What is all the rash from on the trees? It all looks to random to be from vehicle damage. I'm sure to see it first hand was much more disturbing than the pics but some of your pics don't look like much? like the stick in the middle of the trail and the scrub brush next to the rock. I've never been there but I feel you on the pissed off part. I've seen similar crap around here.
Doug, there's still nothing to prevent erosion on that hillside though. This is the part I don't really fully understand. They haven't mitigated the natural process at all at this point. So blowing the rocks without that followup may well just cause worse erosion this winters melt.
Doug, there's still nothing to prevent erosion on that hillside though. This is the part I don't really fully understand. They haven't mitigated the natural process at all at this point. So blowing the rocks without that followup may well just cause worse erosion this winters melt.
With the rocks that were blasted vehicles will go more to the left and avoid the hill. After the rip rap rock (Small 6" cobble) is brought in on the right it should create a drainage area which should control the erosion. As has been stated many times...the goal was to move the traffic off the hill to the left, create a drainage area on the right and reduce traffic log jams. When it is done it should do what was intended...should. Only time will tell. You could be right, but I've seen it in person and there is little if any reason to expect more erosion post blast than pre-blast.
Right, I'm just sitting here thinking that if they waited till too late in the season... they did more harm than good. I know about the initial plan for rip rap/cobble etc oh and the semantic argument that ensued
I'm just hoping they actually come through with the follow up before the snow fall really hits. Then again, since I moved back to AZ, I don't really have a chance to drive up and look at it first hand as readily. So you could very well be right and I'm just missing something.
Wasn't meaning to imply that you did that... but many others do.
As far as nobility goes...
I've PERSONALLY put in several hundred volunteer hours supporting 4x4 areas.
I'm the one that normally goes in and picks up loose trash on the trail. - I've probably personally hauled out 40 cubic yards over the last 4 years.
I've helped plan to keep areas open.
I patrol 4x4 areas for "bad" ORV/4x4 users. Turning them in to the DNR where appropriate, educating the rest when they do wrong.
About the only thing I have stopped doing is writting letters to our state politicians. It's become obvious from their replies that it's pointless. They don't listen, they don't care, I'm not the one lining their pockets. So, I put my energies elsewhere.
I think I've put in the time/money to have the background knowledge to make a general statement like that.
Doug, there's still nothing to prevent erosion on that hillside though. This is the part I don't really fully understand. They haven't mitigated the natural process at all at this point. So blowing the rocks without that followup may well just cause worse erosion this winters melt.
There will be continued erosion. There is still a need to haul rock into the gatekeeper. That has always been a part of the plan. It was always a part of the discussion in managing the water in that area.
There will be continued erosion. There is still a need to haul rock into the gatekeeper. That has always been a part of the plan. It was always a part of the discussion in managing the water in that area.
Can you/FOTR make an official request that any future blasting work must incorporate into the SOP that blast protection must be provided for trees in the area of the blast. The condition of the trees at Gatekeeper is truly sad. It goes without saying(but I'll say it anyway) that any one of us would be paying a hefty fine for damage to trees like that.
Think of the landmark trees at the Sluice and what the impact will be from the amount of blast there is sure to be there. The trees would be vaporized without some form of protection.
Can you/FOTR make an official request that any future blasting work must incorporate into the SOP that blast protection must be provided for trees in the area of the blast.
I understand the idea of adding the cobbles but I am really curious to see how it will be maintained. That is a large amount of rock that will have to be brought in each year to keep that part above grade. Is there maintenance plan for that?
Can you/FOTR make an official request that any future blasting work must incorporate into the SOP that blast protection must be provided for trees in the area of the blast. The condition of the trees at Gatekeeper is truly sad. It goes without saying(but I'll say it anyway) that any one of us would be paying a hefty fine for damage to trees like that.
I think we learned from the Rich Platt, of the FS, that if 1/3 circumference of the bark is damaged the tree will more than likely die. Who ever was contracted to do that blast needs to talk to Rich before they do that again. Thanks for pointing that out Tinman.
I'm all for fixing erosion and keeping the trail open, but lets not to more damage then good in the process. Let’s take more time than 4 days and plan out enough to look around at possible impacts.
Scott,
How much is it snowing? Is it going to be possible to bring rock in this fall?
I think we learned from the Rich Platt, of the FS, that if 1/3 circumference of the bark is damaged the tree will more than likely die. Who ever was contracted to do that blast needs to talk to Rich before they do that again. Thanks for pointing that out Tinman.
I agree, this IMO needs to be brought up to him now. There is a coating that can put on the exposed areas of the tree to help save them from the frost that is forthcoming.
I must say the impact to surrounding flora and fona is greater than I imagined. Anyone with knowledge....Does covering the fireline explosives prior to detonation reduce this impact?
This fireline explosives method is fast and cheap, but might not be so fast and cheap if all surrounding trees and plants had to be protected prior to boom. I'd sure hate to see what the old trees in sluice would look like with some 1000#s of explosives going off... Honestly, unless that is controlled better, I can't see using this method at Sluice.
And...I believe Rich Platt was there during the boom. Don't quote me on that though.
If the erosion was a factor is blasting gate keeper what was the reason they blasted the rock right before you go into the creek bed, about 200 feet past gate keeper?
If they have to truck in rock to fill the area anyway, then why destroy the natural obstacles? Why not just fill around the big rocks. Looks like now you will need MORE fill material.
And blowing up the gatekeeper was like blowing up Stonehenge. It's a landmark, you work around it, you don't destroy it.
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