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Old 10-16-2005, 09:04 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Daily driver lockers

I am looking to add traction to my daily driver but don't want to lose any driveability. would a rear locker such as a lockrite hinder the on road driveabilty at all? I live in the midwest and we do get quite a bit of snow. I would also like to put somthing in my Dana 30 but like to use 4wd in the snow so a locker may be out of the question. Is a limited slip up front even worth the money?
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Old 10-16-2005, 09:29 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Go ARB you'll get best of both worlds.
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Old 10-17-2005, 12:34 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by rticul8_94yj
Go ARB you'll get best of both worlds.

Ditto
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Old 10-17-2005, 03:54 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Personally, I'm not a fan of ARB lockers and never bought into the 'best of both worlds' thinking. Ideally I want all 4 tires turning on pavement, but no binding in the steering, chirping of tires, or fishtailing in snow. Off road I want all 4 tires turning and retain steering ability. ARB, gives you all 4 tires turning when you need it, but when they are off you have open diffs. How is that the best? All at what I consider too much complexity.

I run Truetracs in both diffs. Not the 'best' as I don't get 100% lockup on the trail but on pavement where my Jeep is most of the time they out perform ARB's hands down. All at lower cost, less complexity, and less thinking about what position the switch is in. I've never hear anyone say they can't engage the Truetrac. And if I had to do it today there is the Electrac which gives you a Truetrac that can be locked electrically. That is the best of both worlds in my mind.

Not really bashing ARB as Lord knows they are effective popular enough.

BTW, as far as traction on the trail people normally assume I am locked. And yes, a limited slip in the front is worthwhile.
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Old 10-17-2005, 05:40 AM   #5 (permalink)
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weld or spool it.

no wierd "unlocking" in rain or snow, no worry of ::: psssst::: "hey are both wheels turning" and tire scrub is not that bad.

But thats just me and I am poor if you have the cash go with a ARB in the rear, if you dont than spool or weld it.
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Old 10-17-2005, 06:10 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I run a minispool in my TJ's 8.8 rear all over on the road and highway and off. I like it, very predictable, always there whether you need it or not. In the front I have run lock right, ezlocker and detroit as well as tru trac's. I have the luxury of being able to pull the locker and throw an open carrier when I wish, so does anyone with the abililty. I hardly notice a front locker anymore on the street, snow or not. It is impossible to predict 100% what is going to happen running slippery roads locked up but I have every chance of predictablility that an open rig has. Find a friend that has dual posi's and one with dual lockers, etc. Get them to let you do some beat running and see if you like it.
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Old 10-17-2005, 07:35 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcracco
I run Truetracs in both diffs. Not the 'best' as I don't get 100% lockup on the trail but on pavement where my Jeep is most of the time they out perform ARB's hands down. All at lower cost, less complexity, and less thinking about what position the switch is in. I've never hear anyone say they can't engage the Truetrac. And if I had to do it today there is the Electrac which gives you a Truetrac that can be locked electrically. That is the best of both worlds in my mind.

Not really bashing ARB as Lord knows they are effective popular enough.

BTW, as far as traction on the trail people normally assume I am locked. And yes, a limited slip in the front is worthwhile.
Then you don't wheel, PERIOD. Because if you did, you would know how much LSD's SUCK and are almost worthless.

If you want the best of both worlds, an ARB or ELocker is the only way to go. Open diff's for on-road snow driving is preferred (or any condition for that matter). 100% locked for the trail is the only way to go.
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Old 10-17-2005, 01:09 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I know most of you say that ARB are they way to go, but they are way out of my price range. I am looking to spend $300-400 per axle.
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Old 10-17-2005, 01:44 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I just found these (Aussie Locker) the other day and all the reviews I've seen are very positive. They are a mechanical Detroit-style locker but at a much affordable price point. I am planning on getting one for the front of my 2002 Wrangler.
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Old 10-17-2005, 01:54 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by WN1998
I know most of you say that ARB are they way to go, but they are way out of my price range. I am looking to spend $300-400 per axle.
Well if that's all you have to spend, then you have little choice. Just do it if you what and report back how it worked out.

