soft brakes 87 cherokee 4 L - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
 
Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum  

Go Back   Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum > Brand Specific Tech > Jeep - Non Hardcore
Notices

Reply
 
Share Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-24-2005, 12:55 PM   #1 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Member # 56121
Posts: 8
Exclamation soft brakes 87 cherokee 4 L

Perhaps there is are wise brake men out there. I have very soft brakes on my 87 cherokee laredo, discs front, drums rear. New rear brake cylinders and new MC. I have bench bled the MC and the system 3-4 times, no air. I bled FR, FL, BR, BL. I performed a simple pedal test from the Haynes manual to prove the booster. There is vacuum in the booster. I can pump them to get a more firm pedal. Sometimes, after a slow turn (left or right) as I apply the brakes there is nothing. Thoughts? Prop valve?
mnorvold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2005, 01:09 PM   #2 (permalink)
Low Range Drifter
 
JohnnyJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Member # 7903
Location: SE Michigan
Posts: 2,910
is this for a stock system, or some random mix of parts?
__________________
Neither Skinny Nor Pretty DEAK Racing 4517 Ultra 4 Modified Class
Thanks to Drivetrain Specialists and PAC Racing Springs for your support
JohnnyJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 10-24-2005, 01:58 PM   #3 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Member # 56121
Posts: 8
Exclamation

stock, almost mint for it's age and 255,000 miles
mnorvold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2005, 02:00 PM   #4 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Budd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Member # 28368
Location: OC, California
Posts: 3,140
Blog Entries: 13
'd

Bleed from the farthest brake from the m/c first.
__________________
'68 Jeepster, GN powered
Budd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2005, 02:25 PM   #5 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Member # 56121
Posts: 8
I have done it both ways (neither helped) but the manual and other posts have shown that the fronts must be bled first to set the proportioning valve i guess
mnorvold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2005, 08:44 AM   #6 (permalink)
Wheeler
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Member # 32054
Location: 9738 Atlantic Ave, South Gate Ca 90280
Posts: 491
Send a message via AIM to VancoPBS
Adjust the rears. They should drag to the point that if you spun them as hard as you can with the tire on it only makes one revolution.
__________________
Van
Vanco Power Brake Supply
9738 Atlantic Ave
South Gate, Ca 90280
800-256-6295
323-563-1588
VancoPBS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2005, 10:13 AM   #7 (permalink)
Wheeler
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Member # 40450
Posts: 117
Check into swapping the 96 or newer booster and MC from an XJ. I know I've seen quite a few write ups on here and over on NAXJA. Makes a world of difference. I know theres an issue with the throw of the brake pedal on the older XJ's versus the newer ones, but I believe theres an easy fix for that as well. Search it up!

MIke
MDMIKE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2005, 10:28 AM   #8 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Member # 53227
Posts: 58
get the whole booster/mc from a 95-96 XJ and it will be a direct swap. all you have to do is rig the brake switch and bend up two brake lines. in 97-up they used a lot longer rod in the booster that wont match up. put one in my 92 and it's like night and day.

http://www.madxj.com/MADXJ/technical...terUpgrade.htm
there's a write-up.
xgeekstarx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2005, 10:30 AM   #9 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Member # 56121
Posts: 8
Thanks. I've done all the adjusting and replacing I can. The only thing left is this swap? The brakes worked well 'til 2 years ago. I guess the swap is all that's left?
mnorvold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2005, 10:46 AM   #10 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Member # 6318
Location: TN.
Posts: 40
I swapped a '92Ford E-350 master cylinder into my MJ (I've got Waggy D-44's under it). Bolt on except for the front brake line which requires an adapter from auto parts store. I went to a pull apart for the master cylinder. Total project took about 15 min. to install, and about 30 min. of driving and making adjustments. Total cost was less than $20. The brake pedal is firm... I like firmness, will just about lock up the 38's. Stopping distance is alot shorter. Best 20 bucks I've ever spent for the MJ.

I had to adjust the push rod out a couple of turns to get them where I wanted them. Driving the beast is alot more fun now.

A friend of mine, that figured all this out, has also used a '90 model E-350 MC

Last edited by xjaddiction; 10-25-2005 at 10:48 AM.
xjaddiction is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2005, 10:49 AM   #11 (permalink)
Registered User
 
andyr354's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Member # 28130
Location: KS
Posts: 1,164
The swap only makes the booster stronger to help you out more. In my opinion you have air in the system or a rear out of adjustment.

