The hone/bore the old ones out often time not updating the rest of it to go along with it, try a NEW one and see how it works.

-RJ
78304CJ-7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2004, 05:33 PM   #10 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Member # 13593
Location: Thornton, CO (Denver)
Posts: 90
Send a message via AIM to BlazerZR2
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedRooster
Good Luck with it. I put a Corvette manual master on mine months ago and it stops but not very well. It has stock D60 calipers on front with Gm 1/2 tons on the rear. No proportional valve, rear brakes run directly to rear bowl, with residual. Front brakes run to front bowl. I even put Russell speed bleeders on the calipers to make bleeding easier.
I have already swapped the master out twice thinking it was a poor reman job. Could it be possible that Ghettozone gave me 3 bad ones? I don't know but the pedal feels spongy like it has air in it. I'm 100% positive it doesn't (yes I did bench bleed).
Like I said...Good Luck.
Switch the brake lines at the master cylinder. Rear bowl is supposed to go to front brakes, and front bowl is supposed to go to rear brakes. If you dont do this you get the problem you describe.
__________________
CJ7: SOA, 360/TH400/D20, F D44 & R 9", Locked Front, Spool Rear, 4.88's, 37's on Rockstomper Beadlocks, Custom GM TBI
BlazerZR2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2004, 10:15 AM   #11 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Member # 7354
Location: Rocklin, CA
Posts: 2,402
just an FYI the E350 MC is also 8" long. I think I have a workaround for the vette MC to work which, of course, includes an angle grinder.

SeanP
__________________
If you are not pissed off, you are not paying attention.
SeanP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2004, 10:46 AM   #12 (permalink)
Zeus of the Sluice
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Member # 7876
Location: Rockville, MD
Posts: 4,402
Send a message via AIM to Arya Ebrahimi
What about the Dodge 3500 MC?? I read that's a bolt-on with the TJ Booster, maybe it will work with the XJ booster too?? Something to look into anyway.

Ary
__________________
DD/Tow-rig: '06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Duramax
Classic Rig: '88 FJ62, 100% stock
In the weeds waiting for resurrection: '94 FZJ80, 33s, locked
Arya Ebrahimi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2004, 01:15 PM   #13 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Member # 7354
Location: Rocklin, CA
Posts: 2,402
Keith Strong came over last night and suggested a solution: Cut down the studs to the booster and then I will be able to sneak the MC around my shock hoops.

SeanP
__________________
If you are not pissed off, you are not paying attention.
SeanP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2004, 06:49 AM   #14 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Member # 25770
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlazerZR2
Switch the brake lines at the master cylinder. Rear bowl is supposed to go to front brakes, and front bowl is supposed to go to rear brakes. If you dont do this you get the problem you describe.
Thanks for the tip, but I fixed it the afternoon I posted that. It turns out that they had given me one that was identical in appearance to all the other Corvette ones I have seen but the bore was different.
I ditched the Corvette style anyway. A local guy told me to try an Autozone # M1730. I believe he said it was for a mid 80's one ton 2WD crew cab Chevrolet. I measured and compared. The one I had was a 1" bore (supposed to have been 1-1/16") and the new one was 1.3" with even larger bowl capacity. It stopped like a champ after minimal bleeding and will now lock down all 39.5's on dry asphalt.
The M1730 is a bolt on for CJ's with no adapters needed for the lines. Pushrod adjustment may be necessary due to a shallow pilot hole on the MC.
__________________
Safety Yellow & Handicap Blue CJ with 5.3 Vortec/400/Atlas/Tons/Roks/Locks and Airshocks.
Toss me one of them Skullbusta's!
RedRooster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2004, 09:29 AM   #15 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Member # 21566
Location: Myrtle Beach, SC
Posts: 232
Send a message via AIM to rwangler88
You guys all running XJ's and YJ's? I am trying to set up my TJ to stop 37's. I am running a 9" and 44 out of a 78 F100 with stock drums Rear and discs up front. Once I adjusted the booster rod to reach the E350 MC, I can barely push the pedal down, and when I am on it really hard it finally stops. Can adjusting the rod too far causing little movement make it take that much force to stop. Or is there something else wrong. before I adjusted the rod it did not stop barely at all, and was mooshy. Another think I noticed is everybody talks about bench bleading. I am about to search more about this, bit since my lines were completely drained, when I blead to the wheels, starting with the pass side rear and making a couple of rounds, I would not think Bench Bleading would be necessary.
__________________
'07 Jim's Garage Chassis. LT-1, rocks, stak, shooting for 44's unless Maxxis comes out with some bigger stickies.
[URL]http://aggressivekrawlers.com[/URL]
[URL]http://www.aggressivekrawlers.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=3[/URL]
rwangler88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2004, 01:49 AM   #16 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Member # 7354
Location: Rocklin, CA
Posts: 2,402
well the fawk up fairy has come back around. The start of the travel in the vette MC is 1.5" further in from the mounting flange than the stock on. I guess I need to make a longer pushrod somehow. Also, the stock MC has a nice rubber gasket that fits the ID of the booster nicely to seal it. The vette MC is smaller in diameter and wont seal this way. Any advice to seal it? Also, it looks like my booster (97 XJ) is the same as a TJ booster and they seem to be using the dodge 3500 MC. Does this fit better? I have already drilled the vetter master, so returning it might not work, plus I went to the effort of searching the reduction fittings.

Any advice appreciated. Yes, it is 1:48 and I am just leaving the garage for the night.

