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Old 07-13-2010, 06:57 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Norinco Model 213-B Safety issues.

Yes, I searched.

Recently picked up a Norinco Model 213-B (Chinese version of the Russian Tokarev TT-33/Hungarian M48 Tokagypt). This is the Chinese model in 9mm Luger and with the wrap around grips. The pistol had only ever had two magazines shot through it.


The issue I am having is the safety randomly decides to engage itself. Can anyone give me any ideas of how to fix this or remove it?

I know the original Russian Tokarevs did not have a manual safety on them, and that the safety was installed on the non-russian models to meet import requirements.

It is a fun gun to shoot, just gets irritating when shooting and it randomly decides it wants to be "safe".

The only other issue I really have is there is no way to make the magazine release work left handed. But I can live with that.

Does anybody else here own one of these? Any other tips or tricks to making it run smoother than it already does?

Also, can anyone point me in the right direction to locate the parts needed to convert it to 7.62x25?

Thanks in advance.
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Old 07-14-2010, 08:43 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Not Good News

Intense, as you can probably tell there is not a lot of interest or support for these weapons. I sold mine about 16 months ago at the height of the Gun/Obama hysteria for more than 2X what I paid for it new. Doesn't help you out. My experience with the Norinco Tokey was that no one would even consider working on it. Mostly due to prejudice against inexpensive Chinese stuff. Even the shop where I bought it refused to consider looking at the trigger.

My $0.02 is to try to find a local gunsmith who is on the hungry side and won't rape you to look at it. Given how touchy mine was, and my total lack of mechanical skills, I left mine alone. Maybe you carefully dissassemble it and check it out. FWIW my weapon never failed to fire or eject a single time, and the safety, though tiny, cheap and flimsy, stayed on. I wouldn't trust my life to it.

It's unfortunate that you haven't got any response here, as there are many helpful and qualified pistol peeps here. Same guys that lust/porn on an AK-47 can't or won't pony up for a fellow shooter that needs a hand.

Anyone ??

Signed,

New Ruger P95 owner
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Old 07-14-2010, 09:59 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Lil Uzi, I appreciate the reply. And, you are correct. Even after searching and reading all of the topics that the Tokarev was even mentioned in, I still didn't find much info.

After reading up on a lot of other sites, it seems the common consensus is to just remove the import required safety lever and use the original Russian designed half cock notch and then, fill in the hole that is left.

After disassembling the pistol, I have discovered that all the safety lever does is move the trigger guide bars down and allows the disconnector to drop down and block the sear. Similar to what the disconnector already does when the slide is pulled back. It truly is the very basest of safeties.

This is actually the second Tokarev style pistol I have owned. The first was about 20 years ago and was an actual Russian Tokarev with no safety lever on it. It looked like it had seen a lot better days. But, it went bang every time you pulled the trigger.

This one is in immaculate shape. And, the wrap around grips make it quite comfortable to shoot compared to the original flat panel straight grip design. It is also quite accurate. And, other than the safety issue it feeds everything I have put in it just fine and has never had a FTE or FTF.

I agree that we have some of the most knowledgeable people in the world on this site when it comes to firearms. That is why I posted my query on here.

Oh well. I figure sometime about 4 or 5 years from now, after I have forgotten about this post, someone will dig it up and give me some info that would have been helpful when I asked but, is no longer needed as I had sold the pistol 3 years before.
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Old 07-15-2010, 06:25 AM   #4 (permalink)
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I wish I had kept the Toker
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Old 07-15-2010, 11:16 AM   #5 (permalink)
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if it was added on as an import requirement you can bet it was done as cheaply as possible. I like the remove it and plug the hole option.
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Old 07-15-2010, 03:02 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
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if it was added on as an import requirement you can bet it was done as cheaply as possible. I like the remove it and plug the hole option.

I agree. All it looks like they did was drilled a hole and notched it for the safety lever to go through, then cut a hole in the hammer/trigger housing so the lever would push down on the trigger arms and sear disconnector. For safety stops there are two small divots then a couple of screws to make sure it doesn't over travel. Something a person could do in about ten minutes with a drill and a file.

I have messed with it with the safety lever removed and unloaded trying to see if the half cock feature was unsafe at all. I haven't been able to get it to go off of the half cock notch accidentally at all. It takes a very determined and intentional effort to move it from that notch. It is safer than the safety they put on it.

