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Old 01-21-2009, 08:56 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Shaved 14 bolt - Shave 14b Corporate clearance

I've had a Front HP60 and 14 Bolt sitting in the garage for MONTHS and I finally decided it was time to cut 'em up...I know there are other shaved 14b write-up but here's another one.

This 14 bolt has dually hubs so it will only be 63' wide (compared to the 'normal' 67" wide). It will nicely match the HP Dana 60 that I'm narrowing to 65". This little write-up is about shaving the 14 bolt to give that PIG a little more clearance on the trail...

Below is the 14 bolt after I cut the stock brackets and perches. The stock drum brakes have been removed and trashed (shedding something like 100+ pounds) and the hubs have been removed for cleaning. The axle will run 3/4 ton chevy disk brakes (so will the front Ford HP 60 when I'm done).



The Diff on the 14 is HUGE. My current Jeep has a 14 in the rear which was the first one I ever shaved - on that axle I removed about 2" and replated with 1/2"...This time I thought I'd just start cutting and see where I ended up. Notice the red lines drawn...I figured that was a good place to start. I estimated the pinion angle for this axle to be around 18-22 degrees. So, I set the pinion at 20 degrees before drawing the line for material to remove. This way, when I re-plate the bottom of the axle the shave will be as dramatic as possible and the flat bottom 'should' be parallel to the ground.





Holy MOLY...turns out that line was about 2.5" That is A LOT. So i broke out the preferred too for shaving - the Sawzall of course. I purchased some "Cryogenically Treated" blades at Home Depot and started cutting. If you have never done this before most people would think it would take about 2 days and about 50 blades to cut through the massive beefyness of a Corporate 14 bolt. Turns out that the job is REALLY easy. I used only 1 blade and it took only about 15 minutes to to make the single cut.





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84 CJ "Tripod" One ton 60/14b, 5.0 HO, 331:1 crawl, 39.5 Iroks...just the basics
97 TJ - 35's, 4:1, HP D30/8.8 and too much lift - the wife's daily driver
02 TJ - Under the knife-gettin' 60/14, w/40's
02 F350 - The grocery-getter
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Old 01-21-2009, 08:58 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Here is the CHUNK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Oops...my 14 bolt is now an 11 bolt :o



Here is the BEFORE and AFTER photo (IMPORTANT NOTE: the axle is upside down in the photos...I am shaving the bottom...not the top of the axle)


Here is the gaping hole that has been left behind :shock:



Here's another photo with the stock cover back on just to give you another view of how much material has been removed.

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84 CJ "Tripod" One ton 60/14b, 5.0 HO, 331:1 crawl, 39.5 Iroks...just the basics
97 TJ - 35's, 4:1, HP D30/8.8 and too much lift - the wife's daily driver
02 TJ - Under the knife-gettin' 60/14, w/40's
02 F350 - The grocery-getter
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Old 01-21-2009, 08:58 PM   #3 (permalink)
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The image below shows that I removed so much material from the differential that the ring-gear will need to be shaved too.



There are several ways to shave a ring gear but I opted for the most economical...a grinding wheel. Shaving the ring gear was a MUCH bigger job than actually cutting down the differential. The photos below show me using a sanding disc but I actually used a standard grinding wheel (this photo was taking after I finished all the grinding). I installed the carrier back in the differential and while a friend (Norm) spun the carrier I ground as much material as I could. This process took over an hour and about a half dozen grinding disks. Norm and I took turns spinning the carrier while the other one manned the grinder.



The results...shaved diff and the ring gear after it's been shaved and 'polished' with the sanding disk.



I made a plate from 3/8ths steel to weld back and cover the hole left from the shaving. I needed to clearance about 1/16th - 1/8th of an inch on the plate to make room for the ring gear. The result gives about 1/8" all the way around the ring gear for lubrication.




Welding the plate to the differential is not like welding most steel. In this particular case the differential is cast and as a result must be heated and CAREFULLY cooled for a successful weld. The plan (based upon the success of the other 14 bolt we shaved about 3 years ago) will be heat the diff with a torch till it glows...then it's ready for welding. I will weld three passes inside AND out so there will be no question regarding strength and/or seal. The difficult part is to make sure the materials cool VERY SLOWLY!!! The last time we did this we simply wrapped/insulated the diff with welding blankets, old t-shirts and anything else to keep the heat in to be sure everything cooled nice and slow (it took about 5 hours to cool enough to touch last time). I will likely use this technique again (although I hear a sand-bath works well - I'm considering that option too).

