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Old 05-31-2009, 09:30 AM   #1 (permalink)
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HORN won't turn off!!! AHHHHHHH!! Help!

No flames, please, I am a complete non-mechanical type, I admit it.
The 1998 TJ spent the forecasted clear night with the top down, and then sat open in 2 hours of RAIN!
I have the tub drained, and sopped up all the water I could find. 2 hours after this, the horn began to sound, an WOULD NOT STOP!!!
TAPPING THE (OK, SLAMMING THE) STEERING WHEEL HORN BUTTON DID NOTHING. IT TURNED OFF SPONTANEOUSLY.
This happened 3 times in the last hour.
I don't have the owners manual.
The last time the horn blasted, it fried the horns before I could disconnect the battery. Literally smoked them!!
So, now I need new horns (OK with me since I wanted more oomph anyways), but I want to figure out where the water-caused short is????
Also, if someone has an owners manual, could you tell me where the horn relay/fuse is?
I MUCH appreciate the help!
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Old 05-31-2009, 09:32 AM   #2 (permalink)
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...Sorry.
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Old 05-31-2009, 09:59 AM   #3 (permalink)
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pulled this out of a '99 TJ manual off http://pdftown.com/Jeep-Wrangler-199...ce-Manual.html it should be real similar if not the same as the '98

HORN RELAY
The horn relay (Fig. 2) is located in the Power Distribution
Center (PDC) behind the battery on the
driver side of the engine compartment. If a problem
is encountered with a continuously sounding horn, it
can usually be quickly resolved by removing the horn
relay from the PDC until further diagnosis is completed.
See the fuse and relay layout label affixed to
the inside surface of the PDC cover for horn relay
identification and location. For complete circuit diagrams,
refer to Horn/Cigar Lighter in the Contents
of Group 8W - Wiring Diagrams.
WARNING: ON VEHICLES EQUIPPED WITH AIRBAGS,
REFER TO GROUP 8M - PASSIVE
RESTRAINT SYSTEMS BEFORE ATTEMPTING ANY
STEERING WHEEL, STEERING COLUMN, OR
INSTRUMENT PANEL COMPONENT DIAGNOSIS OR
SERVICE. FAILURE TO TAKE THE PROPER PRECAUTIONS
COULD RESULT IN ACCIDENTAL AIRBAG
DEPLOYMENT AND POSSIBLE PERSONAL
INJURY.
(1) Remove the horn relay from the PDC. Refer to
Horn Relay in the Removal and Installation section
of this group for the procedures.
(2) A relay in the de-energized position should
have continuity between terminals 87A and 30, and
no continuity between terminals 87 and 30. If OK, go
to Step 3. If not OK, replace the faulty relay.
(3) Resistance between terminals 85 and 86 (electromagnet)
should be 75 6 5 ohms. If OK, go to Step
4. If not OK, replace the faulty relay.
(4) Connect a battery to terminals 85 and 86.
There should now be continuity between terminals
30 and 87, and no continuity between terminals 87A
and 30. If OK, perform the Relay Circuit Test that
follows. If not OK, replace the faulty relay.
RELAY CIRCUIT TEST
(1) The relay common feed terminal cavity (30) is
connected to battery voltage and should be hot at all
times. If OK, go to Step 2. If not OK, repair the open
circuit to the fuse in the PDC as required.
(2) The relay normally closed terminal (87A) is
connected to terminal 30 in the de-energized position,
but is not used for this application. Go to Step 3.
(3) The relay normally open terminal (87) is connected
to the common feed terminal (30) in the energized
position. This terminal supplies battery voltage
to the horn(s). There should be continuity between
the cavity for relay terminal 87 and the horn relay
output circuit cavity of each horn wire harness connector
at all times. If OK, go to Step 4. If not OK,
repair the open circuit to the horn(s) as required.
(4) The coil battery terminal (86) is connected to
the electromagnet in the relay. It is connected to battery
voltage and should be hot at all times. Check for
battery voltage at the cavity for relay terminal 86. If
OK, go to Step 5. If not OK, repair the open circuit to
the fuse in the PDC as required.
(5) The coil ground terminal (85) is connected to
the electromagnet in the relay. It is grounded
through the horn switch when the horn switch is
depressed. Check for continuity to ground at the cavity
for relay terminal 85. There should be continuity
with the horn switch depressed, and no continuity
with the horn switch released. If not OK, refer to
Horn Switch in the Diagnosis and Testing section of
this group.
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Old 05-31-2009, 10:00 AM   #4 (permalink)
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The relay is under the hood, on the passenger fender. There is a fuse box mounted there by the air box. Just remove the top. There is a diagram of the fuse box located on the inside of the lid. The horn relay was between the AC and ABS relays.

Here is a picture. I circled the fuse box under the hood.

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Old 05-31-2009, 10:07 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nckwnchstr View Post
pulled this out of a '99 TJ manual off http://pdftown.com/Jeep-Wrangler-199...ce-Manual.html it should be real similar if not the same as the '98

HORN RELAY
The horn relay
(Fig. 2) is located in the Power Distribution Center (PDC) behind the battery on the driver side of the engine compartment. If a problem is encountered with a continuously sounding horn, it can usually be quickly resolved by removing the horn relay from the PDC until further diagnosis is completed.

See the fuse and relay layout label affixed to the inside surface of the PDC cover for horn relay identification and location. For complete circuit diagrams,
refer to Horn/Cigar Lighter in the Contents of Group 8W - Wiring Diagrams.

