NV4500 Rover Adapter

[HandBuilt]

Oh yeah, Dre, the LT230 can be used as a divorce mounted case really easily. Not sure what the wheelbase is on your 55, but on my 113" 109 I could do a 2wd Chevy NV4500 and LT230. I was going to use one U joint in between the trans and I case...

[dieselcruiserhead]

Originally Posted by roverhybrids

I'm checking into getting a 300m coupler shaft made to work with a dodge heavy duty 4x4 output and the rover lt230 input gear...............

That would be killer if it ever happens.. I know there are s few ratio combos, anyone have ready information on the different setups and what they came out of? I seem to remember there was a 2.7 and a 1.1:1 high or something like that??

[dieselcruiserhead]

Thanks JL, stuck with this 4WD NV5600 though, and not too interested in divorced right now at least.. I think I am just going to run that crooked driveshaft, unless AA maybe has a good answer for me

[roverhybrids]

how do the external dimentions of the 5600 compare to the 4500?

the lt230 tcase's all have 3.32:1 low range
high range is 1.003:1 or 1.22:1(most common in states), 1.4:1 and 1.6:1

[dieselcruiserhead]

Physically much much larger than a NV4500... The Dana 300 on it currently looks tiny compared to it. I am psyched to use it but if I could do it again I would probably use the all aluminum Brazilian replacement for it (but I forget what it is called). It is lighter, slightly better gearing, and smaller, but still just as tough... But too late more or less I think...

But the actual tail housing bolt pattern is identical. One of the big advantages (for the first time I really cared) is a clocking ring on the Dana 300 to make it fit as required...

Here are some photos of mine, with my 4BT and the Dana 300 to give a size perspective Dana 300s are small though...

http://forum.ih8mud.com/fj55-iron-pi...ad-day-20.html
http://forum.ih8mud.com/fj55-iron-pi...ad-day-21.html

[aloharover]

Originally Posted by HandBuilt

Oh yeah, Dre, the LT230 can be used as a divorce mounted case really easily. Not sure what the wheelbase is on your 55, but on my 113" 109 I could do a 2wd Chevy NV4500 and LT230. I was going to use one U joint in between the trans and I case...

So what are the details on adapting the lt230 for a divorced application?
Is it just a simple seal and drive flange or more involved?

Pete

[mfreeman]

Originally Posted by aloharover

So what are the details on adapting the lt230 for a divorced application?
Is it just a simple seal and drive flange or more involved?

Pete

I also would like to hear from the group on this. I have pictures of M. Slades four door and it looks simple -- if you have enough frame length. Details on input shaft and seal would be very helpful.

[western110]

Though a coupler stub shaft is weaker it is nice in that it alows the use of the stock NV4500 mainshaft and the stock LT230 input gear. Spare stub shafts would be easy to carry and swap out if need be. If a custom gear or mainshaft died it might be alot harder to find a replacement for. Harder to change out to.

[roverhybrids]

Originally Posted by western110

Though a coupler stub shaft is weaker it is nice in that it alows the use of the stock NV4500 mainshaft and the stock LT230 input gear. Spare stub shafts would be easy to carry and swap out if need be. If a custom gear or mainshaft died it might be alot harder to find a replacement for. Harder to change out to.

Well we know the coupler in the stock size isn't stonger enough. At least not for the application of a 340+ lbs torque.

[western110]

340+ lbs... I guess it might be a bit weak for that I know that it works for something in the 160 hp with 295 ft/lbs range though (6.5na diesel). A stub shaft with a larger dia and matching input gear might be nice though your 32 spline setup does look very nice. Just need to get the price down.

[HandBuilt]

Originally Posted by western110

340+ lbs... I guess it might be a bit weak for that I know that it works for something in the 160 hp with 195 ft/lbs range though (6.5na diesel). A stub shaft with a larger dia and matching input gear might be nice though your 32 spline setup does look very nice. Just need to get the price down.

The part already you would need already exists, the TH400 to LT230 adapter that's available through AA has a 32 spline to rover 10 spline spud shaft. The only spud shaft breakage I have heard of was behind a 6.5 GM diesel, but it might have been turboed. Your 195 ft lbs figure sounds really low, that big V8 should be up around 300, definitely enough power to break couplers, unless it's an auto.

[aloharover]

Originally Posted by HandBuilt

Your 195 ft lbs figure sounds really low, that big V8 should be up around 300, definitely enough power to break couplers, unless it's an auto.

Thats what I was thinking. I dynoed 300 at see level with an NA6.2

of course if the engine was built strictly for MPG (84/85 precups, detuned IP, etc) 230-250ftlb would be the max.

Back on topic, are folks saying I should not think about a NV4500 with remote LT?

My other thought has been to just use an Atlas mated to the NV and then a double jointed rear shaft.

