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Old 12-01-2009, 09:44 PM   #1 (permalink)
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1951 jeep willy's ?

I have a 1951 jeep willy's with a buick v6. I got it when I was 15 and attempted a frame up build. I boxed in the frame and put a small lift on it to clear 33" tires, put a title wheel in from a chevette. With the exception of the engine the rest of the drive train is stock. It has the small 8" drum brake. Well, I worked on it off and on for about 3 years then more or less lost intrest. Now 15 years later I think I might be ready to finish the project.

Dispite the few years I worked on this I still know little about this rig. So can anyone help me with some basic info.
Axles: are they dana 20? What doner vehicals would have larger drum brakes or even disks that can bolt on. Are there any other vehicals that have similar sized axles that are better than the stock ones?
Tranny/case: what would I likely have? Would an sm420 bolt up to the bell housing that connects the v6 to the stock tranny?

One last quesion. The jeep has a hydrolic clutch that is extremely difficult to push in. So much that when I push in the clutch pettel that I have to brack myself against the back of the seat and push as hard as I can. I bought a rebuilt master and slave cylinder but it did nothing to help with this problem. Any ideas why this might be happening? Thanks for your help.
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Old 12-02-2009, 06:04 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Check out earlycj5.com Tons of info on these jeeps there.
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Old 12-02-2009, 07:04 AM   #3 (permalink)
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OEM would be a two piece shaft offset 44 rear and a dana 25 or 27 front, T90, dana 18 transfer case.

Yes a sm420 would bolt up with some minor mods to the front bearing retainer and the bell housing, but you will need a adapter for the dana 18 transfer case.

72-75 cj front 30 has 11" drums that will swap on the front or rear.

70.5-71 had a offset 44 with one piece flange axles that are the common 30 spline and had 10" drums. If you plan to wheel alot I would suggest swaping the front axle for a narrow track cj 30 front with drums or disc's.
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Old 12-02-2009, 07:31 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Thanks for the information guys. Can the two piece axles in the rear be replaced with one piece axles?
I'm hopping to get back on this project by the first of the year. I'll try and post picks my the progress.

Last edited by kirbybuilt; 12-02-2009 at 07:33 AM.
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Old 12-02-2009, 04:18 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kirbybuilt View Post
I have a 1951 jeep willy's with a buick v6. I got it when I was 15 and attempted a frame up build. I boxed in the frame and put a small lift on it to clear 33" tires, put a title wheel in from a chevette. With the exception of the engine the rest of the drive train is stock. It has the small 8" drum brake. Well, I worked on it off and on for about 3 years then more or less lost intrest. Now 15 years later I think I might be ready to finish the project.

Dispite the few years I worked on this I still know little about this rig. So can anyone help me with some basic info.
Axles: are they dana 20? What doner vehicals would have larger drum brakes or even disks that can bolt on. Are there any other vehicals that have similar sized axles that are better than the stock ones?
Tranny/case: what would I likely have? Would an sm420 bolt up to the bell housing that connects the v6 to the stock tranny?

One last quesion. The jeep has a hydrolic clutch that is extremely difficult to push in. So much that when I push in the clutch pettel that I have to brack myself against the back of the seat and push as hard as I can. I bought a rebuilt master and slave cylinder but it did nothing to help with this problem. Any ideas why this might be happening? Thanks for your help.

The clutch worked when you first got it? Either the clutch is seized or the throw out arm is the wrong length. If it used to work I'd say the clutch is bad.

X2 on www.earlycj5.com, there is a tech section to cover the brake conversions available and lots of info to search.

Also check Herm's site, http://www.hermtheoverdriveguy.com/ , he has replacement axles available, but maybe only full float, not sure if has one piece. I think you have 10 spline axles so a carrier from a later D44 19 spline would have to be used. You might have a Jeep that was titled in '51 but built in 1950, which means it might have a Dana 41 in the rear. The rear end has the number cast in it on the web beside the diff cover.
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Old 12-02-2009, 04:32 PM   #6 (permalink)
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I guess i need to go and crawl in the weeds to get that diff number. As for the clutch it has always been that hard to push since I first put it in. So it sounds like the throw out arm is too long. How do I go about finding one that is the correct length?

Next Question:
I have a line on an sm420 with a np205 for free. Will i have any issues with alligning this set up with the stock axles? Eventually i will replace the stock axles but not until I have the funds or run across some for next to nothing.

