Iowa,Take Breathalyzer or Lose Permit.WTF?

[HILMAN76]

Iowa Bill Could Compel Gun Carriers to Take Breathalyzer or Lose Permit

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011...r-lose-permit/

A new bill advancing through the Iowa Senate would compel gun owners to take a breathalyzer test if an officer suspects they're intoxicated while armed.

Under the proposal, anyone who declines would automatically forfeit their firearm permit.

The provision is one of several restrictions included in a bill that would update Iowa's gun ownership laws. It's meant to make the consequences for drinking and carrying a firearm similar to the consequences for drinking and driving.

Under current law, gun owners already risk losing their permit if they are found carrying a gun while intoxicated -- much like motorists risk losing their license if they're caught driving drunk. But the current law does not let police officers compel gun owners to take the blood-alcohol content test.

Sen. Rob Hogg described the new proposal as an extra enforcement tool. Without this authority, he warned, officers would have trouble proving a suspect was intoxicated.

"It's very difficult to enforce that because you can't force somebody to ... do a breathalyzer," Hogg said.

The proposal would also require new gun owners to receive training on a firearms range, while dropping a requirement that gun owners renewing their permit seek the same training.

The Iowa Firearms Coalition has voiced opposition to the bill, particularly a provision that would prohibit prospective gun owners from fulfilling their training requirement with online classes. One Coalition board member told The Gazette in Cedar Rapids the bill contained "a lot of solutions looking for problems."

But lawmakers, who approved the bill in the Senate Judiciary Committee on Monday, watered down the proposal a bit. They took out a provision that would have prohibited anyone carrying a gun from entering a bar.

Democratic Sen. Gene Fraise, the bill's sponsor, continued to express concern about the possibility of alcohol-fueled bar fights, but said individual bars already have the right to ban weapons on their property.

"The people who run their own business have a right to deny guns" on their property, he said.

The new proposals come after the Iowa Legislature last year approved a law requiring sheriffs to issue a firearm permit to those who qualify.


Im not from Iowa, but that's just FUUUUUUCKED UP!

[Numidian]

This is the real retarded part

The proposal would also require new gun owners to receive training on a firearms range, while dropping a requirement that gun owners renewing their permit seek the same training.

So right now, you don't have to have training to get the permit, but you need it to renew the permit? WTF?

[Chris]

.

[trkklr77]

meh, i dont see a problem with it.


in ca if you refuse to submit to a bac test you lose your drivers license for 1 year.


i dont see how its going to stop anyone from getting drunk and carrying a weapon though.

[HILMAN76]

When Im out camping, I always carry a pocket pistol of some sort. I am usually drinking beer when Im camping too. It doesn't take much to be over the limit. The Park Gestapos ALWAYS ask for info when they pass by camp sites, at least my camp site, I show them my fishing license and carry permit with my DL. Ive never had a problem, but I wonder if that law passes in Iowa what would happen in a scenario like that.

[HILMAN76]

Originally Posted by trkklr77

meh, i dont see a problem with it.


in ca if you refuse to submit to a bac test you lose your drivers license for 1 year.


i dont see how its going to stop anyone from getting drunk and carrying a weapon though.

Yeah, that's if your driving, what if your not driving, say camping while carrying and sippin' some brews. Kinda makes ya' hope ya' dont run into a dick cop or ranger.

[misterfubar]

I don't really have a problem with it.

I like people getting drunk and handling firearms almost as much as I like people getting drunk and driving a car.

[Drunk tank]

Slippery slope here.... what if Im piss drunk on my own property or in my own house and have a firearm on me? I may have a permit to carry on public property but I dont need it on my own land.... so could they still come and take my permit for being drunk and armed on private property? Matter a fact.... What about ANY private property even if it isnt your own? What about a private business?

Seems its not specific enough and leaves alot of room for interpretation by the officer. And as we all know.... most officers dont have harvard law degrees. Just saying

[HILMAN76]

Originally Posted by Drunk tank

Slippery slope here.... what if Im piss drunk on my own property or in my own house and have a firearm on me? I may have a permit to carry on public property but I dont need it on my own land.... so could they still come and take my permit for being drunk and armed on private property? Matter a fact.... What about ANY private property even if it isnt your own? What about a private business?

Seems its not specific enough and leaves a lot of room for interpretation by the officer. And as we all know.... most officers dont have harvard law degrees. Just saying

Exactly.

[HILMAN76]

http://www.ohsinc.com/drunk_driving_...mits_chart.htm

Check your state, if you blow a point over, your permit is gone, and don't forget you don't have to be behind the wheel to have to submit to a breathalyzer test.

[Gozuki]

Originally Posted by HILMAN76

Sen. Rob Hogg described the new proposal as an extra enforcement tool. Without this authority, he warned, officers would have trouble proving a suspect was intoxicated.

A "suspect" has already incited an officer's suspicion of something, and can already be handled as such.

[trkklr77]

Originally Posted by Drunk tank

Slippery slope here.... what if Im piss drunk on my own property or in my own house and have a firearm on me? I may have a permit to carry on public property but I dont need it on my own land.... so could they still come and take my permit for being drunk and armed on private property? Matter a fact.... What about ANY private property even if it isnt your own? What about a private business?

