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Old 09-27-2012, 07:25 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Cant find it - Form 1/SBR thread

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/outdo...facturing.html


this one above shows some links but i thought there was a thread dedicated solely to filling out your Form 1 for an SBR here on Pirate? I searched all around and i remember seeing it but maybe it was just info buried in some of the NFA threads?

For some reason, i thought Aloha or Doc started it... i dont know, my brain is mushy this morning and i been working a lot if yall can find it or remember it, ill delete this thread.
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Old 09-27-2012, 08:00 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Old 09-27-2012, 08:51 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Ok from my memory on it all

-we concluded that 7" was the number to put down as that's the shortest ?

-what was the shortest overall length?

-on caliber we can put down "5.56" but are you supposed to list other calibers in 4h? What about engraving the caliber? Say I use a lower that is marked 5.56 from the factory and I list 300 blackout on my Form 1.... I then have to engrave 300 blackout and I can legally use both 5.56 and 300 on the SBR?
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Old 09-27-2012, 04:56 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Ok from my memory on it all

-we concluded that 7" was the number to put down as that's the shortest ?do you have an AR with a collapsible stock? Mine measures 15" with the stock collapsd plus the bbl length so 22"

-what was the shortest overall length?

-on caliber we can put down "5.56" but are you supposed to list other calibers in 4h? just put down 5.56 or .22

What about engraving the caliber? Say I use a lower that is marked 5.56 from the factory and I list 300 blackout on my Form 1.... I then have to engrave 300 blackout and I can legally use both 5.56 and 300 on the SBR?
Just put what is on the lower now on the form. So 556. You can put any caliber on later, as long as the length is the same or longer
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:26 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Bumping, working on my Form 1. So on the length as long as the finished gun is longer then the stated lengths it's good?

Ie 8" barrel but actual is 8+", overall is 18.5" but actual is 20" with folded stock?

Also what do you put for the reason for the build?

Next would be CLEO signature and fingerprint cards?
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Old 11-28-2012, 10:09 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Here you go:

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/outdo...facturing.html
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Old 11-29-2012, 04:37 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Bumping, working on my Form 1. So on the length as long as the finished gun is longer then the stated lengths it's good?

Ie 8" barrel but actual is 8+", overall is 18.5" but actual is 20" with folded stock?

Also what do you put for the reason for the build?

Next would be CLEO signature and fingerprint cards?
I put collapsed stock to front of barrel length,on an 8" barrel.

Reason for the build, I've been using" any lawful purpose"

CLEO signature I don't know about, I use a trust.

This might help you as well FORM 1 – HOW TO | Silenced America
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Old 11-29-2012, 09:10 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas97 View Post
I put collapsed stock to front of barrel length,on an 8" barrel.

Reason for the build, I've been using" any lawful purpose"

CLEO signature I don't know about, I use a trust.

This might help you as well FORM 1 – HOW TO | Silenced America
Thanks, lots of info here, got some reading checking to do.
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Old 11-29-2012, 09:35 AM   #9 (permalink)
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If i plan to build a F1 sbr with a barrel shorter than the length of a handguard, what do i use for the overall length?

stock collapsed to the end of the barrel?

Or

Stock collapsed to the end of the handguard?
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Old 11-29-2012, 09:47 AM   #10 (permalink)
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end of the barrel I would think. Seems the gun can be longer then the stated length but not shorter.

Hand-guard length isn't the issue so that's what makes me say barrel.
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Old 11-29-2012, 09:47 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Deja vu.
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Old 11-29-2012, 09:49 AM   #12 (permalink)
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If i plan to build a F1 sbr with a barrel shorter than the length of a handguard, what do i use for the overall length?

stock collapsed to the end of the barrel?

Or

Stock collapsed to the end of the handguard?
end of the barrel. hand guard has no dog in this fight.
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Old 11-29-2012, 09:50 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Deja vu.
no idea how I missed the first link.
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Old 11-29-2012, 11:53 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Seems the gun can be longer then the stated length but not shorter.
I have heard that multiple times as well, but is there any atf letter stating that as fact?
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Old 11-29-2012, 11:57 AM   #15 (permalink)
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I have heard that multiple times as well, but is there any atf letter stating that as fact?

My statement was an assumption, I would like to know as well.
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Old 11-30-2012, 03:54 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Just put what is on the lower now on the form. So 556. You can put any caliber on later, as long as the length is the same or longer
What if the lower is marked "CAL MULTI"? Does this automatically disqualify this lower from a SBR build because of the non-specific size? Or can I mill off the word "MULTI" and engrave .22 (or whatever caliber I deign) in it's place? I guess what I'm really asking is the lower listed in the factory paperwork as the caliber it's marked with or is it just specified as an AR15 lower? Or is this even a concern?