I already have plans for the diff cover which will need to be customized of course. I plan to put two bolts back into the bottom of the diff to help seal the cover so it does not leak. Stay tuned and I'll update when I finish welding and again when I put the diff cover together.
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84 CJ "Tripod" One ton 60/14b, 5.0 HO, 331:1 crawl, 39.5 Iroks...just the basics
97 TJ - 35's, 4:1, HP D30/8.8 and too much lift - the wife's daily driver
02 TJ - Under the knife-gettin' 60/14, w/40's
02 F350 - The grocery-getter

Last edited by Tripod; 01-21-2009 at 09:06 PM.
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Old 01-21-2009, 09:28 PM   #4 (permalink)
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cool little write up! very interesting...
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Old 01-21-2009, 09:31 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Is there any issue with balance in the ring gear when you reduce its diameter with a grinder? I know nothing about this kind of thing but it would seem to me that a thick ring of steel spinning at high velocity would need to be properly balanced or it would start to "wobble" or at least create vibration in the whole axle/driveshaft.

I shaved my 14 bolt when I had it but didn't go nearly that far. All I did was cut the fat lip off it and blend all the sharp angles smooth on the underside. Nice job on your cut though.
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Old 01-21-2009, 10:40 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Pac - you ask an excellent question that my buddies and I have been pondering. If this were going under a dedicated trail rig I'd say who cares...I never drive that fast anyway (at least not for a long period of time). However, I plan to keep this rig road-friendly. My hope is that when we 'spun' the carrier while grinding on it we spun it fast enough to avoid flat spots and keep the shave even and level. However in reality I know it's not going to be perfect. I'll just have to wait and see if it's close enough. If I start burning up carrier bearings I'll remove the ring gear and have someone true it on a lathe.

I'm curious - any one else out there shave their ring gear by 'hand' like I did? Any balance issues?
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84 CJ "Tripod" One ton 60/14b, 5.0 HO, 331:1 crawl, 39.5 Iroks...just the basics
97 TJ - 35's, 4:1, HP D30/8.8 and too much lift - the wife's daily driver
02 TJ - Under the knife-gettin' 60/14, w/40's
02 F350 - The grocery-getter

Last edited by Tripod; 01-21-2009 at 10:42 PM.
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Old 01-21-2009, 10:45 PM   #7 (permalink)
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When this thing hits the road and you spin it up a few times, please post an update and let us know how its working out.

I looked into this option (reducing the ring) before I hacked my 14b and had planned to have a local guy turn it on a lathe. Instead I figured I'd start with what I did then move on from there. Interested to hear how yours runs though.
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Old 01-21-2009, 11:03 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Yea...I'll definitely post up. If it works everyone can do it. If it doesn't work everyone will know to avoid it. It gonna be a while before these axles are installed (late spring at the earliest) so everyone be patient.
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84 CJ "Tripod" One ton 60/14b, 5.0 HO, 331:1 crawl, 39.5 Iroks...just the basics
97 TJ - 35's, 4:1, HP D30/8.8 and too much lift - the wife's daily driver
02 TJ - Under the knife-gettin' 60/14, w/40's
02 F350 - The grocery-getter
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Old 01-22-2009, 02:30 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Deffinately interested in this also. I have been wondering if it is even worth the 2/2.5" when running 42's. Then I also was wondering about shaving the ring gear and loosing any strength to it. I want to see the diff and the 2 added bolts when your done. Mine will also be road worthy, so I want to make sure it doesnt leak all the damn time.
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Old 01-22-2009, 02:39 AM   #10 (permalink)
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getting rid of the 2-3 inches is more than worth it. my buddy has a 14b rear with 39 krawlers. needless to say he needs to shave his diff. i forwarded him this thread cause it really shows how easy it is to do this maybe a little time consuming but what isnt.

