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Old 11-03-2005, 09:02 AM   #1 (permalink)
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death wobble persists! !@#%

I have a litle problem that I have yet to be able to work out. I recently made my jeep spring-over and installed 1-ton axles. The front 60 is giving me fits in the death wobble department and I can't seem to make it stop. I think i read about every death wobble thread that the search brought up and I tried just about all the tricks they recommended including: checked alignment, completely rebuilt both king-pins (upper and lower), tighted up shackle bolts. tightened and re-checked all tie-rod and drag-link ends for any slop. and nothing seems to work.

I can't check to tires for balance because i have the internal balance beads. Everything on the front end is new. wheels,tires, bearings,shafts,shocks,tie-rod,drag-link,pitman arm, springs,bushings,etc.

Could hi-steer arms have any effect on what is causing this? I have the WFO style arms with the tie-rod behind the axle. I haven't checked my castor angle so I'm guessing that could be a player in the problem,but I'm not sure if that really effects it that much.

Also, I thin I read that some people will shim the upper king-pin springs even when the springs are new. Is that a good idea?

I forgot the mention the I'm running 39.5 x 16.5 x 17 pitbull rockers on 17x9 wheels. don't know if that matters or not but thought it could be relevent.

Sorry for the long post but any ideas would be welcome


Eddie
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Old 11-03-2005, 01:42 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Many people have experienced the same problem you have. I have heard many fixes and what to and what not to do. I personally put a washer for a 1" dia. bolt under my spring pin cap and that fixed my problem.

What is the problem is most likely the preload on the upper kingpin. Too much is a bad thing, but what you have is not enough that is what is causing the death wobble.
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Old 11-03-2005, 02:02 PM   #3 (permalink)
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How much toe-in do you have? Sometimes with the larger tires, a little more toe-in is required to keep the larger sidewall from pushing out and getting the bounce in the tire that is the cause of some death wobble. May not be the answer, but an easy, free thing to try.
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Old 11-04-2005, 09:28 AM   #4 (permalink)
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i had the same problem when i installed my 60

i set the toe in at 1/8"
and added a fender washer under each kingpin cap


ALL GONE
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Old 11-04-2005, 10:21 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Thanks for the ideas! I really appreciate it.

I currently have my toe set to dead on zero. I wasn't sure what the specs were so I just set it there but I will give it some toe-in to see if that works.

How thick was the washer that ya'll installed? I have several bolt supply stores in my area but I would kind of like a rough idea how much to start with.(i.e. 1/8" or 1/4" thick)

Thanks again for the help!!
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Old 11-04-2005, 10:30 AM   #6 (permalink)
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i just got a fender washer
its a large washer but fairly thin, less then 1/4 i would say
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Old 11-04-2005, 11:14 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Wouldn't hurt to check your caster.I had same death wobble on my 78 ford, caster was near 0!
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Old 11-04-2005, 05:56 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I would try diffrent tires, or the rear tires up front. Or just use a friends tires. Put them on the front and see if that fixes it. I did the same thing and the wobbles stoped.
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Old 11-05-2005, 06:14 AM   #9 (permalink)
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I vote for shimming the kingpins or better yet call Offroad Design and just get a new kingpin rebuild kit for $20 incl both sides. That will help alot.
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Old 11-05-2005, 09:07 AM   #10 (permalink)
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I had some problems with mine it ended up being both a combination of too much caster 10+ and being toe in too far. So try both out and in on the toe and see what happens...

I know there is no silver bullet.. get some hydro assist going... your wobble problems will dissapear and you will be able to steer like a fiend... best 300 bucks I ever spent on my truck. I can go wheeling all day and not be worn out from fighting the steering.
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Old 11-05-2005, 09:37 AM   #11 (permalink)
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eddie----can you post a couple of clear pics of the front set-up?
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Old 11-05-2005, 04:58 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZUK
eddie----can you post a couple of clear pics of the front set-up?
I'm at the fire station today but I will post some pics tomorrow when I get off work.

Thanks to everyone for the replies!!

I may not have mentioned that I just finished completely rebuilding the kingpins last week and that didn't solve anything.


Thanks again to everyone for thier time and expertise!!
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Old 11-06-2005, 10:01 AM   #13 (permalink)
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here are a few pictures. I'm not sure if they show what you need to seeor not. If i need to take some other pics let me know I'd be happy to oblige.

Thanks again guys!!
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Old 11-06-2005, 10:04 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Old 11-06-2005, 10:05 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Old 11-06-2005, 10:14 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Can anyone tell from the angle of the steering arms on the knuckles if I have too much caster? I have an angle finder that I used for welding but I don't know if it is accurate enough for this task, or if that is even the right way to go about finding your caster angle.

I'm sure someone will notice, so I'll go ahead and confess that I have yet to get a new front shaft made. I'm not building a poser I just want to get the gremlins worked out first.

Thanks for everyone time!
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Old 11-06-2005, 11:52 AM   #17 (permalink)
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add a steering damper and DW will be gone.
have you tried a test drive with power steering disabled?
DW is a harmonic fawking with the power assist steering box causing it to ossilate
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Old 11-06-2005, 08:40 PM   #18 (permalink)
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you can certainly get a reasonable guess from your angle finder... truly hard to tell from the pics what kinda angles you got going on... if anything it looks more negative that positive from the picture... so I would imagine it would be good to lower those front spring hangars or cut and rotate the knuckles...

Again truthfully... a steering dampener will help... possibly eliminate the DW and hydro assist will pretty much guaranteed fix it.
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Old 11-07-2005, 08:22 PM   #19 (permalink)
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From your picture, I would say you have too much caster. Of course it is always hard to tell from an angle, but it looks as though they are too far leaning back, or too much + caster. I had this problem on my front 60 install. the dimensions of the early CJ did not go well with the shackle reversal. I needed a huge drop bracket in front to make up for the shackles at the rear. I ended up putting the shackles back in front, but there were more contributing factors for this decision.
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