A lower is being shipped to me as I type that I intend to do a SBR build on, so this isn't a hypothetical...
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Old 11-30-2012, 04:39 PM   #17 (permalink)
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What if the lower is marked "CAL MULTI"? Does this automatically disqualify this lower from a SBR build because of the non-specific size? Or can I mill off the word "MULTI" and engrave .22 (or whatever caliber I deign) in it's place? I guess what I'm really asking is the lower listed in the factory paperwork as the caliber it's marked with or is it just specified as an AR15 lower? Or is this even a concern?

A lower is being shipped to me as I type that I intend to do a SBR build on, so this isn't a hypothetical...
List whatever caliber you plan to turn it into on the f1.
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Last edited by runnerboyy; 11-30-2012 at 04:40 PM.
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Old 11-30-2012, 04:47 PM   #18 (permalink)
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What if the lower is marked "CAL MULTI"? Does this automatically disqualify this lower from a SBR build because of the non-specific size? Or can I mill off the word "MULTI" and engrave .22 (or whatever caliber I deign) in it's place? I guess what I'm really asking is the lower listed in the factory paperwork as the caliber it's marked with or is it just specified as an AR15 lower? Or is this even a concern?

A lower is being shipped to me as I type that I intend to do a SBR build on, so this isn't a hypothetical...
Mine has multi as well. I'm getting the caliber engraved along with my city and trust name
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Old 11-30-2012, 05:15 PM   #19 (permalink)
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What if the lower is marked "CAL MULTI"? Does this automatically disqualify this lower from a SBR build because of the non-specific size? Or can I mill off the word "MULTI" and engrave .22 (or whatever caliber I deign) in it's place? I guess what I'm really asking is the lower listed in the factory paperwork as the caliber it's marked with or is it just specified as an AR15 lower? Or is this even a concern?
Don't worry about the marking. Don't need to re-ingrave.

Not a concern.
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Old 11-30-2012, 05:18 PM   #20 (permalink)
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I have heard that multiple times as well, but is there any atf letter stating that as fact?
Fact? ATF letter and fact in the same sentence?

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Old 11-30-2012, 11:59 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Fact? ATF letter and fact in the same sentence?

Sorry, something more than internet hearsay.
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Old 12-01-2012, 01:06 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Anything you ask for here IS internet hearsay. Even if a letter is posted, unless has your name at the top, it is meaningless! And even then, with your name on it, it is little more than rebuttal evidence at your trial.

In the end, you'll need to read the law and make your own decisions, or hire a lawyer to read it to you.
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Old 01-22-2013, 06:08 AM   #23 (permalink)
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bumping this up because i have a question about engraving....

im only a couple months in on my Form 1 wait, but ill be in the area of a good engraver today and want to go ahead and get that knocked out. i have a multi-marked lower, but i think I am going to go ahead and engrave for the caliber i listed and thats 300 blk.

here is an odd caveat and it may not matter: looking through my trust again last night i noticed something. the title at the top of my first page says:

"THE Texas97 NFA Trust"

but in the body of the the opening paragraph in the legal speak, it says something like "this trust shall be known as Texas97 NFA Trust". On all my paperwork, my FFL has instructed me to put "THE Texas97 NFA Trust".


what are the odds my paperwork gets kicked back for something dumb like that? what is wrong with me engraving "THE Texas97 NFA Trust" and having them say "that wont work, you have to drop "THE" off the front"?

i may be nitpicking here, but engraving is permanent. would it be better to wait for final Form 1 approval?


also, what is the preferred nomenclature for the 300 Blackout caliber...

300 Blackout?
300 BLK?
300 AAC Blackout?
300 AAC BLK?




.
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Old 01-22-2013, 09:35 AM   #24 (permalink)
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im in the same boat. lets say i have a .223/300aac/9mm/45acp/.22 pistol uppers. i want one lower to use for all of them.
lets say i have a multi caliber marked registered lower.
on my form 1, i can leave it as "multi caliber" and whatever is my shortest barrel, claim that length, correct?

other than marking the lower with my trust information, all is well?

i would really hate to have a lower for each of my pistol uppers i want to SBR.
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Old 01-22-2013, 09:43 AM   #25 (permalink)
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cal = .30

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