Last edited by kirbybuilt; 12-02-2009 at 04:52 PM.
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Old 12-02-2009, 09:19 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
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I guess i need to go and crawl in the weeds to get that diff number. As for the clutch it has always been that hard to push since I first put it in. So it sounds like the throw out arm is too long. How do I go about finding one that is the correct length?

Next Question:
I have a line on an sm420 with a np205 for free. Will i have any issues with alligning this set up with the stock axles? Eventually i will replace the stock axles but not until I have the funds or run across some for next to nothing.
Or the arm might be too short, no leverage. The clutch needs to be a 10.5" GM, not the original 4 cyl clutch. There could be internal problems too, like a bad throwout bearing, bent arm, rust, etc. Might need to go in and look.

I don't think the 205 will fit between the framerails, and the rear diff you have is offset. People have done it but it's not the ideal setup.
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Old 12-02-2009, 09:54 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I don't think the 205 will fit between the framerails, and the rear diff you have is offset. People have done it but it's not the ideal setup.
I have a SM465 with the original Dana 18, the rear DS is only about 16 inches long now. Definitely need the T/C to be offset.
The Dana 25 was used in the front up until about 1960 when they were replaced by the D27. I did the disc swap on my 27 using Chevy parts and "thick" Jeep rotors. I got tons of info for the swap from ecj5 and JP magazine.
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Old 12-03-2009, 04:10 AM   #9 (permalink)
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I've got a 465 to dana 18 adapter if you need one.
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Old 12-03-2009, 07:33 AM   #10 (permalink)
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I've got a 465 to dana 18 adapter if you need one.
pm sent:

Guys thanks for the information you have been giving me. I'm really getting excited about starting this project again. I just want to get all my pieces and parts together before I drag it back into the shop. I found some 11" disk brakes for $100 but just need to convince the wife to let me buy a christmas present for myself. Keep the information and your opinions coming.
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Old 12-04-2009, 08:54 PM   #11 (permalink)
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unfortunaltly the wife spent what would have been used on my brakes for a christmas tree and other christmas stuff. So now on to my next question. Is there any other vehical to get the 11" drum breaks off of beside a cj5? i have a local junk yard that has lots of 70's cars and trucks that I can pull stuff off for real cheap.
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Old 12-06-2009, 06:17 PM   #12 (permalink)
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51 willy's build

So I just got the jeep to the shop. I plan on going through the jeep and fixing all the crap that I did to it back when I was in high school. I am working on a budget of about $50 a month so I will have to fabricate just about everything that needs to be fixed. My plan is to have a mild wheeler and up grade as things break or I come across parts for free or for a great price.
Thins that I did to it 15 years ago:
1. Boxed the frame
2. 2.5 rugged trail lift
3. welded spiders in the rear
4. Power steering
5. Power brake booster
6. Buick 231 V6
7. Reverse Shakel
8. Tilt gm column
9. Bolt in cage
10. Hydrolic clutch

Here is the plan:
1. Wash it
2. Pull the motor and tranny
a. Check the clutch and throwout arm to make sure its is still good
b. Clean and paint the engine block
3. Weld in a new front bumper/crossmember up front with leaf hangers integrated, moving the front axle forward an inch or two with shackel reverse.
4. Weld in new rear bumper/crossmember in the rear.
5. I will need to build a driveline for the front, porably out of square tubing
6. Cut out driverside rear wheel well so I can move my seat back (I'm 6'2')
7. build some rock sliders
8. Weld cage connecter to the frame.
9. Install 11" drum brakes
I'll update list as I begin to tear into the jeep

Last edited by kirbybuilt; 12-06-2009 at 08:47 PM.
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Old 12-06-2009, 06:39 PM   #13 (permalink)
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The 11" drums off of a early 70's Ford F100 will bolt up to the axles.
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Old 12-07-2009, 03:18 PM   #14 (permalink)
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We'll I got a great deal on a full set of 11" drums that I will be purchasing just after the new year, so I'll have the stoping issue under control. Tomorrow I will get started on fabing up some bumpers and possibly some new spring hangers. I'll try and get some pics up here in the next few hours of what I am starting with.
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Old 12-08-2009, 09:12 AM   #15 (permalink)
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this is what I am starting with.

