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Topic Review (Newest First)
04-09-2012 03:45 AM
ROCKLIMO My bank does it......Comcast Bay does it....and BRC, Cal4Wheel,RTF,etc. should do it too. It is called Text Alerts.....then EVERYONE who wants to know will know....instantly to their portable device, no matter where you are or when it is. It's a no brainer...consider it!
04-08-2012 11:51 PM
cruzila
Quote:
Originally Posted by phattboy View Post
As many of you may or may not know, while I do not have the time to devote to regular posting, etc., I do monitor this forum and othersÖ this thread and three others in particular have had my attention for the last several days.

One major point I have taken from these threads boils down to the recurring thought that we/BRC need to be doing more in the way of communication, or at least making more information available. Folks feel blind and blindsided, and we need to do what we can to change that.

We are trying, and have been trying for some time to revamp and improve on our communications, and we are making progress. At the same time, I know we donít get it all right. I could give a list of reasons or excuses, but I will spare you that lame-osity. The fact is we can improve and we will try. You have my commitment to that end.

The first course of action BRC can and is taking is development of a legal action page on our website where you will be able to go to get background and the latest updates on what we are able to share in regard to the various legal actions we are involved in. Resources are already committed to development of that. You have already seen an interim product with Donís update on Eldorado last week at: http://www.sharetrails.org/news/2012...terim-closures.

To sort through and fully develop the concept will take some time, as will figuring out the best method of serving it up and the protocol checks in what we can and cannot share. I am certain this will go through several iterations, so please be patient.

Sincerely,

Greg Mumm
Executive Director
BlueRibbon Coalition
Awesome response Gregg! I look forward to my BRC alerts from here on out!

Scott
04-08-2012 11:14 PM
R290
Quote:
Originally Posted by kf6zpl View Post
That a post directly calling for support of an emergency issue within the land use arena garners less views and comment
From what I have read that has only been done 3 times since EPA took charge of our lifes.

One thing I have noticed is the same judge has been involved for many years in this case. A quick search shows how he ruled in our favor like a year ago.
04-08-2012 08:58 PM
Brewster2
Quote:
Originally Posted by phattboy View Post
The first course of action BRC can and is taking is development of a legal action page on our website where you will be able to go to get background and the latest updates on what we are able to share in regard to the various legal actions we are involved in. Resources are already committed to development of that. You have already seen an interim product with Donís update on Eldorado last week at: http://www.sharetrails.org/news/2012...terim-closures.

Greg Mumm
Executive Director
BlueRibbon Coalition
Greg
PLEASE, when you do the legal updates, translate the legal terms to something we can comprehend.

Thanks
Ride on
Brewster
CERA...LAO
04-08-2012 07:01 PM
atvobsession
Quote:
Originally Posted by cruzila View Post
There will always be an armchair quarterback. You will always be accused of selling out. What you are forgetting is there is a huge number of people out there rooting for you to succeed!! The problem lies in that you will not hear from them and it is difficult to see. Go back and look at the couple posts where someone says "I will continue to support BRC" etc, etc.
Exactly. The PRO's, will always get outweighed by the CON's. Look at Television shows?? Networks know for every GOOD letter...there are thousands that feel the same way, but didn't bother. But for every nasty letter, there is a much lower number that feel the same.

A few angry people, makes much more "noise" than hundreds of satisfied people.
04-08-2012 06:42 PM
Curly
Quote:
Originally Posted by phattboy View Post
As many of you may or may not know, while I do not have the time to devote to regular posting, etc., I do monitor this forum and othersÖ this thread and three others in particular have had my attention for the last several days.

One major point I have taken from these threads boils down to the recurring thought that we/BRC need to be doing more in the way of communication, or at least making more information available. Folks feel blind and blindsided, and we need to do what we can to change that.

We are trying, and have been trying for some time to revamp and improve on our communications, and we are making progress. At the same time, I know we donít get it all right. I could give a list of reasons or excuses, but I will spare you that lame-osity. The fact is we can improve and we will try. You have my commitment to that end.

The first course of action BRC can and is taking is development of a legal action page on our website where you will be able to go to get background and the latest updates on what we are able to share in regard to the various legal actions we are involved in. Resources are already committed to development of that. You have already seen an interim product with Donís update on Eldorado last week at: http://www.sharetrails.org/news/2012...terim-closures.

