SG Heimed Arms-install

[Jtisdale]

Getting the 90 ready for the Chili Challenge and am about to weld on SG's rear trailing arms, anyone have some good nuggets of info since SG usually doesn't provide detailed instructions. Doug, I know you ran em for a while, anything to watch out for besides so-so quality heims(supposedly using different ones now)? Some say use a safety washer if it is still used alot on road?

Johnathan

[RockRover]

Hey man! Good to hear your going to the CC! Gonna' be a blast even though I'll just be ridin' along. Ah well, motivation is key to getting going on my chop job.

Anyway, no special issues to consider. Just expect about twice as much time to get the old rear frame link mounts off. I thought at first that it would be a piece of cake...It was, but to do a really clean job you have to take your time...Remember our frames are only 14 gauge material, so you need to be careful with the grinder.

I had to notch the passenger side weld on mount because the battery box was lower than what the mount dimensions would accommodate. No biggie. Cleaning up all the waxoil (undercoating) off the frame was a bit of a chore...And I also stitch welded a piece of 3" x 36" strap to the bottom of the frame rail...Remember to stitch weld the mount as well...Don't do continuous welds...I filled the spaces between the stitches with silicon for a neat appearance, but that's just the anal type I am.

Don't know anything about the heims...I do know that mine got sloppy after only a few runs though. What's a safety washer? I considered making a bracket off the mount to put the heim in double shear, but didn't...It was fine too. Haven't heard of any failures either.

--D

[Rover Addiction]

I had Bob Roggy in Coloma weld mine up and I had him brace my sliders as well. He put a tube from the plate up to the slider with a tab to mount the heim in double shear. It seems to be very strong and I've had no problem with the sliders flexing or the heim mounts. I do think I'll have to get new heims already because I'm getting some rattle that seems to be coming from there.

I also had a problem getting the nut/bolt to clear the e-brake drum and we ended up using a jam nut and locktighting it. Hope that holds!!! We also shimmed up the t-case a bit to add a little bit of clearance.


-John

[Rover Addiction]

Here's a pic from the outside. I haven't taken more recently, but maybe someday I'll get to it..



-John

[RockRover]

Originally posted by Rover Addiction
I had Bob Roggy in Coloma weld mine up and I had him brace my sliders as well. He put a tube from the plate up to the slider with a tab to mount the heim in double shear. It seems to be very strong and I've had no problem with the sliders flexing or the heim mounts. I do think I'll have to get new heims already because I'm getting some rattle that seems to be coming from there.

I also had a problem getting the nut/bolt to clear the e-brake drum and we ended up using a jam nut and locktighting it. Hope that holds!!! We also shimmed up the t-case a bit to add a little bit of clearance.


-John

John, one of those heims is brand new...Never been used. The other has about 4 runs on it and zero street miles (well maybe 25). I'm surprized that any of them are loose, but stranger thing's have happend.

What I had to do to clear the break drum, was grind a bit off one of the nuts (and the end of the bolt) which I'm sure you noticed. Did you use SG mounting plates, and if so how much did they dig you for them? I want to use them for my new front radius arms.

--D

--D

[Rover Addiction]

I'm not sure how much the plates were since I did some dealing with Greg on getting the stage III.5 set-up plus this minus that with the plates and some other misc crap. Mary might be able to give you a better idea at SG.

I did notice that one of the heims has a thin piece of some sort of cloth or bushing or something poking out from between the wear areas. I didn't worry about it because it still seemed to be holding together, but I haven't inspected it since before the last run. I'll take another look and let you know. Did you get new ones from SG or some other supplier? I figure I should have at least one spare in my tool bag if I'm going to be running these things.

-John

[RockRover]

Okay, I'll just bite the bullet and check with Mary...

That's probably the teflon lining that's sticking out. The teflon is brown in color and is very thin..It lines the inside of the hime...If you rotate the ball all the way around you can see the lining.

I just called Mary and had them ship me one...They gave it to me at cost ($40). Not sure what they are (brand) though, and yes you should carry a spare. If not for breakage, it would sure keep me sane if I could replace a sloppy one on a 4 day event.

Man have you seen the Rockwell thread over on the General Disc. board? Sheeze...Talk about easy shaving and you end up with .25" more than a 44! Makes me want to trade my 60/70 combo in! Could you imagine a 44" shod, rear steer D90!!! YEE HAW!

--D

[Rover Addiction]

Originally posted by RockRover
Okay, I'll just bite the bullet and check with Mary...