So, I guess now I need to figure out a way to block or cover the hole that doesn't look stupid as fawk.
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Old 07-16-2010, 05:36 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I agree. All it looks like they did was drilled a hole and notched it for the safety lever to go through, then cut a hole in the hammer/trigger housing so the lever would push down on the trigger arms and sear disconnector. For safety stops there are two small divots then a couple of screws to make sure it doesn't over travel. Something a person could do in about ten minutes with a drill and a file.

I have messed with it with the safety lever removed and unloaded trying to see if the half cock feature was unsafe at all. I haven't been able to get it to go off of the half cock notch accidentally at all. It takes a very determined and intentional effort to move it from that notch. It is safer than the safety they put on it.

So, I guess now I need to figure out a way to block or cover the hole that doesn't look stupid as fawk.
is the base metal steel?
copper backing plate and a welder, just fill the hole and file it till it disappears.
anything else and you'll have to have it tigged. Of course, JB weld might fill it in just fine, cover with duracoat.
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Old 07-16-2010, 02:49 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 87manche View Post
is the base metal steel?
Yes, it is. Magnets stick to it just fine.


Quote:
copper backing plate and a welder, just fill the hole and file it till it disappears.
Will a regular wire feed welder work for this? Or, will I need MIG? I have access to a wire feed if that will work. All I have is an ancient Lincoln arc. My original plan was to see if I could find someone to weld it up for me, then I remembered my GF's step-dad has a wire feed.


Quote:
anything else and you'll have to have it tigged.
That is what I though might need done originally due to the small area and lack of thickness.

Quote:
Of course, JB weld might fill it in just fine, cover with duracoat.
This was a fall back option if nothing else was going to work or be reasonably priced.
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Old 07-17-2010, 02:38 PM   #9 (permalink)
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?

I dunno much about welding. I read the book, bought my Lincoln AC stick box, then did my frame sliders for the rig, but my best work is done by a friend Like beers, I prefer OPs. That said, I encourage you to consider the effect of welding upon the temper of the steel gun frame. Maybe this is done with regularity and is completely safe. Just checkin....

Duct Tape ???
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Old 07-18-2010, 02:18 PM   #10 (permalink)
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duct tape ???

yes!!!!!!!!!
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Old 07-19-2010, 07:53 AM   #11 (permalink)
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If you use a copper plate the backing will take most of the heat. MIG would be best because the flux core is nasty, but I have filll welded with my cheapy HF wire feed using a copper backing plate.

I wouldn't worry too much about the temper, it's not likely that the Chinese did when they made it.

If you have a friend that can tig it I'd go that route, hell, it's such a small thing that the local welding shop wold probably do it for $20.
Or just take it out, leave the hole and say F it, that way you can make it all "legal" again if you dump it.
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Old 07-19-2010, 03:37 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 87manche View Post
If you use a copper plate the backing will take most of the heat. MIG would be best because the flux core is nasty, but I have filll welded with my cheapy HF wire feed using a copper backing plate.

I wouldn't worry too much about the temper, it's not likely that the Chinese did when they made it.

If you have a friend that can tig it I'd go that route, hell, it's such a small thing that the local welding shop wold probably do it for $20.
Or just take it out, leave the hole and say F it, that way you can make it all "legal" again if you dump it.

I appreciate the info. I am not all that experienced of a welder so I may just see what I can get a local welder to do it for.

If I were to get ambitious it wouldn't take much to build up the cut out in the handgrips to cover that spot or make a new set of hand grips for it. If I do that then JB and duracoat would work just fine.

Worst case is, as you said, I just leave it as it is. Then it is a simple 5 minute job to pull the grips and reinstall the safety lever if I decide to get rid of it.

Thanks again.
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Old 07-19-2010, 03:45 PM   #13 (permalink)
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I wouldn't worry too much about the temper, it's not likely that the Chinese did when they made it.
You might be surprised, the old Norinco 1911s were the gunsmith's nightmare because of how tough the frames were.
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Old 09-24-2010, 08:59 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Wow this is quite the contray to many gunsmiths I know. They loved the .45 Norinco. the were easy to build and reliable as hell. I actually own a Norinco 213 9mm and its the best gun I own. I own alof of them, but this one shoots accurate as hell. Never jammed or stove piped, Neve failed me in any way. I absolutly love mine. Shoots better than my Glock or my Colt.
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Old 09-24-2010, 09:34 AM   #15 (permalink)
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this one shoots accurate as hell. Never jammed or stove piped, Neve failed me in any way. I absolutly love mine. Shoots better than my Glock or my Colt.
Words of wisdom.