SeanP
__________________
If you are not pissed off, you are not paying attention.
SeanP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2004, 05:33 AM   #17 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Member # 14364
Location: Salt Lake City
Posts: 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanP
well the fawk up fairy has come back around. The start of the travel in the vette MC is 1.5" further in from the mounting flange than the stock on. I guess I need to make a longer pushrod somehow. Also, the stock MC has a nice rubber gasket that fits the ID of the booster nicely to seal it. The vette MC is smaller in diameter and wont seal this way. Any advice to seal it? Also, it looks like my booster (97 XJ) is the same as a TJ booster and they seem to be using the dodge 3500 MC. Does this fit better? I have already drilled the vetter master, so returning it might not work, plus I went to the effort of searching the reduction fittings.

Any advice appreciated. Yes, it is 1:48 and I am just leaving the garage for the night.

SeanP
The 77-82 vette MCs have the Shallow hole you need they are identical otherwise to the 68-76, so you will still have the other problems.
bobdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2004, 07:21 AM   #18 (permalink)
Registered User
 
P&T Jeeps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Member # 3916
Location: south
Posts: 2,823
well Sean, I'm glad you made the jump into the Vette MC before I did b/c that is surely what I planned on using after reading the multiple 'bigger MC' threads b/c I'll have big discs F&R. but, it seems that the 3500 is the way to go.

sucks that the advise was apparently not all that accurate, keep us posted....
__________________
TJ; ARB'd & ChroMo'd 1-tons; 42" IROK's; Atlas 4.3; 4-linked, 106" WB...

[URL="http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=274444"]The Build[/URL]
P&T Jeeps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2004, 10:11 AM   #19 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Member # 7354
Location: Rocklin, CA
Posts: 2,402
Quote:
Originally Posted by P&T Jeeps
well Sean, I'm glad you made the jump into the Vette MC before I did b/c that is surely what I planned on using after reading the multiple 'bigger MC' threads b/c I'll have big discs F&R. but, it seems that the 3500 is the way to go.

sucks that the advise was apparently not all that accurate, keep us posted....
someone had to guinea pig this stuff. Another concern is that the stroke of the stock MC is 1.5" yet the corvette is 1". I am not sure about the bore yet, but the shorter stroke will probably make it more difficult to modulate the braking at the pedal (meaning the pedal input between gradually slowing the vehicle and locking the tires will be less linear).

The thing about the 3500 is that it had drums in the rear. I am not sure where the residual valve is on their systems, but I would want to figure out how to remove this vavle in a 4 disc application.

I will stick with the vette MC and see if I can make it work. I have all ready built my lines that go from the MC to distribution block. I want to find some EPDM rubber to cut a gasket to fit between the MC and booster and then seal it all up with RTV. I just need to keep it from leaking so the booster still has vacuum.

I'll post results.

SeanP
__________________
If you are not pissed off, you are not paying attention.
SeanP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2004, 10:42 AM   #20 (permalink)
Registered User
 
P&T Jeeps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Member # 3916
Location: south
Posts: 2,823
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanP
The thing about the 3500 is that it had drums in the rear. I am not sure where the residual valve is on their systems, but I would want to figure out how to remove this vavle in a 4 disc application.
That is the exact reason I planned to go w/ the Vette MC as well. I would assume that the residual valve would be down-stream from the MC in the stock 3500 setup so that was not my main concern it was that the reservoir volumes were set up for front disc/rear drum. Honestly, I don't think it would matter that much though as both reservoirs are larger than stock & my TJ & my buddies YJ run rear discs on the stock setup, no probs...
__________________
TJ; ARB'd & ChroMo'd 1-tons; 42" IROK's; Atlas 4.3; 4-linked, 106" WB...

[URL="http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=274444"]The Build[/URL]
P&T Jeeps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2004, 10:45 AM   #21 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Keith Strong's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Member # 477
Location: The Peeplz Republik
Posts: 12,254
Send a message via Yahoo to Keith Strong
Hmmmm, so wierd man. I used a Ford van M/C and bolted it together...no problems whatsoever
__________________
[CENTER][SIZE="5"][URL="http://www.strong-arms.com"]Strong Arms "Survival Slings" For Sale PM me for a PBB only price[/URL]
[/SIZE][/CENTER]
Keith Strong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2004, 10:54 AM   #22 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Member # 7354
Location: Rocklin, CA
Posts: 2,402
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith Strong
Hmmmm, so wierd man. I used a Ford van M/C and bolted it together...no problems whatsoever
and you are running rear drums.

I just like to make things more difficult and lose sleep. Keith, did you seal around where the MC meets the booster?
__________________
If you are not pissed off, you are not paying attention.
SeanP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2004, 11:34 AM   #23 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Keith Strong's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Member # 477
Location: The Peeplz Republik
Posts: 12,254
Send a message via Yahoo to Keith Strong
Nope And can you expain to me why a 350 M/C wont push disks?
__________________
[CENTER][SIZE="5"][URL="http://www.strong-arms.com"]Strong Arms "Survival Slings" For Sale PM me for a PBB only price[/URL]
[/SIZE][/CENTER]
Keith Strong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2004, 11:41 AM   #24 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Member # 7354
Location: Rocklin, CA
Posts: 2,402
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith Strong
Nope And can you expain to me why a 350 M/C wont push disks?
Is there a residual valve in the MC that holds presure to the rear brakes? That pressure will cause drag on a caliper vs drum.

SeanP
__________________
If you are not pissed off, you are not paying attention.
SeanP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2004, 12:35 PM   #25 (permalink)
Registered User
 
P&T Jeeps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Member # 3916
Location: south
Posts: 2,823
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanP
Is there a residual valve in the MC that holds presure to the rear brakes? That pressure will cause drag on a caliper vs drum.

SeanP
Sean, are you sure about that? Is it actually 'in' the MC & not downstream?
__________________
TJ; ARB'd & ChroMo'd 1-tons; 42" IROK's; Atlas 4.3; 4-linked, 106" WB...

[URL="http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=274444"]The Build[/URL]
P&T Jeeps is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:26 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.