Seems its not specific enough and leaves alot of room for interpretation by the officer. And as we all know.... most officers dont have harvard law degrees. Just saying

the only argument i could provide for this is that bullets dont stop at property lines....

how unglued would you come if the habbitual drunk 3 houses away started fireing off / see here is where the law fails to acctually accomplish anything. because reguardless of the law, the permit or any other ristriction ther eis nothing in this world that can stop him for doing what the spirit of this law is attempting to do, stop drunk people from firing guns.

[Ranger5.0L]

Originally Posted by Numidian

This is the real retarded part



So right now, you don't have to have training to get the permit, but you need it to renew the permit? WTF?

last years law was any new permits had to take class and pass shooting range. Current permit could just renew.
This years law says new permit has to take class and pass shooting range. Current permits have to re qualify on just the shooting range to renew. They must be trying to make it like last years law I'd guess. Make sense?

[Vortec_Cruiser]

I see no problem with the law at all. Getting drunk while carrying a loaded firearm is just stupid.

[muddinva]

Get your state to pass constitutional carry and there's no permit to take away

[85f150dsel]

Originally Posted by trkklr77

how unglued would you come if the habbitual drunk 3 houses away started fireing off.

Honestly I wouldn't give a shit, I might be a little paranoid and hang out in the basement or work in the lower half of my barn. Worst case he ends up dead from self defense. You should be able to take a drunk pretty easy from a long distance.


There's too many dick head cops that will make you blow because they know if you don't the consequences are huge. I shouldn't have to blow for no reason. Go to a college town and this is a big problem with city cops. They think every one is drunk all the time when they pull you over.

[PONY_DRIVER]

Originally Posted by trkklr77

the only argument i could provide for this is that bullets dont stop at property lines....

how unglued would you come if the habbitual drunk 3 houses away started fireing off / see here is where the law fails to acctually accomplish anything. because reguardless of the law, the permit or any other ristriction ther eis nothing in this world that can stop him for doing what the spirit of this law is attempting to do, stop drunk people from firing guns.

There's not a law on the books, nor will there ever be a law on the books that will prevent people from doing stupid shit. There are plenty of laws on the books that infringe on the rights of us all attempting to do just that.

[Sully]

Originally Posted by trkklr77

meh, i dont see a problem with it.

I do.

It's one more set of laws that CREATES criminals where there were none before,l based on the premise that they could cause harm, rather than punishing those who DO cause harm.

Is handling a firearm while drinking irresponsible? Absolutely. Should it be a crime? I don't think so.

I do think that irresponsible use of that firearm, whether under the influence or not, warrants punishment, up to and including the temporary or permanent loss of your license. But simply having a gun on your hip while you are having a beer at the campsite? Sorry, not a crime, and anyone who says otherwise is advocating the nanny-statism that is so rampant in our society.

[Sully]

Originally Posted by Gozuki

A "suspect" has already incited an officer's suspicion of something, and can already be handled as such.

A "suspect" is anyone who has an interaction with the police.

How many times have people discussed having an officer "run the serial numbers" on their carry piece during a traffic stop where they have told the cop they are carrying?

[fj40john]

I'm not sure how I feel about it. I don't drink much, but do like to have an occasional beer with dinner, or out with some friends. The wife likes to order wine or margaritas, and rarely finishes them, so I generally bat cleanup. If I am carrying, I leave them.

Knowing that I am headed to a bar for a single beer, the guns stay at home, which I hate, because in Texas, as soon as you start drinking while carrying, you are breaking the law. The old law used to state that you had to be legally drunk (.08 BAC) to stop carrying, so a beer or two with dinner was fine.

I guess I don't see how this is any different from them suspecting you are drunk driving. If they suspect it, you are asked to take a breathalyzer. If it is illegal to consume alcohol while carrying in that state, then you are breaking the law and they are simply enforcing it.

[Gozuki]

Originally Posted by Sully

A "suspect" is anyone who has an interaction with the police.

How many times have people discussed having an officer "run the serial numbers" on their carry piece during a traffic stop where they have told the cop they are carrying?

A "suspect" is suspect because of a "reasonable, articulable suspicion". Without such RAS, you are a citizen. If a cop sees you weaving, on the sideway or freeway, that is RAS that you may be inebriated. Don't want to be pulled over? Don't weave/speed/forget turn signals etc.

[aloharover]

Originally Posted by trkklr77

meh, i dont see a problem with it.


in ca if you refuse to submit to a bac test you lose your drivers license for 1 year.


i dont see how its going to stop anyone from getting drunk and carrying a weapon though.

Driving is a privilege, firearms are a right

[TEX]

Originally Posted by Sully

Is handling a firearm while drinking irresponsible? Absolutely. Should it be a crime? I don't think so.

As I understand it, it's already a crime to be in possession of a firearm while intoxicated.

[Gozuki]

Originally Posted by tex

as i understand it, it's already a crime to be in possession of a firearm in public while intoxicated.

ftfy

[rocket flier]

Illegal to shoot a gun in the city - check.
Illegal to threaten someone with a gun - check.
Illegal to shoot someone unless self defense - check.

Why do you need another law?