I have a plan but need some HELP!! - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum

Strange Rover · 03-20-2002, 02:35 AM

So now I have the D44s running 4.09 ratio and 42in tyres. To run these tyres on these diffs I need to get some wheel spacers and to lower the diff ratios.

The four spacers will cost about $900 and to change the ratio would cost the better part of $1200 to buy new gears (import from US) and get them installed.

So to make this current setup work will cost about $2100 (probably more) and I still have stock axles and unis that are not really strong enough (although if it had to be this way then I could manage).

Rear option: I can get a FF14 Bolt out of a chev c20 (I think) that a local company imports with a choice of 4.1, 4.56, or 5.13 to 1 ratio with an open centre for $650. So if I buy this, convert to 5 on 5 1/2 pattern (which dosent look that hard to do). Then I will be way ahead cause I dont need the gears ($600) nor the spacers($400) and I end up with something that I should not break. I will still need to get an ARB for it and sell my shiat but I think that this is what I will do before I spend money on spacers and gears for the rear.

Front option: Now here is the HELP part. For the front I really need a Dana 60. There are no D60s in Australia so I need to get one from the US. I mate of mine (he is actually the scout dude that I bought the d44s off origionally) is going to the US on a buying spree in 2 weeks time (to make money) and is going to bring back a container load of 4wd bits and pieces. So what I need to do is organise getting a front d60 so he can throw it in his container for him to bring back to OZ for me to throw under my Rangie and live happily ever after with my 42s

So I need to buy a front D60 in America while sitting at home in Australia. This is where I need the help. Anyone got any ideas of how I can achieve this. Any ideas of how much it will cost me to buy a front d60 (being realistic and not finding the elusive $200 front d60 at the local pick and pull). If I had to buy a front d60 tomorrow to ship what would I have to pay (meaning what is a reasonable price to pay that will guarantee that I can buy a front d60 in a short period of time)?

I really need to work out how much it will cost to get a front d60 landed here before I spend money on the gears and spacers ($1000) for the front. Cause if the price is in the right ball park then I may as well get the d60.

Of course if anyone has the elusive front d60 deal of a lifetime for me then please PM me.

Thanks.

Sam

All my costings are in $AUS except for the elusive D60 deal of $200 which I would guess to be $US.

Old Scout · 03-20-2002, 05:14 AM

Get intouch with of PARTS MIKE
http://www.partsmikeparts.com/

He will dig you up a D-60 for a good price. You may want to talk to him about a 14 bolt/gears/spacers as well. Your spacers seem way to high in price

RockRover · 03-20-2002, 07:45 AM

Old Scout is right...Give Parts M. a call and see what's he's got either in stock OR can get his hands on.

If that doesn't work out, AND your in a BIG hurry, I would simply clamp down and call Boyce Equipment. They've got um...New bearings and seals and such, nice pretty paint job bla, bla, bla...One thing is that if you order a locker with your 60 the price is pretty darn competitive (for the locker and install). If I remember right, they said $2100 for a bare chevy 60, and $2600US with ARB. This was a year ago though.

A lot of guy's that have connections in the wrecking (salvage) buiz., will rag about how much a rip-off the Boyce price is. Heck, even I got both axles re-built with detroits' and disks for less than one Boyce front, but I had the luxury of time on my side. If you consider the price of completely rebuilding a 60 (if you found a bare housing with knuckles, for say $600, their price ($2100) isn't too far off.

The other option is to check e-bay and the "for sale" board here. Might get a little logistical trying to coordinate with your bud though.

RockRover · 03-20-2002, 11:10 AM

In the "for sale" section

RockRover · 03-20-2002, 11:35 AM

another....

Strange Rover · 03-20-2002, 01:01 PM

Thanks for the leads.

From the 2 prices in the for sale looks like $1200 is the going price for a untouched second hand front d60.

Yea I thought the spacers were too much also there all about the same from guys that make them or import them (aluminium).

Ill chase up Parts Mike and see what he reckons.