WARNING: ON VEHICLES EQUIPPED WITH AIRBAGS, REFER TO GROUP 8M - PASSIVE RESTRAINT SYSTEMS BEFORE ATTEMPTING ANY STEERING WHEEL, STEERING COLUMN, OR INSTRUMENT PANEL COMPONENT DIAGNOSIS OR
SERVICE. FAILURE TO TAKE THE PROPER PRECAUTIONS COULD RESULT IN ACCIDENTAL AIRBAG DEPLOYMENT AND POSSIBLE PERSONAL INJURY.

(1) Remove the horn relay from the PDC. Refer to Horn Relay in the Removal and Installation section of this group for the procedures.

(2) A relay in the de-energized position should have continuity between terminals 87A and 30, and no continuity between terminals 87 and 30. If OK, go to Step 3. If not OK, replace the faulty relay.

(3) Resistance between terminals 85 and 86 (electromagnet) should be 75 6 5 ohms. If OK, go to Step 4. If not OK, replace the faulty relay.

(4) Connect a battery to terminals 85 and 86. There should now be continuity between terminals 30 and 87, and no continuity between terminals 87A and 30. If OK, perform the Relay Circuit Test that follows. If not OK, replace the faulty relay.

RELAY CIRCUIT TEST

(1) The relay common feed terminal cavity (30) is connected to battery voltage and should be hot at all times. If OK, go to Step 2. If not OK, repair the open circuit to the fuse in the PDC as required.

(2) The relay normally closed terminal (87A) is connected to terminal 30 in the de-energized position, but is not used for this application. Go to Step 3.

(3) The relay normally open terminal (87) is connected to the common feed terminal (30) in the energized position. This terminal supplies battery voltage
to the horn(s). There should be continuity between the cavity for relay terminal 87 and the horn relay output circuit cavity of each horn wire harness connector at all times. If OK, go to Step 4. If not OK, repair the open circuit to the horn(s) as required.

(4) The coil battery terminal (86) is connected to the electromagnet in the relay. It is connected to battery voltage and should be hot at all times. Check for battery voltage at the cavity for relay terminal 86. If OK, go to Step 5. If not OK, repair the open circuit to the fuse in the PDC as required.

(5) The coil ground terminal (85) is connected to the electromagnet in the relay. It is grounded through the horn switch when the horn switch is depressed. Check for continuity to ground at the cavity for relay terminal 85. There should be continuity with the horn switch depressed, and no continuity with the horn switch released. If not OK, refer to Horn Switch in the Diagnosis and Testing section of this group.
Good Tech, Made it easier to read
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Last edited by burrellsjeep; 05-31-2009 at 10:07 AM.
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Old 05-31-2009, 10:17 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Thanks!!

The write-ups are great! Thank You! Thanks for the photo too!

Any idea what may have caused the horn to turn on by itself? I know, being flooded somehow is the likely cause, but is there some area I can check...dry off...????

Not likely I'll pull any part of the dash, but any idiot-proof ideas would suit me!!!
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Old 05-31-2009, 11:10 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Basic troubleshooting technique...1st question...what was fawked with last?

Since the Jeep was open in the rain, water got into the steering wheel and column. This is likely your source of trouble unless you left the hood open also. Inside the steering wheel you have the horn button and the clockspring, which is what allows the wheel to turn while keeping the elec connections between the wheel and horn button. The clock spring also connects the airbag!

Pull the plastic shroud off the column (not steering wheel!) and you will see the clock spring elec connector on the drivers side bottom IIRC. Look for water and corrosion aound the elec connectors. Don't start tugging and yanking on stuff, you could possibly set off the air bag. I don't have my FSM handy to tell you exactly how to disable the airbag and allow you to play with the elec junk under there. It takes more then just disconnecting the battery tho. Blow out the water with compressed air, allow stuff a chance to dry, you may be OK.
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Old 05-31-2009, 01:46 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I totally agree. The likely culprit is water in the steering column area, but I hope a 2 hour drive in the 90 degree weather will dry things out. I do not have an air compressor.
Anyone have a good suggestion about a nice loud horn replacement?
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Old 05-31-2009, 04:13 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Next time this happens.... pop your hood, unplug the horn.
Everything else i'd suggest has already been mentioned. Check the steering column for corrosion or a short. Check the relay. Replace the horn.
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Old 05-31-2009, 04:40 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Thanks!
I'll do all of the above, but do worry about that steering column cover. When I say I have NO mechanical skills, I mean it!
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Old 05-31-2009, 09:52 PM   #11 (permalink)
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This used to be a submarine hand operated fog horn...scares the crap outta the stoopid folk!


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Last edited by Fyathyrio; 05-31-2009 at 09:52 PM.
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Old 06-05-2009, 03:58 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I agree with Fyathyrio. Your problem is probably the clockspring in the steering column. When they get wet it causes the check engine light to come on also. Be careful while replacing it, and make sure to deactivate the airbag to prevent it from punching you in the face like Mike Tyson.

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Old 06-06-2009, 05:56 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Sounds like the clockspring is the culprit!
THANK YOU for the help.

So here's my non-mechanical plan:
It has had days to dry out.
I'll spray some WD-40 in there today ("water-displacement"..right?)
When the new horn comes in.. I'll see if my low-tech plan works
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Old 06-06-2009, 06:49 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Dude i would spray some electrical cleaner in there before WD-40. The electrical cleaner will actually dry it out in there.
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Old 06-17-2009, 05:08 AM   #15 (permalink)
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I'm not familiar with electrical cleaner. Is there a brand that's better?? I'll ask at Advance Auto or somewhere, but appreciate your advice.
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Old 06-17-2009, 05:28 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I'm not familiar with electrical cleaner. Is there a brand that's better?? I'll ask at Advance Auto or somewhere, but appreciate your advice.
get it at radio shack, it's called contact clearer.
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