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Jurisdiction for Rubicon Trail Access Points

2K views 17 replies 6 participants last post by  mtnbronco 
#1 · (Edited)
This is gonna be a work in progress -- I'll update the posts up top as people provide info below. I'm pretty familiar with the West Side issues, but less familiar with East Side issues, and am hoping someone can fill in the blanks:

WEST SIDE TRAILHEADS
* Loon Lake
* Wentworth Springs
* McKinstry Lake

EAST SIDE TRAILHEADS
* Tahoma
* Barker Pass
* Blackwood Jeep Trail via Barker Pass

Randii
 
#2 · (Edited)
via Loon Lake

* Icehouse Road to Loon Lake turnoff: paved EDC road both south to 50 and west to G-town
* Loon Lake turnoff to Loon Lake RV Campground: paved EDC road
* Loon Lake RV Campground to east end of dam: unpaved EDC road
* Down from the dam, past the kiosk, and onto the trail: unpaved EDC road
 
#3 · (Edited)
via Wentworth Springs

* Icehouse Road to Loon Lake turnoff: paved EDC road both south to 50 and west to G-town
* two options for Airport Flat to Lawyer Cow Camp
- - unpaved EDC road directly connecting Airport Flat and Lawyer Cow Camp (runs alongside Gerle Creek then crosses it where bridge is washed out)
- - paved ENF system road with route looping around to the West and joining 14N07 to wrap back East to Lawyer Cow Camp
* Lawyer Cow Camp to Wentworth Springs turnoff: short section of paved EDC road
* Wentworth Springs turnoff through Wentworth Springs to main trail: duration of unpaved EDC road
 
#4 · (Edited)
via McKinstry Lake

* Icehouse Road to Loon Lake turnoff: paved EDC road both south to 50 and west to G-town
* two options for Airport Flat to Lawyer Cow Camp
- - unpaved EDC road directly connecting Airport Flat and Lawyer Cow Camp (runs alongside Gerle Creek then crosses it where bridge is washed out)
- - paved ENF system road with route looping around to the West and joining 14N07 to wrap back East to Lawyer Cow Camp
* Lawyer Cow Camp to Wentworth Springs turnoff: short section of paved EDC road
* Wentworth Springs turnoff north on 14NO7 to 14NO5 turnoff: paved and then unpaved ENF system road
* 14NO5 turnoff, bear left at McKinstry Lake to southbound unmarked connector to Ellis: unpaved ENF system road
* southbound unmarked connector to Ellis to main trail: duration of unpaved ENF non system road -- see note, below.
* main trail and points beyond: duration of unpaved EDC road

Note: there's some confusion on the Inventory maps with respect to connections between 14N05 and the Rubicon Trail west of Ellis Creek. The map shows 14N34B connecting toward Bugle Lake but *not*14N05, which it clearly does on the ground.
http://www.fs.fed.us/r5/eldorado/documents/route/maps/enf_se_wentworthsprings.pdf
 
#5 · (Edited)
via Tahoma

* from Highway 89 to the staging area (2 miles) - McKinney Rubicon Road is a paved PC road
* the staging area itself is paved TNF system road
* from the staging area to the intersection with Barker Pass Road unpaved PC road
* from the intersection with Barker Pass Road to the county line is an unpaved PC road
 
#6 · (Edited)
via Barker Pass

* from Highway 89 to Barker Peak (7 miles) - Blackwood Canyon Road is a paved TNF system road, seasonally closed at 89, at the intersection with the Rubicon Trail (McKinney Rubicon Road) and half way in between.
* from Barker Peak to the Rubicon Trail (5 miles) is a unpaved TNF system road
* from the intersection with Barker Pass Road to the county line is an unpaved PC road
 
#7 · (Edited)
via Blackwood Jeep Trail via Barker Pass

* from Highway 89 to Barker Peak (7 miles) - Blackwood Canyon Road is a paved TNF system road, seasonally closed at 89, at the intersection with the Rubicon Trail (McKinney Rubicon Road) and half way in between.
* from Barker Peak to the intersection with Barker Meadow OHV Trail (3 miles) is a unpaved TNF system road
* from the intersection with Barker Meadow OHV Trail to the Rubicon Trail (2 miles) is a unpaved TNF system road
* from the intersection with Barker Pass Road to the county line is an unpaved PC road
 
#8 ·
Tahoma

Highway 89 to the staging area (2 miles) - McKinney Rubicon Road is a paved Placer Co Road to the staging area.