Sam

ol John Henry · 03-20-2002, 02:05 PM

I was on the phone with this guy a couple days ago quoted me killer prices on one-off spacers... check it out

http://www.wheelspacer.com/

evilfij · 03-21-2002, 12:34 AM

Hey Sam make sure you get a Passenger (left hand in this country) side drop.

Some D60 are drivers side drop

Where is your friend going in the US?

Ron

Strange Rover · 03-21-2002, 04:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by evilfij
Hey Sam make sure you get a Passenger (left hand in this country) side drop.

Some D60 are drivers side drop

Where is your friend going in the US?

Ron

Dont know exactly where hes going but I will find out. Yes right side drop would be easier but if it was a left side then I would just cut and swap the tubes.

I may not do a d60 front yet. Got an idea to do convert a 14 bolt (these are more common here) but just gotta do a bit of quick reaserch on getting axles cut and resplined etc.

Sam

RockRover · 03-21-2002, 07:10 AM

Ahhhhh...I get it...Do a 14 bolt Dana 60 hybrid...Source the inner and outer knuckles, spindles, turn down the 14's tubes, re-spline the inner axles and presto! Nice. WMS has done this conversion and they're really cool guy's that don't mind talking on the phone...Give them a call.

Just make sure to shave the heck outa' that 14 lest you want to start planting corn.

--D

P.S.: My 2 year old daughter loves those TV children show guy's from Aus...Wiggles, Wigglies or something like that...Could you do me a favor and biatch slap them for me? Barney is easy compared to those...Er...Guy's(?)

--D

Strange Rover · 03-21-2002, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RockRover
Ahhhhh...I get it...Do a 14 bolt Dana 60 hybrid...Source the inner and outer knuckles, spindles, turn down the 14's tubes, re-spline the inner axles and presto! Nice. WMS has done this conversion and they're really cool guy's that don't mind talking on the phone...Give them a call.

Just make sure to shave the heck outa' that 14 lest you want to start planting corn.

--D

P.S.: My 2 year old daughter loves those TV children show guy's from Aus...Wiggles, Wigglies or something like that...Could you do me a favor and biatch slap them for me? Barney is easy compared to those...Er...Guy's(?)

--D

Yup, thats what im thinking. But I will probably fabricate the knuckles myself so I can get some really big unis in there. The spindle and hub will be off the stock 14 bolt axle. For the inner axle just cut the stock axle and respline the outher end (like a rover inner axle) for the outer axle use the forged drive flange end, cut it real short and respline it (just like a early Range Rover 10 spline outer stub axle. So then all I got to do is work out some way of attachining the uni joint to the two splined axles and support the stub axle in the spindle with a needle roller bearing.

Ive seen pictures of the uni joint ear sections attached to splined axle in the same manner as a uni joint is attached to the pinion of a diff so this wont be too hard. The only hard bit will be finding a uni joint (the ears part) that allows enough turning.

I think that with a bit a fabilcation, a lot of rooting around and a bit of resplining I think that I could make one. Given the core cost of the 14 bolt is $650AUS compared to say $2500AUS - $3000AUS for a d60 I would be a long way in front.

It would be different and fun to do as well.

Sam

Yea the wiggles are big over here as well. Carnt do much about them. One of em even one bachalor of the year over here. These guys arnt going away (I would say they are making too much mone)

Way · 03-21-2002, 09:09 PM

Here is an idea. What about putting either 14 bolt or dana 60 outers on your 44. I have seen this mod done before. You already have 1.31" 31 spline axles up front. Those are the same as a common stock Dana 60 that are 31 splines and are 1.31". I imagine that you could order some moser axle shafts with maybe a 60 CTM u-joint and be fine with your mods. Freight on those items would be significantly less than others. The only problem I can see is that the D60 has a 3" axle housing and the dana 44 carries a 2.75". Going this route you would not need to re-buy locker and such. I bet someone in the US would be happy to torch off a junkyard Dana 60 knuckles for ya. I am not sure how the brake issue would work out, but I am sure you could get something figured out. You could then probably get a few bucks for your inner axles over there.