[western110]

Opps... typo there. I ment 295 ft/lbs, and the shaft and question as done fine at this level in the use that I know of. I must have been thinking 200tdi when I put 195 ft/lbs. I've been thinking of putting a 200 or 300 tdi in front of a NV4500 lately but I'll likey stick to the GM diesel for my 110 project.

[aloharover]

Originally Posted by western110

Opps... typo there. I ment 295 ft/lbs, and the shaft and question as done fine at this level in the use that I know of. I must have been thinking 200tdi when I put 195 ft/lbs. I've been thinking of putting a 200 or 300 tdi in front of a NV4500 lately but I'll likey stick to the GM diesel for my 110 project.

Ahh so hope is restored, no pun intended

I am actually building some new heads, going for mpg. Expect 250 max torgue.

So this coupler would work for me?

Pete

[western110]

It should be fine... though I am planning on building two for myself so that I have a spare. It would be easy to change if the need came up though like I said the other 110 with a 6.5na has about 70000miles on it with one of these shafts and no problems so far.

Originally Posted by aloharover

Ahh so hope is restored, no pun intended

I am actually building some new heads, going for mpg. Expect 250 max torgue.

So this coupler would work for me?

Pete

[HandBuilt]

Originally Posted by aloharover

Ahh so hope is restored, no pun intended

I am actually building some new heads, going for mpg. Expect 250 max torgue.

So this coupler would work for me?

Pete

Sorry I missed your questions with respect to the divorce mounted LT230. I have to give credit to Timm C. for the idea, he turned me onto it. It's easy, the input gear is fully supported so you can use the stock stub shaft and seal and just have a yoke welded on. A piece of 1 inch plate made into a big donut type flange, pressed onto and welded to the input shaft, then drilled for a flange type yoke is likely the easiest way to do it. It's a few hours of lathe work for a caveman like me and 10$ worth of steel. I am sure Pendy or PT could do it in about 5 minutes while juggling three gnomes and completing a rubix cube tho, if you can get them to stop arguing about which end of the haystack you should start on. Then again, Timm C could definitely hook you up reasonably.

The input shaft is retained via a big long bolt coming in from the back, same as the original setup that threads into the stub shaft or trans output shaft, I can't remember.

I could make the divorce mounted setup work in my 109 with the current driveshaft lengths if I used a 2wd Chevy NV4500, but it's no good for anything sub 110/109 as you end up with TJ sized rear driveshaft. Plus I think I could twist off the shaft eventually and it would be two more U joints to break and keep lubed. I still think the ultimate LT230 to NV4500 adapter would be a 35 spline Chevy 2wd output shaft, a Dodge 4wd output housing, and a 35 spline LT230 input gear. I either have to find a 4wd Dodge CTD trans or a late 2wd Chevy trans, but I can't find a used one under 2K up here.

[pendy]

Ryan S had nothing but trouble with the coupler style adapter. That was provided by Clark I believe. What will you do to address these problems?

[HandBuilt]

Originally Posted by pendy

Ryan S had nothing but trouble with the coupler style adapter. That was provided by Clark I believe. What will you do to address these problems?

Whom are you asking?

[western110]

Originally Posted by pendy

Ryan S had nothing but trouble with the coupler style adapter. That was provided by Clark I believe. What will you do to address these problems?

That is an interesting case. Ryan thought he could do it better than Clarke so he didn't use Clarkes adaptor, he only used Clarkes engine mounts as far as I'm aware. I've had a good look at Ryan's adaptor and it is was doomed to fail. If you look closely at the pics of it you will see that he doesn't have 360 degrees of clamping between the plate and the LT230, infact it might be less than 180 degrees. Anyway to make a long story short Ryan's adaptor failed at least twice that I've heard where as Clarke's is still going strong.

This is Ryan's plate:

http://www.apogee-eng.com/Assets/alb...apter1_jpg.jpg

This is Clarke's:

http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l3...e/IMG_1422.jpg

[PlantDriver]

[QUOTE=western110;7820575]That is an interesting case. Ryan thought he could do it better than Clarke so he didn't use Clarkes adaptor, he only used Clarkes engine mounts as far as I'm aware. I've had a good look at Ryan's adaptor and it is was doomed to fail. If you look closely at the pics of it you will see that he doesn't have 360 degrees of clamping between the plate and the LT230, infact it might be less than 180 degrees. Anyway to make a long story short Ryan's adaptor failed at least twice that I've heard where as Clarke's is still going strong.

Kind of off-topic, but: hi Andrew, I know Ryan well, and I (unfortunately) knew Clarke before he drunk himself to death (or whatever he did before he dropped off the face of the earth) and almost was Clarke's first customer/victim for his so-called "kit."