To sort through and fully develop the concept will take some time, as will figuring out the best method of serving it up and the protocol checks in what we can and cannot share. I am certain this will go through several iterations, so please be patient.

Sincerely,

Greg Mumm
Executive Director
BlueRibbon Coalition
Great response, Bravo. Can't ask for more than that. Thanks you for listening and all your hard work and know that as mentioned above, there are many, many people looking to get behind the right organization.

Keeping my chin up,
Tim.
04-08-2012 06:32 PM
phattboy As many of you may or may not know, while I do not have the time to devote to regular posting, etc., I do monitor this forum and others… this thread and three others in particular have had my attention for the last several days.

One major point I have taken from these threads boils down to the recurring thought that we/BRC need to be doing more in the way of communication, or at least making more information available. Folks feel blind and blindsided, and we need to do what we can to change that.

We are trying, and have been trying for some time to revamp and improve on our communications, and we are making progress. At the same time, I know we don’t get it all right. I could give a list of reasons or excuses, but I will spare you that lame-osity. The fact is we can improve and we will try. You have my commitment to that end.

The first course of action BRC can and is taking is development of a legal action page on our website where you will be able to go to get background and the latest updates on what we are able to share in regard to the various legal actions we are involved in. Resources are already committed to development of that. You have already seen an interim product with Don’s update on Eldorado last week at: http://www.sharetrails.org/news/2012...terim-closures.

To sort through and fully develop the concept will take some time, as will figuring out the best method of serving it up and the protocol checks in what we can and cannot share. I am certain this will go through several iterations, so please be patient.

Sincerely,

Greg Mumm
Executive Director
BlueRibbon Coalition
04-08-2012 01:20 PM
cruzila I asked. 3 days before this hit the public.

I asked for details because I heard a reputable rumor that there were massive OHV closures looming in my backyard. My backyard!

I was told that the details were still being worked out and there was no news to report.

Then I was part of a meeting with the local FS and found out a bunch of information. I then asked again for details on a particular piece of information that was a document. Again, was told that it was client attorney privilege. So, ten minutes and one phone call later I had all 4 documents that were public record. Then within a day, backpedaling and releasing info.

I hate the dissension this post will cause, I hate that I feel I have to be contentious. I hate that I may cause ill will for any of these organizations fighting for us. Because I truly believe in the fight for our RIGHTS as they are. I believe that the people in these orgs believe as strongly as I do in the fight for the right for access.

But you guys asked for it.

I am truly sorry and hope this makes a better organization in the future.

John, I watched my friend Randii go through something similar to this. You are too close to the conversation and trying to make a change where there is no solution for you.

There will always be an armchair quarterback. You will always be accused of selling out. What you are forgetting is there is a huge number of people out there rooting for you to succeed!! The problem lies in that you will not hear from them and it is difficult to see. Go back and look at the couple posts where someone says "I will continue to support BRC" etc, etc. I assure you there is a line of people behind that that believe the same except they are not incensed enough to make a statement even after reading here. They are there, support your work and you will never hear from them. Conversely, there are people behind the accusing viewpoint, and very vocal, but ultimately those people may likely support the effort regardless of Monday morning quarterbacking.

I have stepped up to the firing line, I have sat in that room full of eco terrorists, I have looked the enemy in the eye and not capitulated.

You can change the way you do business without paying more staff. It is about making decisions from a public relations viewpoint. About treating people with respect and understanding.

You can make the choice about being in control of the information you have at your disposal. We recently were blessed with an opportunity to get out in front of an issue with an iconic tree that fell over in a storm. We reacted very quickly, made several key calls to inform the agencies and got the info out before it could be spun out of control or worse, seized by those fighting against us. In the end we made a decision, I hope it was good one.