Way

RockRover · 03-22-2002, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Strange Rover

Yup, thats what im thinking. But I will probably fabricate the knuckles myself so I can get some really big unis in there. The spindle and hub will be off the stock 14 bolt axle. For the inner axle just cut the stock axle and respline the outher end (like a rover inner axle) for the outer axle use the forged drive flange end, cut it real short and respline it (just like a early Range Rover 10 spline outer stub axle. So then all I got to do is work out some way of attachining the uni joint to the two splined axles and support the stub axle in the spindle with a needle roller bearing.

Holly Fabrication Batman! I can see fabing up the inner knuckels, but the whole drive-flanged outer stub, into a splined u-joint/yoke, into a double splined inner seems like a HUGE task compared to simply welding on a 60 inner knuckle and using stock dana parts from there. It sure would be cool though. But what's the advantage over using a 14 center section and 60 outers?

--D

fcfred · 03-22-2002, 04:17 PM

hold on
there is currently no ARB for the 14 bolt
yes there is rumor of one, and an electric locker from eaton, but so far nothing yet
the 14 bolt is great in the rear, but I would just spool it and be done, or wait for the locker
as far as the fronts go
I would vote 60 or track down the big salsbury front like on the front of Timm Cooper's truck. I've seen it and it's at least as big as a 60, it has a beefier housing, all your rover outers, big axles, and big big birfields. It will need custom inner axles cut if you wanna run a 35 spline dana 60 arb, but other than that it should drop in. I'm going with the 60 and by the time I have it all rebuilt it will probably cost me close to $1200. My vote is for the 60 because it's ready to go. swapping knuckles will probably not get you anywhere ahead, and for the money a rebuilt 60 with and arb or macnemara locker would probably be the quickest and easiest swap. If your buddy is coming to the northwest I could help him find a rebuilt 60 for about $1400 or less. And that wouldn't take long at all.

if you think you can build your own knuckles and get the shafts cut then why not just go with a rear 60?
drop in the arb
cut and press in tubes of your choice
build your own knuckles
get your custom shafts made.

hey why don't you get your buddy to bring over some cheap mcnamara 35 spline 60 lockers for us yanks?

RockRover · 03-22-2002, 05:21 PM

Duhhhh....Sam, why don't you buy Serious One's FC101 axles from him...Front and rear...Dana 60 centers and you get very stout CV's with them...That's the ticket man!

--D

fcfred · 03-22-2002, 08:56 PM

i just talked to timm about his axles
it turns out they are from a fc 101 but that you should also be able to find them from a LR ambulance or armoured car
good luck

Strange Rover · 03-23-2002, 04:20 AM

Thats the end of the 14 bolt plan. Carnt get an ARB for it. The reason I was thinking 14 bolt is that I can get the right ratio (5.13:1) in somehting that isnt going to break. The reason that I wouldnt go for d60 outers was only that I thing that with a little bit of axle cutting and resplining I could fabricate the rest (inner and outer knuckles) bolt on the existing spindle and hub and voila easy.

But since there isnt an ARB for it. I dont really want one.

Dont really want to go for fc101 axles. They are a dying breed and I think that any CV (no matter how big) is still going to fatigue and break.

Looks like Im back to the d60 plan. Ill ring this guy tomorrow and find out exactly what hes doing.

Sam

fcfred · 03-23-2002, 11:26 AM

where are you in australia?
do you know anyone with a jeep cj-10?
I'm building one here in the states where they are pretty rare, and would love to find some pics of some built auzzy rigs.

Strange Rover · 03-23-2002, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fcfred
where are you in australia?
do you know anyone with a jeep cj-10?
I'm building one here in the states where they are pretty rare, and would love to find some pics of some built auzzy rigs.

I live in Logan Village about 1/2 hour south of Brisbane and 1/2 North of the Gold Coast but slightly inland (this is in the state of Queensland)

Dont see many built jeeps around at all and ever fewer that get driven off road. The only cj-10 that Ive seen is one that must live around here somewhere. Looks absolutley stock and in quite good condition. First time a saw it down the servo I stuck my head under the front and thought, damn D44 (not a d60).