That's probably the teflon lining that's sticking out. The teflon is brown in color and is very thin..It lines the inside of the hime...If you rotate the ball all the way around you can see the lining.

I just called Mary and had them ship me one...They gave it to me at cost ($40). Not sure what they are (brand) though, and yes you should carry a spare. If not for breakage, it would sure keep me sane if I could replace a sloppy one on a 4 day event.

Man have you seen the Rockwell thread over on the General Disc. board? Sheeze...Talk about easy shaving and you end up with .25" more than a 44! Makes me want to trade my 60/70 combo in! Could you imagine a 44" shod, rear steer D90!!! YEE HAW!

--D

Yup, that's it, the teflon is sticking out. At least I know that's the source of that super annoying rattle from the rear end. I was starting to think my 3-link was getting loose or maybe the rear A-arm was loose like it got on my D110. I'll have to call Mary and order 2, one for now and one for a spare. I really wish they would send off the rebuild kit and new heims for the fox shocks on the D110. Those are getting real annoying too rattling all over the place.

I'll have to check out the rockwell stuff. I'm really thinking that if I get to the point where I feel I need bigger axles, I'll go ahead and build a buggy from the ground up and put early series II bodywork on it. I'm thinking portal 60s front and rear with 1.5" shafts and powered by a mild 350 built to be bulletproof. And I like the idea of doing this with an LT230 and full-time. Look at it this way: I've already got locking rear brakes: unlock the center diff, lock the e-brake, and gas it! Of course, that requires praying to the CV gods, but with 60s, no problem!

Of course, rockwells would be killer so long as they could be made a little narrower to fit between the trees!

-John

[RockRover]

What I would do if I were you is check and see (or ask SG) what heims you do have, and then source them yourself. I'm sure you could get them cheaper (better?) from one of the many suppliers listed on POR. Let me know if you want some source info.

I thought the rattle was my 3-link too! Man, with zero bushings to the body, any little rattel ANYWERE is gonna' sound like something's gonna' fall off.

Funny your mentioning RW and a buggy. About 10 months ago I decided that I was going to sell my 90 (can't afford both) and commission RW (Matt) to build the basics of the buggy (frame, suspension)...I just don't have the time if I want to wheel in the next two years! Anyway, we reached an agreement that he would do the platform work, and I would finish it out (paint, seats, gauges, wiring, fuel cell etc). He was estimating that the labor would be about $12k, and materials (60's, vortec V6, coilovers, tub, steel etc) would be about the same. So that's about a 50/50 split labor to parts. Toss in another grand or so for paint, gauges etc. So I was facing approx. $25k for a buggy (almost turn-key). Then I started thinking. I love my 90 so much, and how much would a frame, rear-tub and front fenders cost? I priced them out and looks like for $4k I could put new/used panels on them...And I'll end up with a unique platform that (almost) nobody has.

[Rover Addiction]

Originally posted by RockRover
What I would do if I were you is check and see (or ask SG) what heims you do have, and then source them yourself. I'm sure you could get them cheaper (better?) from one of the many suppliers listed on POR. Let me know if you want some source info.

I could definitely use source info on those. Maybe there are some more durable/better quality racing heim joints out there that will last a little longer

I thought the rattle was my 3-link too! Man, with zero bushings to the body, any little rattel ANYWERE is gonna' sound like something's gonna' fall off.

Honestly, my 3-link used to rattle, but I fixed that. I was just praying that it wouldn't come back!!!

Funny your mentioning RW and a buggy. About 10 months ago I decided that I was going to sell my 90 (can't afford both) and commission RW (Matt) to build the basics of the buggy (frame, suspension)...I just don't have the time if I want to wheel in the next two years! Anyway, we reached an agreement that he would do the platform work, and I would finish it out (paint, seats, gauges, wiring, fuel cell etc). He was estimating that the labor would be about $12k, and materials (60's, vortec V6, coilovers, tub, steel etc) would be about the same. So that's about a 50/50 split labor to parts. Toss in another grand or so for paint, gauges etc. So I was facing approx. $25k for a buggy (almost turn-key). Then I started thinking. I love my 90 so much, and how much would a frame, rear-tub and front fenders cost? I priced them out and looks like for $4k I could put new/used panels on them...And I'll end up with a unique platform that (almost) nobody has.

Ok, here's my buggy plan: I have a '74 chevy 3/4 ton with a crate 350, turbo 350, NP203, 14 bolt rear, and HD 44 front. I'm thinking launch the body, shorten the frame, get some flexy springs and adapt it to crossover steering, and I've got a sweet buggy! Maybe add some early rover panels and a full cage and go wheeling!! I can beat the piss outta it and not worry. So many guys start with a yota or jeep and swap in chevy/ford/waggy parts to make it stronger. I like the idea of starting with the strong stuff (axles, frame, engine, etc) and launching the heavy crap (body) and I've got a cheap rig ready to go!