A selectable locker is the best of both and while ARB always comes up, OX lockers are also a choice. (Although there is no real money savings to talk about.)

And while I think that "Then you don't wheel, PERIOD" is a little harsh, I do agree that LSD's SUCK. I could not get rid of mine fast enough. If you go off-road, not trail riding (that's not a slam), then put a Detroit in the rear and leave the front open until you have the money for a selectable. At the very least, if you MUST put in an LSD, then at least only do the rear and then once you decide it sucks on your own, at least you won't be out the money for both axles. Besides, if you do happen to like it because that is the type wheeling you do, then no big deal. Go out at that point and buy a front one. You'll do it based on YOUR experience and not others.

Last edited by AtlasRocker; 10-17-2005 at 01:56 PM.
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Old 10-17-2005, 04:42 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Knoxville
Then you don't wheel, PERIOD. Because if you did, you would know how much LSD's SUCK and are almost worthless.
Yup! Sure do wheel the thing and I enjoy damn near every minute! And I go EVERYWHERE the other children go with their supper dupper lockers. Just offering a different point of view for someone asking about a daily driver (dickhead).
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Old 10-17-2005, 06:42 PM   #12 (permalink)
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detroit full carrier hands down
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Old 10-17-2005, 08:55 PM   #13 (permalink)
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I ran a rear Detroit and a Trutrac on the front for a number of years. The only way to get the Trutrac to hook up when a tire lifted was to feather the brake pedal, which I became quite good at. When I bumped up to 35" tires, I noticed a performance drop in the Trutrac. It took more frequent use of the brake pedal to get the front to hook up, which was still OK as I had more than enough brakes to go around.

When I installed disc brakes on the rear axle, the feathering method revealed its shortcoming on my rig.....the rear discs worked better than the drums and feathering the brake pedal felt more like I was deploying an anchor as I tried to move forward with a front tire in the air.

I removed the Tractech hardware and installed a pair of ARBs.....I never looked back and haven't regretted making the switch. I don't miss sliding down the off-camber slopes because of a locked rear and I don't miss riding the brake pedal when playing in the rocks.
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Old 10-18-2005, 01:32 AM   #14 (permalink)
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The only thing that i dont like about my ARB's is that theres more shit that can go wrong and leave you one wheel peelin,then say a detroit.

ARBs are kinda nice though cause when your doin Dizzy's in the dirt you can have full posi, but when your taking a 45 mph off ramp at 75 mph in the rain its nice to have it un-locked.
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Old 10-18-2005, 03:36 AM   #15 (permalink)
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I had lockrights front and rear in my daily driver/wheeler. Living in western NY, we get a little snow now and then. The rear locker was invisible until I needed it and it performed very well at paragon. The front locker was invisible until we had snow on the roads. Then it was scary. I drove it all the time, but I like living on the edge. No one else was allowed to drive it.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nor Cal Jeep
when your taking a 45 mph off ramp at 75 mph in the rain its nice to have it un-locked.
I wouldn't recommend doing this with a lockright either. Short wheelbases turn around quickly.
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Old 10-18-2005, 04:52 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by arizona98tj
I ran a rear Detroit and a Trutrac on the front for a number of years. The only way to get the Trutrac to hook up when a tire lifted was to feather the brake pedal.......
Good post. That is the one definite draw back of the system; a tire with zero traction gets all the torque just like an open diff. If you find yourself with tires in the air frequently then lockers are better suited to your application.
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Old 10-18-2005, 05:18 PM   #17 (permalink)
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At the time the Tractech parts were installed, I was in denial about playing on the rocks in my spare time. Trail running was the norm and it wasn't all that often that I was carrying a tire. Well....you can guess how it went from there.....and pretty soon 3 wheelin' in the TJ was the norm. The good part is that I am now cured.
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Old 10-18-2005, 05:27 PM   #18 (permalink)
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I have true-tracs front and rear and would not change even if I had the ARBs laying in the floor. Was going the ARB route but was not thrilled about all the possibilities for trouble. The true trac works great on the road and works well off. all 4 wheels dig. No problems and have enjoyed it. Good luck with your search. ~preach
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Old 10-21-2005, 10:57 AM   #19 (permalink)
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On the good and cheap side I suggest Aussie Lockers. $230 each delievered, great customer support, and no complaints from users. Search here on Pirate and see for yourself. Aussie has a thread in vender forums here too.