The staging area itself is Forest Service land.

Staging Area to the turn off or intersection with Barker Pass Road (8 miles) - McKinney Rubicon Road is an unmaintained Placer Co Road.

Barker Pass Rd turn off or intersection to the El Dorado County line (Rubicon Springs private property) unmaintained Placer Co Rd. The Rubicon Trail!


Blackwood Canyon

Highway 89 to Barker Peak (7 miles) - Blackwood Canyon Road is a paved Forest Service Road, seasonally closed at 89, at the intersection with the Rubicon Trail (McKinney Rubicon Road) and half way in between.

Barker Peak to the intersection or the Rubicon Trail (5 miles) - A forest service graded dirt road.

(again) Barker Pass Rd turn off or intersection to the El Dorado County line (Rubicon Springs private property) unmaintained Placer Co Rd. The Rubicon Trail!


Barker Meadow OHV Trail [shortcut(?)] cuts the corner Barker Pass Road to the Rubicon at two miles from (south of) Barker Peak to two miles down (west on) the Rubicon. This is also a Forest Service Road.
 
#11 ·
Randi

As to the confusion of 14N05/14N34B. I just looked at the new Motor Vehicle Restriction Map and now see what you are saying. But I bet 14N34B references the the short stem going Northwest from the main trail...not the long end of 14N05. Here's why... If you look further south and west at the 14N34A...it sit above the Wentworth springs Camping marker. They appear to be similar...both stems from the Rubicon Trail. I suspect the 14N34B is just the short stem coming up from the trail and there may be a error in color on the map for that short stem. I bet it should it be in Black. This would explain 14N34B and if so...is that what everyone understood would be done with that stem? I'm concerned now.

Also...Everything from that stem to 14N05/14N34B is private land...not FS land as you indicated.

Does anyone know the laws relative to enforcement if you drive on private land. Can you be sited by the FS or any other LE for doing so without the landowner being involved? What is the Jurisdiction when it comes to private land and LE? I don't think the FS or county can stop us from using that leg unless the land owner was to press charges...I hope anyway.
 
#12 · (Edited)
Still dunno about 14N05/14N34B. If you look at 34B it comes in more from the NW, and connects across Bugle Lake... and I flat-out disbelieve that ENF will allow that to happen. I need to print out that quarter-quad and discuss it with them. Marlon, what you described is more consistent with what I thought they were going to do, after speaking with Platt... now, I dunno.

NOTPRETTY said:
Everything from that stem to 14N05/14N34B is private land...not FS land as you indicated.
Agreed, but it is a Forest Service system road, nonetheless. I'm pretty sure that equates to a property right, as part of the quid pro quo for using USFS roads not on private lands, that the private property owner develops roads for the forest service across their private property. Kinda fuzzy on this.

AFAIK, any enforcement on private land needs to be done with something like a Memorandum of Understanding (MOU). If there's an MOU in place, LEO becomes the de facto agent of the property owner, and can prosecute accordingly.

Randii
 
#13 · (Edited)
I know that area like very well (walked much of it) and bugle is not where the 14N34B is printed on the Motor Vehicle Restriction map. Bugle is further North and a bit west of that location...my best guess is about the center of square 29...or just a bit north and west of center. I would say 14N58A is actually closer to Bugle than is 14N34B.

Agreed, but it is a Forest Service...
I don't think it is Forest System road. Am I missing something. Is it part of the non-system road route designation process that I'm not aware of?
 
#14 ·
#16 ·
i know some areas have multiple names but wasnt there a way in past WW called hells canyon? seem to recall coming in on it 5 years ago and a hand full of times over the years but my memory is vague
 
#17 ·
mtnbronco, I'm just trying to pull this information together in one place, to allow clearer discussions. Any time we talk about a given trailhead, it seems like we wind up talking about who owns it and who has jurisdiction (note that in some cases, ownership and jurisdiction are separate).

ddestruel, Hell's Half Acre lies directly north of where 14N05 runs SSE of McKinstry Lake, and I believe there's a non-motorized trail that I believe accesses the inflow to Hellhole Reservoir, a couple valleys/canyons to the north -- see the purple line off of 14NO5: http://www.fs.fed.us/r5/eldorado/documents/route/maps/enf_sw_wentworthsprings.pdf
I'm pretty sure I recollect a brown forest service sign to that effect that is visible off 14N05.

Randii
 
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