Do you have to push the pedal a ways to get the brakes to work? That is a major sign of a rear out of adj. The way you also have to pump the brakes is also a giveaway to this condition. Gotta push enough fluid to get the shoes back in contact.

Also do you have the crappy old Bendix ABS?
__________________
89XJ, 4.0L, AW4, D30, D44, 33s, homefab dakota and RE lift.
93 Dodge W250 Clubcab LE, Cummins, getrag 5spd, 3.54s, straightpipe.
[URL="http://trailkrawlers4x4.org/"]Trailkrawlers 4x4[/URL]
andyr354 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2005, 11:08 AM   #12 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Member # 56121
Posts: 8
Exclamation

the pedal does travel a bit before i feel resistance. I'll check the rears again but they did drag to the point of hearing a little friction. I know what you mean by pumping but even at that they are never rock hard. This all started after I replaced rear pads and cylinders about three years ago.
No, this is not ABS
mnorvold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2005, 11:10 AM   #13 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Steve N's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Member # 112
Location: Pleasant Hill CA
Posts: 9,166
__________________
[COLOR=yellow]it's all about show & shine[/COLOR]

[COLOR=Lime] Stiffy®? why screw around with anything less? [/COLOR]

Charter member PBB mod divorce club for men.
Steve N is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2005, 07:07 PM   #14 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Member # 2521
Location: Northern Colorado
Posts: 956
Quote:
Originally Posted by mnorvold
Sometimes, after a slow turn (left or right) as I apply the brakes there is nothing. Thoughts?

Bad wheel bearings pushing the front pistons back in?
Slagburn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2005, 08:32 PM   #15 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Member # 56121
Posts: 8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slagburn
Bad wheel bearings pushing the front pistons back in?
Perhaps, is that really a concern? I will check
mnorvold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2005, 07:18 AM   #16 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2002
Member # 11588
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 879
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjaddiction
I swapped a '92Ford E-350 master cylinder into my MJ (I've got Waggy D-44's under it).

That won't work on stock brakes.

Last edited by Kilby; 10-26-2005 at 07:19 AM.
Kilby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2005, 04:16 PM   #17 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Member # 6318
Location: TN.
Posts: 40
nope
xjaddiction is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2005, 09:59 PM   #18 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Member # 56121
Posts: 8
Thumbs up victory Slagburn is the man

Today, after replacing both rear cyls, MC, purging and filling the system with new fluid, setting up the rears, new front hoses i decided to check a suggestion from "Slagburn". He thought maybe it was a faulty wheel bearing pushing the piston in. I wasn't sure that this could happen but I knew that it was in need of replacement so since it had to be done, i did it.....not really thinking that it would help.........by gosh and by golly SLAGBURN WAS RIGHT!. Thanks to all of you for your patience and help
mnorvold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2009, 01:00 PM   #19 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Member # 126919
Posts: 3
how is a wheel bearing pushing the pistion back in? im having the same proablem with the front not having any stopping power but the rear are locking up and no pedle......any one....
visa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2009, 07:00 AM   #20 (permalink)
I should be working
 
Jam Master Jay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Member # 18829
Location: Broken Arrow
Posts: 1,170
Wow, old thread. Nobody should complain about people not using the search function here....


If your wheel bearing is worn out and letting the wheel wobble, the rotor will push the pads and thus the piston back into the caliper as it wobbles. That will make it such that the piston has to travel farther to grip the rotor and that's why the pedal is softer or the travel is longer.

FYI In normal operation your brake pads are riding on the rotor. There should be no gap between the caliper and pads or pads and rotor.
__________________
Ride 'Em Cowboys!
Jam Master Jay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2009, 10:14 PM   #21 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Member # 126919
Posts: 3
in that case i dont think thats the problem cause it all new parts, if it helps here is some extra info, its a 94 Yj that i just swapped in some dana 44's from a 89 grand waggy, the only parts that are not new are the calipers and it still has drum rears with all new parts, im thinking that readjusting the rear might help, but there fells like there's nothing in the front and there is a real soft pedle, pumping will only lock up the rear and still fells like it has nothing in the front. i know that all the break components are a bit bigger, but not by much, so could it be an issue of the amount of fluid that has to be pushed through it too......
visa is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:31 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.