But be very careful on snow and ice. When you start to spin a rear wheel on an open diff, only one wheel spins and the rearend stays behind you. With a locker one spins, both spin, and rearend trys to get infront of you real fast!

Last edited by doyll; 10-21-2005 at 11:01 AM.
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Old 10-21-2005, 11:45 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jeepinlunatic
detroit full carrier hands down
I agree, Ive got the full detroit in the rear and and the detroit EZ locker in the front. Works awesome. The rear will pop every once and a while on the road. Its loud enough to scare any passenger you have with you. We get a little ice and snow in lubbock, tx and i think its fun as hell to drive when its a little icy out. Ive had the lockers in for a little over two years. tire wear is not significant enough to outweigh the performance offroad. DETROITS all the way IMO.
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Old 10-21-2005, 12:34 PM   #21 (permalink)
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I like ARB's for the road, 'specially since my wife drives the rig with kids in tow.

On the trail, I like being able to unlock the diffs & run open. It is easier on equipment. There are also times when being open allows me to hold a line better than being locked.
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Old 10-21-2005, 12:58 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knoxville
Then you don't wheel, PERIOD. Because if you did, you would know how much LSD's SUCK and are almost worthless.

If you want the best of both worlds, an ARB or ELocker is the only way to go. Open diff's for on-road snow driving is preferred (or any condition for that matter). 100% locked for the trail is the only way to go.

Maybe he wheels on sand dunes-Everyone who goes off road does not have to be a low crawing rock demon. LSD are fine for mud and sand-and are great for people who have to have their junk on the street to go to work and pick up milk and eggs. Different strokes....
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Old 10-21-2005, 02:00 PM   #23 (permalink)
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WN1998,

Clearly you are going to get a lot of varied responses on this. Here is some more. You should ignore comments from anyone who lives in an area that does not get snow and lots of it every year because they probably have not had the experience of front/rear end swapping on on ice/hard packed snow. I have experienced this numerous times and frankly there is just too much too risk: aside from risking your own life you risk ruining someone elses life too. So I would pass on an automatic locker. A less aggressive lsd might do, but then, as others have mentioned, you risk poor performance on the trail. So this pretty much leaves selectable lockers or a spool. I personally dont like the idea of a spool ice because both tires spin whereas with an open diff one will stay put and keep you from fishtailing, but thats just an opinion.

Have you considered upgrading just the rear to a selectable locker and then the front as you can afford it or your offroad abilities require it? You will spend the same cash, but still have great on road drivability and good offroad ability.

Karl
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Old 10-21-2005, 03:47 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Eaton E-Lockers...

The best of both worlds fro a DD...
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Old 10-22-2005, 02:16 PM   #25 (permalink)
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I was running a full detroit in the back of my Tj for awhile and it does take some getting used too but I like it. Its certainly driveable and I'd recommend it however if you want the drive of a car then no... but if your willing to put up with some banging and learning to redrive alittle its certainly great.

One thing I don't like so far about the detroit is the amount of backlash.. I really noticed it when trying to ease myself though a rocky section.

The best thing about running a detroit is the look on peoples faces with your chirping around corners or the best is when it unlocks in a parking lot. People go running
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