Of course, that may change as I make mods to my D90 and D110, but for now, that sounds like a sweet idea! Oh yeah, here's a pic of the raw materials!

[RockRover]

No pic amigo!

--D

[Rover Addiction]

Originally posted by RockRover
No pic amigo!

--D

D'OH!!

Okie dokie.. fixed..

I found that if you put in the link to a pic that was on another thread and then you delete the first thread, the pic is deleted on all subsequent threads.

anyway, fixed....

-j

[Jtisdale]

D-

The safety washers are used in single shear applications(piece of mind for me drivin down the highway at 80!), Bill R. pointed out a good site for them. www.spidertrax.com They have heims and lots of other trick stuff too.

Johnathan

[RockRover]

Originally posted by Jtisdale
D-

The safety washers are used in single shear applications(piece of mind for me drivin down the highway at 80!), Bill R. pointed out a good site for them. www.spidertrax.com They have heims and lots of other trick stuff too.

Johnathan

Yup...Cool site...I'm going to use them a bunch when it get's down to link building time.

--D

[FrankenRover]

Spidertrax.com is a great site. Lots of cool stuff, and the guy I dealt with there was very knowledgable and helpful. I returned several parts without any hassle at all, and they quickly special ordered stuff for me. I really like their Billet aluminum hawse fairlead - for the synthetic winch lines it would be great. My roller fairlead hardly turns at all when winching the blue line in under power (just slides over the rollers). I loose a few points of approach angle with the rollers as well.

Bill R.

ps. Jonathan, I sent you some jpegs of my SG trailing arm mounts and bolts.

[FrankenRover]

Here is a pict of the new heims and the misalignment washers:

Billster

[merv]

Originally posted by BillnSandi
Spidertrax.com is a great site. Lots of cool stuff, and the guy I dealt with there was very knowledgable and helpful. I returned several parts without any hassle at all, and they quickly special ordered stuff for me. I really like their Billet aluminum hawse fairlead - for the synthetic winch lines it would be great. My roller fairlead hardly turns at all when winching the blue line in under power (just slides over the rollers). I loose a few points of approach angle with the rollers as well.

Bill R.
.

That Aluminum fairlead looks neat! Nice and tidy , but I've noticed the roller types work away rolling for us over here (With synthetic). I'd guess the hawse style would be ok at almost straight or a little off, but what about winching to the side? not so sure? What after 6 months when it's a little dented and scratched?
Merv.

[FrankenRover]

My roller fairlead is pretty dinged up anyway. I think the hawse would work fine, as long as the radius of the curve is not too small for the rope (meaning that under tension from a side pull would cut the rope, as the roller has a much larger radius). I had the specs for the smallest suggested "radius" for the fairlead for synthetic winch lines but cannot find it. I think it was surprisingly small and somewhat smaller than the usual hawse fairlead. This is not anything I am sure about, so if you buy a hawse and cut your line, then fall off of Nemisis 2 or 3 and bust your ass, it is your own fault.

Billster (Bill R's POR alter ego)

[RockRover]

Originally posted by BillnSandi
Billster (Bill R's POR alter ego)

Damn! I thought that read "Blister"!

[Jtisdale]

Blister...hmmm that might stick if you aren't careful!



Johnathan

[Rover Addiction]

Originally posted by Jtisdale
Blister...hmmm that might stick if you aren't careful!



Johnathan

now the question is, does the blister match the yellow of the rover?

[tomw]

Originally posted by RockRover

I thought the rattle was my 3-link too! Man, with zero bushings to the body, any little rattel ANYWERE is gonna' sound like something's gonna' fall off.

Funny your mentioning RW and a buggy.

Heh! I've had a nasty rattle of late also, I ended taking out my recovery gear box out of the rig and every other thing semi loose I could find, I crawled under the rig and retorqued everything, I was sure it was the rear shock mounts or the hiem on the trailing arm ( sounded a bit like Bill R's blown heim joint )... but all seemed OK! It turns out today, I found out it was the top screw of the rear door hing ( them swamper and gas can on the SG rear carier must be taking its toll )..... this is the hinge bolt not the torx srew thingies... So to others with like tires and heavy rear mounts, I'd check the hinge bolt..... Also I'll go double check my tailing arm for the tell tale heim teflon.