So no not many of the older jeeps down here at all (we get the new currenrt model stuff).

Sam

03-20-2002, 02:35 AM	#1 (permalink)
Strange Rover Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Member # 7962 Location: Australia Posts: 1,462	I have a plan but need some HELP!! So now I have the D44s running 4.09 ratio and 42in tyres. To run these tyres on these diffs I need to get some wheel spacers and to lower the diff ratios. The four spacers will cost about $900 and to change the ratio would cost the better part of $1200 to buy new gears (import from US) and get them installed. So to make this current setup work will cost about $2100 (probably more) and I still have stock axles and unis that are not really strong enough (although if it had to be this way then I could manage). Rear option: I can get a FF14 Bolt out of a chev c20 (I think) that a local company imports with a choice of 4.1, 4.56, or 5.13 to 1 ratio with an open centre for $650. So if I buy this, convert to 5 on 5 1/2 pattern (which dosent look that hard to do). Then I will be way ahead cause I dont need the gears ($600) nor the spacers($400) and I end up with something that I should not break. I will still need to get an ARB for it and sell my shiat but I think that this is what I will do before I spend money on spacers and gears for the rear. Front option: Now here is the HELP part. For the front I really need a Dana 60. There are no D60s in Australia so I need to get one from the US. I mate of mine (he is actually the scout dude that I bought the d44s off origionally) is going to the US on a buying spree in 2 weeks time (to make money) and is going to bring back a container load of 4wd bits and pieces. So what I need to do is organise getting a front d60 so he can throw it in his container for him to bring back to OZ for me to throw under my Rangie and live happily ever after with my 42s So I need to buy a front D60 in America while sitting at home in Australia. This is where I need the help. Anyone got any ideas of how I can achieve this. Any ideas of how much it will cost me to buy a front d60 (being realistic and not finding the elusive $200 front d60 at the local pick and pull). If I had to buy a front d60 tomorrow to ship what would I have to pay (meaning what is a reasonable price to pay that will guarantee that I can buy a front d60 in a short period of time)? I really need to work out how much it will cost to get a front d60 landed here before I spend money on the gears and spacers ($1000) for the front. Cause if the price is in the right ball park then I may as well get the d60. Of course if anyone has the elusive front d60 deal of a lifetime for me then please PM me. Thanks. Sam All my costings are in $AUS except for the elusive D60 deal of $200 which I would guess to be $US. __________________ Land Rover SIIa, 302W, NP435, NP205, MOG404s, 42in Swamper TSLs, 112in WB "An expert is somebody who learns more and more about less and less until one day they know absolutely everything about nothing." Outerlimits4x4.com - home of aussie rock crawling.

03-20-2002, 05:14 AM	#2 (permalink)
Old Scout IH/Rover Moderator Join Date: Feb 2000 Member # 17 Location: Aptos,Ca Posts: 13,398	Get intouch with of PARTS MIKE http://www.partsmikeparts.com/ He will dig you up a D-60 for a good price. You may want to talk to him about a 14 bolt/gears/spacers as well. Your spacers seem way to high in price __________________ I like beer. On occasion, I will even drink beer to celebrate a major event such as the fall of communism or the fact that the refrigerator is still working." BUY MY BOAT http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/misc-...e-history.html

03-20-2002, 07:45 AM	#3 (permalink)
RockRover Rock God Join Date: Apr 2001 Member # 4101 Location: Santa Fe Posts: 2,232	Old Scout is right...Give Parts M. a call and see what's he's got either in stock OR can get his hands on. If that doesn't work out, AND your in a BIG hurry, I would simply clamp down and call Boyce Equipment. They've got um...New bearings and seals and such, nice pretty paint job bla, bla, bla...One thing is that if you order a locker with your 60 the price is pretty darn competitive (for the locker and install). If I remember right, they said $2100 for a bare chevy 60, and $2600US with ARB. This was a year ago though. A lot of guy's that have connections in the wrecking (salvage) buiz., will rag about how much a rip-off the Boyce price is. Heck, even I got both axles re-built with detroits' and disks for less than one Boyce front, but I had the luxury of time on my side. If you consider the price of completely rebuilding a 60 (if you found a bare housing with knuckles, for say $600, their price ($2100) isn't too far off. The other option is to check e-bay and the "for sale" board here. Might get a little logistical trying to coordinate with your bud though. __________________ Hendrix 'X' Chassis #006 http://www.hunt4steve.com/Doug.html