As I posted above, an AK is righteous, but a Chinese Tokarev is crap. It's a pistol people thing. Too many Glock snobs.
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Old 09-24-2010, 09:49 AM   #16 (permalink)
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easy fix for the hole..tap it..insert bolt..dremel off excess..blue touch up pen..dun!
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Old 09-24-2010, 01:17 PM   #17 (permalink)
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easy fix for the hole..tap it..insert bolt..dremel off excess..blue touch up pen..dun!
That would be easy, except it isn't exactly a round hole. So far, I have just left the safety lever out of it and used the half cock notch on it.

No issues whatsoever. Only real issue is as you practice drills, moving it from holster it is a slight stretch of thumb to pull it and pull hammer back the rest of the way to full cock. Not a huge issue. Just takes a touch to get used to.

As for reliability and accuracy. I do not claim to be any kind of pistolero at all. My forte has always been rifles and long range accuracy practicing.

After watching the Todd Jarret video on how to shoot 1911's though, I use the same methods he explains in shooting the 1911. It makes the gun quite easy to shoot well.

Accuracy, in my limited experience with pistols is decent. I can hold 3 inch 8 shot groups at the 10 yard range shooting unsupported if I take my time. I think this has a lot to do with the surprisingly crisp trigger on the pistol. It breaks with very minimal creep and very crisply at about 4.5lbs. I think the wrap around Toka-gypt type grips help it a lot as well.

Bad part is, my 10 year old son shoots it better than me.

Reliability, this thing loves hollow points. No FTE, FTF, or stovepipes or anything else regardless of hollow point loaded. Just goes bang every time the trigger is pulled.

With standard round nose jacketed bullets though, about 1 out of every 30 or so will fail to feed all of the way on me. A good whack to back of slide and it goes right into battery though. I am not sure if this is due to the cheaper WWB and other affordable ammunition I am shooting, or due to the round nose. I need to polish the feed ramp a little bit and see if that helps.


Overall review though is it is a fairly well made pistol and well worth the $125 rifle I traded for it.

Last edited by intenseimages; 09-26-2010 at 08:20 AM.
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Old 09-25-2010, 12:25 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Mine was given to me, but it shoots great. No issues with any ammo I throw at it adn as I stated before the Norinco 213 is spot on accrate. I really like mine. Not the prettiest girl at the ball, by i trust my life to the norinco.
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Old 12-18-2013, 03:17 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Norinco 213

I recently purchased a N213 in excellent shape and took it out to the range and had not a single problem with it. The safety was very hard to move so I removed it and ordered a set of grips from http://marschalgrips.com/tt33wr/tt33wr.htm as he sells a set of full side grips which cover the safety hole. I have heard alot of negative things about the norinco but I have found this gun to be a well made accurate shooting gun. I have one of the new zastava m57's and the guide rod/spring retaining pin fell off while shooting and trying to get a replacement part has been a nightmare. Here is a picture of the grips I had made for the 213

cant wait to get them in the mail.
here is a pic of a set of grips installed on one of his guns, I will post a pic when mine come in

Last edited by keith1066; 12-18-2013 at 03:24 PM.
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Old 12-18-2013, 05:30 PM   #20 (permalink)
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You just joined and your first post is one necroing a 3 year old thread?


Do have to hand it to you for at least searching first.
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Old 12-19-2013, 03:22 AM   #21 (permalink)
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I enjoy the ease of cleaning the tokarevs, good simple guns, mostly just a range/backpack gun. My carry gun is a PT145, or Ballester .45, I did post on the Norinco as I have seen on other posts elsewhere where people look to cover the hole with weld which is more work than really needed and the vendor I found takes a great new approach, covering it with a new set of grips, I got to choose the wood, color, even the engraving design - not too shabby. I have heard of those who have thought of converting back to 7.62x 25 but for the expense you can just purchase one of the new zastava m57's. Century arms has a magnetic laser sight that works with the Toks. maybe no one will read this post for awhile BUT when they do they will have some good info to read that may help. Happy Holidays - may your stocking be filled with sporting goods and ammo
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