I'm a general contractor as well as a vendor of WVO kits, and tried to get Clarke to sign a contract that gathered in one legally binding document everything about the GM/NV4500-to-Defender kit I was about to purchase. Clarke wanted a huge amount of $ upfront, and I wanted a schedule of payments tied to sequential delivery of components with a very small upfront payment. Clarke began to foam about the mouth and (Thank you Lord!) the deal fell apart.

I told him I was going to have Shane Ballensky install a 300Tdi into a Series/Defender hybrid (which I now drive) and Clarke retaliated by dropping the dime on ECR to the EPA, then went searching for a new customer/victim, and poor Ryan, who was not then hanging out on the D-90 List and had thus missed my public outing of Clarke, entered into a transaction with Clarke. All he ever got from Clarke Williams other than a ton of grief was two motor mounts that were so warped that he remade them. (He's a process engineer and a very good machinist and fabricator.) I knew that Timm Cooper had made an adaptor for a NV4500 to LT230, and hooked him up with Timm and Ryan made the same adapter that Dutchman had made for Timm.

What's the old drunk/crook up to BTW, or has he perhaps been reincarnated as a sea slug?

Craig

[western110]

Hi Craig,

I know there are some hard feelings down there... I've only ever heard second hand from Clarke, one of his US partners, Ryan, and a couple of other customers what happened so I'd rather not comment because I wasn't there. I'm not trying to attack Ryan either, just making sure that it is clear that his setup was his own and not the same as Clarke's, hence any problems with it where not the fault of Clarke's design.

I helped Clarke design the conversion back in 1999/2000 but I was not directly involved in the operation of Yeti or the resulting mess, nore did I profit from it in any way. It is only now that I'm getting around to making the parts to do my truck, about 9 years in the making at this point.

Andrew

[PlantDriver]

Originally Posted by western110

Hi Craig,

I know there are some hard feelings down there... I've only ever heard second hand from Clarke, one of his US partners, Ryan, and a couple of other customers what happened so I'd rather not comment because I wasn't there. I'm not trying to attack Ryan either, just making sure that it is clear that his setup was his own and not the same as Clarke's, hence any problems with it where not the fault of Clarke's design.

I helped Clarke design the conversion back in 1999/2000 but I was not directly involved in the operation of Yeti or the resulting mess, nore did I profit from it in any way. It is only now that I'm getting around to making the parts to do my truck, about 9 years in the making at this point.

Andrew

Hi Andrew,

I have absolutely no hard feeling toward you, and my recollection of events (this was almost 10 years ago at this point) is that you were also victimized by the little weasel, just like anyone else who ever had the misfortune of crossing his path.

Craig

[PlantDriver]

Originally Posted by western110

Hi Craig,

I know there are some hard feelings down there... I've only ever heard second hand from Clarke, one of his US partners, Ryan, and a couple of other customers what happened so I'd rather not comment because I wasn't there. I'm not trying to attack Ryan either, just making sure that it is clear that his setup was his own and not the same as Clarke's, hence any problems with it where not the fault of Clarke's design.

I helped Clarke design the conversion back in 1999/2000 but I was not directly involved in the operation of Yeti or the resulting mess, nore did I profit from it in any way. It is only now that I'm getting around to making the parts to do my truck, about 9 years in the making at this point.

Andrew

Hey Andrew,

Do you have current contact info for Clarke? If you've got a phone number, email it to me at craigreece@plantdrive.com I'll let you lurk on the other end of a conference call if you like. This would of course assume that you enjoy a little drama and I'd never tell that I got his number from you, and if he's still alive or ever sober enough to read a computer screen I can assure you he's too destitute to be able to afford a computer - he hasn't posted on any 4x4 or diesel forum that I've hung out on for at least 8 years.

Thanks! Could be big fun for all!

Craig

[pendy]

Find the Yeti? Get pictures!

[HandBuilt]

I am bumping this thread because I just bought a 1998 NV4500 out of a low mile 2500 Dodge. It is getting swapped into my pile of junk soon.

The trans is a gasser and I have a diesel input shaft for swap in. I am considering keeping the 23 spline output and running my welded spud shaft adapter since I have it and it's served me well and it's a 100% direct bolt up to the trans. T case is a 1.003 LT230.

I want more info on this twisted spline output that has failed behind a 6.5 GM diesel. Was the shaft annealed and re-hardened or just welded hard? Mine was welded hard and the stock rover couplers have good metalurgy and hardness characteristics. I am debating running the spud shaft I built for now, and if it fails, to do something like Shane did, using a 2wd Chevy mainshaft.

Any info on how the spud shaft was made would be helpful.

Edit - I should add that my homebrew adapter has been 100% reliable and shows no signs of twist, and I have not been friendly to it. I'm seeing 30PSI of boost, which is apparently 200 hp and about 500 ft lbs of torque, max GCVWR has been up to about 18K lbs, but the damn loosey goosey dodge automatic keeps the shock loading to a minimum.