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Old 01-12-2012, 09:46 AM   #1 (permalink)
Zeus of the Sluice
 
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Willys Build Ideas

Howdy,

I have been playing around with Willys Wagons for a long time. For a variety of reasons I have one that isn't getting done and I would like to finish if off in the next year or so. It is pretty low for a spoa and it is on a Wagoneer frame. The real hard part is done. There is a 229/T-18/Dana 18 left over from my current build I would like to use if I can't sell it.

Here is the intended use for the wagon:

Drive to work a few days a week-40 miles round trip
Deep snow 4x4 locally - within 50 miles from home.
No towing with it.
37's for daily use-I have a new set of 37" Toyo's that need to be used. Possibly some 39" PBR's for snow only-not much hwy usage

Here is what I have:

Offset Dana 44's front and rear from a 70's Wagoneer. 5.38's with a rear locker and front Tru Trac. The engine is a 229 V8 (think pre 4.3) with a Ford T-18 and a Dana 18 case.

I'd really like to use what I have on hand. Because I do snow and not a lot of rocks generally I am hoping that this would be a nice combo. Offset axles for snow is nice.

There is no firewall or front floor so I can change things as needed to make them fit.

I am guessing that there is the proper balance of weight, gears and power to make things work well for what I need. Also, I live on the 55 MPH side of the mountains so no need to go 70 with it.

The only real issue that I can see is the possibility of Dana 18 problems, but I am hoping that I can avoid those with sensible driving and reasonable weight. Worst case, I could run a centered rear and a Dana 20.

What are your thoughts, concerns or experiences with my plan etc. here? Have any of you ran the 4.3 in a wagon and with what results? I am really hoping it is half economical to operate.

Thanks for your ideas.

ROB

Last edited by ToyotaJeep; 01-12-2012 at 09:49 AM.
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:51 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I like your basic plan. Not sure on the motor choice though. Is it a V6 or tiny V8?
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:53 PM   #3 (permalink)
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It is a pre-4.3. Same design. They came out in 79-81ish El camino's etc. Looks like a 4.3 but it isn't. I own it and it runs great, I'd like to use it if I could.
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Old 01-12-2012, 03:27 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I like the D20 idea.
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Old 01-12-2012, 06:57 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Hey Willysworker, we chat again.

The truth is that I set it up to run a Ford 300-6. I am considering removing all of that and running this stuff. I suppose a centered 44, with a 300/NP435/205 couldn't be all bad. I wouldn't have to worry about breaking the transfer case at least!

Much of whatever I end up running is going to depend on what sells. I am going to continue attempting to sell my V6 / T-18 and Dana 18 case. I have too many drivetrain parts from my hoarding days and essentially no storage or at least not much.

Thanks for your thoughts.

ROB
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Old 01-13-2012, 05:28 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I think the torque of the Ford 300 i6 would be great for a retro daily driver/ wheeler.

On the other hand with 5.38s keeping the M18 t-case and keeping an eye out for a overdrive would make for a nice combination.
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Old 01-15-2012, 08:10 AM   #7 (permalink)
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If I run the 300, I would need to drop the gears back a bit. The 300 is one torquey engine. The nice thing about the 300, is that I already have it, and I have the Ford 205 etc. Not much to break there, a little more weight and so forth but not bad.

Regardless, I think I need to push the v6 stuff to help fund my CJ build. If it doesn't sell, it will likely end up in my wagon.

Thanks for the thoughts.
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Old 01-16-2012, 03:45 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Are the 5.38's already in the Diffs? I know a few people that have 300's, and your right, They're torque monsters. A friend had a 300 in his 3/4 ton ford, 4 wheel drive, with 33"s, and 3.50 gears, He would consistently get MPG's in the high teens, towing his boat. I think you'd be very happy with the 300, if driven daily.
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Old 01-16-2012, 06:48 PM   #9 (permalink)
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compared to that 229, lots more ford 300's out there for spares, upgrades, etc. run the t-18 and the d-18 or d-20 as both should handle the 300 easily enough. add a saturn od for double the tranny gears. i've had 2 of those od's and they're great! with all the low rpm torque the 300 puts out, i'd back off the axle gears to something like 4.56 especially with all those gears in the tranny/od combo.
sounds like a great build. good luck and have fun!!

Last edited by strvger; 01-16-2012 at 07:01 PM.
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Old 01-16-2012, 07:00 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I vote for the 300 also . I've got a 300, T98 and 3.92 Gears and I VERY rarely have to use low range with the 38" Boggers in the snow. I've gotten as high as 19.5 Miles Per Gallon (35"s on the highway).
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Old 01-20-2012, 08:25 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ3BWILLYS View Post
I vote for the 300 also . I've got a 300, T98 and 3.92 Gears and I VERY rarely have to use low range with the 38" Boggers in the snow. I've gotten as high as 19.5 Miles Per Gallon (35"s on the highway).
WOW! great MPG. I get 12/13 in my rig with AMC 360,T18,4.10's and 33"
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Old 01-21-2012, 08:54 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willysworker View Post
WOW! great MPG. I get 12/13 in my rig with AMC 360,T18,4.10's and 33"

I've gotten AS HIGH AS 19.5 !!!!! It's usually more like 16/17.
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Old 01-23-2012, 07:43 PM   #13 (permalink)
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If its paid for, and the gov dont mess with you, then your saving atleast 200$ to 400$ A month on A rig that best will get you 30 mpg. So even 12 to 15 mpg W/O the payment isnt that bad.
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Old 01-24-2012, 12:27 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Sounds like you got it with the 300, T98, and 18 t-case with Waggy 44's. It will be a nice combo with 37's. Nothing bigger though with 44's, unless you want to start breaking stuff.

The 300 will definitely require firewall mods, so it's good that ya don't have one. This will give you a chance to set it up correctly with plenty of space for the radiator and good mechanical/clutch fan. Stay away from electric fans if you can help it. They can work well, but a good one with a minimum 2800 cfm and higher will not be cheap. Stay with the mechanical and life will be good.

By the way, the offset Wagoneer 44 will still work with a Dana 20 and standard u-joints on the driveline. Don't try that with a CV though. It will vibrate, because you can't compensate for the offset.

I prefer a 4.3 with TBI or carb over a 300 in a wagon, because it fits better. But the 300 is still a good engine.
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Old 01-24-2012, 05:33 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Thank you for the replies. I still have all of the stuff so I'll figure it out when I get a little closer. I know the 300 is a torque monster. To get things where I wanted them I have part of the VC under the cowl.

Currently we are building a "toyota jeep" (tends to make a guy not too popular!) so that is taking precedence. It is all toyota 4x4 stuff with EFI and 35's etc. Daily driver / snow rig.

That is the project of the day. This Willys will probably hit the shop in the next year or so.

It was going to be more of a long range expedition style of rig, but now I am thinking closer to home with snow and DD usage. Hence the need for clearance and gearing.

Have a good day and thank you for the input.

ROB
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Old 01-24-2012, 07:29 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Got a link to a build thread on the Toy-jeep?? I'm looking to do something similar...
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