Interesting? You betcha. Out of your control to do better? Not on your life.
04-07-2012 10:20 PM
randii
Quote:
Originally Posted by kf6zpl View Post
Who among the readership is willing to step up to the firing line and have your commetment questioned and your reputation trashed all because others are unwilling to check facts??
Been there and done that -- any time we deal with contentious issues and divided constituents, it is part of the job, John... or the volunteer commitment, for some of us.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kf6zpl View Post
Who is willing to sit in a room full of environmentalists and hold to an anti-Closure position only to be accused of being part of a sellout??
Been there and done that, too -- again, there are divided constituents, and anyone whoe presumes to speak for the majority all will inevitably have to hear from the minorities.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kf6zpl View Post
I am waiting for the time the "Monday morning quarterbacks" reach a level of maturaty they are willing to be part of the sution.
Perhaps it *is* time for a reality check. This is a discussion forum... all manner of things will be discussed. You can choose NOT to read or engage, or choose to respond to every thread. Anything at either extreme or in the middle will expose you to dissenting opinions. Have I mentioned yet that the readership is divided in their opinions of how to proceed?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kf6zpl View Post
Yes, the main organizations need to improve their communications capabilities. They can't do tvat without funding to support staff.
Perhaps funding needs reallocated. Battling and winning doesn't help fund-raising if nobody knows about it! Losses aren't any fun to read about, either, but if you get the word out first, your donors and supporters are better able to cope with it than they will be if blind-sided.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kf6zpl View Post
Can "local organizations" file effective lawsuits???
Define effective.

Randii
04-07-2012 10:17 AM
fermentor John, here's my personal perspective on the whole thing cherry/nit picked off your post:

Quote:
Originally Posted by kf6zpl View Post
Yes, the main organizations need to improve their communications capabilities.
^^^^^ root cause^^^^^^^^^
Information was available, but was not shared. Preliminary, incomplete or for whatever reason. The damage was self-inflicted.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kf6zpl View Post
Who is willing to sit in a room full of environmentalists and hold to an anti-Closure
position only to be accused of being part of a sellout??
No thank you. I'm content to volunteer, donate what $$ I can afford, and Monday Morning Quarterback - BUT, without the whole playbook..... there's going to be some fumbles.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kf6zpl View Post
Who among the readership is willing to step up to the firing line and have your commetment questioned and your reputation trashed all because others are unwilling to check facts??
See first point. What facts? Until the actual court documents were posted on BRC, only snippets of the whole story got dribbled out from somewhere - including the "C" word, which was kinda the truth. Why were those not "silver plattered" to us until 6 weeks after they were inked?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kf6zpl View Post
That a post directly calling for support of an emergency issue within the landuse arena garners less views and comment than a posting postulating about the potential de ision of one judge.

In fact, the post about the potential judicial decision has spawned an incredible amount of adverse comments and second guessing about the very organizations that have maintained a hard fight to stop closures.
See first point. Nature abhors a vacuum. Judge renders interim ruling 2/14/12 that included the "C" word without any fanfare. "C" word gets sucked into the vacuum a week ago, amplifying the vacuum. Whole pile of poop joins the vacuum and you end up with what we have here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kf6zpl View Post
Perhaps it is time for a reality check.
I couldn't agree more.
04-07-2012 12:38 AM
kf6zpl
Interesting....

That a post directly calling for support of an emergency issue within the landuse arena garners less views and comment than a posting postulating about the potential de ision of one judge.

In fact, the post about the potential judicial decision has spawned an incredible amount of adverse comments and second guessing about the very organizations that have maintained a hard fight to stop closures.

Perhaps it is time for a reality check.

Who among the readership is willing to step up to the firing line and have your commetment questioned and your reputation trashed all because others are unwilling to check facts??

Who is willing to sit in a room full of environmentalists and hold to an anti-Closure

position only to be accused of being part of a sellout??

I am waiting for the time the "Monday morning quarterbacks" reach a level of maturaty they are willing to be part of the sution.

Yes, the main organizations need to improve their communications capabilities.

They can't do tvat without funding to support staff.

Can "local organizations" file effective lawsuits??? I am still waiting for a couple of "local organization" law suits that promised ground-breaking results to make it into the court system.

Web wanna-be lawyers are plentiful in the forums.

And, thee are several lawyers reading these forums. Where is there support for points of law??

I am not saying you should blindly trust any organization. I encourage you to be active in your organization of choice.

However, with your organization of choice, are they filing lawsuits or are they talking about filing lawsuits??

You have a choice.

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