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Old 12-08-2009, 09:48 PM   #16 (permalink)
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So I got some work done today. I removd the old bumper, a piece of 6" c-channel. Then I took a piece of 2.5" x 3/16 square tubing and slid it in between the frame rails, then welded it into place. Then i got crazy with the tubing bender and made a front stinger. I still need to add guesets to the stingers. Not bad for 2 hrs of work. Tomorrow I will hopefully get it finished.



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Old 12-12-2009, 10:47 AM   #17 (permalink)
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So I'm trying to figure out what I can do about my steering. Right now it has what appears to be a car style steering with multiple joints and a drag link. The PO installed this, it has been cut, shortend, and rewelded in the center and on the passenger side tie rod. What I wold like to do is build a steering set up with a staight tube connection the steering arms and one connecting from the pitman arm to the tie rod.
1.Any suggestions or links on how to do this?
2. I don't have the money to buy a new set up, but possible could look for a used set up from a dooner vehical if there is one.
3.I have access to metal that I could build one but would need to know what type/size of rod ends you all would recommend.
4. If I due a straigh tube connecting the two steering arms I would like to mount it on top of the steering arms to give a little more room between it and the leaf springs. To do this I am assuming I would need to tapper the top of the steering arms. Would I then need to find a tappered sleve for the bottom side. If so is this a special order iteam or can I find one at the local auto parts store.

I have tried to search for this info, but haven't found anything on modifing the steering on a dana 25. All advice and opinions are welcome

Here is a pic of what I got now.

Last edited by kirbybuilt; 12-12-2009 at 10:51 AM.
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Old 12-12-2009, 11:06 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Check out Herm the Overdrive Guy and ECJ5.com
http://www.hermtheoverdriveguy.com/id83.htm
http://www.earlycj5.com/technical/st...ginaw_steerin/
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Old 12-12-2009, 12:58 PM   #19 (permalink)
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jjeep, thanks for the links. Looks like herm has what i need but it might take me a while to save up the cash for it. Does anyone out there have an old set up that they might be willing to sell me for cheaper? If so pm me and maybe we can make a deal.

Next question:
I did a shackle reverse back in the day without putting much thought into it. All I did was take the shackle off the front and put them on the back. There is about a 7" difference in elevation from front eye to rear eye. I'm thinking this is wrong. Should I try and get the two spring eyes on the same plane or shoud there be some elevation difference?

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Old 12-12-2009, 04:53 PM   #20 (permalink)
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[QUOTE=kirbybuilt;10721121]jjeep, thanks for the links. Looks like herb has what i need but it might take me a while to save up the cash for it.QUOTE]

If you get a chance give Herm a call, he is a great guy, very knowledgeable and interesting to talk to.
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Old 12-12-2009, 09:16 PM   #21 (permalink)
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I have some D25/27 stuff as well as brake parts from my Willys I am not going to use. Send me a pm.
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Old 12-20-2009, 09:35 PM   #22 (permalink)
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So I just found a 2 pairs of leaf springs, rear toyota and chevy 52". Just curious if I should swap in these springs and do a SOA in place of my SUA "2 1/2 Rugged Trail" springs (34" eye to eye, by 1 3/4" wide) I will still be running 33" tires. If I do switch over to these springs should I run the Yota springs up front and the 52"s in back or vis versa. Thanks.
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Old 01-10-2010, 06:13 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Ok, so i am making some progress on my jeep. I just picked up a 1952 jeep truck frame. I got the frame because it has a sm420 with an aa adaptor to the d18. It also has the stock axles. From the research I gathered the 52 truck has a dana 25 front axle and a timken 3/4 ton rear axle. I have been toying with the idea of swaping in the truck axles for the added width. What do you all think about this? Is the ten spline timken a better rear axle than the 19 spline dana 44 with 2 piece axles? Please give me your opinions.
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Old 01-10-2010, 06:28 PM   #24 (permalink)
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that wiily did not come with a hydrulic clutch, that is aftermarker or home made. the steering is an saginaw box and they did not come in that year either. Most of those conversions are common. My 46 has the steering conversion.
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Old 01-10-2010, 06:37 PM   #25 (permalink)
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yeah i know that. From my research the best I can come up with is that the previouse owner put a ford hydrolic cluth and brake mastercyclender on it. As well the hooked it up with a saginaw power steering set up.
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