03-20-2002, 11:10 AM	#4 (permalink)
RockRover Rock God Join Date: Apr 2001 Member # 4101 Location: Santa Fe Posts: 2,232	In the "for sale" section __________________ Hendrix 'X' Chassis #006 http://www.hunt4steve.com/Doug.html

03-20-2002, 11:35 AM	#5 (permalink)
RockRover Rock God Join Date: Apr 2001 Member # 4101 Location: Santa Fe Posts: 2,232	another.... __________________ Hendrix 'X' Chassis #006 http://www.hunt4steve.com/Doug.html

03-20-2002, 01:01 PM	#6 (permalink)
Strange Rover Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Member # 7962 Location: Australia Posts: 1,462	Thanks for the leads. From the 2 prices in the for sale looks like $1200 is the going price for a untouched second hand front d60. Yea I thought the spacers were too much also there all about the same from guys that make them or import them (aluminium). Ill chase up Parts Mike and see what he reckons. Sam __________________ Land Rover SIIa, 302W, NP435, NP205, MOG404s, 42in Swamper TSLs, 112in WB "An expert is somebody who learns more and more about less and less until one day they know absolutely everything about nothing." Outerlimits4x4.com - home of aussie rock crawling.

03-20-2002, 02:05 PM	#7 (permalink)
ol John Henry Registered User Join Date: Feb 2002 Member # 9971 Location: Maryland Posts: 591	$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ I was on the phone with this guy a couple days ago quoted me killer prices on one-off spacers... check it out http://www.wheelspacer.com/ __________________ I swing this old hammer, for a dollar and a half a day…. ….. AKA cornfedred

03-21-2002, 12:34 AM	#8 (permalink)
evilfij Registered User Join Date: Oct 2001 Member # 7755 Location: Main Line PA Posts: 1,953	Hey Sam make sure you get a Passenger (left hand in this country) side drop. Some D60 are drivers side drop Where is your friend going in the US? Ron __________________ :evil:

03-21-2002, 07:10 AM	#10 (permalink)
RockRover Rock God Join Date: Apr 2001 Member # 4101 Location: Santa Fe Posts: 2,232	Ahhhhh...I get it...Do a 14 bolt Dana 60 hybrid...Source the inner and outer knuckles, spindles, turn down the 14's tubes, re-spline the inner axles and presto! Nice. WMS has done this conversion and they're really cool guy's that don't mind talking on the phone...Give them a call. Just make sure to shave the heck outa' that 14 lest you want to start planting corn. --D P.S.: My 2 year old daughter loves those TV children show guy's from Aus...Wiggles, Wigglies or something like that...Could you do me a favor and biatch slap them for me? Barney is easy compared to those...Er...Guy's(?) --D __________________ Hendrix 'X' Chassis #006 http://www.hunt4steve.com/Doug.html

03-21-2002, 09:09 PM	#12 (permalink)
Way Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Member # 9428 Location: Colorado Springs Posts: 1,151	Here is an idea. What about putting either 14 bolt or dana 60 outers on your 44. I have seen this mod done before. You already have 1.31" 31 spline axles up front. Those are the same as a common stock Dana 60 that are 31 splines and are 1.31". I imagine that you could order some moser axle shafts with maybe a 60 CTM u-joint and be fine with your mods. Freight on those items would be significantly less than others. The only problem I can see is that the D60 has a 3" axle housing and the dana 44 carries a 2.75". Going this route you would not need to re-buy locker and such. I bet someone in the US would be happy to torch off a junkyard Dana 60 knuckles for ya. I am not sure how the brake issue would work out, but I am sure you could get something figured out. You could then probably get a few bucks for your inner axles over there. Way