good work, looks great and strong
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Old 01-22-2009, 04:17 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Really nice write up and looks really good. Any concerns with using 3/8th and an 1/8" trough for ring gear clearance. I think for piece of mind I'd use (when I do mine) 1/2" plate and machine/grind out a slightly deeper trough for the ring...although IDK. I know the span isn't that big but I wonder how resistant it'll be to bending after landing on a rock. Any plans for the cover attachment? Looking good.....keep posting up.
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Old 01-22-2009, 06:07 AM   #12 (permalink)
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I don't want to bash your technique of clearing the ring, but if I were going that route then I would have it spun on a lathe. That ring spins pretty quickly to rest your balancing on a grinder while spining the ring. If you don't have one a good machininst could defidently do this for you. They'll turn the jaws in the chuck to grab the I.D. of the ring. Good Luck. I'm defidently checking back to see how this turns out
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Old 01-22-2009, 10:06 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Good write up so far. Just one question: Did you check the "runout" on the ring gear once you got done grinding/sanding it down? I would imagine if you you got it close enough that the balance issue wouldn't be a problem at all.
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Old 01-22-2009, 12:04 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Wonder how much the welding will warp the shaft alignment ? Are you going to check it for straightness when you are all done or just run it ? Good writeup - thanks.
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Old 01-22-2009, 02:24 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by 1TonOfSh!t View Post
I don't want to bash your technique of clearing the ring, but if I were going that route then I would have it spun on a lathe. That ring spins pretty quickly to rest your balancing on a grinder while spining the ring. If you don't have one a good machininst could defidently do this for you. They'll turn the jaws in the chuck to grab the I.D. of the ring. Good Luck. I'm defidently checking back to see how this turns out
If he just plans to use it for rockcrawling I do not forsee the unbalanced ring gear being a problem, but with any road time I would be worried as well.

Build is looking good, weld it up and show us some pictures.
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Old 01-22-2009, 03:10 PM   #16 (permalink)
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I can't see the balance of the ring gear being an issue, it's turning the same speed as the much larger diameter, usually unbalanced tire.
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Old 01-22-2009, 03:20 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Is there a market for shaved ring gears!

I ahve been meaning to buy a yellow star anyway!!!
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Old 01-22-2009, 04:11 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Is there a market for shaved ring gears!

I ahve been meaning to buy a yellow star anyway!!!
There might be if the price was right. I would either leave more material on the housing or have someone machine it down.
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Old 01-22-2009, 04:12 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Is there a market for shaved ring gears!

I ahve been meaning to buy a yellow star anyway!!!
Yes, get a good rep built up and you will have the man in brown knocking on your door often.
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Old 01-22-2009, 04:51 PM   #20 (permalink)
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i shaved mine the same way but turned the ring gear on a lathe ..whats ur plans for a diff cover ??



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Old 01-22-2009, 06:51 PM   #21 (permalink)
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So, I set the pinion at 20 degrees before drawing the line for material to remove. This way, when I re-plate the bottom of the axle the shave will be as dramatic as possible and the flat bottom 'should' be parallel to the ground.
Why make the plate parallel to the ground?
I shaved mine to match the rib that runs from the pinion to the back of the axle. This way when the plate "meets" a rock with any forward momentum it will want to lift the axle and create a slide for the pig....

I also used the same method of shaving but mine is a trail rig, so no worries about balance... That being said if I do it again it'll be done on the lathe (have one now) because the grinder took FOREVER....

Find a way to get some new bolts in the bottom, I thought I could get away without but it definitely needs one/two...
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Old 01-22-2009, 07:08 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Nice work, thanks for posting and for those who have posted their shaved pig!
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Old 01-22-2009, 07:38 PM   #23 (permalink)
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I've been contemplating about doing the same thing to mine. Since it's already set up, I might shave the ring gear down to the pattern to get the most out of this mod. Nice work!
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Old 01-22-2009, 07:44 PM   #24 (permalink)
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this is ALOT easier than i thought.. How are you guys securing the lower edge of the diff covers and what are you using for a cover ?? just a thicker steel one shaved the same way?
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Old 01-22-2009, 09:19 PM   #25 (permalink)
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While previously researching this mod I believe it became a rather important point that there needs to be some kind of bolted retention of the lower edge of whatever cover you wind up using. Whether that means welding in nothing more than a nut to the inside of the case that matches a custom drilled hole on the cover or drilling directly into the case edge itself, something needs to be done down there. A lot of the previous threads discussing this mention the covers peeling back when dragged over rocks or an inability to seal the cover while it does nothing more than sit in the driveway.

Here's an interesting solution, a photo I believe I found in one of the threads here. Looks like this guy didn't bolt the bottom of the cover at all but welded a plate "mini-skid" that protected the cover's bottom edge. I don't think he cut the case as much as the author here and the ring gear appears to be full diameter. FWIW:


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