03-22-2002, 04:17 PM	#14 (permalink)
fcfred 4xdork Join Date: Feb 2001 Member # 3263 Location: not portland Posts: 3,162	hold on there is currently no ARB for the 14 bolt yes there is rumor of one, and an electric locker from eaton, but so far nothing yet the 14 bolt is great in the rear, but I would just spool it and be done, or wait for the locker as far as the fronts go I would vote 60 or track down the big salsbury front like on the front of Timm Cooper's truck. I've seen it and it's at least as big as a 60, it has a beefier housing, all your rover outers, big axles, and big big birfields. It will need custom inner axles cut if you wanna run a 35 spline dana 60 arb, but other than that it should drop in. I'm going with the 60 and by the time I have it all rebuilt it will probably cost me close to $1200. My vote is for the 60 because it's ready to go. swapping knuckles will probably not get you anywhere ahead, and for the money a rebuilt 60 with and arb or macnemara locker would probably be the quickest and easiest swap. If your buddy is coming to the northwest I could help him find a rebuilt 60 for about $1400 or less. And that wouldn't take long at all. if you think you can build your own knuckles and get the shafts cut then why not just go with a rear 60? drop in the arb cut and press in tubes of your choice build your own knuckles get your custom shafts made. hey why don't you get your buddy to bring over some cheap mcnamara 35 spline 60 lockers for us yanks? __________________ Team Tank old junk, new junk, unfinished junk Live Large-RIP Jason Payne ARMY TRUCK STOLEN!

03-22-2002, 05:21 PM	#15 (permalink)
RockRover Rock God Join Date: Apr 2001 Member # 4101 Location: Santa Fe Posts: 2,232	Duhhhh....Sam, why don't you buy Serious One's FC101 axles from him...Front and rear...Dana 60 centers and you get very stout CV's with them...That's the ticket man! --D __________________ Hendrix 'X' Chassis #006 http://www.hunt4steve.com/Doug.html

03-22-2002, 08:56 PM	#16 (permalink)
fcfred 4xdork Join Date: Feb 2001 Member # 3263 Location: not portland Posts: 3,162	i just talked to timm about his axles it turns out they are from a fc 101 but that you should also be able to find them from a LR ambulance or armoured car good luck __________________ Team Tank old junk, new junk, unfinished junk Live Large-RIP Jason Payne ARMY TRUCK STOLEN!

03-23-2002, 04:20 AM	#17 (permalink)
Strange Rover Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Member # 7962 Location: Australia Posts: 1,462	Thats the end of the 14 bolt plan. Carnt get an ARB for it. The reason I was thinking 14 bolt is that I can get the right ratio (5.13:1) in somehting that isnt going to break. The reason that I wouldnt go for d60 outers was only that I thing that with a little bit of axle cutting and resplining I could fabricate the rest (inner and outer knuckles) bolt on the existing spindle and hub and voila easy. But since there isnt an ARB for it. I dont really want one. Dont really want to go for fc101 axles. They are a dying breed and I think that any CV (no matter how big) is still going to fatigue and break. Looks like Im back to the d60 plan. Ill ring this guy tomorrow and find out exactly what hes doing. Sam __________________ Land Rover SIIa, 302W, NP435, NP205, MOG404s, 42in Swamper TSLs, 112in WB "An expert is somebody who learns more and more about less and less until one day they know absolutely everything about nothing." Outerlimits4x4.com - home of aussie rock crawling.

03-23-2002, 11:26 AM	#18 (permalink)
fcfred 4xdork Join Date: Feb 2001 Member # 3263 Location: not portland Posts: 3,162	where are you in australia? do you know anyone with a jeep cj-10? I'm building one here in the states where they are pretty rare, and would love to find some pics of some built auzzy rigs. __________________ Team Tank old junk, new junk, unfinished junk Live Large-RIP Jason Payne ARMY TRUCK STOLEN!

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